[Takara Tomy] Maximum Garuda Testing/Discussion
Can you try Maximum Garuda on Accel or Hunter? I want to see how well it can work for Push Attack
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I freakin knew this was gonna happen. This may end up being the fastest banned part ever lol
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Have there been any tests against the standard right-spin attack layers, like the Valkyrie/Valtryek family, B2, X, ect? I see a lot of people here saying that attack is trash now, but I'm seeing absolutely no burst attack tests against this, and logically with mG's lack of teeth burst should be it's weakness right? I get that the tests are for the current burst meta, which is almost devoid of attack thanks to dF, and the fact that mG is a perfect circle, but that doesn't mean we should just discount attack before officially testing it here
i would ban atomic and mg why not drain fafnir because every single op stamina combo the is (well at lest most) includes atomic
TT rlly needs more attack types
Beyblade burst meta game is trash because the players that spam on stamina all day and tt not releasing enough good attack types to balance the meta game burst will se its end if they release another good stamina type
TT rlly needs more attack types
Beyblade burst meta game is trash because the players that spam on stamina all day and tt not releasing enough good attack types to balance the meta game burst will se its end if they release another good stamina type
(Aug. 02, 2017 6:20 PM)Red Eye Wrote: i would ban atomic and mg why not drain fafnir because every single op stamina combo the is (well at lest most) includes atomic
TT rlly needs more attack types
Beyblade burst meta game is trash because the players that spam on stamina all day and tt not releasing enough good attack types to balance the meta game burst will se its end if they release another good stamina type
Sure stamina rules the meta but u can't blame TT for not making good attack layers. Attack is supposed to be that risky genre where it's high risk high reward, so the only problem is probably the stamina layers that make attack useless.
I just find it weird that the most OP parts are only available in random boosters. First Atomic, now Maximum Garuda. And by the way, mG is a completely round layer which has pretty much no weaknesses besides bursting, which is hilarious considering this was almost the exact reason that got D2 banned. While D2 can still be bursted and KOed with relative ease, not to mention that it is slightly unbalanced and can easily break down after about 100 or so launches, mG just seems like a perfect version of D2, while also having only a 1/8 chance of actually obtaining the layer. So yeah, the metagame is pretty much screwed at this point. Maybe someone with lS could burst it on the reg, but it also gets shut down by aC, which is comparable with dF, and we'll need to grab Atomic drivers again.
(Aug. 04, 2017 3:57 PM)Bastillon Wrote: I just find it weird that the most OP parts are only available in random boosters. First Atomic, now Maximum Garuda. And by the way, mG is a completely round layer which has pretty much no weaknesses besides bursting, which is hilarious considering this was almost the exact reason that got D2 banned. While D2 can still be bursted and KOed with relative ease, not to mention that it is slightly unbalanced and can easily break down after about 100 or so launches, mG just seems like a perfect version of D2, while also having only a 1/8 chance of actually obtaining the layer. So yeah, the metagame is pretty much screwed at this point. Maybe someone with lS could burst it on the reg, but it also gets shut down by aC, which is comparable with dF, and we'll need to grab Atomic drivers again.
I guess TT is, in their own twisted way, trying to balance the meta, but at this point, the counters they release to good parts break the hell out of the meta.
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(Aug. 04, 2017 3:57 PM)Bastillon Wrote: I just find it weird that the most OP parts are only available in random boosters. First Atomic, now Maximum Garuda. And by the way, mG is a completely round layer which has pretty much no weaknesses besides bursting, which is hilarious considering this was almost the exact reason that got D2 banned. While D2 can still be bursted and KOed with relative ease, not to mention that it is slightly unbalanced and can easily break down after about 100 or so launches, mG just seems like a perfect version of D2, while also having only a 1/8 chance of actually obtaining the layer. So yeah, the metagame is pretty much screwed at this point. Maybe someone with lS could burst it on the reg, but it also gets shut down by aC, which is comparable with dF, and we'll need to grab Atomic drivers again.
Is it really weird? I mean TT wants people to buy the random boosters and the best way of making them do that is by putting the best parts in them.
(Aug. 04, 2017 3:57 PM)Bastillon Wrote: I just find it weird that the most OP parts are only available in random boosters. First Atomic, now Maximum Garuda. And by the way, mG is a completely round layer which has pretty much no weaknesses besides bursting, which is hilarious considering this was almost the exact reason that got D2 banned. While D2 can still be bursted and KOed with relative ease, not to mention that it is slightly unbalanced and can easily break down after about 100 or so launches, mG just seems like a perfect version of D2, while also having only a 1/8 chance of actually obtaining the layer. So yeah, the metagame is pretty much screwed at this point. Maybe someone with lS could burst it on the reg, but it also gets shut down by aC, which is comparable with dF, and we'll need to grab Atomic drivers again.
Atomic and mG are indeed only in random boosters currently (although chances are they will get re-released at some point), but I wouldn't talk about "the most OP parts" being only included in random boosters as if that was the norm. Most good parts are released regularly, and actually many RB parts haven't been that great.
Bursting is a pretty significant weakness though? Based on my experience at tournaments, D2 was not bursted or KOed with "relative ease" by any stretch of the imagination. I haven't had a chance to test mG myself yet, but if TrainiacJ's testing in the Legend Spriggan thread is any indication, it appears as if the weakness mG has to bursting is significant, which is perfect; something that round does indeed need to be burstable. TT was clearly aware of that when designing the part because there's no real teeth and very little resistance when putting it together.
I think people need to step back for a minute and stop hitting the "metagame is screwed" panic button so quickly when something like this has just been released. It's a bit dramatic and not a healthy practice for the community to start instilling this type of attitude towards new parts which are still in the process of being tested (people also haven't even tested mG against Revolve-based combos yet, which is significant) and understood fully. Not saying mG isn't very good by the looks of things, but from what I can tell, it does seem to have clear weaknesses so far.
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(Aug. 05, 2017 12:33 AM)Kei Wrote: Atomic and mG are indeed only in random boosters currently (although chances are they will get re-released at some point), but I wouldn't talk about "the most OP parts" being only included in random boosters as if that was the norm. Most good parts are released regularly, and actually many RB parts haven't been that great.While true, I heavily doubt that mG is as prone to bursting in normal circumstances. If it successfully resists bursting by dF, one of the best stationary burst attack layers right now, then I will expect that mG is at least powerful enough to exist in the metagame without any real resistance besides lS, and most layers would fail to burst it. And I meant D2 being easier to burst and KO in comparison with mG.
Bursting is a pretty significant weakness though? Based on my experience at tournaments, D2 was not bursted or KOed with "relative ease" by any stretch of the imagination. I haven't had a chance to test mG myself yet, but if TrainiacJ's testing in the Legend Spriggan thread is any indication, it appears as if the weakness mG has to bursting is significant, which is perfect; something that round does indeed need to be burstable. TT was clearly aware of that when designing the part because there's no real teeth and very little resistance when putting it together.
I think people need to step back for a minute and stop hitting the "metagame is screwed" panic button so quickly when something like this has just been released. It's a bit dramatic and not a healthy practice for the community to start instilling this type of attitude towards new parts which are still in the process of being tested (people also haven't even tested mG against Revolve-based combos yet, which is significant) and understood fully. Not saying mG isn't very good by the looks of things, but from what I can tell, it does seem to have clear weaknesses so far.
Because it's totally fair that almost every single meta combo relies on Atomic, a part currently only available in random boosters, and other people who aren't lucky enough would have to wait for the re-release in customized bey *3 + launcher box (which is way more expensive and has a soon ™ slapped on it) or maybe in another regular booster (lol gl with that). It's pretty much the only reason why I've been stuck in a limbo for so long. I just can't test anything anymore without someone casually throwing around "what about __Atomic?" and stuff, and I pretty much "exiled" myself because I still haven't succeeded in defeating dFSR without the new lS.
I don't know how well the "Let's wait for a few months before banning it" will work out, it didn't work so well with dF to mG so far.
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(Aug. 05, 2017 1:46 AM)FIREFIRE CPB Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2017 1:39 AM)Jinbee Wrote: I don't know how well the "Let's wait for a few months before banning it" will work out, it didn't work so well with dF to mG so far.
True. Though as for dF, I'm peetty sure Atomic ban would even it out.
Yeah, I'm also aware that there are many counters for it. Still, opposite spin stamina on stamina is boring.
And we waited almost a year before banning Dark Deathscyther, while the issue was clear upon the first few tournaments after its release...
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:53 AM)Kai-V Wrote: And we waited almost a year before banning Dark Deathscyther, while the issue was clear upon the first few tournaments after its release...
Probably delayed the ban because some were probably waiting for something to beat D2 fairly consistently... and we know how well that went.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:53 AM)Kai-V Wrote: And we waited almost a year before banning Dark Deathscyther, while the issue was clear upon the first few tournaments after its release...
I think reason it took so long to notice it must be ban was due to for stamina it was overshafowed by Deathscyther for quite a some time (most use only that for stamina as Odin was banned) so no one thought it as big treat. I think at one point someone created thread to ban both but discussion didn't ended with any conclusion. When TT banned it we too started discussion again and it got banned.
Edit:- TL;DR Deathscythe kept it from banning and it only pulled it in ban
Contrary to my other post I actually think mG sucks, just launch harder, mG will lose stamina more quickly than any other stamina bey because of the "aerodynamic" design, it will actually slow it down quicker. Trypio is an extreme example but if you launch it fast it loses stamina extremely quicky because of the resistance it adds when the air goes directly through the attack ring. It's time to stop and test Revolve and more attackers k tnx.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:21 AM)Bastillon Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2017 12:33 AM)Kei Wrote: Atomic and mG are indeed only in random boosters currently (although chances are they will get re-released at some point), but I wouldn't talk about "the most OP parts" being only included in random boosters as if that was the norm. Most good parts are released regularly, and actually many RB parts haven't been that great.While true, I heavily doubt that mG is as prone to bursting in normal circumstances. If it successfully resists bursting by dF, one of the best stationary burst attack layers right now, then I will expect that mG is at least powerful enough to exist in the metagame without any real resistance besides lS, and most layers would fail to burst it. And I meant D2 being easier to burst and KO in comparison with mG.
Bursting is a pretty significant weakness though? Based on my experience at tournaments, D2 was not bursted or KOed with "relative ease" by any stretch of the imagination. I haven't had a chance to test mG myself yet, but if TrainiacJ's testing in the Legend Spriggan thread is any indication, it appears as if the weakness mG has to bursting is significant, which is perfect; something that round does indeed need to be burstable. TT was clearly aware of that when designing the part because there's no real teeth and very little resistance when putting it together.
I think people need to step back for a minute and stop hitting the "metagame is screwed" panic button so quickly when something like this has just been released. It's a bit dramatic and not a healthy practice for the community to start instilling this type of attitude towards new parts which are still in the process of being tested (people also haven't even tested mG against Revolve-based combos yet, which is significant) and understood fully. Not saying mG isn't very good by the looks of things, but from what I can tell, it does seem to have clear weaknesses so far.
Because it's totally fair that almost every single meta combo relies on Atomic, a part currently only available in random boosters, and other people who aren't lucky enough would have to wait for the re-release in customized bey *3 + launcher box (which is way more expensive and has a soon ™ slapped on it) or maybe in another regular booster (lol gl with that). It's pretty much the only reason why I've been stuck in a limbo for so long. I just can't test anything anymore without someone casually throwing around "what about __Atomic?" and stuff, and I pretty much "exiled" myself because I still haven't succeeded in defeating dFSR without the new lS.
You can get Atomic in the individual beyblade on ebay for $25 shipped right now. If you really can't afford to spend that then beyblade probably isn't the right hobby for you.
(Aug. 05, 2017 2:02 AM)1234beyblade Wrote: Contrary to my other post I actually think mG sucks, just launch harder, mG will lose stamina more quickly than any other stamina bey because of the "aerodynamic" design, it will actually slow it down quicker. Trypio is an extreme example but if you launch it fast it loses stamina extremely quicky because of the resistance it adds when the air goes directly through the attack ring. It's time to stop and test Revolve and more attackers k tnx.
No offense but your launch is faster then most lol. What driver you tried it on?
Edit:- I 100% agree with against revolve and more attackers (like mainly Valkyrie, V2, gV) and Deathscythe/Chaos/A2/gK
(Aug. 05, 2017 2:24 AM)Bastillon Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2017 2:02 AM)Ultra Wrote: You can get Atomic in the individual beyblade on ebay for $25 shipped right now. If you really can't afford to spend that then beyblade probably isn't the right hobby for you.You DO realize that not everyone has a credit card right?
You don't need a credit card to shop on ebay.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:21 AM)Bastillon Wrote: While true, I heavily doubt that mG is as prone to bursting in normal circumstances. If it successfully resists bursting by dF, one of the best stationary burst attack layers right now, then I will expect that mG is at least powerful enough to exist in the metagame without any real resistance besides lS, and most layers would fail to burst it. And I meant D2 being easier to burst and KO in comparison with mG.
Because it's totally fair that almost every single meta combo relies on Atomic, a part currently only available in random boosters, and other people who aren't lucky enough would have to wait for the re-release in customized bey *3 + launcher box (which is way more expensive and has a soon ™ slapped on it) or maybe in another regular booster (lol gl with that). It's pretty much the only reason why I've been stuck in a limbo for so long. I just can't test anything anymore without someone casually throwing around "what about __Atomic?" and stuff, and I pretty much "exiled" myself because I still haven't succeeded in defeating dFSR without the new lS.
I'm not going to say anything either way about that since I haven't tested it yet other than in the only Attack testing posted on the WBO so far for mG, it demonstrated that it can lose to a significant degree to it. That's not to say all Layers will perform the same way (although I've heard stuff like Valkyire does well too), but it's a good thing that we know something already can perform well against it (unlike for example, with D2 where we didn't know Minoboros did well against it for some time). In any case, it's too early to assume it will exist without "any real resistance besides lS".
Nobody uses dF for stationary attack, though? You my be referring to weak launching–which does increase the chances of it bursting high RPM opponents–but in real tournaments smart players won't hard launch if you're using dF, so this strategy doesn't result in burst finishes much at all.
What Ultra said is true; a fact of life when you play Beyblade competitively is that you sometimes have to buy the newest parts to stay competitive. To me, it hasn't even been that bad in Burst considering how long things like Wyvern, Odin, Neptune, Valkyrie, Revolve, Heavy, Gravity, Spread, etc were (and still are to varying degrees) were competitive. Unfortunately, sometimes we do run into situations where powerful parts are somewhat hard to get, but everyone has an equal opportunity to get them like they do with other regular Burst products ultimately, even if they are in random boosters.
Have you tried something like gV.H.X against dF.S.R? dF.S.R is easier to deal with than the Atomic variant.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:39 AM)Jinbee Wrote: I don't know how well the "Let's wait for a few months before banning it" will work out, it didn't work so well with dF to mG so far.
dF is becoming less dominant as time goes on, though. lS seems to do very well against it, gK on Atomic can consistently OS dF on Atomic, mG seems to do well against it. It's still relevant and useful in the metagame, but I don't think it's as overwhelming as it was even a month ago.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:46 AM)FIREFIRE CPB Wrote: True. Though as for dF, I'm peetty sure Atomic ban would even it out.
Yeah, if we should be considering anything, it should probably be a ban on Atomic sometime soon. It's far more of a problem than mG or dF.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:48 AM)Jinbee Wrote: Still, opposite spin stamina on stamina is boring.
This is a bit off-topic, but it's interesting that you mention that "opposite spin stamina on stamina on stamina is boring". I can't claim to know this for a fact, but the impression I got on my trips to Japan and interactions with the Beyblade community over there is that they didn't necessarily have this pre-conceived notion that for the game to be interesting, Attack had to be viable (that's not to say they didn't use it or enjoy it, though). They placed more care in their launch technique, being able to craft the best Beyblade with the best parts, combo balance, and wear (in the case of things like Xtreme) that they could and found that interesting in itself.
In any case, Burst is indeed a bit too focused on Stamina at the moment (although I don't think it's boring necessarily because of the above reasons and because there are so many smaller nuances to these battles depending on the parts in use), but I do think with Atomic removed the situation could be improved.
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:53 AM)Kai-V Wrote: And we waited almost a year before banning Dark Deathscyther, while the issue was clear upon the first few tournaments after its release...
It's a bit of a stretch to make that comparison at this particular junction. At this point in time, I believe there has been only one WBO tournament with players who own Maximum Garuda? And key match-ups have yet to be tested (vs. Revolve-based combos in particular).
(Aug. 05, 2017 1:55 AM)Jinbee Wrote: Probably delayed the ban because some were probably waiting for something to beat D2 fairly consistently... and we know how well that went.
Minoboros did beat it relatively consistently all along, though. It just took a while for people to discover it. There's a fine line we have to walk here. It's easy to let our knee-jerk reaction to something being evidently powerful upon release like mG seems to be inform our decisions, but you also have to allow at least some time for people to fully understand, use the part, and see the effect it has on the metagame. At this point in time, I think you cannot argue that we have done so with Maximum Garuda.
We don't want to wait for a year, but we also don't want to be hasty and not allow something to play itself out in real tournaments and tests.
To me, a part becomes potentially bannable when the metagame revolves around it; right now that part is perhaps Atomic, not mG (if only by virtue of the fact that there's literally been like one tournament played with it) or dF.
@[Kei] yeah I know dF isn't as good right now, but I mean taking a while to ban dF let's mG arrive. Though maybe it is the Atomic driver, I wouldn't know since I don't own one.