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MFB: Limited :: Competitive Customs List and Public Discussion

Dec. 04, 2013  1:37 AM
 
:: MFB: Limited ::
Competitive Customs List and Public Discussion
For the BB-10 Attack Type Stadium, and some parts are banned

Welcome, everybody, to the competitive custom list and public discussion for the MFB: Limited format! In this format, Metal Fight Beyblades are used, but some parts are banned! Battles are conducted in the BB-10 Attack Type Stadium.

For a list of the currently banned parts, click here.

If you're just looking for the competitive list, just scroll down to that section below. If you're here to discuss what should go on the list, keep reading!

-=-=-=-=-

When it comes to updating the competitive customs list, the Advanced forum has an unfortunate habit of falling behind the newest customs being brewed, meaning the latest customs might not be listed and out-of-date customs might still be on the list. With this in mind, we are creating this public discussion to hopefully garner a better idea of what needs to be included or removed from the competitive list.

The way this will work is that both the public and the advanced threads will remain open with the advanced thread acting as a "final word" as to what, exactly, the competitive list will look like. This thread will act as a way for anyone to provide much-needed input between list updates, with the hope that this discussion will aid in overcoming the lethargic update patterns from which the competitive list frequently suffers.

While we're on that topic, the Advanced Forum Competitive Limited Customs List Discussion can be found here. (Currently that thread does not exist! Oh no!)

I must implore all of you to please be intelligent about what you post in here. If you are going to propose a brand new custom, you will have to provide actual test and/or tournament results to back your claim up. If there is something that isn't on the list that obviously should be or there is something that you don't think should be on the list any more, please still provide as much insight into your suggestions as possible.

The main thing is that this thread has been tried in the past and had to be closed and moved to the advanced forum. I do not think anyone wants to see that happen again, so please be smart about what you post!

So, in closing, the current competitive list can be found below and an archive of all the recent lists is under that. Let's get discussing!


:: Current Competitive Limited Customs List ::
As of September 28th 2016

This is a list of the currently competitive combos in WBO Organized Play's Limited Format. Will be updated as new tests are conducted and tournaments are played.


Limited Top Tier List Wrote:
Attack


Pegasis
  • MF-H Pegasis (CH120/R145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Lightning
  • MF-H Lightning L-Drago [Upper] (85/90/100/W105/DF105/LW105/CH120/R145/TR145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Wyvang
  • MSF-H (Shinobi/Gladiator/Samurai/Bandid) Wyvang [Crystal-Up] (R145/H145/GB145/TR145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Gravity
  • MF-H Gravity Perseus (S130/CH120/R145/TR145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Vulcan
  • MF-H Vulcan (Byxis/Pisces/Uranus/Horuseus/Giraffe/Gemios) (85/90/100/W105/DF105/LW105/CH120) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Screw
  • MF-H Screw (Uranus/Pisces/Horogium) (85/90/100/W105/DF105/LW105) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)


Defense


Earth
  • MF-H Earth (Aquario/Cygnus/Cancer/Hades/Sagittario II) (85/90/R145/GB145/TH170/230) (RSF/RB)

Scythe (Metal Fury)
  • MF-H Scythe (Aquario/Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (R145/GB145/TH170/230) (RSF/RB)

Bakushin
  • MF-H Bakushin (Leone/Escolpio/Gemios/Aires/Libra) (85/90) (RSF/RB/RF)

Jade (4D / Hyperblades)
  • {MF(-H/-L)} Jade (Pisces/Horogium/Cygnus/Uranus/Escolpio/Gemios) (85/90) (RSF/RB)


Stamina


Burn
  • {MF-L} Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TR145/SW145/ED145/W145/85) (WD/EWD)
  • {MF-L} Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D

Earth
  • {MF-L} Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades/Sagittario II) (TR145/SW145/ED145/W145/85) (WD/EWD)
  • {MF-L} Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades/Sagittario II) B:D
  • {MF-L}[/color] Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades/Sagittario II) (TH170/230) (D/SD/MB/EDS)

Scythe (Metal Fury)
  • {MF-L} Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TR145/SW145/ED145/W145) (WD/EWD)
  • {MF-L} Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D
  • {MF-L} Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/230) (D/SD/EDS)

Duo (Metal Fury)
  • {MF-L} Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TR145/SW145/ED145/W145) (WD/EWD)
  • {MF-L} Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D
  • {MF-L} Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/230) (D/SD/EDS/MB)

Meteo
  • {MF(-H/-L)} Meteo L-Drago (TR145/ED145/CH120/S130) EWD


Balance
  • {MF(-H/-L)} (Scythe/Earth/Flame) (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/SR200/230) (CS/MB/EDS)
  • {MF-L} Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades/Escolpio/Gemios) (85/90) MF
  • {MF-L} Scythe (Escolpio/Pegasis II/Gemios/Hades/Cygnus/Cancer) (90/W105/DF105/LW105) MF
  • MF-H Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) CH120 RF
  • (Duo/Scythe) (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) F230 (CF/GCF)
  • {MF(-H/-L)} Meteo L-Drago (TR145/ED145/CH120/S130) (CF/GCF/GF)
  • Meteo L-Drago F230 (CF/GCF)
  • Gravity Perseus F230 (CF/GCF)
  • Gravity Perseus (S130/CH120/TR145/ED145) (CF/GCF/GF)



:: Competitive Limited Customs List Archives ::

From 01/15/15 to 09/28/16 (Click to View)

There haven't been any official lists yet! Get discussing!
Dec. 04, 2013  4:28 PM
 
Here is a draft cc list I made while doing testing on parts for the format back when it was a tiny private project (hence some prospective notes like "if RS is illegal" etc). Keep in mind I lack anything from Zero G aside from Revizer, Dragooon, Saramanda, Samurai, E230 and SA165, I don't have any Metal Fury and I also lack Cloud, Crash, Divine, Forbidden, TR145, SWD, and I didn't try Bakushin because mine is an eclipse ver and I had it in a box under my bed (or MB and W2D for stamina as I never got around to that), so they aren't accounted for at all by this. Basically: I'm just posting this as a starting point for discussion, the list in general, and also because it has some tips on good benchmark combos etc.

Faces: MF-H's seem to be the best choice for attack and defense, regular faces for stamina but don't be afraid to experiment there or anywhere really (MF-M seems to provide better stability for stamina types which can be helpful for spin stealing matchups and various other things for example). I assume metal stone faces are the same but I don't own any.

Attack:
MF-H Gravity Perseus (ATK>DEF) 85/90/CH120/D125/R145/TH170 RF/R2F/LRF
MF-H Lightning L Drago 85/CH120/R145 RF/LRF
MF-H Leone 85/90/CH120/R145 RF/R2F (TH170 might be an option).
MF-H Pegasis 85/90/R145 RF/R2F
MF-H Screw Pisces/Horogium/Uranus 85/90/R145 RF/R2F
MF-H Ray Kerbecs/Unicorno II/Unicorno/Whatever 85/90/R145 RF/R2F (borderline)
If RS is illegal, Vulcan and Quetz also get a spot, with low tracks, CH120S and GB145 being the best choices (GB145 in particular for quetz, Vulcan really prefers being under things/low tracks in general and doesn't work well on tall tracks at least from what I've tried (which matches what I remember from back in the day).)


Notes:
Yes, Screw and maybe even Ray work better than Vulcan, mostly because Vulcan isn't very good in same-height matchups or against lower opponents or on tall tracks in general really, and also doesn't have good synergy with R145 which seems to be a big deal. I've tried old and new ones, it does work very well on low tracks vs 145 defense, however given LTDC will be a thing and that lightning does better against them, it just seems kinda inferior to lightning.

Gravity, Lightning and Leone are good for benchmarking.

On Tracks: R145 seems to be the best choice in general by a significant margin, weight (and ability to put it right under contact points) and some ability to handle lower opponents is extremely useful.
GB145 seems to be the best option for two-sided attackers.

85 has use on lightning for doing well against LTDC, and on Gravity for OSing libra LTDC.
CH120/D125 might work on more than Gravity/Lightning but I haven't really tested anything else with those tracks yet. The same goes for TH170 but gravity benefits more significantly by being able to OS Earth 85RF/RSF (but not RS). Have only tried leone as an alternative though, so others might work (screw perhaps?)
SW145, UW145, H145 might be viable, but I've had no luck with H145 and the others have to contend with R145 for a spot so eh.

Metal Flat ends up making things too balancey seeing as there's nothing like flash here.


Defense/Anti-Attack
Clear Wheels are the same as regular MFB
MF-H Earth ___ 85/90/GB145/TH170/230 CS/MF/RSF/RF
MF-H Libra ____ 85/90/GB145 CS/MF/RSF/RF
MF-H Flame ____ 230/TH170??? CS/MF/RSF (borderline, RF seems like a bad idea)
MSF-H Reviser ____ 85/90/GB145/TH170/230 CS/MF/RSF (RF will get you outspun by a lot of things)

Notes:
Earth and Libra are the best wheels to use for benchmarking as Flame is situational/limited to tall tracks and Reviser has its balance issues. CS and RSF are generally the best choices for tips for benchmarking, particularly RSF given CS's variability. RF/MF move too much to be truly consistent.

Stamina:

I don't have SWD, and haven't tried W2D and MB. They would likely be competitive I guess (MB is a maybe, and only on tall tracks). I don't have any Zero G tracks/tips that are legal, either.
Earth ____ 85/90/AD145/TH170/230 D/SD/WD/EWD
Burn ____ 85/90/AD145/TH170/230 D/SD/WD/EWD
Virgo _____ 85/90/AD145/TH170/230 D/SD/WD/EWD
Libra 85/90 D/EWD/SD/EDS? (Libra is only here because it can take hits well and has okay stamina, so it's more balancey)
MLD Spinstealers are probably going to have some place too, though earth could pose a problem for them if I remember things correctly.
Thermal might be worth trying as some people had success with it, but I was very much not one of them.

Notes: Earth and Burn are standard, gold standard for stamina v stamina tests on metal wheels used to be putting both on 145WD and making sure the WD's were both at least near mint so that still stands I guess. Virgo is probably not great to test against because of the whole mold thing.

Balance:
Haven't tried anything serious yet, presumably Gravity CH120MF, MLD CH120XF, and various other things would work. MF-M Rock Cancer 85/90MF is cool to mess around with, but almost certainly not competitive. 230MB combos could go here, perhaps. LDrago 85MF might be usable etc, MLD CH120XF will work, and maybe some things with libra, idk. Attack dominance and no RDF should prevent anything too powerful in balance though, at least not anything that doesn't show up as broken for another type. Oh, F230 will be there so there's that and CF/GCF might also be exploitable some other way but yeah.
Dec. 04, 2013  11:06 PM
 
I've been looking at a few stamina combinations, mostly Burn ___ 90 MF, Earth ___ AD145 EWD/WD, & Meteo L Drago GB145 EWD/WD. I'll put up some tests later this week.
Dec. 05, 2013  3:18 AM
 
Would anyone be willing to do tests with (Metal Fury) Beat ____ 90 RF/R2F and Meteo L-Drago BGrin, unfortunately, no BB-10 access. Tongue_out
Dec. 05, 2013  3:25 AM
 
Meteo l drago ch120 ewd
Enough said.
Dec. 05, 2013  3:34 AM
 
This custom was brought up years ago, but what about MF-H Burn____90RF? It seems that Burn had decent smash. Here is my list:
Attack

Gravity Perseus
MF-H Gravity Perseus(Right Spin, Counter Mode)CH120R2F/RF/MF
Lightning L Drago
Lightning L Drago CH120RF/R2F/MF
Balro
MSF/MSF-H Samurai Balro(Crystal Down Mode)CH120R2F/RF/MF
Wyvang
MSF/MSF-H Archer Wyvang 145(?)R2F/RF/MF

Defense

MSF/MSF-H Dark Knight Reviser/Killerken(Crystal Up/Down Mode) E230CS

Stamina
Genbull
Dark Knight Genbull(Crystal Down Mode)SR200TB
Dark Knight Genbull(Crystal Down Mode)TH170TB
Dark Knight Genbull(Crystal Up Mode)TR145WD/EWD
Burn
MF-L Burn Cancer/Cygnus W145WD
Earth
MF-L Earth Cancer/Cygnus W145WD

Dragooon
Dark Knight Dragooon(Crystal Up/Down Mode)TR145EWD/WD

Balance
MF-L Burn Cancer/Cygnus 85MF
Dark Knight Genbull(Crystal Down)E230(Boost Mode)MB
Archer Gryph(Crystal Down Mode)E230(Normal Mode)BSF
Dec. 05, 2013  3:36 AM
 
It looks nice, I say we need Meteo BGrin testing, haha.
As far as Stamina, why TR145 on that Genbull combo? Wouldn't AD145 or W145 provide more use?

Also, to what GA said, E230 and the other Disk Tracks are banned.

Barely any of these were tested, though. Tongue_out
Dec. 05, 2013  3:37 AM
 
Don't forget E230 and other related round disks are banned.
Dec. 05, 2013  3:38 AM
 
TR145 is on that Genbull combo because it is Dark Knight which is left spin, and TR145 has tons of LAD.
GB145 on the Defense and all other E230 is banned.
Dec. 05, 2013  3:44 AM
 
(Dec. 05, 2013  3:38 AM)Shining God MS Wrote: TR145 is on that Genbull combo because it is Dark Knight which is left spin, and TR145 has tons of LAD.
GB145 on the Defense and all other E230 is banned.

What...? (To the second part, haha)

I don't get what you mean, haha. Tongue_out
Dec. 05, 2013  3:45 AM
 
Whoa whoa whoa, it is wayyyyy too early to be talking about a full competitive custom list!! This format just came out today; half those customs have never been officially tested! Until this format has grown some legs, just use this thread to advocate individual customs that have test results to back them up! We won't have a true competitive list for quite awhile, which is why I made that "Test against these customs" in the first place!
Dec. 05, 2013  3:46 AM
 
What I meant was that on the E230 Defense combo, it will only be GB145 for Defense, and the other combos w/ E230 on there are banned.
Dec. 05, 2013  3:49 AM
 
Well, I really don't know how all these crystal wheels are going to work out, especially with Stamina and/or defense...

Like Ingulit said we will defenitely need to test first.
Dec. 05, 2013  3:50 AM
 
...

@th!nk: Um... I'm sorry if I'm totally out of it, but, why the heck is MF in the Defense section? I mean, granted Attack customizations in limited format aren't as high-powered as the ones we have in the standard meta, but don't you think it would get, I don't know, destroyed?

I know Gravity and Lightning can't take a 230MF-height custom very well, but you've gotta remember we have Metal Fury Cosmic and Beat now. Those things are a heck of a lot more powerful than Gravity or Lightning any day.

Libra GB145MF will get shredded by an Attacker on S130/D125. :\ Especially if it's a Gravity or Lightning variant. I don't know, the idea of having a Metal, flat Bottom on a Defense custom just bothers me. Granted, I'm nowhere near as well informed in this category as I am in Zero-G or Standard Format, but I do know a bit about these things.

If I'm completely wrong, then please educate me, heheh. XD I wasn't really around for most of this stuff. Tongue_out
Dec. 05, 2013  4:10 AM
 
I am very Confused What's This mostly saying?
Dec. 05, 2013  5:40 AM
 
@tbd : mf is there primarily for tall tracks, where it's momentum+ability to catch the ridge are very useful. It isn't bad on Libra LTDC either iirc. It does veer more towards balance but it is very workable for defense in the right set up.
Also if beat and cosmic are that much stronger than gravity, they may well end up banned anyway, given gravity is pushing it as it is.

On a side note, everyone is overlooking LTDC, funnily enough 85 is probably the best defense track in limited.
Dec. 05, 2013  8:22 PM
 
Huh...I wonder if Earth Cancer 230TB would work like Duo Cancer 230TB...
Dec. 05, 2013  8:28 PM
 
What about bakushin CS? Bakushin defence can really be good if basalt is out of the equation
Dec. 05, 2013  8:37 PM
 
(Dec. 05, 2013  8:22 PM)Striker Phantom Wrote: Huh...I wonder if Earth Cancer 230TB would work like Duo Cancer 230TB...

This thread is supposed to just be about the competitive list, but this post would go really well in the Random Thoughts thread instead! Here:
worldbeyblade.org/Thread-MFB-Limited-Primer-Random-Thoughts-and-Q-A-Thread

(Dec. 05, 2013  8:28 PM)DRAGON KING Wrote: What about bakushin CS? Bakushin defence can really be good if basalt is out of the equation

I'm very interested to see how it performs, yeah! Of course, we'll need some test results before we can really say for sure if it's competitive or not, though. You already saw this, but for other users, we're informally discussing Bakushin in the Random Thoughts thread:
worldbeyblade.org/Thread-MFB-Limited-Primer-Random-Thoughts-and-Q-A-Thread
Dec. 06, 2013  3:01 AM
 
I really think Aquario is underrated. I've seen Aquario 100GCF KO Phantom Bull W145WD, and tornado stall around Revizer Revizer E230RS/RSF. Not consistently for the former, but still, I think it has potential.

Of course I'm probably completely wrong.
Dec. 07, 2013  1:51 AM
 
I'm putting Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120 FB/XF for this. It does it's job well against Stamina and Defense, and it can pray/play against attack. No tests yet, but on a definite hunch based on informal tests.
Dec. 07, 2013  2:22 AM
 
Couldn't someone just use top tier combos like Duo Cygnus 230D and replace Duo with Earth?
(Dec. 07, 2013  1:51 AM)Kujikato Wrote: I'm putting Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120 FB/XF for this. It does it's job well against Stamina and Defense, and it can pray/play against attack. No tests yet, but on a definite hunch based on informal tests.
I like Meteo L-Drago TR145EWD/WD
Dec. 07, 2013  2:45 AM
 
(Dec. 07, 2013  2:22 AM)RagerBlade Wrote: Couldn't someone just use top tier combos like Duo Cygnus 230D and replace Duo with Earth?
(Dec. 07, 2013  1:51 AM)Kujikato Wrote: I'm putting Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120 FB/XF for this. It does it's job well against Stamina and Defense, and it can pray/play against attack. No tests yet, but on a definite hunch based on informal tests.
I like Meteo L-Drago TR145EWD/WD
exactly, I just had an idea. How about MF-L Burn Cygnus 85/100MF.
Dec. 07, 2013  2:47 AM
 
(Dec. 07, 2013  2:45 AM)*Aquamarine* Wrote:
(Dec. 07, 2013  2:22 AM)RagerBlade Wrote: Couldn't someone just use top tier combos like Duo Cygnus 230D and replace Duo with Earth?
(Dec. 07, 2013  1:51 AM)Kujikato Wrote: I'm putting Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120 FB/XF for this. It does it's job well against Stamina and Defense, and it can pray/play against attack. No tests yet, but on a definite hunch based on informal tests.
I like Meteo L-Drago TR145EWD/WD
exactly, I just had an idea. How about MF-L Burn Cygnus 85/100MF.

The Supreme One has a thread about a very similar combo. I think it's burn aquario 90mf.
Dec. 07, 2013  3:39 AM
 
(Dec. 07, 2013  1:51 AM)Kujikato Wrote: I'm putting Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120 FB/XF for this. It does it's job well against Stamina and Defense, and it can pray/play against attack. No tests yet, but on a definite hunch based on informal tests.

LOL & the part I bolded

Yeah, (MF(-H)) Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120XF will likely be a shoe-in based on its performance in metas gone by, and I'm betting GF will do it some favors as well. I'll have to try FB, that's an interesting idea!

(Dec. 07, 2013  2:45 AM)*Aquamarine* Wrote: exactly, I just had an idea. How about MF-L Burn Cygnus 85/100MF.

I've been testing this for days actually, and I'll have some results posted shortly. It was the first thing I tested once this format was made official Grin
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