Toronto Beyblade Burst Tournament Report: WELCOME TO A&C GAMES VI

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TORONTO BEYBLADE BURST TOURNAMENT REPORT
December 17, 2017 at A&C Games in Toronto, Ontario, Canada • BURST FORMAT
OFFICIAL EVENT PAGE

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On December 17th, 2017 we were back at A&C Games for the sixth time exactly one year since since our first event there in 2016! Finding an indoor venue like A&C Games has been such a huge boon to our community here in Toronto. We used to host maybe one tournament outdoors in December (like this one), and that would be about it until March. Now, we can continue hosting events and bringing everyone together all throughout the year!

Going into this event a few weeks after the emergence of Destroy in the metagame as a force at WELCOME TO A&C GAMES V where I used it to win the event, I predicted that this event would be plagued by its presence. And it certainly was haha. I knew this would be the case not only because I was aware of how powerful it was, but because the remaining three Nightmare Longinus I had for sale had been sold, and because OldSchool™ also had a handful available for sale (as well as God Customize Sets). I had the advantage of surprise at the last event having been able to obtain and practice with the new parts before most other players besides 1234beyblade, but I understood that I wouldn’t have that going into this tournament.

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As a result, my biggest priority was finding something which would not only defeat Drain Fafnir on Destroy, but have utility beyond that singular purpose. Right-spin Destroy combos can do the trick against dF.?.Ds, but in many ways they are a one-trick pony: they generally beat left-spin, but not much else. Right-spin Bearing was also an option, but it again is almost a one-trick pony in many respects given how vulnerable it is to being bursted. I eventually came to the realization that Lost Longinus might be a good option. I was reminded of L2 after seeing the It's Beyxercise Time! II winning combinations list. While I wasn’t particularly fond of the combos used in that tournament, I did think it could still be useful on Destroy. After testing L2.5B.Ds a little bit on the morning of the tournament, I discovered that my hunch was correct and that it was able to not only KO (or Burst, but it’s less likely) dF on Atomic and Destroy, but OS right-spin combos on things like Revolve and Atomic. This was good enough for me, so I decided I would use it. Even though I will always use the best combos available, it is important to me after discovering a powerful combo to try and evolve beyond it and stay ahead of the curve.

I was able to use it once in the preliminary stage to beat BAWB18’s tN.4M.X 3-2, I lost with it against OldSchool’s sO.4B.Ds–which was a shocking pick to run into haha–and then I gave it to JesseObre who was able to defeat kerpao’s sX on Destroy with is. In the finals, I won my entire match in the finals against SUGOI-KONICHEWA’s dF.2V.Ds and also his lS.6G.X with it. Two of the rounds against his lS were won at the very last moment; the second win in particular won me the match 6-4 and was the result of a weak launch that almost caused me to stop spinning before he hit me at the last second, bursting himself. I wish someone had been recording … it was incredible hahaha. Don’t think I’ve ever won a match which I was that close to losing before.

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In the final battle against OldSchool I lost the first round after a instant KO at the beginning of the round … I admittedly got a little worried after that since I was down 2-0 even though it could have easily just been a fluke, so I switched to dF on Atomic and amazingly ended up being bursted by his dF.4B.Ds twice. I also heard that he was able to somehow burst 1234beyblade’s Deep Chaos with dF in a previous match … 1234beyblade jokingly kept calling him “RNG carried” after this, but really OldSchool has been doing so well lately and I think that sometimes you create your own luck once you become that good. Good things happen to good players consistently for a reason. Good things happen to bad players infrequently not because they created that luck with intention necessarily, but because of random chance.

In any case, losing that dF.4B.Ds vs. dF Atomic match-up itself was shocking, but in the first place I probably should have stuck with L2 and attempted to tie things up after that first round because nothing in his deck had a 100% win rate against my L2 combo. Even though going down 2-0 in a Deck Format battle is certainly winnable, it can be difficult to overcome a sense of panic sometimes, especially with a new combo you’re using for the first time that day. The doubt and pressure certainly mount at times like that, so it was a good learning experience for me.

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Unsurprisingly, throughout the tournament not only was Destroy present, the amount of Nightmare Longinus in use was insane. I believe at least five or six people bought one that day in combination with the people who already had it, so it was just everywhere. For some reason, I kept seeing Drain Fafnir vs. Nightmare Longinus match-ups and could only shake my head and laugh at all the dF users since it’s such a bad match-up for them and they should have seen it coming! 1234beyblade and I knew that right-spin Stamina types like Deep Chaos actually shut down nL pretty well, so we were able to defeat it when we came up against one using that.

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Overall, this tournament did leave a bit of worry amongst 1234beyblade and I afterwards because of how dominant Destroy was. It felt like Xtreme-based combos weren’t as viable as they should be because of it. You can certainly win with Xtreme-based combos against Destroy, but the Destroy-based combos are easier to use. We struggled to come up with ideas for what Attack types would consistently beat Destroy. In my mind, I think something like Merge or Impact-based Attack types which move faster than Xtreme could maybe do it, but the question then is: are they good enough against other types of combos?

More testing is needed, and that’s always a good thing. Smile Looking forward to what 2018 brings for Beyblade Burst and the Toronto community!




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Winning Combinations
1st: OldSchool™
Drain Fafnir 4 Bump Destroy
Shadow Orichalcum 4 Bump Destroy
Deep Chaos 7 Glaive Atomic

2nd: Kei
Drain Fafnir 7 Glaive Destroy
Drain Fafnir 7 Glaive Bearing
Lost Longinus 5 Bump Destroy
Deep Chaos 7 Revolve

3rd: 1234beyblade
Drain Fafnir 7 Glaive Destroy
Deep Chaos 7 Glaive Atomic
Deep Chaos 7 Glaive Destroy
Deep Chaos 7 Revolve (Deck Format Finals Only)
Sieg Xcalibur 5 Meteor Orbit (Deck Format Finals Only)


Photos
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Deck Format Finals
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Thanks for reading! If you have any questions about this event, please feel free to post below!

More Beyblade Tournament Reports
If you enjoyed this report, then you may also enjoy some of my other Beyblade Burst tournament reports:
Thorough as always!
My first matchup against kei, I felt that he would choose left spin and sO was the only counter I had handy.
Regarding my dF being burst-resistant, using an A-Mold god chip definitely played a part.

I was surprised when I beat 1234beyblades' Deep Chaos though.
Luck does play a part haha ^_-
O W △
Why was deep chaos used on atomic instead of orbit?
(Dec. 23, 2017  10:32 PM)OldSchool™ Wrote: Regarding my dF being burst-resistant, using an A-Mold god chip definitely played a part.

I had A-Mold on my dF too! Haha.

(Dec. 24, 2017  2:25 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: Why was deep chaos used on atomic instead of orbit?

Better life after death and stamina which might have been more valuable for whatever they were anticipating, probably.

One example is nL.Ds vs. dC: if you use Orbit you might have a greater chance of losing via OS than if you use Atomic. This is exactly what happened in a match JesseObre had with someone; we were debating which Driver to use against his opponent and they ended up using nL.Ds, so having Atomic was a good choice. I haven't tested the match-up of Orbit vs. nL.Ds specifically, but I imagine it might have a better chance against Orbit because Orbit doesn't have as strong life after death, which is critical when playing an opposite spin direction Destroy opponent–even one as aggressive as Nightmare Longinus. Lost Longinus for example has better Stamina than nL because it is more compact and can actually OS right-spin Atomic with some consistency on Destroy (which is one of the reasons I used it at this event).
(Dec. 24, 2017  2:51 AM)Kei Wrote:
(Dec. 24, 2017  2:25 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: Why was deep chaos used on atomic instead of orbit?

Better life after death and stamina which might have been more valuable for whatever they were anticipating, probably.

One example is nL.Ds vs. dC: if you use Orbit you might have a greater chance of losing via OS than if you use Atomic. This is exactly what happened in a match JesseObre had with someone; we were debating which Driver to use against his opponent and they ended up using nL.Ds, so having Atomic was a good choice. I haven't tested the match-up of Orbit vs. nL.Ds specifically, but I imagine it might have a better chance against Orbit because Orbit doesn't have as strong life after death, which is critical when playing an opposite spin direction Destroy opponent–even one as aggressive as Nightmare Longinus. Lost Longinus for example has better Stamina than nL because it is more compact and can actually OS right-spin Atomic with some consistency on Destroy (which is one of the reasons I used it at this event).
But wont atomic have disadvantage against mirror orbit  i mean dC orbit could definitely beat dC atomic right.  Since orbit has more stamina than atomic in same spin. Also Can dC atomic beat dC revolve?
(Dec. 24, 2017  4:07 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote:
(Dec. 24, 2017  2:51 AM)Kei Wrote: Better life after death and stamina which might have been more valuable for whatever they were anticipating, probably.

One example is nL.Ds vs. dC: if you use Orbit you might have a greater chance of losing via OS than if you use Atomic. This is exactly what happened in a match JesseObre had with someone; we were debating which Driver to use against his opponent and they ended up using nL.Ds, so having Atomic was a good choice. I haven't tested the match-up of Orbit vs. nL.Ds specifically, but I imagine it might have a better chance against Orbit because Orbit doesn't have as strong life after death, which is critical when playing an opposite spin direction Destroy opponent–even one as aggressive as Nightmare Longinus. Lost Longinus for example has better Stamina than nL because it is more compact and can actually OS right-spin Atomic with some consistency on Destroy (which is one of the reasons I used it at this event).
But wont atomic have disadvantage against mirror orbit  i mean dC orbit could definitely beat dC atomic right.  Since orbit has more stamina than atomic in same spin. Also Can dC atomic beat dC revolve?
Atomic has better stamina then Orbit from what I seen. Orbit's ball is also not as freely spinning + dirt makes it even less free spinning with time. I'm not sure if its case with atomic too but as its larger I think it will be easier to clean too
(Dec. 24, 2017  4:23 AM)FIREFIRE CPB Wrote:
(Dec. 24, 2017  4:07 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: But wont atomic have disadvantage against mirror orbit  i mean dC orbit could definitely beat dC atomic right.  Since orbit has more stamina than atomic in same spin. Also Can dC atomic beat dC revolve?
Atomic has better stamina then Orbit from what I seen. Orbit's ball is also not as freely spinning + dirt makes it even less free spinning with time. I'm not sure if its case with atomic too but as its larger I think it will be easier to clean too

In my experience Atomic outspins Orbit in both spin directions, though Atomic is more aggressive than Orbit, which could cause people to launch it a little weaker than they would Orbit to avoid self-KOing (and then get outspun by Orbit). I'm positive that Atomic accumulates dirt/dust in the same way Orbit does, both of mine are both significantly tighter than they were when I first got them. I could definitely see dC Orbit beating dC Atomic, but by bursting it rather than outspinning it. Variations in spring tightness aside, I still think Orbit is the most burst-resistant Driver out there.

I'm curious as to what right spin Stamina types people were using to counter nL Destroy? In a previous post you said the only thing that could OS Destroy in opposite spin was Bearing, which would probably burst vs nL (and like, everything else). Destroy vs Destroy sounds like it would come down to which Disk has more LAD or who has the more freely-spinning Destroy, and like you stated, right spin Destroy is kind of like right spin Hold in that it really only has applications against left spin. I also agree with Attack being really tough to use with nL Destroy running around - though it doesn't have the same weight advantage that L2 Hold did against its contemporary Attackers, it can still work as a Mobile Defense combo. Though I don't have a nL to test against myself, at least in the case of L2.2G.H the only things I could get to beat it were Chaos/Odin/Neptune Yell Revolve, so maybe something like aC Bearing could get the job done?
(Dec. 24, 2017  7:47 AM)Wombat Wrote: I'm curious as to what right spin Stamina types people were using to counter nL Destroy? In a previous post you said the only thing that could OS Destroy in opposite spin was Bearing, which would probably burst vs nL (and like, everything else). Destroy vs Destroy sounds like it would come down to which Disk has more LAD or who has the more freely-spinning Destroy, and like you stated, right spin Destroy is kind of like right spin Hold in that it really only has applications against left spin. I also agree with Attack being really tough to use with nL Destroy running around - though it doesn't have the same weight advantage that L2 Hold did against its contemporary Attackers, it can still work as a Mobile Defense combo. Though I don't have a nL to test against myself, at least in the case of L2.2G.H the only things I could get to beat it were Chaos/Odin/Neptune Yell Revolve, so maybe something like aC Bearing could get the job done?

We used dC.7.R and dC.7G.At against nL.Ds and found success. In both cases you have to launch pretty weakly; JesseObre launched too hard in a few rounds when he played nL and got knocked around more than he should have (see 3:18 in my video), but he still won ultimately. I also know dC on Destroy does well against nL.

When I said that the only thing that could OS Destroy in opposite spin was Bearing, I meant when Destroy was used with Layers that have good Stamina like Drain Fafnir. Nightmare Longinus is so wide that with Destroy is can't OS the same things that Drain Fafnir can because its balance isn't as strong in tandem with Destroy.

And yeah, I mean the issue isn't that you can't beat Destroy combos with Attack, it's that using the Destroy combos is a lot more safe and easy than the Attack types. Illustrating this perfectly is the fact that I actually only won 3-2 against EX139's aC.?.X in my first match with dF.7G.Ds. But ultimately, my combo has a better chance of winning against many more things overall, so it's a better combo choice.

Without Destroy running around, Xtreme-based Attackers would be dominant by my estimation because they can counter Revolve, Atomic, Orbit, and Bearing much more reliably. Destroy feels like an anomaly in the sense that it's actually an Attack Driver, but it's being used for Stamina as well.
I remember after his dC testings Mage concluded dC can't resist spin equalization that well, what's your own opinion on it?
Is dC as reliable as gK when it comes to OS dF?
(Dec. 25, 2017  1:22 PM)Wind~down~cat Wrote: I remember after his dC testings Mage concluded dC can't resist spin equalization that well, what's your own opinion on it?
Is dC as reliable as gK when it comes to OS dF?

I think it's just as good, at least. The fact of the matter is that the winner of an opposite spin match-up depends on not just one factor, but many:

1. Which Driver has better 'life after death'?
2. Which Frame will allow the Beyblade to continue spinning longer as it scrapes against the floor?
3. Which Core Disk has better balance/stamina?
4. Which Layer has better balance/stamina?

Assuming numbers one through three are the same and the only variance is the Layer, Deep Chaos will win against Drain Fafnir just like Guardian Kerbeus would because they have better stamina than dF. If the match-up isn't a mirror match besides the Layers, then obviously things can play out differently because in that case, the variance of the Layer alone isn't going to be the only factor influencing the outcome.

And for example, the fact that in Mage's test of dC.7G.O vs. dF.4G.At, dC didn't lose any battles and earned draws instead just proves to me how strong dC's stamina is in comparison to dF. Although dC did have 7–which does have better stamina than 4–if the Drivers were switched around, dF would have surely lost at least a few battles I think.
After seeing the winning combos for this tournament, I tried out dC.7.R against dF.4G.At and dC pretty much consistently won. I was surprised to see that Glaive actually hindered dC's LAD
(Dec. 28, 2017  8:09 AM)Mage Wrote: After seeing the winning combos for this tournament, I tried out dC.7.R against dF.4G.At and dC pretty much consistently won. I was surprised to see that Glaive actually hindered dC's LAD

Yeah, that's another thing too. That's something I learned on my trip to Japan in November. To my surprise, everyone was using Frame-less combos with 7 when using Revolve.
I see a lot of non-LAD frames like Vortex and Bump tandem with Destroy, as well as lighter disks like 5 and 4, what's up with that?
(Dec. 29, 2017  1:49 AM)XYZ-Jaden Wrote: I see a lot of non-LAD frames like Vortex and Bump tandem with Destroy, as well as lighter disks like 5 and 4, what's up with that?

A couple potential reasons:

1. Some players just don't have certain parts.
2. In Deck Format you have to make compromises sometimes because of the necessity of your Deck being composed of entirely different parts on all combinations.
3. With regards to Destroy specifically, my view is that it already has such amazing Life After Death that it doesn't even necessarily need the "best" Frame for LAD to succeed. As a result, this allows you to think about upgrading your combination in other ways by using something like Bump for the extra weight it provides as the heaviest Frame currently available. All of this being said, I don't think something like Bump in particular would necessarily be that bad for LAD anyways.

As for why I used 5 on L2 even in the first stage where I wasn't under any constraints instead of 7 ... I was trying it out before the tournament and for some reason 5 was doing better in the very limited time I had to test it. I didn't have time to question it or test more, so I just stuck with 5 that day.