Burst Classic - New Format Feedback & Discussion
(Mar. 17, 2019 10:05 PM)bladekid Wrote:(Mar. 17, 2019 8:44 PM)DeceasedCrab Wrote: Nah, Wombat has a good point: Wolborg only excelled because everyone wasn't using attack layers.
I was and it didn't make a dent in WB
Hey bladekid!
I appreciate you using attack! I didn't get to see any of your matches so I apologize if my last post made it sound like attack combos weren't used at the tournament.
I was able to do some quick tests with V2.H.Hn' against Wolborg.Y.Et and V2 was able to burst it consistently. While Wolborg on Y/H.Et is a pretty safe choice to use and was pretty much spammed at Wombat's tournament, it is by no means unbeatable. I'll try and get some more formal testing done and a video up soon to show you my results!
(Mar. 18, 2019 2:11 AM)LazerBeamz Wrote:That is interesting. Have you tried any other beys against V2.H.Hn'? It seems like maybe R isnt as good as Ive heard and seen, even though it was able to burst my G2.G.O pretty easily. Thanks!(Mar. 17, 2019 10:05 PM)bladekid Wrote: I was and it didn't make a dent in WB
Hey bladekid!
I appreciate you using attack! I didn't get to see any of your matches so I apologize if my last post made it sound like attack combos weren't used at the tournament.
I was able to do some quick tests with V2.H.Hn' against Wolborg.Y.Et and V2 was able to burst it consistently. While Wolborg on Y/H.Et is a pretty safe choice to use and was pretty much spammed at Wombat's tournament, it is by no means unbeatable. I'll try and get some more formal testing done and a video up soon to show you my results!
Finally getting around to this after it slipped my mind, haha. Sorry for the delay! 
Back to the Classics
London, UK - 19/01/19
1st - @[Mr LT]
Deathscyther Knuckle Zephyr
Kaiser Kerbeus Gravity Orbit
Victory Valkyrie Heavy Planet
2nd - @[SprigganJoseph]
Kaiser Kerbeus Gravity Orbit
Deathscyther Heavy Revolve
Gigant Gaia Spread Zephyr
3rd - ~Mana~
Victory Valkyrie Heavy Planet
Victory Valkyrie Gravity Xtreme'
Roktavor Central Accel
Nice diversity of combos at our event. I wasn't 100% sure what to expect given that we were the first Classic event to be held, but it panned out pretty nicely, and there was a lot of progression throughout the day. Many people went back to combos that were popular back in the 2016 metagame (DHR, OHD etc), but to limited success due to newer Drivers mixing things up. I personally went into the event with V2.H.Pl being my key combo due to it's swiftness to Burst the stationary targets that I assumed people would try to stick to. Planet helps give V2 both the stamina and the weight to compete in a stationary attack battle, which was really nice to see. This combo caught on throughout the day, with LT and Basedsamuraij also using it to success too.
K2 Orbit then became a thing to counter V2 Planet, and it was pretty much the one thing that worked consistently. gK bursts, A2 bursts etc, so seeing K2 become a thing again was cool, and it was great to see that the effective meta within the event shifted as the day went on as counters were improvised and succeeded.
Everyone definitely had a blast with this though, and I've heard many say that they'd like more of Classic, so that can only be a good thing!
Future Considerations
The meta is still evolving, and that's easily seen in the varying winning combos lists from the communities that have taken part in this development (thanks to all the hosts to have joined this initiative!), so it's difficult to comment on much of our next steps. I'm hearing that Wolborg Eternal has been making a splash in some areas, and we're seeing counters to that being developed, which is definitely increasing the diversity even further! Nonetheless, we'll keep an eye on Wolborg for sure, as it's a force to be reckoned with even with the current "counter".
It's also worth reconsidering the stance on some of our Dash Drivers, and it might even be worth hosting a Classic event with them completely unbanned just to check the major areas of impact and how much it'd really affect the event as a whole. There's a lot of speculation and differing opinions in this area, so this would absolutely help to quell this difference and give us some competitive data to work with (not disregarding testing in any way of course). Stuff like Merge', Jolt' and Fusion' can probably definitely be removed from the banlist for their own reasons, so it'd be interesting to just give everything a try as a whole to pick out what actually is problematic.
Addressing New Disks
As you probably expected, the following Disks are now banned within Burst Classic;
I'm conscious that we'll need to create some better wording for Disk restrictions though, as it's pretty impractical to have to declare immediately on a new Disk release "by the way, you can't use this new Disk". Need to consider what the best way to word this is to avoid as much confusion as possible, while still providing the catchall.
Back to the Classics
London, UK - 19/01/19
1st - @[Mr LT]
Deathscyther Knuckle Zephyr
Kaiser Kerbeus Gravity Orbit
Victory Valkyrie Heavy Planet
2nd - @[SprigganJoseph]
Kaiser Kerbeus Gravity Orbit
Deathscyther Heavy Revolve
Gigant Gaia Spread Zephyr
3rd - ~Mana~
Victory Valkyrie Heavy Planet
Victory Valkyrie Gravity Xtreme'
Roktavor Central Accel
Nice diversity of combos at our event. I wasn't 100% sure what to expect given that we were the first Classic event to be held, but it panned out pretty nicely, and there was a lot of progression throughout the day. Many people went back to combos that were popular back in the 2016 metagame (DHR, OHD etc), but to limited success due to newer Drivers mixing things up. I personally went into the event with V2.H.Pl being my key combo due to it's swiftness to Burst the stationary targets that I assumed people would try to stick to. Planet helps give V2 both the stamina and the weight to compete in a stationary attack battle, which was really nice to see. This combo caught on throughout the day, with LT and Basedsamuraij also using it to success too.
K2 Orbit then became a thing to counter V2 Planet, and it was pretty much the one thing that worked consistently. gK bursts, A2 bursts etc, so seeing K2 become a thing again was cool, and it was great to see that the effective meta within the event shifted as the day went on as counters were improvised and succeeded.
Everyone definitely had a blast with this though, and I've heard many say that they'd like more of Classic, so that can only be a good thing!
Future Considerations
The meta is still evolving, and that's easily seen in the varying winning combos lists from the communities that have taken part in this development (thanks to all the hosts to have joined this initiative!), so it's difficult to comment on much of our next steps. I'm hearing that Wolborg Eternal has been making a splash in some areas, and we're seeing counters to that being developed, which is definitely increasing the diversity even further! Nonetheless, we'll keep an eye on Wolborg for sure, as it's a force to be reckoned with even with the current "counter".
It's also worth reconsidering the stance on some of our Dash Drivers, and it might even be worth hosting a Classic event with them completely unbanned just to check the major areas of impact and how much it'd really affect the event as a whole. There's a lot of speculation and differing opinions in this area, so this would absolutely help to quell this difference and give us some competitive data to work with (not disregarding testing in any way of course). Stuff like Merge', Jolt' and Fusion' can probably definitely be removed from the banlist for their own reasons, so it'd be interesting to just give everything a try as a whole to pick out what actually is problematic.
Addressing New Disks
As you probably expected, the following Disks are now banned within Burst Classic;
- Blitz (Bl)
- Sting (St)
- Hurricane (Hr)
I'm conscious that we'll need to create some better wording for Disk restrictions though, as it's pretty impractical to have to declare immediately on a new Disk release "by the way, you can't use this new Disk". Need to consider what the best way to word this is to avoid as much confusion as possible, while still providing the catchall.
(Mar. 18, 2019 12:10 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: I'm conscious that we'll need to create some better wording for Disk restrictions though, as it's pretty impractical to have to declare immediately on a new Disk release "by the way, you can't use this new Disk". Need to consider what the best way to word this is to avoid as much confusion as possible, while still providing the catchall.
>no Outer, Zenith, or Disks w/numbers or two-letter initials allowed
Done. ?
Can we assume Power is also to remain legal? lol
![[Image: vwa_copy3_by_elcesplooshe_daejy2u-fullvi...Za8ANFHK5M]](https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca887773594c2.wixmp.com/f/0779b042-834a-4ac6-9292-fab88a9af9cb/daejy2u-70e51d94-acbe-4593-ad69-5434d834b672.jpg/v1/fill/w_1024,h_317,q_75,strp/vwa_copy3_by_elcesplooshe_daejy2u-fullview.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9MzE3IiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvMDc3OWIwNDItODM0YS00YWM2LTkyOTItZmFiODhhOWFmOWNiXC9kYWVqeTJ1LTcwZTUxZDk0LWFjYmUtNDU5My1hZDY5LTU0MzRkODM0YjY3Mi5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTAyNCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19.GJIQK2sXAJm5ScpS3pSVJ8KrA6Ru9qtE4Za8ANFHK5M)
(Mar. 18, 2019 2:54 PM)Angry Face Wrote:(Mar. 18, 2019 12:10 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: I'm conscious that we'll need to create some better wording for Disk restrictions though, as it's pretty impractical to have to declare immediately on a new Disk release "by the way, you can't use this new Disk". Need to consider what the best way to word this is to avoid as much confusion as possible, while still providing the catchall.
>no Outer, Zenith, or Disks w/numbers or two-letter initials allowed
Done. ?
Can we assume Power is also to remain legal? lol
Something along those lines. That's the general gist, just wondered whether that was too complicated for some people, haha.
And yes, until further notice, Power and the other new Drivers are legal. We'll evaluate their impact on Classic over time.
So Charge is not banned?
I can imagine it could be used for tornado stalling.
It is just a flat tip with a metal dome above it.
It will just need testing.
I can imagine it could be used for tornado stalling.
It is just a flat tip with a metal dome above it.
It will just need testing.
It sounds like a fair format, so I won't give any harsh or bad feedback. It actually seems more fair than other formats, but other than that this format is actually cool, and it sounds fun too!
![[Image: tumblr_pev4slgYJv1xyuhm7o3_400.gif]](https://66.media.tumblr.com/716f35733b6ce5e904ee10427fc56687/tumblr_pev4slgYJv1xyuhm7o3_400.gif)
That's epic!!!!???✨??
(Mar. 18, 2019 7:42 PM)ks123 Wrote:(Mar. 18, 2019 7:25 PM)MWF Wrote: So Charge is not banned?
I can imagine it could be used for tornado stalling.
It is just a flat tip with a metal dome above it.
It will just need testing.
Charge isn’t banned. Only Bearing (H only), Atomic and most dash drivers is banned.
Charge should be banned. It’s roughly the same size as the gt discs, which are larger than the older layers, and very heavy too.
I mean...
I was picky with my words. Let's see the impact is has in the last few trial events before the format becomes ranked before jumping to any major conclusions. It's heavy for sure, but so is Octa and that barely makes a splash, so let's see what happens when it appears in an event.
(Mar. 18, 2019 5:19 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: We'll evaluate their impact on Classic over time.
I was picky with my words. Let's see the impact is has in the last few trial events before the format becomes ranked before jumping to any major conclusions. It's heavy for sure, but so is Octa and that barely makes a splash, so let's see what happens when it appears in an event.
Is there any rulling on octa, or is there not enough testing on octs to make a rulling?
No rulings on Octa. Hasn't really made a major splash as it does have its drawbacks. But it's obviously a part to keep an eye on.
I dont have any layers that are not banned
Charge doesn’t need to be banned unless it has a dash counterpart
Charge has a weake spring
So it doesn’t matter if it is heavy
Also because it is basically yard + accel, it can’t pull of a sliding shoot very easily
For tornado stalling, it may be decent, because again it is like yard, it wont have much LAD at all, and when it touches the tornado ridge it spreads up reducing stamina.
If you have a particular combo i wouldnt mind trying it out, as i have had charge for 3 days, and right now it is not that impressive
Charge has a weake spring
So it doesn’t matter if it is heavy
Also because it is basically yard + accel, it can’t pull of a sliding shoot very easily
For tornado stalling, it may be decent, because again it is like yard, it wont have much LAD at all, and when it touches the tornado ridge it spreads up reducing stamina.
If you have a particular combo i wouldnt mind trying it out, as i have had charge for 3 days, and right now it is not that impressive
Are the new disks from gachi gonna be banned?
I’m pretty sure this is banned, but is Br unbanned just like Gk?
@[~Mana~] Please, I'm begging you, edit the OP to clarify the ruling. They still won't read it, just like they won't read the answers staring them in the face on the same page they ask, but maybe, just maybe, one of them will.
Done ?
(Mar. 19, 2019 1:17 AM)~Mana~ Wrote: I mean...
(Mar. 18, 2019 5:19 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: We'll evaluate their impact on Classic over time.
I was picky with my words. Let's see the impact is has in the last few trial events before the format becomes ranked before jumping to any major conclusions. It's heavy for sure, but so is Octa and that barely makes a splash, so let's see what happens when it appears in an event.
To be fair, there's very little access to Octa. Charge will be a lot more available, so more people are going to try it.
I'm referring to Octa in a performance sense really. It just doesn't make much impact on things; it's weight is nice and lets it keep the center nicely, but it's instability and average stamina means that it can very easily be beaten. I hear it works nicely in an "Octavor" combo, but I don't think it'll make much of a splash outside of that.
Charge, yes, will be more available from the get go and I'm sure lots will try to use it in Classic because of the weight advantage. I don't think this weight advantage will he's the fact that the Driver has poor Burst resistance and subpar stamina though, haha. But it'll be interesting to see how it goes.
Charge, yes, will be more available from the get go and I'm sure lots will try to use it in Classic because of the weight advantage. I don't think this weight advantage will he's the fact that the Driver has poor Burst resistance and subpar stamina though, haha. But it'll be interesting to see how it goes.
(Mar. 22, 2019 7:24 PM)~Mana~ Wrote: I'm referring to Octa in a performance sense really. It just doesn't make much impact on things; it's weight is nice and lets it keep the center nicely, but it's instability and average stamina means that it can very easily be beaten. I hear it works nicely in an "Octavor" combo, but I don't think it'll make much of a splash outside of that.
Charge, yes, will be more available from the get go and I'm sure lots will try to use it in Classic because of the weight advantage. I don't think this weight advantage will he's the fact that the Driver has poor Burst resistance and subpar stamina though, haha. But it'll be interesting to see how it goes.
What is an Octavor Combo?