[LTD] Screw Discussion

I've always been a big fan of Screw, and I'd be lying if I said watching such a good wheel (and Screw is a good wheel – it's heavy, externally distributed, and has big contact points with all of the wheel's weight behind them) being completely eclipsed by the rest of the maximum series wasn't a big contributing factor to my desire for something like Limited.

Screw is a good Attack Metal Wheel that does its best work when it can catch opponents in the dips in its wings, and while it has decent side-on smash, height matchups are quite important to it. The main reason I love Screw is that while its ability to launch opponents using it's strong Upward Smash is nice and consistent, every so often it decides it wants to make a hole in my roof and/or face and launches something skyward with more power than I've ever seen the famed Pegasis muster.
On the whole, I expect it to get a spot on the competitive combos list for Attack, and I would recommend people try it out, as while Gravity may put up better numbers thanks to its Dual Spin, Screw is much more exciting without the risk associated with the similarly appealing Pegasis.

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Important: Clear Wheel Choice
Screw is the source of my neurotic obsession with unobstructive clear wheels. Its slopes are not that far out from the clear wheel and it needs them unobstructed as possible, more than it needs matching weight distributions or anything. Stick to the following recommendations unless you want it to perform poorly:
Pisces: My old favourite and a great choice, though I do worry about the spikes in the centre perhaps making contact with significantly taller opponents instead of the slopes once in a while.
Horogium: Probably not as good as Pisces especially against opponents of closer height, but just about everyone owns one and it does work just fine.
Uranus: Juvenile sniggering aside, Uranus provides fantastic clearance for Screw's slopes and is my personal choice of CW for it.

I don't have every CW, so as a general guide anything that is more raised at the edge and like 3mm in from it compared Horogium (and tbh even horogium itself) will reduce effectiveness. If you think you have a good clear wheel for it, take clear side-on and top down pictures for me and I will try to assess it based on those.
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Track Choice Notes
Given the factors that affect Screw's effectiveness, Track Height is obviously very important. Here are the tracks I tried in pre-testing:
R145 is amazing against 230 but not very good against GB145 and meh against lower opponents so it depends on your meta. Generally the improvement over CH120's 145 height is not enough for me to use it seeing as one of my CH120's stays in place nicely in that mode.
85-W105 work well against GB145 and do okay against LTDC (though "okay" against LTDC is still quite poor), but can't do much to 230. 90 was my favourite of them, also being my go-to track for Screw back in the day.
TH170 doesn't seem to work well against anything.
CH120 works quite nicely against GB145 and 230, and very well against the latter if you have one that will reliably lock in place at 145. It does okay against LTDC, going for anything lower track-wise doesn't seem to make that big a difference to how well it does against them, at least. 120 does seem like the tallest you can go while still hitting GB145 users nicely.

As such today I focussed on CH120. I used RSF on my defensive customs and RSF generally does well against Right Spin, so winrates against CS should be and appear to be higher from informal testing.


TESTS!

MF-H Screw Uranus CH120RF (Click to View)


Other track tests will be added when completed (likely when I've done some other major wheels in the format and am back home so I can edit this post easily), however the RF I used for these tests is now pretty much dead, and most of my RF's are either very worn or completely mint, and my RSF is getting worn pretty quick too, and I only have one more regular one and one slightly softer one from the Beat Lynx Random Booster that I don't like as much. I might throw up some CS tests if I get time, as Screw does significantly better against it than RSF (perhaps moreso than most other wheels).

As for benchmarks, I'll do some more tests on other wheels tomorrow so you can get an idea, mainly Leone as I intend to make the part thread for that too (it's my other favourite Metal Wheel in the system), and I personally think Leone is much more suitable for benchmarking than Screw is haha.

Obviously, I'd appreciate other people testing and experimenting with it, but there are more interesting and potentially broken things to test at the moment so no rush.
On CW choice:

I did a quick check, and I can confirm that these CWs are:
Useless for Screw:
Leone
Kerbecs
Pegasus II
Capricorn
Wolf
Aquario
Phoenix
Libra

Less effective for Screw:
Bull
Zurafa

Orion

Possibly effective for Screw:
Byxis
Cancer
Aquila


I would've checked Gil, Dragonis, Quetz and Lynx, but I don't have them on me. Uranus being the best on Screw makes me wonder if TT is really that childish inside. Hah.
Fake tests (Click to View)
WBO Committee: It was recently brought to our attention that all tests by Crescent in this topic are fabricated. We urge you to forget their results and that someone trustworthy conduct the actual tests for the sake of this metagame.
Kujikato I have all those cw's and they all suck aside from Orion which is not terrible but not great. I'll post a list of the ones I don't have later tonight.
Galaxy blade: better compared to what? I see no rf tests in your post. Personally I prefer rf as screw has rotational recoil that needs to be controlled and I find rf does that better, but r2f may work better for others as speed does help screw along.
Fake tests (Click to View)
WBO Committee: It was recently brought to our attention that all tests by Crescent in this topic are fabricated. We urge you to forget their results and that someone trustworthy conduct the actual tests for the sake of this metagame.
Galaxy Blade: Tests from different users aren't directly comparable, it's why we have benchmarks. Even then, for attack in particular, such comparisons are prone to innacuracy.
Thanks for the tests, though.

I did a test using MF-H Screw Uranus R145RF as part of a large batch of tests I'm going to post in random thoughts shortly, and it did decently all things considered, though I did have to bank extremely harsh to get the best out of it. I'll copy that and any other relevant tests into the OP once I get back home next week.

Oh, and the clear wheels I don't have are:
Aries, Orso, Chimera, Anubius, Dragonis, Hades, Cygnus, Jupiter, Fox, Ionis, Lyra, Beelzeb, or any others introduced in the Jade Jupiter and Fusion Hades Random Boosters that I may have forgotten. I'm pretty sure that's all of them, though it's entirely off the top of my head.
I'm glad Screw has received it's own thread. I actually liked it when it came out and used it a lot. Is there anything in particular that someone wants to see a Screw Attack combo play against? I can test against the majority of things. Also I'll probably try to do some of the tests in the OP to verify the results (although I'm pretty positive they will be about the same). Thanks for making the thread th!nk, I'm glad I can mess around with my Srcew metal wheels some more now.
I would think Gemios, Scorpio, & Horuseus might work well with Screw as well.
and Thunder Dome, you know you don't mess around with screw, it's quite obvious you screw around with it...
Why would Unicorno not work well with Screw?
Guys I have checked every cw I own and I own the vast majority of them. A couple of posts back I listed the ones I don't have (I forgot crown,admittedly), but unless it is on that list or the one in the OP it is certainly not a good choice for screw. Please, I have blisters on my phone typing thumb and really dodgy internet with limited data allowance, try not to make me have to post unnecessarily. Smile
I know this wouldn't help much, but if you put escolpio on it although it blocks metal but Escolpio also has great effect on destabilizing things higher. I've informally tested this on 85 and sometimes it could ko 230. Please try.
I'll be happy to try. I'm looking at all my CW's, but can't seem to find the best fit for Screw. I hope Elscopio is good. IIRC, it used to be tier for attack, on the list. I was looking at Elscopio, but wasn't sure about it. I look happy to try Elscopio and hope it's a good CW choice for Screw.
I've always been one of escolpio's biggest proponents (originally because MF Rock Escolpio 90MF was hella fun, but sadly it doesn't really work as well as I remember), but its entire thing is adding what Screw already has to metal wheels that don't have it. Screw does it better, better with metal, and Escolpio or any other CW seeking to add a less effective version of what Screw already does to Screw only gets in its way.

As I've said, if I didn't list it in the OP and I have it, it isn't a good choice. I'll sit down today and provide some alternate choices for people who somehow have neither Horogium or Uranus/Ice-Titan, and we'll see what ends up there.
Ah Screw!

It as well is one of my overall favorite Metal Wheels!
Since I have been in Mexico without any Beyblades just to tinker with, I can not tell you how many times I saw a Screw Capricorn 90 MF at Walmart and just had to practically yank it from my hands since I really need to be saving my money as much as possible due to my current situation.

Anyways,

Glad to see it is finally getting some attention, and hopefully will be a useable part in the Limited Format.
It's most certainly usable, very likely competitive depending on how metal fury and zero g wheels pan out opposition and competition wise. It will face a lot of competition from Pegasis which is very similar and perhaps a little more powerful, while Screw is heavier (including my heaviest CW, a 3.5g Kerbecs, it's heavier than anything pre-maximum series not called "Libra", in fact) and less recoil prone.

I'm glad we managed to implement a more complex banlist so we didn't just ban the entire maximum series, allowing screw to shine.
This is so cool! Thank god I have Screw, and as a matter of fact, TWO!!
I would like tests done against Earth/Burn SR200 and TH170 stamina customs, just to see how well Screw does against it. Though I would mainly want to see Screw Uranus R145RF go against Earth and Burn SR200 customs.
That is all.
Did a couple of tests for Screw. I wanted to get in-deph about R145 for it.

MF (TT) Screw Pisces R145RF vs MF (Hasbro) Earth Aquario 230RSF

Banking Used for attack, defense launched normally.
BB-10 Stadium (Repaired) L/R String
MF Screw Pisces R145RF 10 Wins All KOs
MF Earth Aquario 230RSF 10 Wins All OSs
Screw Win Rate=50%

I wanted to mention the MFs original manufacture because of the weights etc... TT's MFs are lighter than Hasbro something like that I read a long time ago that I'm pretty sure is true.

My launch could have been better with the banking and my launcher has been repaired and not as strong as a Mint one. I'm pretty sure Screw would have gotten around 70% If not higher if these factors didn't occur.

MF Screw Pisces R145RF vs MF Earth Aquario GB145RSF
MF Screw Pisces R145RF 4 Wins All KOs
MF Earth Aquario GB145RSF 16 Wins all OSs
Screw Win Rate=20%

I think it could have gotten a 40% with a better launcher maybe it seemed to be taller than Earth and proaboly was barely but it like has always seemed needs to be slightly under.

MF Screw Pisces R145RF vs MF Earth Aquario 90RSF
Screw Pisces 0 Wins
Earth Aquario 20 Wins 19 OSs 1 Under Belly KO
Screw Win Rate= 0%

Expected.

I wanted to do the SR200 one for fun.

MF Screw Pisces R145RF vs MF Earth Aquario SR200RSF
Screw Pisces 7 Wins All KOs
Earth Aquario 13 Wins All OSs
Screw Win Rate= 35%

SR200 is interesting.
Sorry if I missed something or whatever I haven't tested in a while just yell at me about it if you need something like molds etc...

Wall Saves is also counted as other factors. Preformed generally as guessed could have been better on my part. I know that tests for the these combos might have been done in the past a long time ago but this gave me a perfect chance to play with my Screw Grin
R145 seems like a sensible choice for screw between screw being the heaviest HWS wheel in the format (metal fury pending) and R145 being the heaviest track (X: D is heavier than R145MB but has problems), but it really needs to get under things or at least get a good height matchup. That 0% vs LTDC is why I went with CH120 for the OP.

I'm puzzled by that SR200 matchup as I don't recall TH195 being that problematic for it, but I'll check if I get time when I'm done what I'm currently working on. I also feel those 230 results are on the low side but idk, it's been a while. I'll check my memory tomorrow.
I wanted to see if it could throw its weight to hit LTDC I didn't expect very good results but wanted to see it against most of the viable defense limited combos I have read recently in case anyways. The SR200 might just be cause its the last test I did as in, Launcher got more worn ou,t, or/and I got tired. Its late for me I'm gonna get to bed now lol. I am pretty sure CH120 would be maybe the best track for screw when I was doing the LTDC test I just wanted a compairison test in stone as a check.
At BillyBlast:
Thank you for the SR200 testing, and I also liked the 230 tests. Even though I haven't done any tests(which I won't be able to do for a while, hopefully after Christmas), I can conclude that from the tests, IF the launcher did wear out, or if you had gotten tired, that SR200 was able to absorb Screw Pisces' hits to some extent thanks to the plastic ring encircling it. Maybe it wouldn't do the same if you weren't tired, which is actually what I would not want to happen, not the tests being better, but your Launcher being worn out. Smile

At th!nk:
I can understand that R145 is like Screw's son, but what about TR145? Just asking.
I'll get back to you on TR145 when mine arrives in the next few days.


I wouldn't think the ring on SR200 is wide enough to do anything to screw but then I don't own one.
Checked my clear wheels & I couldn't find anything that hadn't been covered already except Unicorno, which seems to me to be on the same level as Uranus. My question is why use Screw when there are more viable attack wheels out there? (namely Gravity)
I messed around with Screw for a few days after hearing about the Limited format, but gave up because it seemed like a waste of time.
Screw is one of the heavier wheels in Limited, if not one of the heaviest IIRC, which puts it at a pretty big advantage.
It is pretty heavy, which is definitely an advantage. I just don't see the attack power as being tier list worthy. I'll have to do a little more testing myself though.