random stamina rant
(May. 22, 2013 10:46 PM)Ultra Wrote: [ -> ]Um Dragooon combos are spin stealers which are stamina and they dominate the metagame and probably always will... The reason that Zero G Synchrom wheels aren't good at stamina is more to do how they heavy they are.
While spin steal is arguably a subset of Stamina, it is not, in fact, pure Stamina. Basalt and spin stealers have "stamina" due to interaction with their opponent. This affects the relative balance of stamina in between the two beyblades, allowing Basalt to chew away at its opponent's momentum faster than it loses its own, or for a spin stealer to "take" some of its opponents momentum. However, smooth-edged MWs like Duo are pretty much unaffected by Basalt, and Death has shown its magical resistance to spin stealers. All these have stamina-like aspects, in that they attempt to OS their opponent, but are somewhat gimmicky in comparison to "pure" Stamina MWs.
My issue is that Genbull is all alone in ZG Stamina. It's also fairly difficult to obtain two for a Synchrome, because it's only obatinable through a Random Booster. To me the Zero-G meta looks pretty lopsided; there's an abundace of Attack-types, some Defense-types (but only one really good one), only one (albeit very useful) spin-steal, and only one Stamina. While there will certainly be many, many more releases, if this trend continues, it's going to look very bad for Stamina-type users like myself. I want more diversity because that increases the chance that something might be really good, have some quality the designer didn't intend that makes it interesting.
*cough cough* basalt and death *cough cough*
Genbull isn't the best ZERO-G Wheel in terms of pure Stamina. Killerken has better Stamina, for example. Whether that translates into the specific combo you guys have been talking about is another matter, though.
(May. 23, 2013 3:53 PM)Ultra Wrote: [ -> ]I don't really understand physics but I think the reason that synchroms are less inclined to stamina is because of the massive increase in weight. I'm now thinking however. I believe that due to the increase in weight aspects of stamina combos need to be adjusted. This is vague but here is my understanding of why that combo works:
According to my research more weight means faster precession which is what happens when a beyblade loses energy. Once it loses all it's energy it will stop spinning. So:
I don't either, so I'm not going to try to explain my point of view haha. Hopefully somebody who does can shed some light on the issue for us.
Um many many more releases? From where exactly? It looks like Takara is going into a break for a few years meaning that MFB is done.
You can be technical with types all you want but tbh Zero G has changed things. Look at plastics in comparison for example. Reviser Dragooon is essentially a zombie. Or to be more precise it's a defensive zombie. It's left spinning and has got good LAD. For plastics there isn't any such thing as pure stamina. Beyond zombies there is no stamina in plastics. The only other things that come close are compacts which are themselves split into several types.
So you can moan that spin stealers aren't real stamina or whatever but tbh they are what's top tier. They are top tier stamina these days. What used to be very niche and not that effective with things like MLD TR145EWD is now pretty dominant.
Also I wouldn't agree with the point that you said about Genbull. If my theory is correct (can anyone with physics knowledge weigh in please?!) then we just need more testing. Again if my theory is correct I see no reason why reviser couldn't be a top tier wheel for stamina. Once we use physics to identify the reason the heavy weight of synchroms makes the old stamina types work then it shouldn't be a hard task.
Orojya, Killerken, Girago and Saramanda could be tested for stamina, (mostly the first two, but the last two can be "substitude") also when Sonokong release Genbull we well see more test of it, but that at least 5 wheels can be useful for stamina because weight can handle recoil, and they don't have so huge contact points, Girago isn't tested for the same reason of Genbull, Killerken, Orojya and Saramanda should have more actual tests because of the tracks and tips that were released after them
I'm not trying to rip on Revizer Dragooon, it's a scary good setup. I'm trying to point out that Dragooon can't be used the same way as Phantom or Duo.
EDIT:
Hasbro's sabotage of 4D has me going on a little Zero-G witch hunt, sorry.
I guess I'm just overly suspicious against new releases... Takara Tomy has had several years to figure out what works and what doesn't in MFB/ZG, so they know what to make. Lack of parts diversity concerns me because I'm used to dud parts getting released with the good ones. I also notice that I underestimated the usefulness of Synchrome. MSF-H Bahamdia Ifraid SA165R2F is an example of that; using one Chrome Wheel to show the contact points of another is very different from what was possible in MFB; it's practically creating your own MW, and I overlooked that. After not being on for several months, I need to do more research and testing before I'm caught up again, and I feel it was kind of a newbie mistake I shouldn't have made to start this discussion.
"Making your own metal wheel" I really, really like that, nice way to put it!
Yea, I wish there were more 0G Stamina combos as well. Thats why I plan on buying more Stamina oriented 0G Beys. I also hope we find some use to Crystal Wheels. I mean, I know weight is huge, but these parts are just sitting there doing nothing and I always end up saying, "There's gotta be something to do with these..." Only time will tell, I guess.
I think zero g with crystal wheel should have it's own category, but has casual, maybe I will do a thread of that
(May. 23, 2013 6:06 PM)Izhkoort Wrote: [ -> ]Orojya, Killerken, Girago and Saramanda could be tested for stamina, (mostly the first two, but the last two can be "substitude") also when Sonokong release Genbull we well see more test of it, but that at least 5 wheels can be useful for stamina because weight can handle recoil, and they don't have so huge contact points, Girago isn't tested for the same reason of Genbull, Killerken, Orojya and Saramanda should have more actual tests because of the tracks and tips that were released after them
Saramanda's been proven that it has God-awful weight distribution in the past, and that doesn't help with the stamina. Even 2x Saramanda is extremely bad, just because of the weight distribution.
Killerken > Genbull > Orojya is how I see it.
(May. 23, 2013 10:21 PM)UGottaCetus Wrote: [ -> ]Yea, I wish there were more 0G Stamina combos as well. Thats why I plan on buying more Stamina oriented 0G Beys. I also hope we find some use to Crystal Wheels. I mean, I know weight is huge, but these parts are just sitting there doing nothing and I always end up saying, "There's gotta be something to do with these..." Only time will tell, I guess.
There's really only one possible Crystal Wheel that I could see having any potential use, and that's Dark Knight, because it's left spin. And it would only do well as a mediocre Dragooon. All of the other Crystal Wheels are pretty useless, due to low weight, and metal on plastic contact always results in a lot of recoil on the plastic side. Dark Knight is the only one with any potential, IMO.
yeah, it's the worst of the wheels I said but still, from the wiki: "Synchrom by itself: Saramanda's side contact points line up almost to perfection when it is put in Synchrom with itself, and seems to have good balance since its weight distribution is consequently symmetrical. Because of this equilibrium, it has some minor Stamina potential, but not top tier.
I know Saramanda very well (I have 3 Saramandas, had 4, and at some time I wanted 8!) and still I think like many other wheels that has to be tested again because we know more of them now than when Orojya and Saramanda were originally released
I have a thought, it is people say W²D is on par with WD but not in Hasbro stadiums it is'nt
in Hasbro stadiums it hits the slope and the side scrapes against the slope and by the time it gets off the slope the beyblade with it usually has already stopped spinning!!
I recently got in touch with Adachi Takafumi, who worked with the show in some capacity. I asked if the production team received a special one of a kind beyblade like the Gold DJ Wyvern the Bakuten Shoot production team received. And this is what he responded with.
Beyblade Can anyone identity this
(May. 26, 2013 11:45 PM)Dark_Mousy Wrote: [ -> ]I recently got in touch with Adachi Takafumi, who worked with the show in some capacity. I asked if the production team received a special one of a kind beyblade like the Gold DJ Wyvern the Bakuten Shoot production team received. And this is what he responded with. Beyblade Can anyone identity this
I remember looking at a thread that Kai-V made about this. Someone made it for some else's birthday.
(May. 26, 2013 11:45 PM)Dark_Mousy Wrote: [ -> ]I recently got in touch with Adachi Takafumi, who worked with the show in some capacity. I asked if the production team received a special one of a kind beyblade like the Gold DJ Wyvern the Bakuten Shoot production team received. And this is what he responded with. Beyblade Can anyone identity this
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Awesome-...i-Takafumi
Yo, why do you not ask me before asking him. Also, do you not read my threads hah ? First Osamu Mashimo, now this.
(May. 27, 2013 1:01 AM)Kai-V Wrote: [ -> ] (May. 26, 2013 11:45 PM)Dark_Mousy Wrote: [ -> ]I recently got in touch with Adachi Takafumi, who worked with the show in some capacity. I asked if the production team received a special one of a kind beyblade like the Gold DJ Wyvern the Bakuten Shoot production team received. And this is what he responded with. Beyblade Can anyone identity this
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Awesome-...i-Takafumi
Yo, why do you not ask me before asking him. Also, do you not read my threads hah ? First Osamu Mashimo, now this.
Its the lack of sleep from traveling. I would think the MFB production team had to have been given something i would think.
So my Berserker Begirados came today (three cheers for super-fast powerpig shipping) and when I got it out, I freaked out. I was not expecting Begirados to be mostly hollow. Expecting the worst, I checked to make sure it was, in fact, Takara-Tomy. Seeing as it was, I got out my scale and weighed it. It weighs 30.9 grams, slightly heavier than what Beywiki states. I'm impressed and shocked; if it was completely filled with metal, it would probably weigh twice as much.
AAAAAAHHHHHHHHH! 120g Synchroms! AAAAAAHHHHHHHH!
i just found out that if i use my Leone, aquario, and cancer clear wheels can be used with a left spin launcher so now i'm most likely going to see if the cosmic fusion wheel will be a good smash attacker left spin.
Well ok, but its illegal, so I don't know why you'd test it?
Unless they are manufacturing errors, which is very uncommon, they are almost certainly fakes. Either way, they are illegal.
I so so think that there should be two of these kinds of Chrome Wheel-
- A dual spin
- A one with rubber(27 grams metal, about 2-3 grams rubber).
This would change the Dragooon dominated Meta-game
(May. 30, 2013 3:50 PM)zeneo Wrote: [ -> ]I so so think that there should be two of these kinds of Chrome Wheel-
- A dual spin
- A one with rubber(27 grams metal, about 2-3 grams rubber).
This would change the Dragooon dominated Meta-game
That would go in
this thread.
But I do agree that dual-spins are extreemly useful for countering spin-stealers, especially if the dual-spin is very heavy. Run into a right-spin? Switch to left and win by spin-stealing. Going against Death B : D? Right-spin. Battling a spin-stealer? Kill it with left-spin.
About a week or two ago I was posting about how I had trouble with my launchers. So I decided to take some apart and see what was wrong with them. I couldn't really see anything other than dust and some plastic that was peeling off of the molds, so I removed those. Even when I put them back exactly the same, the main launcher I was tinkering with, was still having problems, but then I decided to change the ripcord(which had 1 messed up ridge) and replace it with a perfectly good one. After that, the launcher work GREAT. The same thing happened when I switched some ripcords of the other launchers, and some of them worked better as well. So I don't know if it was just the ripcords or what, but I'm glad that I got one working really well. I can finally see Bahamdia full power!!
I find that worn LL2s lose a lot of power as compared to new shiny ones. I would say that a pretty heavily worn LL2 has maybe half the power of a brand new one.
Regarding Light Launchers, I really appreciate how Zero-G launchers have a small plastic ring around the ripcord hole. Old LL2s get pretty much sliced in half from friction, which doesn't happen as easily with the separate ring piece.
Get Beylaunchers if you can!! They're more consistent IMO and are much more powerful!
I'm gonna back up a few conversations about 0G stamina: Yes, Killerken has cool stamina, but as KainHighwind first told me (I did some informal tests and he was right) Killerken Killerken has less stamina than Genbull Genbull. That being said, Genbull Genbull needs a specific setup to work, namely SR200TB (or Genbull Genbull TH170TB, which is by far my favorite stamina custom at the moment). In almost every respect, 0G stamina is still outclassed by the likes of Duo and Phantom except in VERY specific customs.
(before you ask I've forgotten what Genbull + Killerken was like x) )
More Staminaminaminuh stuff-
I was stamina-testing my new Zero-G stuff, and found some very interesting results.
By the way, I KNOW solo spin times don't mean a whole lot, but still, this is surprising.
Benchmark:
Phantom Cancer W145WD: 3:53
Synchroms (Each with the same W145WD):
Killerken Killerken: 2:36 <--This is shameful.
Revizer Killerken: 3:02
Goriem Killerken: 3:04
Wyvang Killerken: 3:06
Begirados Killerken: 3:07
Ifraid Killerken: 3:23
Orjoya Killerken: 3:26
And, shockingly, the best I tested-
Balro Killerken:
4:30I did redo all of these tests several times each. These times represent the best times I got. (I read a good chunk of a book whilst waiting XD)
With BALRO. O.o
It outdid
Phantom!
Incredible!