MFB: Limited :: Competitive Customs List and Public Discussion

I see lots of people testing bakushin, I just thought mercury isn't classified as 4D is it? it seems that might be even more effective than bakushin if it's legal.
Wouldn't mercury have more recoil than bakushin?
(Dec. 07, 2013  3:39 AM)Ingulit Wrote:
(Dec. 07, 2013  1:51 AM)Kujikato Wrote: I'm putting Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120 FB/XF for this. It does it's job well against Stamina and Defense, and it can pray/play against attack. No tests yet, but on a definite hunch based on informal tests.

LOL & the part I bolded

Yeah, (MF(-H)) Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb) CH120XF will likely be a shoe-in based on its performance in metas gone by, and I'm betting GF will do it some favors as well. I'll have to try FB, that's an interesting idea!

(Dec. 07, 2013  2:45 AM)*Aquamarine* Wrote: exactly, I just had an idea. How about MF-L Burn Cygnus 85/100MF.

I've been testing this for days actually, and I'll have some results posted shortly. It was the first thing I tested once this format was made official Grin

METEO CH120XF AWWW YEAHHHHHH (why though look at this meta)

i think absorb is like marginally better/not worth compared to original MLD? (I could have just used absorb constantly and forgot)
plz no FB though.

BURN MF FOR WHAT? haha seriously can it outspin anything or what exactly puts it above RF?
This seems like a super attack (RUBBER RUBBER RUBBER) oriented meta.. so I am curious to see where exactly MF and XF find their use. I actually can't wait to see your tests and maybe even try them myself in the coming months (??)

Bakushin hmmm I think if you want a straight up defense, Earth and Libra is where it's at. Exclusively.
For anti-attack (probably the only viable non-attack type), I think Bakushin could work. Maybe Bakushin GB145RF? I forget it's weight but yeah stick some heavy stuff on it + RF and see if it doesn't sink vs. Gravity or Lightning.
I hate to actually recommend going for counters to the attack types so early on but I think it will bring about some really creative stuff from you guys!
Or RF battles for days.

Yeah uh Mercury is probably a no-no unless again you make it heavy and smack RF on it.
But I forget if it was tried at >85/90/100 as an attacker when it came out. It probably was, but I don't remember anything really outstanding about it anyway so I'd not spend a whole lot of time on it.

oh ya

hi guys wats up
Hi Dan.

I honestly think FB is a really cool variant off the original combo, but hey, you're the creator, you should know how it works best.

MF-H Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb/Normal Version) CH120 XF/BF/FB

AWW YEAH.
The Absorb version is the normal L-Drago II CW.
(Dec. 07, 2013  8:01 AM)Kujikato Wrote: Hi Dan.

I honestly think FB is a really cool variant off the original combo, but hey, you're the creator, you should know how it works best.

MF-H Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb/Normal Version) CH120 XF/BF/FB

AWW YEAH.
The Absorb version is the normal L-Drago II CW.

IIRC there is no BF tip
(Dec. 07, 2013  8:04 AM)DRAGON KING Wrote:
(Dec. 07, 2013  8:01 AM)Kujikato Wrote: Hi Dan.

I honestly think FB is a really cool variant off the original combo, but hey, you're the creator, you should know how it works best.

MF-H Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb/Normal Version) CH120 XF/BF/FB

AWW YEAH.
The Absorb version is the normal L-Drago II CW.

IIRC there is no BF tip

FB* sorry bout that XD
@Dan absorb and reg were the same, but meteos with a bit of wear did work better generally, both in my experience and what I remember from back in our day. It is good to see you back, brother.
I think I might return to WBO for this Limited System! I've been testing some Limited combos lately and I'm loving the new system. To be honest, all the Synchrom beys everyone uses are just not as colorful and interesting as Metal Fight/Metal Masters. I'm glad HWS/Pre-HWS is getting a comeback.
(Dec. 07, 2013  8:01 AM)Kujikato Wrote: Hi Dan.

I honestly think FB is a really cool variant off the original combo, but hey, you're the creator, you should know how it works best.

MF-H Meteo L-Drago II (Absorb/Normal Version) CH120 XF/BF/FB

AWW YEAH.
The Absorb version is the normal L-Drago II CW.
hey I believe you, not entirely knocking it, just personal preference!
If you do some tests and it turns out to be more reliable/better, feel free to rub it in my face. From what I recall FB isn't exactly aggressive enough. At least not enough vs attack giants. The only hope I can see from a combo like MLDCH120XF is that fact that it will have to go ridiculously fast in an attempt to stay in the arena or get totally wrecked. With that said, you can try and weak launch but you'll need to be heavier than CH120 at least to not still get KO'd.

@Th!nk yeah... hmmmm iirc a fresh CW worked better as far as outlasting something like Basalt BDCS (not a problem here, haha) but it would be just so damn bouncy where the used CW would be a bit more tame.
So yes if this is what you mean, you're going to want a very tame meteos.
also I won that quetz lot for $10 LOL
Hmm, I remember my more worn one doing better against basalt bd145, I recall the reasoning I had for that being worn means rougher or larger contact surface so more efficient equalising. That said, I strongly recall us finding kind xf's had better late game survival than used ones (lower friction etc) perhaps that is what you're thinking of?


Oh neat, and if you didn't see, it turns out quetz is better than I had thought (good enough to end up here, perhaps). Just keep them away from your grandmother this time, please.

As for this FB discussion, I have a divine chimera coming for TR145, so I will give fb a shot myself. FWIW, there was a huge argument between either you or bluezee, pretty sure it was bluezee, and deikailo about the speed of fb while tornado stalling vs that of xf (though the "discussion" centred around the effect of framerate on apparent top speed in video and went downhill from there as such "discussions" tended to do.) Memories, eh?


Either way I think most of the discussion about this list needs to wait till tourney results start coming in, so we have some idea of what the starting meta is like.
Yep, memories.

Wasn't that detailed/complex though, it was beyond me back then.

FB on the Tornado Ridge is fast and stays in, then has some decent stamina near the end. Informal tests are suggesting to me that it'll only work in left. Right spin FB hasn't been promising.
Shinobi lines up nearly perfectly with Wyvang.

Just a note: my CS is semi-aggro so on heights lower than 100 if it gets hit off balance then it goes aggro. Could somebody else test with the low heights with a newer CS/RSF (which i don't own).

MSF-H Shinobi Wvvang CH120 LRF vs. MF-H Earth Eagle GB145CS (CS semi-aggro, gets fairly aggro when hit off balance)

Earth always launched first.

SW: 13 wins, all KO
EE: 7 wins, 2 OS, 5 KO
Wyvang Win Rate: 65%
Ties: 1

Detailed results (Click to View)
Earth's KOs were via Wyvang's recoil, so that is something that could happen off and on. It is an uncontrolled variable.
Shouldn't we pull out the older top tier list?

It would give us an idea how it will look like or to begin with.
There's a list of stuff here with stuff that's good and should be tested against.

I think adding some old tier lists would be cool though. We're restarting it so maybe not having the older tier lists could give us a much better fresh start since we have many new parts available now for this format that weren't made yet back then. I don't know though.
(Dec. 12, 2013  5:30 AM)Stars Wrote: Shouldn't we pull out the older top tier list?

It would give us an idea how it will look like or to begin with.

My list in the second or third post of this thread is based off my memory of the older lists and all of my testing which was also based off of them, as well as including newer parts that could affect that. This was the entire reason I made the post.

Also, adding the actual older lists would probably cause misleading errors to seep through into our fresh start. Best to just leave them to the sands of time, methinks.
Ok, so I tried out the 230MF thing th!nk suggested,
MF-H Earth Aquario 230MF vs Gravity Perseus(Atk Ver, Left Spin)R145R2F
Earth always launched.
Earth wins: 1/20(all OS)
Perseus wins: 19/20(4 OS, 15 KO)
Earth Win Percentage: 95%
Sorry th!nk
You've got Earth Percentage instead of Gravity Percentage there, but yeah in retrospect, I'm not 100% sure why I felt it worked so well (I guess a lot of it was not having specific numbers - note CS was listed as well, and gravity turned out slightly stronger than I expected too) , though that is still worse than I would've expected that particular setup to do. Oh well, that list was only intended to be a starting point for people to work based off, just for some early direction, not an actual candidate list.

Galaxy Blade and I are working on a more accurate list at the moment anyhow, so there'll be more to discuss soon enough.
I still feel it is too early for a list, since it has only been about three weeks since Limited Format started, and there need to be more tests.
(Dec. 29, 2013  12:42 AM)Shining God MS Wrote: I still feel it is too early for a list, since it has only been about three weeks since Limited Format started, and there need to be more tests.

It is a little early, but have a little faith that I know what I'm doing - at the very least, it will be a solid start for serious discussion on the topic.
I think I might know a thing or two, so may I join in on the discussing?
I appreciate the offer, but we've got things covered - it would be better to hold off until it gets posted, that way you'll be able to explain your reasons etc from the start, and everything can be discussed publicly. It's not really a "project" so much as me just giving him a little help with a draft list he sent me which I thought he did a really good job on, that will serve as a really nice start point for us all to work from.
All right, so now I will post some other mirror matches, and I will also post these in the Competitive List Discussion and the Duo Discussion thread.

Duo Cancer W145WD vs Burn Cancer W145WD
Alternating launches. Swap parts each 10 rounds.
Duo wins: 12/20(4 KO, 8 OS)
Burn wins: 8/20(6 KO, 2 OS)
Duo Win Percentage: 60%

Duo Cancer W145WD vs Earth Cancer W145WD
Alternating launches. Swap parts each 10 rounds.
Duo wins:17/20(3 KO, 14 OS)
Earth wins:3/20 (1 OS, 2 KO)
Duo Win Percentage:85%

On W145 Duo did pretty good, but nothing to go rushing home about. Will post 230 tests and 85 tests soon.
Not bad results. They do OK against Burn/Earth, but against Scythe I'd think it'd stand no chance, hah. Yeah, Duo does do great on W145. I think 85 might be a little risky...
Honestly, this wasn't really that great for W145 on Duo, I think it's the king on 230.
Not from my testing. It kinda sucks. Maybe cause I used Scythe...