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[LTD] The Metal Fury Project - Phase 2 - Stamina

Dec. 19, 2013  8:15 PM
 
:: The Metal Fury Project ::
Phase 2 - Stamina
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Hey guys! Who's ready for Phase 2 of this exciting project? Conventional Stamina is a super important element to test in any given format, so this will definitely be a beneficial source of information once we pack it full of testing.

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As you all know, this Limited format incorporates mostly parts from the old Hybrid Wheel/Metal System generations. Well, we already have testing for all that stuff. A lot of it's on Beywiki, and, thanks to the great testing bladers before us, we already know everything we need to know about this format.

Right...?

Wrong! All these parts have been tested before, because, at one time, they showed competitive potential. However, there was one series of Beyblade releases that were never tested, due to the fact that, though they were new, they showed no potential against the current metagame. That series was Hasbro's Metal Fury line, their Hybrid Wheel conversions of Takara Tomy's 4D series.

However, as Synchrom and 4D have been eliminated in this exciting new format, Metal Fury has become... well... actually good for something! In the Metal Fury Project, members who wish to volunteer will undergo extensive testing for the Metal Wheels from the Metal Fury line, to find where they lie competitively in the Limited Format meta. This is Phase Two, testing in the field of Stamina. Defense will, obviously, follow later.

Please volunteer your time to test these Metal Wheels out to see if they hold potential!

Fortunately, back around a year ago when I had no idea what I was doing, I bought loads of Metal Fury Beyblades. I'm happy I did now, but I don't have everything! If you own any Metal Wheels that have not been tested yet, chances are it's because I don't own them. Break 'em out and start testing!

We also need multiple users to test each Metal Wheel so that we can see whether or not the results are consistent. If you own any Metal Fury Wheels and the top-tier Track/Bottom combinations to test them out, please do!

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Here, we'll be testing the Metal Fury wheels Phantom, Scythe, and Duo. These are really the only wheels that have shown any potential in the past, and their 4D counterparts were all revolutionary in the field of Stamina following their releases.

To best analyze these Metal Wheels' performance, we'll be setting them up in mirror matches against the ever-dominant Burn Metal Wheel, probably the best contender for pure Stamina in Limited format. We'll also be testing against Earth, another amazing Stamina wheel (and probably the most popular one currently). We'll be testing mirror matches with 230D, W145WD, and 85WD. Unfortunately, I do not own two TH170's, but the 230 testing should more than make up for that.

SR200 TB testing may come later, but, as these alone will be extremely time consuming, I wouldn't get my hopes up if I were you. XD

We'll also be doing testing to compare each wheels' recoil, by putting them each up on W145WD against a semi-aggressive combination, Gravity Perseus TR145RSF (right-spin, counter mode). This will tell us how high the recoil of each wheel is (which is very important, hence the frequent use of Earth/Libra over Burn).

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Let the testing begin!


Recoil benchmarks:
Spoiler (Click to View)


Phantom testing:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Average win rate: 35%

Phantom discussion thread!


Scythe testing:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Average win rate: 58.13%

Additional testing:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Scythe discussion thread!


Duo testing:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Additional testing:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Duo discussion thread!


Overall, to sum it up:

Phantom is sort of meh. It's not necessarily bad, but it's basically a Burn without the advantage of higher-than-average Stamina. There's just no reason to use it over Earth or Burn with such high recoil and only mediocre Stamina.

Scythe is absolutely amazing. Aside from the fact that it's virtually unuseable on a low track, the thing is astoundingly dominant on 230, W145, and TH170 from what we've seen so far. It even out-does Burn the majority of the time! Plus, it has far lower recoil than Burn or Phantom, which is extremely advantageous in just about any situation.

Duo... I don't really know what to say about Duo. I don't own it, but from the numbers I see I'd say it's no knockoff. Some members have been concerned with its extremely low defensive ability, but, again, I haven't experienced it.

So, my personal final conclusion:

Scythe > Earth/Burn > Phantom

And then Duo is somewhere off to the side, because, again, I really have no experience with it. XD

Remember, confirmation is absolutely crucial. Test guys! Remember, if you have testing, make sure to post it here and in the corresponding part's discussion thread if there is one. Also, thanks to Ingulit, Zancrow, and Galaxy Blade for their testing!

One more request here... I know it's a long shot, but if anyone happens to own a Hasbro Death, could they maybe try it out a little and see if it's any good? I wouldn't expect amazing numbers, but just something to experiment with if somebody has time.

Merry Christmas everybody! Grin
Dec. 19, 2013  8:22 PM
 
Wow! I really do think scythe holds potential. Thanks for the tests TBD.

EDIT: I was waiting for someone to make a death thread, i hope someone make it soon, it might hold stamina potential and if we are lucky maybe even defence!
Dec. 19, 2013  8:26 PM
 
I'd like to see Phantom 230 D for Stamina, that'd be pretty cool of anyone wanted to test. Tongue_out
Dec. 19, 2013  8:31 PM
 
Well, I agree. Scythe looks like it's gonna lead stamina. Earth/Burn looks good. Phantom.... Yeah when I done Phantom vs Duo.... Phantom won, but against Scythe, Earth and Burn. It got KO'd. Duo looks like its got really no use. It might be good if you don't have the others. This is what I was thinking. So no "WOW I NEVER THOUGHT THIS!" for me. I look forwards to testing more(well mostly with Scythe, haha.)

Thanks for the tests TBD and for the thanks Tongue_out
Dec. 19, 2013  8:32 PM
 
From what I've seen here's what I think:

Scythe>Earth>Burn>Duo>Phantom

I'm sure a lot of people opinions will be different, but I think it's safe to say Scythe is the best stamina wise.

Here's some tests I did a few days ago to see how it did against a staller.

Scythe Cancer 230D vs. Gravity Perseus D125GCF
SC: 14 wins (All OS)
GP: 6 wins (1 OS, 5 KO)
Scythe Cancer win percentage: 70%

It's awesome that there are so many good choices for metal wheels stamina wise in this format.
Dec. 19, 2013  8:54 PM
 
I only have a modified hasbro stadium so ill try some unofficial tests, hopefully ill get a bb10 soon, i always knew the hasbro scythe wasnt complete worthless to get
Dec. 19, 2013  9:48 PM
 
I have both Hasbro metal fury Duo and Phantom that I'll test, any requests for me to test?
Dec. 19, 2013  9:58 PM
 
Really great job on this thread! You've done a pretty great job of encompassing the tests and what we know of the the Metal Fury-line Wheels into a single thread.
I agree with pretty much everybody in saying that Scythe is the most impressive of the bunch. It's results have been pretty great so far.
At the same time though, I feel Duo is much better than Earth and Burn at the 145-height and when paired with 230MB against 145-height opponents. Galaxy Blade even tested Duo and Scythe in an AD145WD mirror match, and Duo came out on top (surprisingly).
Dec. 19, 2013  10:00 PM
 
(Dec. 19, 2013  9:48 PM)OrionBlade Wrote: I have both Hasbro metal fury Duo and Phantom that I'll test, any requests for me to test?

Test them in the same combos that TBD used for his. Also do a benchmark. This will help us a lot.
Dec. 19, 2013  10:05 PM
 
Ok then thnx ill do testing this weekend as well as post results.
Dec. 20, 2013  1:50 AM
 
Ahhhh, lots and lots of data, and not only that, but data that supports my decision to buy Scythe! <3

Thanks for the tests, TBD.
Dec. 20, 2013  2:06 AM
 
Oh, btw, here are two tests for Duo :}
Earth Cygnus W145WD vs Duo Cancer W145WD
Alternating launches. Swap Clear Wheels every 10 rounds.
Duo wins: 9/20(all OS)
Earth wins: 11/20(all OS)
Duo Win Percentage: 45%

Duo Cancer 230D vs Earth Cygnus 230D
Alternating launches. Swap Clear Wheels every 10 rounds.
Duo wins: 17/20(all OS)
Earth wins: 3/20(all OS)
Duo Win Percentage: 85%
Dec. 20, 2013  2:14 AM
 
Make sure you post those in the Duo thread, as that 145 test is different to what others have got.
Dec. 20, 2013  10:03 AM
 
More info for Scythe, awesome. I really wish i was home and was able to contribute to the testing for this format. I doubt there will be a huge amount of difference in the numbers, but could someone test Scythe on 230? I want to see if there is much of a difference between it and TH220.
Dec. 20, 2013  12:32 PM
 
(Dec. 20, 2013  10:03 AM)Kai Hiwatari Wrote: More info for Scythe, awesome. I really wish i was home and was able to contribute to the testing for this format. I doubt there will be a huge amount of difference in the numbers, but could someone test Scythe on 230? I want to see if there is much of a difference between it and TH220.

I've already done tests on 230. Unless you mean: 230 vs TH220 ?
Dec. 20, 2013  6:55 PM
 
(Dec. 20, 2013  12:32 PM)Galaxy Blade Wrote:
(Dec. 20, 2013  10:03 AM)Kai Hiwatari Wrote: More info for Scythe, awesome. I really wish i was home and was able to contribute to the testing for this format. I doubt there will be a huge amount of difference in the numbers, but could someone test Scythe on 230? I want to see if there is much of a difference between it and TH220.

I've already done tests on 230. Unless you mean: 230 vs TH220 ?

My apologies, I found your post in the Scythe thread, not sure how I skipped over it.
Dec. 29, 2013  8:59 PM
 
All right, so now I will post some other mirror matches, and I will also post these in the Competitive List Discussion and the Duo Discussion thread.

Duo Cancer W145WD vs Burn Cancer W145WD
Alternating launches. Swap parts each 10 rounds.
Duo wins: 12/20(4 KO, 8 OS)
Burn wins: 8/20(6 KO, 2 OS)
Duo Win Percentage: 60%

Duo Cancer W145WD vs Earth Cancer W145WD
Alternating launches. Swap parts each 10 rounds.
Duo wins:17/20(3 KO, 14 OS)
Earth wins:3/20 (1 OS, 2 KO)
Duo Win Percentage:85%

On W145 Duo did pretty good, but nothing to go rushing home about. Will post 230 tests and 85 tests soon.
Dec. 29, 2013  11:22 PM
 
...That's not actually that bad. 60 percent against Burn is pretty darn good.

What concerns me is the fact that Burn landed as many KO's as it did. I had the privilege of watching a Metal Fury Duo perform the other day against a Metal Fury Scythe, and Scythe was pretty solidly superior from what I saw. Plus, Duo was insanely light and hollow. The fact that it took 30 out of 40 percent KO's against another Stamina type is also a bit discouraging. :\
Dec. 30, 2013  1:35 PM
 
I've got more tests!
Duo Cancer 230D vs Scythe Cancer 230D
Alternating launches. Swap parts each 10 rounds.
Duo wins:17/20 (all OS)
Scythe wins:3/20(all OS)
Duo Win Percentage:85%

Duo Cancer 230D vs Burn Cancer 230D
Alternating launches. Swap parts each 10 rounds
Duo wins: 19/20(all OS)
Burn wins: 1/20(all KO)
Duo Win Percentage: 95%

Duo Cancer 230D vs Earth Cancer 230D
Alternating launches.Swap parts each 10 rounds.
Duo wins: 13/20(all OS)
Earth wins: 7/20(all OS)
Duo Win Percentage: 65%

Also TBD, did you notice that Burn has some smash? Because from my Attack tests w/ Burn, it does, so I'm not surprised by the KO's
Dec. 30, 2013  2:21 PM
 
Burn has some Smash, but on WD etc it becomes almost entirely recoil, so while against other Burns/similarly recoily stuff it'll get KO's, it's mostly based on the opponents recoil rather than any attack burn has. Perhaps Duo is so light that Burn doesn't suffer as much recoil against it and therefore actually has some attack in that matchup.
Dec. 30, 2013  2:38 PM
 
there has to be something up with some of the Duo's or Scythes as with my 230D test they were a draw. Either I got a superior Duo or inferior Scythe because I've heard multiple people say Scythe makes Duo look like a chump which I have not noticed one bit.
Dec. 30, 2013  2:53 PM
 
Jeez way to make me worry about my decision to get Scythe instead of Duo haha (though really their comparative weights were what made me go with scythe so eh). Tongue_out

The way to see if that's the case, IMO, would be to have all of you test both your wheels against something else, Burn being the obvious candidate for not being completely shut out by any of them IIRC, on the same setup you used (230D) (also because I think that's already been partially done by one or two of you). I posted some other ideas in the Scythe thread, but if you think it's something up with either of them that would be the way to go. It would also mean if it's something up with Scythe I'll be able to check mine when it arrives. I'd suggest going until you have 20 matches decided by outspin (record the KO's anyway but don't include them in your calculations etc, and don't count them towards your 20 match total nor the ten rounds after which you swap parts over). A lot to ask, but if you're keen to see what's going on (like I am), it's probably as good as you'll get. If that doesn't show any real differences, then odds are it's not a molding/wheel difference thing.

Personally, because Hasbro have never had any real mold differences as far as I know and because these wheels aren't so heavy that there should be significant weight differences occurring, I'd be banking on something related to Scythe's profile and the launch stability/technique or the like of the three of you, especially as we're talking 230D here (though as that's Scythe's forte that's the main height that's relevant to test so changing that is a no-go right now). Perhaps I'm biased by having been doing some solo spin tests and noticing how huge an impact launch stability can have on solo spin times, but that's my guess haha.
Dec. 30, 2013  5:33 PM
 
Ok quick weights:
Scythe: 33.69 grams
Duo: 29.21 grams
I'll get the pics and post more testing results soon. my scale got here so I got excited XD
Dec. 30, 2013  5:35 PM
 
Coach, be sure to post them in the limited weight thread. I don't think we've got Duo yet.
Dec. 30, 2013  5:39 PM
 
The best we had was one someone posted without a source, but it was close to that, which by the way is very light for an MFB wheel, let alone one of Duo's size. As Galaxy Blade said, posting those weights in the Metal Fury weights thread would be great Smile
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