World Beyblade Organization by Fighting Spirits Inc. World Beyblade Organization Beyblade Tournaments Processed Events Archive
Jul
07

Return of The Supreme One

  Norbeck, MD
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1st
CoolStuffYT
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2nd
Hyper xeno
User avatar
3rd
Wombat
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East Norbeck Park
3131 Norbeck Road
  Meet under the picnic shelter
11:00am on 07/07/2019
Hosted by
  The Supreme One
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Format
Burst

Most official Beyblade Burst gear can be used.

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Type

One Beyblade is prepared and used in each First Stage match.

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Admission
0 cash
Hosts: The Supreme One and Yami

Location: This event will be held outdoors at the East Norbeck Park. Please note that the tournament may be postponed due to inclement weather. 

Time: As the tournament will start promptly at 12:00pm, please plan to arrive around 11:00am when registration will begin. Registration will close at 11:45am. If the participant cap has not been met at this time, waitlisted players will be offered a spot. Confirming your attendance on the WBO event page does not substitute for registration at the venue.

Prizes: Due to WBO funds currently being put on hold, prizes will not be offered at this event (fortunately this also means no entry fees!)

Other Information:
Please come prepared. It is helpful for both hosts and judges if all participants bring at least one Takara Tomy or Hasbro-manufactured Beyblade of their own and more than one launcher when possible. Additionally, parents of children under the age of 13 must be present for the duration of the event, as tournament end times can be difficult to estimate, and we would hate for someone to be left behind once it is over.

Be aware of your belongings. We'd advise users to please, please look after your stuff. While yes this is a Beyblade tournament and we're not suggesting that any of us would attempt to take each other's stuff it is still happening at a public venue where other people (who may not be so friendly) are going to be present as well. Of course, if you see a personal belonging lying around bring it up any of the judges so we can return it to the right person. Your co-operation is appreciated!

All players must arrive on-time. The tournament will begin no later than 12:00 PM and is expected to run for about 3 hours, though if there is a large turnout it may take longer. Please plan accordingly. If you do not arrive at the scheduled start time, you risk being excluded from the tournament. The software we use to run our events–Challonge–does not allow us to add in extra participants once the tournament has started.

If you know in advance that you will be late, please post in this thread or contact someone at the event and depending on the circumstances we can perhaps still include you if we know you will arrive soon.



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Jul. 07, 2019  8:44 PM
 
(Jul. 07, 2019  8:33 PM)OldSchool™ Wrote: Match history means if they played one another during the Swiss rounds.
1- # of wins
2- Tiebreaker (only if those players have match history)
3- Buchholz score.

If 2 does not apply, then 3 determines who advances to finals.

Cool. But step 2 reads "2. Challonge TB column (Only if the players in question have match history)" and it is unclear who the "players in question are. If it's everyone tied with a 3-2 record, that seems to be my interpretation of it. What is your interpretation? Why are only the three at the top of the 8 way tie list being considered for tiebreakers instead of all 8?

Challonge is already placing people at the top of the 3-2 list based on TB values, their number of wins against other people with the same record. Are we going down that list from top down, seeing if they've fought each other, and then comparing Buchholz if we haven't? Because in that case, both tiebreak wins and buchholz figure heavily into step 2, and instead of just the TB value.

And that's not what it says in the rules, At All.
Jul. 08, 2019  1:07 AM
 
top 3? congrats to who won
Jul. 08, 2019  1:42 AM
 
(Jul. 07, 2019  8:44 PM)DeceasedCrab Wrote:
(Jul. 07, 2019  8:33 PM)OldSchool™ Wrote: Match history means if they played one another during the Swiss rounds.
1- # of wins
2- Tiebreaker (only if those players have match history)
3- Buchholz score.

If 2 does not apply, then 3 determines who advances to finals.

Cool. But step 2 reads "2. Challonge TB column (Only if the players in question have match history)" and it is unclear who the "players in question are. If it's everyone tied with a 3-2 record, that seems to be my interpretation of it. What is your interpretation? Why are only the three at the top of the 8 way tie list being considered for tiebreakers instead of all 8?

Challonge is already placing people at the top of the 3-2 list based on TB values, their number of wins against other people with the same record. Are we going down that list from top down, seeing if they've fought each other, and then comparing Buchholz if we haven't? Because in that case, both tiebreak wins and buchholz figure heavily into step 2, and instead of just the TB value.

And that's not what it says in the rules, At All.

The players in question are whom have EQUAL amount of wins vying for top 8.  IE the SCORE column.
If there are players tied for top 8 placement, check if they have TB with each other.
Lastly, if they DO NOT have a TB with each other (have not faced each other in the event so far), the Blader with the HIGHER Buchholz score is placed above the other. IE advances.
Easy and simple system. Joyful_3

Regardless of how Challonge places Bladers based on TB, BUCHHOLZ takes priority if Bladers with same score have not faced each other. Understand? Wink
Jul. 08, 2019  2:03 AM
 
Cool stuff YouTube 1st
Hyper Xeno 2nd
Wombat 3rd
Tangy blader 4th
Jul. 08, 2019  2:30 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  1:42 AM)OldSchool™ Wrote: The players in question are whom have EQUAL amount of wins vying for top 8.  IE the SCORE column.
If their are players tied for top 8 placement, check if they have TB with each other.
Lastly, if they DO NOT have a TB with each other (have not faced each other in the event so far), the Blader with the HIGHER Buchholz score is placed above the other. IE advances.
Easy and simple system. Joyful_3

Regardless of how Challonge places Bladers based on TB, BUCHHOLZ takes priority if Bladers with same score have not faced each other. Understand? Wink

Yeah, in this case Hyper xeno and RyanTheDragon had match history with only select players who also had 3-2 records. As a result, the TB column does not factor in when determining finalists based on our rules. It is only for when two specific players are tied and vying for a spot in the finals (or if there's something crazy like three players with tied records all with match history with one of the other two players tied with them).

If there's other players tied with them that they don't have match history with, Bucholz takes precedence. That means in this case Hyper xeno (8th with 11.0 Bucholz) and Wombat (7th with 12.0 Bucholz) would advance since they have the highest Bucholz of the tied 3-2 players vying for the 7th and 8th spots in the finals.
Jul. 08, 2019  3:12 AM
 
Thanks for coming out today and bearing (no pun intended) the heat! We had a total of 30 players, and as Hyper Xeno shared above, our placers were:
1st - Cool Stuff YT
2nd - Hyper Xeno
3rd - Wombat
4th - Tangy blader

It was great to see some new and old faces and to meet members of the PA and MD community that I hadn't seen before. Our next Burst tournament will likely be Classic and may or may not take place before Beyblade East... stay tuned.
Jul. 08, 2019  3:14 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:12 AM)The Supreme One Wrote: Thanks for coming out today and bearing (no pun intended) the heat! We had a total of 30 players, and as Hyper Xeno shared above, our placers were:
1st - Cool Stuff YT
2nd - Hyper Xeno
3rd - Wombat
4th - Tangy blader

It was great to see some new and old faces and to meet members of the PA and MD community that I hadn't seen before. Our next Burst tournament will likely be Classic and may or may not take place before Beyblade East... stay tuned.

What’s Beyblade east!?
Jul. 08, 2019  3:15 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:12 AM)The Supreme One Wrote: Thanks for coming out today and bearing (no pun intended) the heat! We had a total of 30 players, and as Hyper Xeno shared above, our placers were:
1st - Cool Stuff YT
2nd - Hyper Xeno
3rd - Wombat
4th - Tangy blader

It was great to see some new and old faces and to meet members of the PA and MD community that I hadn't seen before. Our next Burst tournament will likely be Classic and may or may not take place before Beyblade East... stay tuned.

Lol, did three people drop out? Also why didn’t Firecracker play? She went 4-1!
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:14 AM)UltimateMaster Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:12 AM)The Supreme One Wrote: Thanks for coming out today and bearing (no pun intended) the heat! We had a total of 30 players, and as Hyper Xeno shared above, our placers were:
1st - Cool Stuff YT
2nd - Hyper Xeno
3rd - Wombat
4th - Tangy blader

It was great to see some new and old faces and to meet members of the PA and MD community that I hadn't seen before. Our next Burst tournament will likely be Classic and may or may not take place before Beyblade East... stay tuned.

What’s Beyblade east!?
A huge tournament for all of the Eastern Bladers that’s been developing for a while.
Jul. 08, 2019  3:17 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:15 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:12 AM)The Supreme One Wrote: Thanks for coming out today and bearing (no pun intended) the heat! We had a total of 30 players, and as Hyper Xeno shared above, our placers were:
1st - Cool Stuff YT
2nd - Hyper Xeno
3rd - Wombat
4th - Tangy blader

It was great to see some new and old faces and to meet members of the PA and MD community that I hadn't seen before. Our next Burst tournament will likely be Classic and may or may not take place before Beyblade East... stay tuned.

Lol, did three people drop out? Also why didn’t Firecracker play? She went 4-1!

We had 30 start but 1 person did have to leave early. Firecracker registered but she gave up her spot to Tangy blader, as he arrived just as we had started running matches. Still have to change it in the brackets, but she'll be placed by Tangy blader when I share the results sheet Smile
Jul. 08, 2019  3:18 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:17 AM)The Supreme One Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:15 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote: Lol, did three people drop out? Also why didn’t Firecracker play? She went 4-1!

We had 30 start but 1 person did have to leave early. Firecracker registered but she gave up her spot to Tangy blader, as he arrived just as we had started running matches. Still have to change it in the brackets, but she'll be placed by Tangy blader when I share the results sheet Smile

OkaySmile. That makes more sense. Smile. Also, did you see my PM?
Jul. 08, 2019  3:33 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:15 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:12 AM)The Supreme One Wrote: Thanks for coming out today and bearing (no pun intended) the heat! We had a total of 30 players, and as Hyper Xeno shared above, our placers were:
1st - Cool Stuff YT
2nd - Hyper Xeno
3rd - Wombat
4th - Tangy blader

It was great to see some new and old faces and to meet members of the PA and MD community that I hadn't seen before. Our next Burst tournament will likely be Classic and may or may not take place before Beyblade East... stay tuned.

Lol, did three people drop out? Also why didn’t Firecracker play? She went 4-1!
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:14 AM)UltimateMaster Wrote: What’s Beyblade east!?
A huge tournament for all of the Eastern Bladers that’s been developing for a while.

When is this
Jul. 08, 2019  3:34 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:33 AM)Hitashi Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:15 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote: Lol, did three people drop out? Also why didn’t Firecracker play? She went 4-1!
A huge tournament for all of the Eastern Bladers that’s been developing for a while.

When is this
Don’t know.
Jul. 08, 2019  3:47 AM
 
Beyblade East
Host:me and Natedogphilly
Time 11
Location:paddock farms park Havertown PA
Date:August 3-burst
August 4th burst classic mfb limited
Jul. 08, 2019  3:52 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  3:47 AM)Hyper xeno Wrote: Beyblade East
Host:me and Natedogphilly
Time 11
Location:paddock farms park Havertown PA
Date:August 3-burst
August 4th burst classic mfb limited
Lol, can’t make that one.
Jul. 08, 2019  4:09 AM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  2:30 AM)Kei Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  1:42 AM)OldSchool™ Wrote: The players in question are whom have EQUAL amount of wins vying for top 8.  IE the SCORE column.
If their are players tied for top 8 placement, check if they have TB with each other.
Lastly, if they DO NOT have a TB with each other (have not faced each other in the event so far), the Blader with the HIGHER Buchholz score is placed above the other. IE advances.
Easy and simple system. Joyful_3

Regardless of how Challonge places Bladers based on TB, BUCHHOLZ takes priority if Bladers with same score have not faced each other. Understand? Wink

Yeah, in this case Hyper xeno and RyanTheDragon had match history with only select players who also had 3-2 records. As a result, the TB column does not factor in when determining finalists based on our rules. It is only for when two specific players are tied and vying for a spot in the finals (or if there's something crazy like three players with tied records all with match history with one of the other two players tied with them).

If there's other players tied with them that they don't have match history with, Bucholz takes precedence. That means in this case Hyper xeno (8th with 11.0 Bucholz) and Wombat (7th with 12.0 Bucholz) would advance since they have the highest Bucholz of the tied 3-2 players vying for the 7th and 8th spots in the finals.

Okay, wow, it took only the 6th person trying to explain it to me to finally give an explanation that even gets partway there. But at least after Kei's explanation I finally realize what you're all trying to say.

But first and foremost, None of what you all just said corresponds to the rules as how they are written. I mean, I understand how they've been interpreted up to this point now.

One sentence. All you needed was a one sentence explanation, either in the rules, or explained at the tournament or on the boards or anything.
"Challonge TB column is only considered if at least one player involved in the tie had a match against every other player in the tie."
That's all you had to say.

Here's what is written:
2. Challonge TB column (Only if the players in question have match history)

Here's how you've interpreted it
2. Challonge TB column (But only if at least one player involved in the tie had matches against every other player in the tie)

Which, again, is not what that says. When I read that, I come up with
2. Challonge TB column (If there's a TB value, then clearly some of the players had match history, so this text is basically meaningless)


When you write "Only if the players in question have match history" that doesn't indicate that ALL players need to have had matches against their tied opponents, or that ONE of the players needs to have had matches against their tied opponents; it's vague and unclear. The text as written doesn't actually mean anything.

And we are going to have this fixed in the Organizer's Guide rules. Nobody wants this confusion to happen again. May I suggest using the text "But only if at least one player involved in the tie had matches against every other player in the tie" because that's nice and clear according to Kei's example?

And hey, even if this is how we're interpreting the rule, it's a bad rule anyway!
Ryan went 3 wins, 2 losses, and beat 1 opponent with the same record.
Xeno went 3 wins, 2 losses, and beat 1 opponent with the same record.
Wombat went 3 wins, 2 losses, and beat 0 opponents with the same record.
And yet Wombat goes to the finals, not Ryan. Now that I understand this rule, I understand how... terrible it is.
Maybe you should consider switching it to
2. Challonge TB column (No caveat)
But that's a discussion for another thread.


But as for this tournament? I guess there's no undoing it now. But it can be really demoralizing to bladers who look at the standings, think they're going to the finals, and then suddenly don't make it.. The rules as they were written? Definitely looked like Ryan, and not Wombat, should've gone on to the finals. It can look really bad if a judge/organizer goes onto the finals, under dubious circumstances, instead of a regular participant; thankfully this wasn't that, this was a valid ruling, even if it was confusing. It makes sense now that the rules interpretation has been clarified, but it's unfortunate.

This is the second tournament I've been to in a month and a half with major irregularities with who goes to the finals. First the unscored match leading to the wrong person going to the finals in A New Bey Hope (and scored incorrectly later), and now this. Honestly, once was enough. This is becoming an unfortunate pattern.
Jul. 08, 2019  4:27 AM
 
DeceasedCrab (not going to quote the whole post because it's too long) I see where you're coming from and I understand your frustration. Please do not take this out on myself or the other judges who are just following the rules that we know and are familiar with. It is not doing someone a disservice to abide by what is written in the rulebook, even if one person misinterprets the reading.

To restate: The tournament was run without a hitch and all decisions were made according to current WBO rulings, so PLEASE do not make this out to be an actual mishap. When you dedicate an entire afternoon to running two tournaments, it can be frustrating to come back to something like this, when the decision for who goes to finals was NOT made incorrectly. If you do not agree with the way the rulebook is worded, I think the best place to take it up is with Kei or ~Mana~ (the ones who write the rulebook) via PM or Organized Play Official Rules.
Jul. 08, 2019  4:55 AM
 
That's fair.

The tournament did run successfully and all the rules were followed.

I have attempted to reword some of that.
Jul. 08, 2019  5:09 AM
 
The tournament was well run! It was done soo quickly! 1st stage lasted ‘till ‘bout 1:30-45 which was unbelievable! I left around 2:00 sadly and learned this: NEVER tell anyone in free play what you’re using. It cost me a match.
Jul. 08, 2019  6:11 PM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  5:09 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote: The tournament was well run! It was done soo quickly! 1st stage lasted ‘till ‘bout 1:30-45 which was unbelievable! I left around 2:00 sadly and learned this: NEVER tell anyone in free play what you’re using. It cost me a match.

LOL Smile
Jul. 08, 2019  6:20 PM
 
Oh yes Coolstuffyt won! AWESOME
Jul. 08, 2019  9:08 PM
 
(Jul. 08, 2019  6:11 PM)SS2 Blader Wrote:
(Jul. 08, 2019  5:09 AM)CheetoBlader Wrote: The tournament was well run! It was done soo quickly! 1st stage lasted ‘till ‘bout 1:30-45 which was unbelievable! I left around 2:00 sadly and learned this: NEVER tell anyone in free play what you’re using. It cost me a match.

LOL Smile
*hisses intensely*
Sep. 29, 2019  3:24 PM
 
Uh… SS2 Blader already has an account. So why was SS2Blader created to process this tournament?
Sep. 29, 2019  3:32 PM
 
(Sep. 29, 2019  3:24 PM)CheetoBlader Wrote: Uh… SS2 Blader already has an account. So why was SS2Blader created to process this tournament?

Lol
That's A Major Oof For SS2 Blader
Sep. 29, 2019  4:11 PM
 
The SS2Blader account was created in July 2018 so it predated the event. Looks like the tournament was just processed using the wrong one, which is a quick fix Smile
Nov. 03, 2019  7:09 PM
 
(Sep. 29, 2019  4:11 PM)The Supreme One Wrote: The SS2Blader account was created in July 2018 so it predated the event. Looks like the tournament was just processed using the wrong one, which is a quick fix Smile

Yeah! I couldn't find out how to activate my account o I gave up............But I wanted to try it again and it worked so yeah a MAJOR oof 4 me. Pegasis_Wink
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