As far as I know, Bahamdia Ifraid had the best use with SA165 in attack mode. I do believe it deserves to be on the list though, just not with those spin tracks you listed.
MFB: Standard :: Competitive Customs List and Public Discussion
If not Flash on RF for top tier, I do definitely believe Flash W145MF should be on there.
![[Image: 20af95v.png]](https://i61.tinypic.com/20af95v.png)
![[Image: 29c0thl.png]](https://i60.tinypic.com/29c0thl.png)
Flash totally deserves to remain up. While something like Wyvang is a fail against Duo, Flash dominates it.
yeah I knew flash still deserved a spot 
(now I an go to tournaments with it as soon as I get mf cause so far I have lrf )
(now I an go to tournaments with it as soon as I get mf cause so far I have lrf )
![[Image: titi_sig.png]](https://box44.fr/beyblade/sig/titi_sig.png)
(Sep. 13, 2013 4:01 AM)ShinobuXD Wrote: Flash totally deserves to remain up. While something like Wyvang is a fail against Duo, Flash dominates it.
This man has it covered, couldn't put it any better.
(Sep. 12, 2013 11:43 PM)AZL Wrote: My draft:
ATTACK
MF-H Flash Orion/Belzeeb/Ionis GB145/W145/H145/S130/CH120 R2F/LRF/RF
Flash Orion/Belzeeb/Ionis W145 MF
MSF-H Wyvang^2 GB145/W145/H145/CH120 R2F/LRF/RF
Wyvang Dragooon SA165 RF/R2F/LRF (RF probably works the best).
MSF-H Balro^2 S130/CH120/W145 R2F/LRF/RF
Bahamida Ifraid H145/CH120/S130/SA165/W145 RF/R2F/LRF
I like this list outside of a few nitpicks:
1) There hasn't been much (any?) testing of Bahamdia Ifraid on anything but SA165, iirc
2) While I like LRF on right-spin well enough, I know a number of users have expressed in the past that LRF shouldn't be on the competitive list for right-spin customs since R2F (and RF?) is faster.
(Sep. 12, 2013 11:43 PM)AZL Wrote: BALANCE
Revizer Dragooon E230CF/GCF (defeats many Wyvang/Balro combos).
Duo/Death Cygnus/Aquario/Cancer F230CF/GCF
Ah, here are the customs I've had questions about.
The test results for Reviser Dragooon E230CF/GCF have been surprisingly good, but has it made a dent in competitive play yet?
So Duo/Death Cygnus F230CF/GCF is sort of like an anti-spin-steal custom, isn't it? I still haven't totally figured out what it is notably good at since I don't have one of those darn orange F230s
(Sep. 12, 2013 11:43 PM)AZL Wrote:
DEFENSE
MF-H Scythe Uranus/Picses/Horuseus (maybe) 85 RS
MSF-H Revizer/Killerken Revizer/Killerken E230/BD145 RSF/RB/RDF/CS
MSF-H Duo Bull/Aquario/Cygnus E230/BD145 RDF/RSF/RB/CS.
I'd be afraid that Horuseus would have more recoil than Uranus and Pisces, but it MIGHT work. I can check it out when I get home.
I have no complaints with the rest, though I was a fan of the pruning that theblackdragon did for some of the defense customs (no Killerken on bottom on E230, no Duo on E230, etc).
One could argue Genbull is missing, but overall that looks pretty good.
IMO, Flash is totally amazing... one thing more to note is that it has much more speed, mobility and controllability than most other attack wheels. 
![[Image: 68vfxj.jpg]](https://oi57.tinypic.com/68vfxj.jpg)
yes I totally agree with theblackdragon and ingluit but other then what they mentioned the list looks great!
but other then what they mentioned the list looks great!
(Sep. 13, 2013 3:47 PM)theblackdragon Wrote: IMO, Flash is totally amazing... one thing more to note is that it has much more speed, mobility and controllability than most other attack wheels.
I still love it, but I have a relatively easy time controlling the other attack wheels. :o
It is still great against Duo though XD
I added stamina, what do people think?
I have to say no for BWD because it is made for the Zero-G Stadium, but unbalanced in the BB-10. Genbull on D? lol no, as far as Stamina goes, it goes well with TB. And Killerken W145GF, wouldn't work too well :\ I'm gonna draft a list soon.
![[Image: shining_sig.jpg]](https://s25.postimg.org/ni454yfgv/shining_sig.jpg)
(Sep. 12, 2013 11:43 PM)AZL Wrote: My draft:
STAMINA
Duo Cancer/Aquario/Cygnus/Hades W145 BWD/WD
Duo 160 PD
Duo TH170 D
Duo 230 D
Phantom Hades/Cancer/Cygnus W145BWD/WD
Phantom TH170 D
Phantom 230 D
Genbull^2 SR200/TH170D
Revizer Dragooon SA165 EWD/WD
Woah... you threw me a curve ball man! XD
1. Where's TB for Genbull? I believe TB and CS were the only things Genbull got great results on.
2. Where's SR200TB for Duo? I like that set up a lot.
3. I don't believe BWD was ever proven to do anything as well/better than WD in a BB-10 stadium (I could be wrong about that) :\
4. SD isn't up there.
That's one thing that totally shuts me off... SD is eternally dominant in the field of stamina. It leaves almost everything in the dust from my experience.5. There's no Dragooon anywhere! That's absolutely essential IMO. :\
^ Yes.
theblackdragon called pretty much everything on the Stamina Draft, a lot is missing from it as opposed to the rest of AZL's draft.
Also, I noticed that MSF-L Girago Girago BD145 RF was left off the list, and I feel that it deserves a place after the results it was getting. Some of the best that had been seen in a while.
theblackdragon called pretty much everything on the Stamina Draft, a lot is missing from it as opposed to the rest of AZL's draft.
Also, I noticed that MSF-L Girago Girago BD145 RF was left off the list, and I feel that it deserves a place after the results it was getting. Some of the best that had been seen in a while.
(Sep. 14, 2013 4:15 AM)Kai Hiwatari Wrote: ^ Yes.
theblackdragon called pretty much everything on the Stamina Draft, a lot is missing from it as opposed to the rest of AZL's draft.
Also, I noticed that MSF-L Girago Girago BD145 RF was left off the list, and I feel that it deserves a place after the results it was getting. Some of the best that had been seen in a while.
That combo is in he balance section.
EDIT: I edited my draft.
I feel like we've gotten a pretty darn good list together, so until we get official word as to whether or not we'll see an update soon...
CAN OF WORMS TIME
What does everybody think regarding this: Should the competitive customs list favor only the THEORETICALLY best customs (regardless of their popularity), or should it favor POPULAR parts and customs (meaning the parts you are most likely to run into at a tournament)?
The best example I can think of of a part that would be on one list and not the other is B:D. If the list is only concerned with the theoretical best, then it would not be on the list due to its laughably poor defense and awkward height. However, if tournament popularity was a bigger factor, B:D would almost certainly make the list since it is a very common sight at tournaments.
One argument for favoring theory is that the list would be the "true" best of the best. An argument for favoring tournament popularity is that the list would be a better indicator of what one is most likely to face in a tournament situation.
Thoughts?
CAN OF WORMS TIME
What does everybody think regarding this: Should the competitive customs list favor only the THEORETICALLY best customs (regardless of their popularity), or should it favor POPULAR parts and customs (meaning the parts you are most likely to run into at a tournament)?
The best example I can think of of a part that would be on one list and not the other is B:D. If the list is only concerned with the theoretical best, then it would not be on the list due to its laughably poor defense and awkward height. However, if tournament popularity was a bigger factor, B:D would almost certainly make the list since it is a very common sight at tournaments.
One argument for favoring theory is that the list would be the "true" best of the best. An argument for favoring tournament popularity is that the list would be a better indicator of what one is most likely to face in a tournament situation.
Thoughts?
Beyblade communities vary widely area to area but I think it would be cool to see combos on there that have high tournament success and also the theoretical top tier customs.
The tournament list could give new people an idea of what they should expect to see at a tournament and get them ready for what they're about to face. I like te idea!
The tournament list could give new people an idea of what they should expect to see at a tournament and get them ready for what they're about to face. I like te idea!
I like the idea of having a list for popular combos, but I would argue that it should be separate from the top-tier list. Additionally, the Winning Combos thread is already a hub for emerging and popular customs.
Yes... I have a few thoughts: 
*GASP* It's good to have that out of my system.
XD Aaaaaanywho, on the subject of having 2 lists... I believe only customs that are confirmed through test/tournament results to be superior to the average combo should be considered for the tier-list.
Think about it... if something is more popular, does that make it more competitive than something else?
If something wins a lot, then it should be tested to see if it's awesome... if it is, then that's great, and we'll slap it onto the list, but having a list of popular combos labeled as "Competitive" really doesn't strike me as a good idea. Having a list that keeps us all up to date with the current metagame would be really cool though, as long as we made the distinction between combos that are popular, and ones that have been tested/proven to be competitive, IMO
Cool Idea!
EDIT: ^What Cake said
Spoiler (Click to View)
*GASP* It's good to have that out of my system.
XD Aaaaaanywho, on the subject of having 2 lists... I believe only customs that are confirmed through test/tournament results to be superior to the average combo should be considered for the tier-list.
Think about it... if something is more popular, does that make it more competitive than something else?
If something wins a lot, then it should be tested to see if it's awesome... if it is, then that's great, and we'll slap it onto the list, but having a list of popular combos labeled as "Competitive" really doesn't strike me as a good idea. Having a list that keeps us all up to date with the current metagame would be really cool though, as long as we made the distinction between combos that are popular, and ones that have been tested/proven to be competitive, IMO
Cool Idea!
EDIT: ^What Cake said
well looks like this list has come a long way other than what theblackdragon and cake said in the balance section why no Diablo UnicornoII/Kerbecs BD145/GB145RF/R2F for anti attack? I mean I can understand that basalt just isn't what it used to be but Diablo?
other than what theblackdragon and cake said in the balance section why no Diablo UnicornoII/Kerbecs BD145/GB145RF/R2F for anti attack? I mean I can understand that basalt just isn't what it used to be but Diablo?
Isn't that sort of what the "Winning Combinations" thread is for? (To show, what combos are currently dominating a particular metagame.) Imo, combining them would be somewhat redundant.
The question would also have to be proposed: What kind of concrete process could we use to determine if a combination is used "enough" to be on the list. Because the meta-game is not a constant thing, it would be difficult to sort of generalize combos. Things like B would go up at the drop of a hat, but Wyvang Wyvang R2F, and F230CF are still far from the popularity of B, solely because they are ridiculously expensive and attackers are generally more risky. Are we really going to limit the tier list based on price and availability?
The question would also have to be proposed: What kind of concrete process could we use to determine if a combination is used "enough" to be on the list. Because the meta-game is not a constant thing, it would be difficult to sort of generalize combos. Things like B
would go up at the drop of a hat, but Wyvang Wyvang R2F, and F230CF are still far from the popularity of B, solely because they are ridiculously expensive and attackers are generally more risky. Are we really going to limit the tier list based on price and availability?
![[Image: genbullsig.png]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-io7_XMqG5Rc/UbZB3O0wpOI/AAAAAAAAA7U/zjtN6ICXrbc/s800/genbullsig.png)
The tier list should be the absolute best customs; price/availability should not have any effect on it.
I noticed Duo SA165WD can beat Revizer dragooon E230CF. I feel bad for revizer dragooon, it can't go on the list.
Ummm... no? It should be on the list, no Dragooon can beat Duo except BD145GF and Genbull Dragooon maybe.