Burst Classic - New Format Feedback & Discussion

(Jan. 13, 2019  6:54 PM)ks123 Wrote:
(Jan. 13, 2019  6:41 PM)K1D Wrote: Is SgV banned?

Yes. Only God Valtryek is allowed.

Well, technically that not true. The reason just "Valtryek V3" was listed is being Genesis Valtryek V3 and Strike Valtryek V3 are pretty much the same thing, with the centrepiece being a minor cosmetic change but the Bound Layer being identical. But I suppose that's something worth clarifying really.

The bottom line is that Strike God Valkyrie isn't permitted really, which should give Victory Valkyrie the opportunity to shine and distinguish itself.

(Jan. 13, 2019  7:01 PM)Kei Wrote: Thanks for putting this together @[~Mana~]! A lot to consider here, but a few quick initial thoughts/questions:

- Is there any particular reason only X' and Hn' are permitted among the Dash Drivers? Why not the others? Even Ds' doesn't seem concerning if there isn't any good left spin Layers.
- Can you explain the reasoning for 1 Point Burst and 2 Point KO from your perspective?
- I agree with Wombat that there is probably some Core Disks like 11 and 13 which could be unbanned.
- Anyone playing in experimental unranked events for this format: make sure that in evaluating how the event went afterwards that you look at the bigger picture. Especially for the first few events, the results will probably bit a bit all over the map as everyone tries to figure out what works best.

I'd say the Dash Driver situation is debatable. The majority of the team working on this ruleset were against this due to concerns that it'd prevent Bursting a little too much in this format, but I think we'd be open to debating it after some testing.

2 Point KO is something we've questioned recently. I think in an ideal world, we should start this at 1 point and increase it to 2 points if needed after we've had some data from tournaments to work with, but the same could technically be said about the reverse. This was a very debatable point in our planning for sure.

I still hold firm on Core Disks; the idea is to outright prevent Frames from being usable in this Format, and I don't necessarily see the need to unban these specific Disks to cater to that. Given that this is "Classic" as opposed to "Limited", I don't think it'd hurt to actually let our standard Alphabetical Disks have a chance to shine within this format and get some use.

Completely echo the last point; literally any and all feedback will be extremely useful for any experimental events, even during the preliminary rounds of these events! We'll take the feedback very seriously, and it'll help with decision making far more than people may think it will!

(Jan. 13, 2019  7:09 PM)CheetoBlader Wrote: Is Rip Fire still Banned?

Always.
(Jan. 13, 2019  7:01 PM)Kei Wrote: Thanks for putting this together @[~Mana~]! A lot to consider here, but a few quick initial thoughts/questions:

- Is there any particular reason only X' and Hn' are permitted among the Dash Drivers? Why not the others? Even Ds' doesn't seem concerning if there isn't any good left spin Layers.
- Can you explain the reasoning for 1 Point Burst and 2 Point KO from your perspective?
- I agree with Wombat that there is probably some Core Disks like 11 and 13 which could be unbanned.
- Anyone playing in experimental unranked events for this format: make sure that in evaluating how the event went afterwards that you look at the bigger picture. Especially for the first few events, the results will probably bit a bit all over the map as everyone tries to figure out what works best.

When I start doing tournaments, I plan to make them in the classic format
I'd love to see the non-core disks get a chance to shine. I want to see what Burst was like before frames!
Are duel-layer remakes in turbo allowed Because I just got Blizzard-X Gaianon G4? Plus they are like the original layers but just recolors
(Jan. 13, 2019  9:59 PM)RED NINJA 0829 Wrote: Are duel-layer remakes in turbo allowed Because I just got Blizzard-X Gaianon G4?

Yeah, and are the Slingshock Drivers allowed?
(Jan. 13, 2019  5:53 PM)ks123 Wrote: Finally, a bit of rest from Cho-Z and Turbo

~Mana~ , please add next Star Format:
(Nov. 15, 2018  4:38 PM)ks123 Wrote: Could there be a format like Battleship Cruise. All bladers starts 3 stars. Max stars is 4. Every lost your lost 1 star and win get 1 star. Battles: 1v1, 2v2, 1v1v1, 3v3, Extreme Battles, 1v1v1v1, Battle Royale, Previous Champion vs bladers. If top 8 or 16 is survive, begins the elimination finals. The name could be Star Format
This whole Duelist Kingdom/ Star format it similar to Swiss format
(Jan. 13, 2019  9:59 PM)RED NINJA 0829 Wrote: Are duel-layer remakes in turbo allowed Because I just got Blizzard-X Gaianon G4? Plus they are like the original layers but just recolors

Yeah, just not the disks
Welp, time to bring out that mint Valkyrie sitting in the back of the shelf
Sorry guys, maybe i lost some news in these months. Are there going to be two different formats (classic and limited)?
(Jan. 14, 2019  12:26 PM)bblader/90 Wrote: Sorry guys, maybe i lost some news in these months. Are there going to be two different formats (classic and limited)?

Yes, Burst Classic is already out but Burst Limited isn't out yet.
(Jan. 14, 2019  12:52 PM)RED NINJA 0829 Wrote:
(Jan. 14, 2019  12:26 PM)bblader/90 Wrote: Sorry guys, maybe i lost some news in these months. Are there going to be two different formats (classic and limited)?

Yes, Burst Classic is already out but Burst Limited isn't out yet.

I'm a bit confused of what Limited would be pretty much just the god series? Cuz I mean we can't put super Z in there because the metal being too heavy and we can't put dual layers and they're either being too light and teeth being outclassed. And on top of that I'm pretty sure we're going to have to ban the banana and possibly spriggan requiem. I mean heck we've already banned D2 and L2 in burst classic.
Why are the turbo layers banned? V4, L4, A4, R4, and F4 are just glorified dual layers. Could allowing those be beneficial?
Ok, got it. Who knows what changes from classic to limited?
As far as I'm concerned, the Turbo Layers are more comparable to God Layers than Dual Layers, so I'm very reluctant to consider including them. As I've stated above, this is a Classic format, not a Limited format, so the aim is to stick to the roots of Classic underused stuff than Turbo Layers. Including underpowered God Layers already leaves a bad taste in my mouth if I'm being totally honest as it defies the "Classic" intentions, but it's something I've reluctantly turned a blind eye to for now.

If Turbo were to belong anywhere, it'd be Limited, which is a format we're currently looking into but we're not ready to share any details on really. It'll be a few months before we're ready to divulge anything even slightly related to that, haha.

But let's have less discussion on what "Limited" is or anything about it. We don't have anything to disclose, and you really don't need to concern yourselves with it too much yet, haha. Even we don't really know what it is, what it'll be, or when will be best to implement something like that. 

Back to the actual Classic discussion! :P
so will this be a separate format from burst or will be on the burst rankings


and will anyone host one in Canada
It'll be on the Burst rankings, in the same way we include Standard, Limited and Zero-G altogether in the MFB rankings. It'll only be unranked during the experimental/development period.
(Jan. 14, 2019  2:32 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: As far as I'm concerned, the Turbo Layers are more comparable to God Layers than Dual Layers, so I'm very reluctant to consider including them. As I've stated above, this is a Classic format, not a Limited format, so the aim is to stick to the roots of Classic underused stuff than Turbo Layers. Including underpowered God Layers already leaves a bad taste in my mouth if I'm being totally honest as it defies the "Classic" intentions, but it's something I've reluctantly turned a blind eye to for now.

If Turbo were to belong anywhere, it'd be Limited, which is a format we're currently looking into but we're not ready to share any details on really. It'll be a few months before we're ready to divulge anything even slightly related to that, haha.

But let's have less discussion on what "Limited" is or anything about it. We don't have anything to disclose, and you really don't need to concern yourselves with it too much yet, haha. Even we don't really know what it is, what it'll be, or when will be best to implement something like that. 

Back to the actual Classic discussion! Tongue_out

Thank you! I really do agree with your stance on adding god layers, I kinda would also enjoy not having them. Plus some of the god layers in classic are still not that bad like hasbro regulas.

(Jan. 14, 2019  2:15 PM)MWF Wrote: Why are the turbo layers banned? V4, L4, A4, R4, and F4 are just glorified dual layers. Could allowing those be beneficial?

Not so. As weak as they seem, I've done to test battles with turbo combos and they can easily beat dual and single layers, with R4 being one of the best attack type beys in the hasbro meta period. Plus, the L4 spin equilizers would be a bit of a problem, and we already have to deal with DGF.
(Jan. 14, 2019  3:07 PM)bladekid Wrote:
(Jan. 14, 2019  2:32 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: As far as I'm concerned, the Turbo Layers are more comparable to God Layers than Dual Layers, so I'm very reluctant to consider including them. As I've stated above, this is a Classic format, not a Limited format, so the aim is to stick to the roots of Classic underused stuff than Turbo Layers. Including underpowered God Layers already leaves a bad taste in my mouth if I'm being totally honest as it defies the "Classic" intentions, but it's something I've reluctantly turned a blind eye to for now.

If Turbo were to belong anywhere, it'd be Limited, which is a format we're currently looking into but we're not ready to share any details on really. It'll be a few months before we're ready to divulge anything even slightly related to that, haha.

But let's have less discussion on what "Limited" is or anything about it. We don't have anything to disclose, and you really don't need to concern yourselves with it too much yet, haha. Even we don't really know what it is, what it'll be, or when will be best to implement something like that. 

Back to the actual Classic discussion! Tongue_out

Thank you! I really do agree with your stance on adding god layers, I kinda would also enjoy not having them. Plus some of the god layers in classic are still not that bad like hasbro regulas.

(Jan. 14, 2019  2:15 PM)MWF Wrote: Why are the turbo layers banned? V4, L4, A4, R4, and F4 are just glorified dual layers. Could allowing those be beneficial?

Not so. As weak as they seem, I've done to test battles with turbo combos and they can easily beat dual and single layers, with R4 being one of the best attack type beys in the hasbro meta period. Plus, the L4 spin equilizers would be a bit of a problem, and we already have to deal with DGF.

Ok makes sense.
It's so nice to see that Dual Layers and such are getting some love now. Can't wait for more of these events to happen.
(Jan. 14, 2019  8:13 PM)Atlas Requiem Wrote: It's so nice to see that Dual Layers and such are getting some love now. Can't wait for more of these events to happen.

Honestly it defines what burst is Beyblade bursting God started to get rid of that and just wasn't as much bursting as we seen from single and dual layers.
(Jan. 15, 2019  4:54 AM)ZYeYO Wrote:
(Jan. 14, 2019  8:13 PM)Atlas Requiem Wrote: It's so nice to see that Dual Layers and such are getting some love now. Can't wait for more of these events to happen.

Honestly it defines what burst is Beyblade bursting God started to get rid of that and just wasn't as much bursting as we seen from single and dual layers.

Yeah man, plus attack can actually be used more safely than in ChoZ
(Jan. 13, 2019  7:16 PM)~Mana~ Wrote:
(Jan. 13, 2019  7:01 PM)Kei Wrote: Thanks for putting this together @[~Mana~]! A lot to consider here, but a few quick initial thoughts/questions:

- Is there any particular reason only X' and Hn' are permitted among the Dash Drivers? Why not the others? Even Ds' doesn't seem concerning if there isn't any good left spin Layers.
- Can you explain the reasoning for 1 Point Burst and 2 Point KO from your perspective?
- I agree with Wombat that there is probably some Core Disks like 11 and 13 which could be unbanned.
- Anyone playing in experimental unranked events for this format: make sure that in evaluating how the event went afterwards that you look at the bigger picture. Especially for the first few events, the results will probably bit a bit all over the map as everyone tries to figure out what works best.

I'd say the Dash Driver situation is debatable. The majority of the team working on this ruleset were against this due to concerns that it'd prevent Bursting a little too much in this format, but I think we'd be open to debating it after some testing.

2 Point KO is something we've questioned recently. I think in an ideal world, we should start this at 1 point and increase it to 2 points if needed after we've had some data from tournaments to work with, but the same could technically be said about the reverse. This was a very debatable point in our planning for sure.

I still hold firm on Core Disks; the idea is to outright prevent Frames from being usable in this Format, and I don't necessarily see the need to unban these specific Disks to cater to that. Given that this is "Classic" as opposed to "Limited", I don't think it'd hurt to actually let our standard Alphabetical Disks have a chance to shine within this format and get some use.

Completely echo the last point; literally any and all feedback will be extremely useful for any experimental events, even during the preliminary rounds of these events! We'll take the feedback very seriously, and it'll help with decision making far more than people may think it will!

@[Kei] When we put this list together, we wanted bursts to be as possible as ever, hence why it will be entirely right spin (with possibly one or two exceptions) and why only pure attack combos can't be bursted. Ds' & Z' just have far too much stamina and potential as tornado stallers to not be broken in my opinion. The two point KO is something that we've gone back and forth on but the way I viewed it was that it would encourage and reward smash attack which requires more skill than stationary burst attackers. Just trying to buff attack as much as possible if we want it to be a format similar to MFB Limited Smile 

As for the core disks, Wombat wanted to allow 11 & 13 but I'm with ~Mana~ on this one - it just feels a little unnecessary since players can't use frames and takes away from the "classic" aspect, which is already being stretched by adding weak god layers and all the new drivers into the mix.
Were Duo Apollos, Duo Artemis and Duo Eclipse deemed too heavy?
(Jan. 15, 2019  12:20 PM)MonoDragon Wrote: Were Duo Apollos, Duo Artemis and Duo Eclipse deemed too heavy?

They were probably deemed too "not single or dual layer".
I'm more than happy that we finally have an official WBO Beyblade Burst Limited/Classic Format. In our regional BeyClub (the Blackwater Guardians) we already had a Limited Format for a while now, but I personally think ours was not as good as the official one is now. I would be very happy if I can promote the WBO Beyblade Burst Classic Format on my YouTube channel. I think many people would be interested. 😊

My critique towards Burst Classic:
I really like it but I am for unbanning of L2 and for a banning of Eternal, Octa and Deathscyther (Takara Tomy) and maybe Gaianon (Hasbro). Other than that I like it a lot and I would be happy to host a tournament in this format.

Here's our old Blackwater Guardian Limited Format Banlist:

[spoiler:]
"
Layers:
Deathscyther
Dark Deathscyther
All God Layers
All ChoZ Layers
All ChoZ Awakening Layers

Disks:
All Core Disks (& Frames)
Outer
Zenith

Drivers:
All Dash/Prime ( ' ) Drivers
Atomic
Bearing
Eternal
Xtend+
Octa
"

Note: We should have probably included Hasbro Beys in the ruling. 😅

[/spoiler]