The State of the Customisation Forum

I actually think the issues that this thread originally addressed have by and large been eradicated; repeat questions and ignorance will unfortunately always be a part of every single forum. Members who do take the time to answer questions are just going to have to be more patient and understanding while staff try to enforce rules. There's obvious a balance to be kept between strictness levels, but none of the suggestions outlined above seem that feasible either.
This is true, my one complaint about this forum is that the standard rules for testing have not been merged into a single, clear, topic.

That said, I'm working on that myself, so expect a draft in the next week or so, a summary of what we've established as our standards, plus some tips on new combo topics and all that.
I request that this thread be locked, as the new version of it has been posted

http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Hasbro-S...ms-go-here
(Jul. 12, 2011  5:28 AM)th!nk Wrote: This is true, my one complaint about this forum is that the standard rules for testing have not been merged into a single, clear, topic.

That said, I'm working on that myself, so expect a draft in the next week or so, a summary of what we've established as our standards, plus some tips on new combo topics and all that.

I went ahead and posted it myself, but obviously please feel free to make any suggestions. I hope I haven't made any of your hard work gone to waste. ;[

(Jul. 12, 2011  10:57 PM)LeonTempestXIII Wrote: I request that this thread be locked, as the new version of it has been posted

http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Hasbro-S...ms-go-here

okay but this is related to this thread how?
No, that's cool, I only had a rough list Smile I've been focussed on finishing other stuff first Smile I'm just glad to see it done Grin
So at the risk of reminding people of how grumpy I used to be, I'm posting to bring this back up. I've been going through burst threads trying to find decent testing. I see a lot of talk and claims about performance, but there's literally zero testing in a lot of these threads. Even threads with "testing" in the title are often devoid of it.

Back in MFB, testing became obsessive and we learnt so much because of it. We did have issues with the competitive combos list being updated slowly but there was at least a lot of data to work with. Even for MFB limited, in which most part capabilities were already somewhat known, there was significant testing of the hasbro metal fury parts. Testing of combos became a point of sometimes heated discussion and people would use tests to counter each other to argue over combos and parts and ideas. Burst seems like people just aren't bothering.

I realise that "be the change you want to see" applies to this, and maybe I'm missing a hidden repository of it, but surely there are people with parts and stadiums who can contribute - and perhaps people shouldn't be making threads for parts or claims without tests.
(Apr. 27, 2021  12:16 PM)th!nk Wrote: So at the risk of reminding people of how grumpy I used to be, I'm posting to bring this back up. I've been going through burst threads trying to find decent testing. I see a lot of talk and claims about performance, but there's literally zero testing in a lot of these threads. Even threads with "testing" in the title are often devoid of it.

Back in MFB, testing became obsessive and we learnt so much because of it. We did have issues with the competitive combos list being updated slowly but there was at least a lot of data to work with. Even for MFB limited, in which most part capabilities were already somewhat known, there was significant testing of the hasbro metal fury parts. Testing of combos became a point of sometimes heated discussion and people would use tests to counter each other to argue over combos and parts and ideas. Burst seems like people just aren't bothering.

I realise that "be the change you want to see" applies to this, and maybe I'm missing a hidden repository of it, but surely there are people with parts and stadiums who can contribute - and perhaps people shouldn't be making threads for parts or claims without tests.

The testing threads look fine for the most part outside of the fact that there are only few pages worth of discussion for each part(especially post-GT stuff), and the fact that for some reason everyone seems to have forgotten that the average amount of rounds to make testing valid was I think, 18-20?meanwhile when I returned after half a decade's worth of hiatus last year, everyone was only doing 10, and it wasn't common to see even less than that.

Admittedly that was for MFB so Burst might have had different rules regarding that because early on in the series, bursting was a relatively common thing. But don't quote me on that since I'm not exactly sure if that's the reason.
20, back then. I'm not sure, the threads I've looked at have been largely devoid of testing - at least, nothing compared to what we had, and there also seem to be less threads for combos etc. Perhaps it is just the way Burst works, but it really feels like there is a paucity of useful data in the subforum to me.
In the past 10 years the Customization subforum has only gotten worse. It should be closed, or the rules changed to suit the testing people are unwilling to do, or deleted. Being able to post new threads in it should not have been enabled by default since the requirements were so high.

It's not a solvable problem.
(Apr. 27, 2021  3:05 PM)th!nk Wrote: 20, back then. I'm not sure, the threads I've looked at have been largely devoid of testing - at least, nothing compared to what we had, and there also seem to be less threads for combos etc. Perhaps it is just the way Burst works, but it really feels like there is a paucity of useful data in the subforum to me.

I believe the main problem is that people don't make separate threads for specific combos anymore, and instead those combos that should have had their own  discussions are just shown in testing data in testing threads for specific parts/beyblades.
(Apr. 28, 2021  1:39 AM)Shido-kun Wrote:
(Apr. 27, 2021  3:05 PM)th!nk Wrote: 20, back then. I'm not sure, the threads I've looked at have been largely devoid of testing - at least, nothing compared to what we had, and there also seem to be less threads for combos etc. Perhaps it is just the way Burst works, but it really feels like there is a paucity of useful data in the subforum to me.

I believe the main problem is that people don't make separate threads for specific combos anymore, and instead those combos that should have had their own  discussions are just shown in testing data in testing threads for specific parts/beyblades.

And those combos used to be tested vs the entire meta. The testing in threads where it exists is very limited in scope.
(Apr. 28, 2021  2:54 AM)Strikegamerv6 Wrote: originalzankye is the best at making combo's

not really
he is really, really good but not the best

and I think for burst and metal fight only I never heard him talking about plastics and hms (would be cool if he did know a lot about those)
(Apr. 28, 2021  1:48 AM)th!nk Wrote:
(Apr. 28, 2021  1:39 AM)Shido-kun Wrote: I believe the main problem is that people don't make separate threads for specific combos anymore, and instead those combos that should have had their own  discussions are just shown in testing data in testing threads for specific parts/beyblades.

And those combos used to be tested vs the entire meta. The testing in threads where it exists is very limited in scope.

I think it's kind of more than that. We used to have individual parts discussion which worked perfectly fine, like when Fyuuor was one of the first to show that RS and RSF made right-spin obsolete on arrival. But, it didn't just fall on him, for example, more people were willing to put up tests of their own, because it cannot be expected that one user has every part out thus far, never mind doubles of all parts (required if you want to determine stamina-oriented parts). There was also a time where combos were given their own threads, but normally this was for parts that have already been well-established and tested, but only now arranged in a specific order. It seems as if there are combo standards in place for each typing in Burst, so perhaps a valuable part just gets thrown into the rest of the tried and true formula without being experimented on in other ways later down the line. Maybe it's efficient, maybe it's not creative, you can call it what you want.

Let me use a recent example. Here is the testing thread for the Drift driver, started by Fafnir. Drift came out at the end of November, but it only gets its own driver-specific testing thread in April..? I'm assuming this is the first one, because it would have been closed already if it wasn't (hopefully). That's nearly a 6 month delay on legitimate, written out testing. Could you imagine that when Vulcan came out, only six months later did anyone bother find out it had monstrous smash? 
The thing is, you can see from some of the replies that there are other users who are well-acquainted with Drift, how it works, and have even drawn their own conclusions about where it fits best in meta combos. There is zero drive to post about it, discuss it, or show off the testing they've done to reach those conclusions, though. There appears to be no impetus in our community to proliferate gathered information on new parts to remain on the bleeding edge of Burst. I've no clue why, maybe they just want to keep it hidden for tournaments? Even more, it appears that the only people who bother to post in those threads frequently, beyond OP, are those who want to see the OP test it all for them. So they don't have the part themselves yet and are in need of OPs who already do to tell them whether its a worthy competitive purchase. It cannot fall on one person, or else who wants to do all that work, write it out, when they can figure a part out informally by themselves? Maybe there needs to be some form of reward system in place to incentivize meaningful and thorough testing. Deliberate silence and waiting to see what rocks up on tournament day, or at the top of the boards, isn't what we should be striving for.

To top it all off, like you've mentioned in other posts here, OP's often don't even follow testing format to a T, nor do they always consider the meta as a whole. In the Drift thread, for example, only 10 rounds are done each time. I also see a distinct lack of something like Rage + Drift anywhere there, just pure stamina/defense testing, nothing outside of the box or anything. Obviously you don't want to disincentivize people from posting if you're going to nitpick the little things, especially when the testers are so few and far between though.. so again, perhaps a reward system should be implemented to promote the type of discussion that used to go on years ago. Advanced was an incredibly toxic role given that our sub-forum was exclusive and anyone who wasn't us had the pleasure of reading but not contributing. Out of reach sub-forums are quite cringe in general. Something different, like a Face or coloured name might revitalize testing and get people back to discussing the game here.

Edit: Th!nk informed me that the Amethyst bit is a face given as a reward for extensive testing on the forum, but it doesn't look like it is regularly updated, nor is the rational for its awarding consistent. Seems like a case by case basis, and not strictly based on testing, but general WBO helpfulness. I am also only slightly offended I was never given one, but I forgive you guys, don't worry lol

More importantly, I came across something that is a little bit concerning. Here is a thread from last September by the same Fyuuor I referenced earlier, where he provided an unorthodox, yet seemingly effective Burst combo. It was surreal to see a thread from him in the year 2020. I don't want to convince people one way or another, but take a look at that thread and see how many people contributed to that discussion with actual testing, or even general positivity, and then see how many people chose to dismiss it completely because of their own predetermined beliefs about its components.
Testing and experimentation isn't fueled by belief alone, but results, so maybe that frequent dismissiveness exhibited in that thread is another reason why some people may choose not to contribute. It is evident that Fyuuor chose not to stick around after that response, despite making a huge effort to get back into the newest series with the most up-to-date information he had. You don't just buy many of the newest parts and products for a single new combo, and then stop posting completely. It borders on hilarious that he was told the combos he tested against are no longer worth much, and other things are far better, yet the only resource available to him to figure out what was best was on BeyBase, and not here, where many people were quick to point out how things have progressed in just a few months. He put in a lot of work into each test, followed standard testing procedure, and provided insight into why he believed the combo worked well, on top of results that pointed towards his assumptions being correct. The same cannot be said about other threads I've come across in my brief time back here. Just something to think about regarding the existing combo testing culture.