World Beyblade Organization by Fighting Spirits Inc.

(Jul. 31, 2021  1:54 AM)RiseAshindra12 Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 30, 2021  9:53 PM)BeySkozo Raky Wrote: [ -> ]Just wanted to to ask: Who of you all is waiting on more information for Hasbro's QD-Series? I'm mainly waiting on pictures, you?

Yeah. I’m waiting for an more in-depth explanation for the new system and the tip functions. I mean, look at Assault-Q in the app. I mean, the system has to be simple. Besides, once we know about the system, then we can try making predictions about the Belfrye gears.

Okay. My guess is that Hasbro will do (all) the upgrade gears for Belfyre, respectivly I hope it. They may fuse them together to the parts which wear them, like F-Gear (all plastic) fused with  Destruction, V-Gear (also all plastic) fused to Venture and so on. They may leave out one Gear maybe, one which isn't that relevant. Maybe the S-Gear, or even the L-Gear? Idk. I still hope that they will at least give us something when it comes to the gear upgrades. I have hopes for system, really! I'm pretty that it can get to be a big improvement from Speedstorm.

---

(Jul. 31, 2021  5:15 AM)Attila Wrote: [ -> ]Is the new string launcher left and right?

I think it is, respectivly it should be dual spin! Just like all the other launchers Hasbro had released in the last years since Switchstrike.

(Jul. 31, 2021  6:10 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]"Allowing more customization options ruins customizability."

Another surface level attempt to undermine it without giving it any real thought huh? Consider this: Many Hasbro buyers will not have access to TT compatible drivers for this to even be a feature, short of those that Hasbro didn't release through Pro Series. This means one of two things:

1: You get access to a rather small handful of drivers you couldn't before (Hasbro Pro Series), at the cost of driving up complexity and the price to build
2: You have to rely on TT to provide any meaningful amount of extra driver options

1 itself is why there's no real payoff to doing so, you're making things harder and more expensive to build just to allow a very small amount of Hasbro released parts to be usable. It's a lot of effort to do almost nothing, and goes against their existing advertising of these Pro Series beys being incompatible with the mainline. 2 is why it's possibly even a bad thing to attempt, as relying on a different brand to fill in holes in your releases is bad form in so many ways it's not even funny. It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change. It's not the biggest risk ever, but it is risking a small amount of monthly sales to provide a feature to a more narrow segment of buyers, plus the added costs of getting you there.

tl;dr It's not good on a business decision level, and simply adds more cost to the line (designing costs, added production costs) with no real way to make that money back from it without driving up the costs to the consumer. Add that to the fact that there's no way to simply adjust heights to get it to work and it becomes even harder to do. You're so focused on "more customizability" that you failed to realize that Hasbro as the producer gets absolutely nothing out of this deal, utterly no bang for their buck. They're not gonna do something they can't profit from in some manner, even if it's as simple as free advertising on their boxes like the painted disks are.

(Jul. 31, 2021  6:10 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]You could just redesign the slopes in a manner that accommodates both drivers, but that would require Hasbro to actually think.

Speaking of actually thinking, I'm not sure you realize how difficult this would be on the engineering end. You can't just "redesign the slopes", the incompatibility is built straight into the drivers themselves so that what is compatible with one is incompatible (or stupidly loose) with the other. Mainline Hasbro drivers have a lower base for their drivers, and mainline Hasbro layers have thicker slopes to fit that extra bit of driver in. TT drivers fit in a smaller space, and squeeze the thicker Hasbro layers to death when applied because they're supposed to have thinner teeth to fit around instead, literally crushing the softer plastic underneath them until literally everything is loose on them. There is no way to account for this change in both height and the necessary thickness of the slopes without having two different sets of slopes entirely with two different thicknesses to account for the two different types of drivers. Possibly doable via a flippable system, but it'd still require total disassembly of the bey to pull your slopes out, flip them, and put them back in... and if whatever holds that in place wears a little or there's too much clearance it could just make things more rattly.

And on top of that you'd have to do this while also adding in the two different heights for the QuadDrive system and other gimmicks like Spriggan's dual spin and possibly Valtryek's spring (if they bring that back). That means you have to build 2 slopes for 2 heights and make sure it can work with both, plus leave room for bonus features. If anything I'm surprised to hear that QuadDrive may actually have those two heights, it's a bit unlike Hasbro not to just strip out gimmicks like that for simplicity... but I suppose it's such a big deal for Belial/Belfyre that they couldn't cut it out of the anime. This still makes it far more difficult to be able to adjust and flip a piece 4 different ways. It may be technically possible, but would likely require removing and flipping the slopes around (which itself is undesirable, it generates a smaller part than previous chips have and makes the line less child safe and therefore less attractive to parents with really young kids).

Oh yeah, and even if they did do this, I'm pretty sure the reason why Hasbro slopes are thicker and their driver plates lower to compensate for it is so they don't break so badly with their softer plastic. Making them TT level thin could make them more fragile or prone to denting (and if it dents, then you have a damaged and maybe unusable layer), and softer Hasbro plastic isn't really good for ' driver level wear either (as earlier Pro Series has proven). There's reasons why their drivers are built so that the layers can have thicker support structures, and I don't think messing with that is a good idea in general.

THE REALLY BIG FRIGGIN' TL;DR:
-This change would add to costs to a line they're trying to make relatively cheaply
-There's no way to recoup those increasing costs short of pushing them on the buyers, making them pricier and less desirable for some
-It would go against existing and continued advertising of Pro Series being incompatible with the mainline
-The number of Pro Series driver releases is so small that you get very little out of the change anyways
-It could entice people to spend their money on overseas beys to get the most out of this feature, actively reducing sales for their own brand
-It's not TT's job to fill in holes that Hasbro makes anyways
-This change would require two different sets of slopes and a way to disassemble your layer to flip between them at a minimum
-I've already gone ad nauseum that just having "Pro Slopes" would make anything prior to their introduction (Hypersphere, Speedstorm, e.t.c.) so loose that they wouldn't work as intended on new layers, so there's no getting around having one side for each
-The most likely way to do a double-ended slope piece generates small parts and makes it a less child-safe brand
-Such a change could also make the beys perform worse, letting their parts wiggle and rattle more
-You still have other gimmicks to work this change around (e.g. Spriggan's dual spin and the QuadDrive system's dual heights) which only makes it harder to design for in a limited amount of space
-The "Pro Side" slopes would likely be more fragile and wear-prone than normal mainline releases would be as the plastic is thinner and easier to bend
-There's already reasons why Hasbro's mainline slopes are designed the way they are that contribute to the above

Yes, I've thought this through that much. The idea is simply untenable for Hasbro to attempt. Were it at the beginning of the Burst line I might've said "Well, they could pull a Pro Series with everything now and just declare everything earlier like some sort of prototype", but that doesn't work when Pro Series is but a tiny fraction of their line and ignores the hundreds of things that came before. It is way too little way too late. If you really want TT compatibility in your Hasbeys, just wait for the Pro Series releases. It's the only way Hasbro can reasonably do it at this point in time.

(Jul. 31, 2021  11:22 AM)MagikHorse Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 31, 2021  6:10 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]"Allowing more customization options ruins customizability."

Another surface level attempt to undermine it without giving it any real thought huh? Consider this: Many Hasbro buyers will not have access to TT compatible drivers for this to even be a feature, short of those that Hasbro didn't release through Pro Series. This means one of two things:

1: You get access to a rather small handful of drivers you couldn't before (Hasbro Pro Series), at the cost of driving up complexity and the price to build
2: You have to rely on TT to provide any meaningful amount of extra driver options

1 itself is why there's no real payoff to doing so, you're making things harder and more expensive to build just to allow a very small amount of Hasbro released parts to be usable. It's a lot of effort to do almost nothing, and goes against their existing advertising of these Pro Series beys being incompatible with the mainline. 2 is why it's possibly even a bad thing to attempt, as relying on a different brand to fill in holes in your releases is bad form in so many ways it's not even funny. It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change. It's not the biggest risk ever, but it is risking a small amount of monthly sales to provide a feature to a more narrow segment of buyers, plus the added costs of getting you there.

tl;dr It's not good on a business decision level, and simply adds more cost to the line (designing costs, added production costs) with no real way to make that money back from it without driving up the costs to the consumer. Add that to the fact that there's no way to simply adjust heights to get it to work and it becomes even harder to do. You're so focused on "more customizability" that you failed to realize that Hasbro as the producer gets absolutely nothing out of this deal, utterly no bang for their buck. They're not gonna do something they can't profit from in some manner, even if it's as simple as free advertising on their boxes like the painted disks are.

(Jul. 31, 2021  6:10 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]You could just redesign the slopes in a manner that accommodates both drivers, but that would require Hasbro to actually think.

Speaking of actually thinking, I'm not sure you realize how difficult this would be on the engineering end. You can't just "redesign the slopes", the incompatibility is built straight into the drivers themselves so that what is compatible with one is incompatible (or stupidly loose) with the other. Mainline Hasbro drivers have a lower base for their drivers, and mainline Hasbro layers have thicker slopes to fit that extra bit of driver in. TT drivers fit in a smaller space, and squeeze the thicker Hasbro layers to death when applied because they're supposed to have thinner teeth to fit around instead, literally crushing the softer plastic underneath them until literally everything is loose on them. There is no way to account for this change in both height and the necessary thickness of the slopes without having two different sets of slopes entirely with two different thicknesses to account for the two different types of drivers. Possibly doable via a flippable system, but it'd still require total disassembly of the bey to pull your slopes out, flip them, and put them back in... and if whatever holds that in place wears a little or there's too much clearance it could just make things more rattly.

And on top of that you'd have to do this while also adding in the two different heights for the QuadDrive system and other gimmicks like Spriggan's dual spin and possibly Valtryek's spring (if they bring that back). That means you have to build 2 slopes for 2 heights and make sure it can work with both, plus leave room for bonus features. If anything I'm surprised to hear that QuadDrive may actually have those two heights, it's a bit unlike Hasbro not to just strip out gimmicks like that for simplicity... but I suppose it's such a big deal for Belial/Belfyre that they couldn't cut it out of the anime. This still makes it far more difficult to be able to adjust and flip a piece 4 different ways. It may be technically possible, but would likely require removing and flipping the slopes around (which itself is undesirable, it generates a smaller part than previous chips have and makes the line less child safe and therefore less attractive to parents with really young kids).

Oh yeah, and even if they did do this, I'm pretty sure the reason why Hasbro slopes are thicker and their driver plates lower to compensate for it is so they don't break so badly with their softer plastic. Making them TT level thin could make them more fragile or prone to denting (and if it dents, then you have a damaged and maybe unusable layer), and softer Hasbro plastic isn't really good for ' driver level wear either (as earlier Pro Series has proven). There's reasons why their drivers are built so that the layers can have thicker support structures, and I don't think messing with that is a good idea in general.

THE REALLY BIG FRIGGIN' TL;DR:
-This change would add to costs to a line they're trying to make relatively cheaply
-There's no way to recoup those increasing costs short of pushing them on the buyers, making them pricier and less desirable for some
-It would go against existing and continued advertising of Pro Series being incompatible with the mainline
-The number of Pro Series driver releases is so small that you get very little out of the change anyways
-It could entice people to spend their money on overseas beys to get the most out of this feature, actively reducing sales for their own brand
-It's not TT's job to fill in holes that Hasbro makes anyways
-This change would require two different sets of slopes and a way to disassemble your layer to flip between them at a minimum
-I've already gone ad nauseum that just having "Pro Slopes" would make anything prior to their introduction (Hypersphere, Speedstorm, e.t.c.) so loose that they wouldn't work as intended on new layers, so there's no getting around having one side for each
-The most likely way to do a double-ended slope piece generates small parts and makes it a less child-safe brand
-Such a change could also make the beys perform worse, letting their parts wiggle and rattle more
-You still have other gimmicks to work this change around (e.g. Spriggan's dual spin and the QuadDrive system's dual heights) which only makes it harder to design for in a limited amount of space
-The "Pro Side" slopes would likely be more fragile and wear-prone than normal mainline releases would be as the plastic is thinner and easier to bend
-There's already reasons why Hasbro's mainline slopes are designed the way they are that contribute to the above

Yes, I've thought this through that much. The idea is simply untenable for Hasbro to attempt. Were it at the beginning of the Burst line I might've said "Well, they could pull a Pro Series with everything now and just declare everything earlier like some sort of prototype", but that doesn't work when Pro Series is but a tiny fraction of their line and ignores the hundreds of things that came before. It is way too little way too late. If you really want TT compatibility in your Hasbeys, just wait for the Pro Series releases. It's the only way Hasbro can reasonably do it at this point in time.

1.  So, Hasbro bladers would have to buy Pro Series beys.  That just means more money for Hasbro.  However, due to the small amount of Pro Series drivers, available, the original drivers aren't completely alienated.  Additionally, How is this any different from the original Burst discs(Knuckle, Gravity, etc.) being completely outclassed by God Layer discs(7, 0, 00, etc.)?

2.  "It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change."

Yes, and pay almost double the price for shipping.  If Hasbro manages to offer the same product, locally, people are going to prefer them because they're cheaper.

3.  It's too expensive to slightly modify the slopes, but turning the Sparking layers into GT layers instead of just reusing Takara TOMY molds is well within the budget?

4.  "You can't just "redesign the slopes"

Yes, you can.  The walls above the slopes are what's keeping Pro Series drivers from fitting on mainline layers.  You lower these walls, and the Pro Series drivers will fit.  Of course, this leaves more wiggle room for mainline divers.  That's where you redesign the slopes.  There's a sweet spot that would allow both drivers to be viable.  All you have to do is find it.

(Jul. 31, 2021  11:22 AM)MagikHorse Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 31, 2021  6:10 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]"Allowing more customization options ruins customizability."

Another surface level attempt to undermine it without giving it any real thought huh? Consider this: Many Hasbro buyers will not have access to TT compatible drivers for this to even be a feature, short of those that Hasbro didn't release through Pro Series. This means one of two things:

1: You get access to a rather small handful of drivers you couldn't before (Hasbro Pro Series), at the cost of driving up complexity and the price to build
2: You have to rely on TT to provide any meaningful amount of extra driver options

1 itself is why there's no real payoff to doing so, you're making things harder and more expensive to build just to allow a very small amount of Hasbro released parts to be usable. It's a lot of effort to do almost nothing, and goes against their existing advertising of these Pro Series beys being incompatible with the mainline. 2 is why it's possibly even a bad thing to attempt, as relying on a different brand to fill in holes in your releases is bad form in so many ways it's not even funny. It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change. It's not the biggest risk ever, but it is risking a small amount of monthly sales to provide a feature to a more narrow segment of buyers, plus the added costs of getting you there.

tl;dr It's not good on a business decision level, and simply adds more cost to the line (designing costs, added production costs) with no real way to make that money back from it without driving up the costs to the consumer. Add that to the fact that there's no way to simply adjust heights to get it to work and it becomes even harder to do. You're so focused on "more customizability" that you failed to realize that Hasbro as the producer gets absolutely nothing out of this deal, utterly no bang for their buck. They're not gonna do something they can't profit from in some manner, even if it's as simple as free advertising on their boxes like the painted disks are.

(Jul. 31, 2021  6:10 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]You could just redesign the slopes in a manner that accommodates both drivers, but that would require Hasbro to actually think.

Speaking of actually thinking, I'm not sure you realize how difficult this would be on the engineering end. You can't just "redesign the slopes", the incompatibility is built straight into the drivers themselves so that what is compatible with one is incompatible (or stupidly loose) with the other. Mainline Hasbro drivers have a lower base for their drivers, and mainline Hasbro layers have thicker slopes to fit that extra bit of driver in. TT drivers fit in a smaller space, and squeeze the thicker Hasbro layers to death when applied because they're supposed to have thinner teeth to fit around instead, literally crushing the softer plastic underneath them until literally everything is loose on them. There is no way to account for this change in both height and the necessary thickness of the slopes without having two different sets of slopes entirely with two different thicknesses to account for the two different types of drivers. Possibly doable via a flippable system, but it'd still require total disassembly of the bey to pull your slopes out, flip them, and put them back in... and if whatever holds that in place wears a little or there's too much clearance it could just make things more rattly.

And on top of that you'd have to do this while also adding in the two different heights for the QuadDrive system and other gimmicks like Spriggan's dual spin and possibly Valtryek's spring (if they bring that back). That means you have to build 2 slopes for 2 heights and make sure it can work with both, plus leave room for bonus features. If anything I'm surprised to hear that QuadDrive may actually have those two heights, it's a bit unlike Hasbro not to just strip out gimmicks like that for simplicity... but I suppose it's such a big deal for Belial/Belfyre that they couldn't cut it out of the anime. This still makes it far more difficult to be able to adjust and flip a piece 4 different ways. It may be technically possible, but would likely require removing and flipping the slopes around (which itself is undesirable, it generates a smaller part than previous chips have and makes the line less child safe and therefore less attractive to parents with really young kids).

Oh yeah, and even if they did do this, I'm pretty sure the reason why Hasbro slopes are thicker and their driver plates lower to compensate for it is so they don't break so badly with their softer plastic. Making them TT level thin could make them more fragile or prone to denting (and if it dents, then you have a damaged and maybe unusable layer), and softer Hasbro plastic isn't really good for ' driver level wear either (as earlier Pro Series has proven). There's reasons why their drivers are built so that the layers can have thicker support structures, and I don't think messing with that is a good idea in general.

THE REALLY BIG FRIGGIN' TL;DR:
-This change would add to costs to a line they're trying to make relatively cheaply
-There's no way to recoup those increasing costs short of pushing them on the buyers, making them pricier and less desirable for some
-It would go against existing and continued advertising of Pro Series being incompatible with the mainline
-The number of Pro Series driver releases is so small that you get very little out of the change anyways
-It could entice people to spend their money on overseas beys to get the most out of this feature, actively reducing sales for their own brand
-It's not TT's job to fill in holes that Hasbro makes anyways
-This change would require two different sets of slopes and a way to disassemble your layer to flip between them at a minimum
-I've already gone ad nauseum that just having "Pro Slopes" would make anything prior to their introduction (Hypersphere, Speedstorm, e.t.c.) so loose that they wouldn't work as intended on new layers, so there's no getting around having one side for each
-The most likely way to do a double-ended slope piece generates small parts and makes it a less child-safe brand
-Such a change could also make the beys perform worse, letting their parts wiggle and rattle more
-You still have other gimmicks to work this change around (e.g. Spriggan's dual spin and the QuadDrive system's dual heights) which only makes it harder to design for in a limited amount of space
-The "Pro Side" slopes would likely be more fragile and wear-prone than normal mainline releases would be as the plastic is thinner and easier to bend
-There's already reasons why Hasbro's mainline slopes are designed the way they are that contribute to the above

Yes, I've thought this through that much. The idea is simply untenable for Hasbro to attempt. Were it at the beginning of the Burst line I might've said "Well, they could pull a Pro Series with everything now and just declare everything earlier like some sort of prototype", but that doesn't work when Pro Series is but a tiny fraction of their line and ignores the hundreds of things that came before. It is way too little way too late. If you really want TT compatibility in your Hasbeys, just wait for the Pro Series releases. It's the only way Hasbro can reasonably do it at this point in time.

Oh my goodness magik, he do be writing essays tho… 

got my hands on the 2-pack, hydrax looks sick but treptune looks bad

Harsh! Haha. I kind of like Treptune. It's so fourth of July

(Aug. 01, 2021  11:28 PM)KinkoUsagi Wrote: [ -> ]Harsh! Haha. I kind of like Treptune. It's so fourth of July

*The Star-Spangled Banner Intensifies*

Treptune reminds me if one of those white red and blue toothpaste

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 31, 2021  11:22 AM)MagikHorse Wrote: [ -> ]Another surface level attempt to undermine it without giving it any real thought huh? Consider this: Many Hasbro buyers will not have access to TT compatible drivers for this to even be a feature, short of those that Hasbro didn't release through Pro Series. This means one of two things:

1: You get access to a rather small handful of drivers you couldn't before (Hasbro Pro Series), at the cost of driving up complexity and the price to build
2: You have to rely on TT to provide any meaningful amount of extra driver options

1 itself is why there's no real payoff to doing so, you're making things harder and more expensive to build just to allow a very small amount of Hasbro released parts to be usable. It's a lot of effort to do almost nothing, and goes against their existing advertising of these Pro Series beys being incompatible with the mainline. 2 is why it's possibly even a bad thing to attempt, as relying on a different brand to fill in holes in your releases is bad form in so many ways it's not even funny. It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change. It's not the biggest risk ever, but it is risking a small amount of monthly sales to provide a feature to a more narrow segment of buyers, plus the added costs of getting you there.

tl;dr It's not good on a business decision level, and simply adds more cost to the line (designing costs, added production costs) with no real way to make that money back from it without driving up the costs to the consumer. Add that to the fact that there's no way to simply adjust heights to get it to work and it becomes even harder to do. You're so focused on "more customizability" that you failed to realize that Hasbro as the producer gets absolutely nothing out of this deal, utterly no bang for their buck. They're not gonna do something they can't profit from in some manner, even if it's as simple as free advertising on their boxes like the painted disks are.


Speaking of actually thinking, I'm not sure you realize how difficult this would be on the engineering end. You can't just "redesign the slopes", the incompatibility is built straight into the drivers themselves so that what is compatible with one is incompatible (or stupidly loose) with the other. Mainline Hasbro drivers have a lower base for their drivers, and mainline Hasbro layers have thicker slopes to fit that extra bit of driver in. TT drivers fit in a smaller space, and squeeze the thicker Hasbro layers to death when applied because they're supposed to have thinner teeth to fit around instead, literally crushing the softer plastic underneath them until literally everything is loose on them. There is no way to account for this change in both height and the necessary thickness of the slopes without having two different sets of slopes entirely with two different thicknesses to account for the two different types of drivers. Possibly doable via a flippable system, but it'd still require total disassembly of the bey to pull your slopes out, flip them, and put them back in... and if whatever holds that in place wears a little or there's too much clearance it could just make things more rattly.

And on top of that you'd have to do this while also adding in the two different heights for the QuadDrive system and other gimmicks like Spriggan's dual spin and possibly Valtryek's spring (if they bring that back). That means you have to build 2 slopes for 2 heights and make sure it can work with both, plus leave room for bonus features. If anything I'm surprised to hear that QuadDrive may actually have those two heights, it's a bit unlike Hasbro not to just strip out gimmicks like that for simplicity... but I suppose it's such a big deal for Belial/Belfyre that they couldn't cut it out of the anime. This still makes it far more difficult to be able to adjust and flip a piece 4 different ways. It may be technically possible, but would likely require removing and flipping the slopes around (which itself is undesirable, it generates a smaller part than previous chips have and makes the line less child safe and therefore less attractive to parents with really young kids).

Oh yeah, and even if they did do this, I'm pretty sure the reason why Hasbro slopes are thicker and their driver plates lower to compensate for it is so they don't break so badly with their softer plastic. Making them TT level thin could make them more fragile or prone to denting (and if it dents, then you have a damaged and maybe unusable layer), and softer Hasbro plastic isn't really good for ' driver level wear either (as earlier Pro Series has proven). There's reasons why their drivers are built so that the layers can have thicker support structures, and I don't think messing with that is a good idea in general.

THE REALLY BIG FRIGGIN' TL;DR:
-This change would add to costs to a line they're trying to make relatively cheaply
-There's no way to recoup those increasing costs short of pushing them on the buyers, making them pricier and less desirable for some
-It would go against existing and continued advertising of Pro Series being incompatible with the mainline
-The number of Pro Series driver releases is so small that you get very little out of the change anyways
-It could entice people to spend their money on overseas beys to get the most out of this feature, actively reducing sales for their own brand
-It's not TT's job to fill in holes that Hasbro makes anyways
-This change would require two different sets of slopes and a way to disassemble your layer to flip between them at a minimum
-I've already gone ad nauseum that just having "Pro Slopes" would make anything prior to their introduction (Hypersphere, Speedstorm, e.t.c.) so loose that they wouldn't work as intended on new layers, so there's no getting around having one side for each
-The most likely way to do a double-ended slope piece generates small parts and makes it a less child-safe brand
-Such a change could also make the beys perform worse, letting their parts wiggle and rattle more
-You still have other gimmicks to work this change around (e.g. Spriggan's dual spin and the QuadDrive system's dual heights) which only makes it harder to design for in a limited amount of space
-The "Pro Side" slopes would likely be more fragile and wear-prone than normal mainline releases would be as the plastic is thinner and easier to bend
-There's already reasons why Hasbro's mainline slopes are designed the way they are that contribute to the above

Yes, I've thought this through that much. The idea is simply untenable for Hasbro to attempt. Were it at the beginning of the Burst line I might've said "Well, they could pull a Pro Series with everything now and just declare everything earlier like some sort of prototype", but that doesn't work when Pro Series is but a tiny fraction of their line and ignores the hundreds of things that came before. It is way too little way too late. If you really want TT compatibility in your Hasbeys, just wait for the Pro Series releases. It's the only way Hasbro can reasonably do it at this point in time.

1.  So, Hasbro bladers would have to buy Pro Series beys.  That just means more money for Hasbro.  However, due to the small amount of Pro Series drivers, available, the original drivers aren't completely alienated.  Additionally, How is this any different from the original Burst discs(Knuckle, Gravity, etc.) being completely outclassed by God Layer discs(7, 0, 00, etc.)?

2.  "It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change."

Yes, and pay almost double the price for shipping.  If Hasbro manages to offer the same product, locally, people are going to prefer them because they're cheaper.

3.  It's too expensive to slightly modify the slopes, but turning the Sparking layers into GT layers instead of just reusing Takara TOMY molds is well within the budget?

4.  "You can't just "redesign the slopes"

Yes, you can.  The walls above the slopes are what's keeping Pro Series drivers from fitting on mainline layers.  You lower these walls, and the Pro Series drivers will fit.  Of course, this leaves more wiggle room for mainline divers.  That's where you redesign the slopes.  There's a sweet spot that would allow both drivers to be viable.  All you have to do is find it.

Dude, you lost.

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 31, 2021  11:22 AM)MagikHorse Wrote: [ -> ]*snip*

4.  "You can't just "redesign the slopes"

Yes, you can.  The walls above the slopes are what's keeping Pro Series drivers from fitting on mainline layers.  You lower these walls, and the Pro Series drivers will fit.  Of course, this leaves more wiggle room for mainline divers.  That's where you redesign the slopes.  There's a sweet spot that would allow both drivers to be viable.  All you have to do is find it.

Okay then why don’t you find it 

(Aug. 02, 2021  3:27 AM)BeybladeManiac0 Wrote: [ -> ]I just realized that Hasbro has repeated names. The app refers to Ifritor I2 as "Inferno Ifritor" and there's also a Hypersphere-exclusive Salamander evolution named "Inferno Salamander". Like, what the heck, Hasbro? Not only do you screw up names, but you repeat them as well!? I don't know about you guys, but this REALLY infuriates me.

Give. Hasbro some slack he's way to lazy to make new.names oh but Inferno is cool tho... (I did not help this situation at all did i?)

(Aug. 02, 2021  3:27 AM)BeybladeManiac0 Wrote: [ -> ]I just realized that Hasbro has repeated names. The app refers to Ifritor I2 as "Inferno Ifritor" and there's also a Hypersphere-exclusive Salamander evolution named "Inferno Salamander". Like, what the heck, Hasbro? Not only do you screw up names, but you repeat them as well!? I don't know about you guys, but this REALLY infuriates me.

I think I know why Habrso used Inferno as the first name for their exclusive Salamander Evo in Rise. The original first name of the Cho-Z Salamander was Hell right? Then they changed Hell to Heat (because of its deep meaning). So, just that you know, Hell and Inferno have the same meaning, but they are just two different words. So to reference the original first name of the Cho-Z Salamander, they decided to use a word which has the same meaning as Hell, but isn't that direct to it. And that went to be Inferno. 
Maybe the reason why they ignored the Inferno of Ifritor is because it's only given in the App, and not in the actual product. Even the Fandom only says "Ifritor I2" and not "Inferno" Ifritor I2". So I think this can be the reason.

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Also why complain about it only now? Salamander got released like more than 8 months ago, so I think it's a bit irrelevant to speak about especially its name now.

2-pack review, Driger Fang got slightly better slopes than Wolborg and Draciel F but still pretty weak compared to Dranzer F this is very passable unless you want to get it but heavily discounted.

Can't wait for this Surge nightmare to be over

(Aug. 02, 2021  11:02 AM)BeySkozo Raky Wrote: [ -> ]

(Aug. 02, 2021  3:27 AM)BeybladeManiac0 Wrote: [ -> ]I just realized that Hasbro has repeated names. The app refers to Ifritor I2 as "Inferno Ifritor" and there's also a Hypersphere-exclusive Salamander evolution named "Inferno Salamander". Like, what the heck, Hasbro? Not only do you screw up names, but you repeat them as well!? I don't know about you guys, but this REALLY infuriates me.

I think I know why Habrso used Inferno as the first name for their exclusive Salamander Evo in Rise. The original first name of the Cho-Z Salamander was Hell right? Then they changed Hell to Heat (because of its deep meaning). So, just that you know, Hell and Inferno have the same meaning, but they are just two different words. So to reference the original first name of the Cho-Z Salamander, they decided to use a word which has the same meaning as Hell, but isn't that direct to it. And that went to be Inferno. 
Maybe the reason why they ignored the Inferno of Ifritor is because it's only given in the App, and not in the actual product. Even the Fandom only says "Ifritor I2" and not "Inferno" Ifritor I2". So I think this can be the reason.

---

Also why complain about it only now? Salamander got released like more than 8 months ago, so I think it's a bit irrelevant to speak about especially its name now.

I understand your reasoning, but if that was the case, why did Hasbro change King Helios to Kolossal Helios even though the name was already used by Kerbeus K2?

(Aug. 03, 2021  12:03 AM)BeybladeManiac0 Wrote: [ -> ]

(Aug. 02, 2021  11:02 AM)BeySkozo Raky Wrote: [ -> ]I think I know why Habrso used Inferno as the first name for their exclusive Salamander Evo in Rise. The original first name of the Cho-Z Salamander was Hell right? Then they changed Hell to Heat (because of its deep meaning). So, just that you know, Hell and Inferno have the same meaning, but they are just two different words. So to reference the original first name of the Cho-Z Salamander, they decided to use a word which has the same meaning as Hell, but isn't that direct to it. And that went to be Inferno. 
Maybe the reason why they ignored the Inferno of Ifritor is because it's only given in the App, and not in the actual product. Even the Fandom only says "Ifritor I2" and not "Inferno" Ifritor I2". So I think this can be the reason.

---

Also why complain about it only now? Salamander got released like more than 8 months ago, so I think it's a bit irrelevant to speak about especially its name now.

I understand your reasoning, but if that was the case, why did Hasbro change King Helios to Kolossal Helios even though the name was already used by Kerbeus K2?

cause kerbeus k2 has the name King Kerbeus used in the anime
so it isnt something game only

(Aug. 03, 2021  12:10 AM)valtaoi_007 Wrote: [ -> ]

(Aug. 03, 2021  12:03 AM)BeybladeManiac0 Wrote: [ -> ]I understand your reasoning, but if that was the case, why did Hasbro change King Helios to Kolossal Helios even though the name was already used by Kerbeus K2?

cause kerbeus k2 has the name King Kerbeus used in the anime
so it isnt something game only

Oh, ok. That makes sense. I don't watch the dub often, so I wasn't aware of that.

Hasbro should not have done the Plastic Gen remakes. I can't imagine they sell well at all and they're very poorly executed. Perhaps a limited set with all them together in one would've worked, but they probably would've still been hollowed out, missing stickers, and probably would've cost like 89.99 USD.

(Aug. 02, 2021  12:15 AM)Logic123ABC Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]1.  So, Hasbro bladers would have to buy Pro Series beys.  That just means more money for Hasbro.  However, due to the small amount of Pro Series drivers, available, the original drivers aren't completely alienated.  Additionally, How is this any different from the original Burst discs(Knuckle, Gravity, etc.) being completely outclassed by God Layer discs(7, 0, 00, etc.)?

2.  "It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change."

Yes, and pay almost double the price for shipping.  If Hasbro manages to offer the same product, locally, people are going to prefer them because they're cheaper.

3.  It's too expensive to slightly modify the slopes, but turning the Sparking layers into GT layers instead of just reusing Takara TOMY molds is well within the budget?

4.  "You can't just "redesign the slopes"

Yes, you can.  The walls above the slopes are what's keeping Pro Series drivers from fitting on mainline layers.  You lower these walls, and the Pro Series drivers will fit.  Of course, this leaves more wiggle room for mainline divers.  That's where you redesign the slopes.  There's a sweet spot that would allow both drivers to be viable.  All you have to do is find it.

Dude, you lost.

Says you.

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(Aug. 02, 2021  2:08 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote: [ -> ]

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]4.  "You can't just "redesign the slopes"

Yes, you can.  The walls above the slopes are what's keeping Pro Series drivers from fitting on mainline layers.  You lower these walls, and the Pro Series drivers will fit.  Of course, this leaves more wiggle room for mainline divers.  That's where you redesign the slopes.  There's a sweet spot that would allow both drivers to be viable.  All you have to do is find it.

Okay then why don’t you find it 

I did. It's why I even brought it up.  Here's an example.  The red is a hypothetical redesign of the slopes, using that sweet spot.

(Aug. 01, 2021  9:07 PM)originalzankye Wrote: [ -> ]
got my hands on the 2-pack, hydrax looks sick but treptune looks bad

Pretty sure the Treptune color reference is Master Dragoon 😉

(Aug. 03, 2021  1:39 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]

(Aug. 02, 2021  12:15 AM)Logic123ABC Wrote: [ -> ]Dude, you lost.

Says you.

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(Aug. 02, 2021  2:08 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote: [ -> ]Okay then why don’t you find it 

I did. It's why I even brought it up.  Here's an example.  The red is a hypothetical redesign of the slopes, using that sweet spot.

Even if there's a way of making the slopes compatible, wouldn't that mean that Hasbro would have to remake ALL mainline layers, chips and drivers again only to making it useful?

(Aug. 03, 2021  12:12 PM)Hollowmind8 Wrote: [ -> ]

(Aug. 03, 2021  1:39 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]Says you.

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I did. It's why I even brought it up.  Here's an example.  The red is a hypothetical redesign of the slopes, using that sweet spot.

Even if there's a way of making the slopes compatible, wouldn't that mean that Hasbro would have to remake ALL mainline layers, chips and drivers again only to making it useful?

Not really.  They could just make it a feature of a new line of layers.

(Aug. 03, 2021  12:12 PM)Hollowmind8 Wrote: [ -> ]

(Aug. 03, 2021  1:39 AM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]Says you.

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I did. It's why I even brought it up.  Here's an example.  The red is a hypothetical redesign of the slopes, using that sweet spot.

Even if there's a way of making the slopes compatible, wouldn't that mean that Hasbro would have to remake ALL mainline layers, chips and drivers again only to making it useful?

This ^
Asking for Pro Series to have slopes is pointless they already did the system and advertised it is authentic to the JP product there is little to no chance that Hasbro will decide to do ANOTHER series like Pro just to have slopes.

It sucks but it is what is.

Wishful thinking aside, I think QuadDrive System looks pretty interesting at first blush. The idea seems like a creative derivative from existing Takara Tomy design ideas (High/Low modes) and doesn't seem to be either samey and repetitive (like HyperSphere was) or dull (like SpeedStorm was). Cautiously optimistic for Hasbro's future products.

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]1.  So, Hasbro bladers would have to buy Pro Series beys.  That just means more money for Hasbro.  However, due to the small amount of Pro Series drivers, available, the original drivers aren't completely alienated.  Additionally, How is this any different from the original Burst discs(Knuckle, Gravity, etc.) being completely outclassed by God Layer discs(7, 0, 00, etc.)?

Hasbro bladers don't have to buy into this gimmick at all you know. Advertising it might make it more enticing, but Hasbro Pro is also relatively more expensive than the mainline and would make this gimmick undesirable for a buyer on an allowance. For them you're literally just giving them a less useful product since by your own admission you're still weakening the slopes for OG Hasbro drivers at all and giving them less value unless they specifically buy into the TT/Pro cross-compatibility. Maybe they just like the driver gimmicks and don't care about Pro either, you're just screwing them over too. Odds seem high that you're screwing over more people than you're ever helping by doing this.

And to the disk point... I really don't see the relevance of bringing this up at all. Like, both brands did the same things with their disks during that span of the line, and for the Evolution block Hasbro was still sticking really close to TT and not cheaping out as badly as they have been in recent times with their hollowed out GT disks, lighter Wheel disk, these cheap and tiny double chassis disks... It sort of looks like you're not keeping up with the changing times, or else trying to make an argument about why disks should never be powercrept in a discussion about layer slopes for some reason. It just seems totally off-base, either misguided or a desperate attempt to pin something somewhere.

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]2.  "It encourages people to spend their money on overseas beys if they learn about the cross-brand compatibility, and if they only have so much money to spend and spend it there they're not supporting Hasbro as much and may lose some sales from the change."

Yes, and pay almost double the price for shipping.  If Hasbro manages to offer the same product, locally, people are going to prefer them because they're cheaper.

I don't think you have a clue how much Pro costs. Pro costs $20 a piece, more expensive than their mainline by far. I can find a TT Zwei Longinus on eBay mostly between $18-$23, a very similar price point (when you exclude the wild $13 and $28 outliers that really don't fit in). You're overblowing the prices in your favor, and it's not hard to find better deals with just a little looking around. The fact that they're local is the only real draw I can see here, but given the general wear issues of Hasbro's Pro Series until the latest wave I also don't trust their quality as much either. It still is utterly useless without Pro Series in your pocket, and many kids on a limited allowance may not want to buy into Pro Series' high price tag (or TT's either, for that matter). At best it's still not useful to a fair chunk of the target audience.

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]3.  It's too expensive to slightly modify the slopes, but turning the Sparking layers into GT layers instead of just reusing Takara TOMY molds is well within the budget?

Once again a grab at something you don't understand. There is not a single Hasbro Burst beyblade made with an official TT mold that isn't Pro Series. At the very least they have to change the teeth into their slopes, which results in new molds being produced for Hasbro use (you can't just change a piece of a mold out for another). The same is true for drivers as well, once again due to the differences in their systems and the incompatibilities I've already pointed out (though they can possibly just replace the top piece of those instead of redoing the whole thing).

For earlier releases it was mostly just this (though some layers like Odax, Nepstrius, Wyvron, Wyvron W2, and Valtryek V2 had additional modifications in their Hasbro release, mostly more aggressive slopes or an extra type of reinforcement), but from GT on they had to make extra changes too to fuse the layer weights to them and redo the chip system. This carried on to Sparking as well, and looks to be totally revamped for DB/QuadDrive too. You don't seem to understand why, so I'll explain it: Cheaper layers that use less material net greater profits, and that can offset the costs of the changed molds. Excluding the vast majority of metal from their layers in particular saves a ton of money, as metal is pricier than plastic. Since they're doing that already might as well do some other changes since you're going to be creating an entirely new mold anyways, such as their easily assembled two-piece layer system that was carried over between GT and Sparking. Like, that design is so simple and easy I can't imagine it took them any real time or resources at all to do it, and once it's been done once it's easy to copy/paste to everything else too.

tl;dr They have to make new layer molds for their system anyways, making their layers hollowed out and copy/pasting incredibly basic multi-part layer assembly systems overall gets dividends back in greater profits from the hollowed out layers. Be glad they didn't just fuse the chips in, they could have totally done that too if they wanted to go even cheaper.

(Jul. 31, 2021  4:38 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: [ -> ]4.  "You can't just "redesign the slopes"

Yes, you can.  The walls above the slopes are what's keeping Pro Series drivers from fitting on mainline layers.  You lower these walls, and the Pro Series drivers will fit.  Of course, this leaves more wiggle room for mainline divers.  That's where you redesign the slopes.  There's a sweet spot that would allow both drivers to be viable.  All you have to do is find it.

Where is this "sweet spot" then? If you don't make it as thin as TT/Pro designs you'll squeeze it too hard and damage the bey when you equip TT/Pro drivers, and you'll destroy it quickly. You can only make it marginally thicker at best (which will already make non-' TT/Pro drivers tighter than they should be, more like ' drivers which would already damage their softer plastic more and create a wearing issue), and at that point OG Hasbro drivers are too loose to really matter. This is a last ditch effort to sound like you know what you're doing, but unless you can actually provide a working model to prove it your claim is unbelievable from logic alone, because that logic dictates that either they will be breakable/have wear issues or they will make the vast pool of older Hasbro drivers unfeasibly loose. There's simply not enough wiggle room in these design for this to be workable, and it still sacrifices the older systems for this new one way late into their line even if it did function.

By doing this you're still hurting a significant amount of players to satisfy some niche urge of others. I can't condone that decision, especially not this late into the line.