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MSF-Samurai Wyvang GB145 R2F (Crystal Up)

Poll: Is this a Tier Worthy Combo?

Yes, definitly.
50.00%
4
Definitly a chance, do more tests.
50.00%
4
Nope.
0%
0
Total: 100% 8 vote(s)
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  • Show Results
Dec. 16, 2013  9:16 PM
 
This was a combo I first use and won with in Beys of Our Lives, however it can truly shine in LMTD. Format.

Why this combo?
Spoiler (Click to View)




The best part... tests! Grin

Attack
Spoiler (Click to View)


Against Defence:

Spoiler (Click to View)
Special thanks to Galaxy Blade, for helping test.

If anyone wants to test, that'd be great. Seeing how it does against other Attack and even Defense, I think it may be Limited Tier worthy, haha.

Thanks for viewing! Grin
Dec. 16, 2013  9:19 PM
 
You didn't list the direction you had Gravity in for those tests. Keep in mind that gravity can be weak launched in opposite spin to other attackers and synchromes generally topple first, though being an aggressive wheel it might not be enough to save gravity - it's something that needs to be tested for attack vs attack with gravity wandering the format.

You also didn't mention what mode the wheels are in (crystal or chrome up).

Thanks for the tests though, nice to see my synchrome dx set def/stamina purchase was worthwhile haha.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:24 PM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  9:19 PM)th!nk Wrote: You didn't list the direction you had Gravity in for those tests. Keep in mind that gravity can be weak launched in opposite spin to other attackers and synchromes generally topple first, though being an aggressive wheel it might not be enough to save gravity - it's something that needs to be tested for attack vs attack with gravity wandering the format.

You also didn't mention what mode the wheels are in (crystal or chrome up).

Thanks for the tests though, nice to see my synchrome dx set def/stamina purchase was worthwhile haha.

Its Crystal-Up, I just edited the title, thanks for reminding me!

(Once I Galaxy Blade responds to me, I'll add Gravity's rotation, again, thanks for reminding me, haha)

Tongue_out
Dec. 16, 2013  9:31 PM
 
Deleted

Never mind Unhappy
Dec. 16, 2013  9:31 PM
 
Also, any particular reason for R2F over RF? From what I've heard Wyvang has some recoil trouble in general, and recoil is the entire reason I've been using RF over R2F ever since I tried Flash against some diablo combo uwik tossed up when we were chatting that was apparently killing it in Indonesia. Well, that and the fact I hate the sound R2F makes.

Still, good to see Wyvang showing up now, a little later to the party than I expected, but I'm not sure if anything else we haven't seen tests for yet is going to have the power and versatility (seeing as it should work the same in either direction due to its shape and access to Dark Knight for left spin) to break gravity's stranglehold on limited.

dragon King: Or perhaps we could test against things that aren't inevitably going to be sent through windows by a strong attack type idk
Dec. 16, 2013  9:36 PM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  9:31 PM)th!nk Wrote: Also, any particular reason for R2F over RF? From what I've heard Wyvang has some recoil trouble in general, and recoil is the entire reason I've been using RF over R2F ever since I tried Flash against some diablo combo uwik tossed up when we were chatting that was apparently killing it in Indonesia. Well, that and the fact I hate the sound R2F makes.

Still, good to see Wyvang showing up now, a little later to the party than I expected, but I'm not sure if anything else we haven't seen tests for yet is going to have the power and versatility (seeing as it should work the same in either direction due to its shape and access to Dark Knight for left spin) to break gravity's stranglehold on limited.

dragon King: Or perhaps we could test against things that aren't inevitably going to be sent through windows by a strong attack type etc idk

I had a more useable R2F, at the time. If anyone wanted to do RF tests, that'd be awesome, not sure how much the results will differ, if anything. Tongue_out

I chose Samurai, as at least in my opinion, it has really good synergy with Wyvang, making it the best choice for Right Spin. Tongue_out



Yeah, Dragon King, this would probably kill Burn and Phantom, haha. If anyone wanted to bother with tests, it wouldn't hurt.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:37 PM
 
I do not have access to my parts, but I have heard that Lynx is not a great CW to use with Beat, or really much of anything, could be wrong though. Same for Cosmic.

Also, did the Earth Customs you tested use MF-H?

Regardless though, nice results from Wyvang.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:38 PM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  9:37 PM)Kai Hiwatari Wrote: I do not have access to my parts, but I have heard that Lynx is not a great CW to use with Beat, or really much of anything, could be wrong though. Same for Cosmic.

Also, did the Earth Customs you tested use MF-H?

Regardless though, nice results from Wyvang.

I'll have to double check with Galaxy Blade on the Metal Face, but I'm not fully aware there was.

Actually, Lynx (from my understanding) is one of the better choices for Beat, as it's been used in one of TheBlackDragon's threads, too. Tongue_out
Dec. 16, 2013  9:40 PM
 
I'm sorry for suggesting it Unhappy.........never mind.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:41 PM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  9:40 PM)DRAGON KING Wrote: I'm sorry for suggesting it Unhappy.........but how are u guys guaranteeing it will destroy them with no tests? I'm not saying that phantom and burn will beat it, but we need formal tests to make sure don't we?

Quote:Yeah, Dragon King, this would probably kill Burn and Phantom, haha. If anyone wanted to bother with tests, it wouldn't hurt.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:42 PM
 
The original Beats dimensions were too big for Lynx to get in the way (the PC Frame was narrowly taller than lynx and the wheel itself was too big for horizontal interference), I assume the same goes for its Metal Fury incarnation, however investigating things that could put more weights behind a wheels contact points is always a good idea.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:43 PM
 
I was referring to this mostly

dragon King: Or perhaps we could test against things that aren't inevitably going to be sent through windows by a strong attack type idk

I probaly should have said that.......sorry bout that.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:46 PM
 
~To Confirm~

All Earth Defense customs used MF-H and Gravity was in Left Spin.
Dec. 16, 2013  9:52 PM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  9:36 PM)Leone19 Wrote: I had a more useable R2F, at the time. If anyone wanted to do RF tests, that'd be awesome, not sure how much the results will differ, if anything. Tongue_out

I chose Samurai, as at least in my opinion, it has really good synergy with Wyvang, making it the best choice for Right Spin. Tongue_out

Oh, fair enough then, I've been in the same situation before.

Yeah, fair enough, apparently DK is kinda recoil prone and I can see samurai being a good top crystal wheel (not to mention it being the heaviest crystal wheel IIRC), and Right Spin attack does have its advantages (chiefly that most defense types can't weak launch vs you, which could be even more important for wyvang).

Oh also, I just noticed, no MSF/MSF-H on this combo? That could also help with recoil, no?

As for gravity being left spin, I'd be curious to see which moves faster around the stadium, as right spin attack vs attack is often entirely decided by who hits the opponent from behind on the ridge, and IIRC gravity doesn't have a weight advantage over wyvang due to its CWs all being crazy light which means its usual strategy of "smash headfirst into them and KO with BULK" may not be the best idea here.


dragon King: oh idk fast moving attack type with metal on the underside vs low combo that cannot take a good hit and Samurai's slopes on a fast moving decently heavy bey vs a tall combo that can't take even a light tap kinda seems like a no brainer to me, especially as I've used Samurai offensively a little before.
Literally all we need here is someone to grab the parts and inevitably knock them both out and report back on what launch guarantees that against burn and that yes, testing these would have been a waste of time. Even that is kinda excessive, there's a reason we don't test any attack type that can KO a decent defender against standard stamina, you know.

A little more history: Even back in the golden age of MFB when this forum was at its busiest ever, we still had to be economical about testing, and I've always been very strongly against wasting testers time with frivolous requests because I know testing is pretty draining, and therefore making sure the time people have to spend on it is spent in the most efficient way possible is always going to be my priority. It surprises me that understanding that was one of the things that seemed to have slipped away as testers became fewer, but now I'm here I fully intend to do what I can to make it stick this time around.
Dec. 16, 2013  10:02 PM
 
th!nk Wrote:Oh also, I just noticed, no MSF/MSF-H on this combo? That could also help with recoil, no?

Yup, there was an MSF on the combo Tongue_out
Dec. 16, 2013  10:09 PM
 
Hey, just wanted to let you guys know, I'm sorry if I forgot anything I should have not. I did a few stamina tests, but guess what ? They got KO'd back to Japan where they came from. Please notice: My head is ringing and I feel really, really tired.
Dec. 16, 2013  10:15 PM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  10:09 PM)Galaxy Blade Wrote: Hey, just wanted to let you guys know, I'm sorry if I forgot anything I should have not. I did a few stamina tests, but guess what ? They got KO'd back to Japan where they came from. Please notice: My head is ringing and I feel really, really tired.

That's fine man, I appreciate the amount of testing you're doing. Get some rest.
Dec. 17, 2013  12:09 AM
 
(Dec. 16, 2013  10:15 PM)th!nk Wrote:
(Dec. 16, 2013  10:09 PM)Galaxy Blade Wrote: Hey, just wanted to let you guys know, I'm sorry if I forgot anything I should have not. I did a few stamina tests, but guess what ? They got KO'd back to Japan where they came from. Please notice: My head is ringing and I feel really, really tired.

That's fine man, I appreciate the amount of testing you're doing. Get some rest.

Yeah, I'd assume the Stamina testing wouldn't be needed for that, haha.


Thanks for everything Galaxy Blade, you're tests are very appreciated. Grin
Dec. 18, 2013  1:00 PM
 
You might want to try different tracks out, as I was doing some solo spins and GB145 tends to exaggerate the imbalances of the chrome wheels I own. Usually one of R145's orientations works (while the other makes the imbalance reaaally bad) and as R145 is heavier and more aggressive than GB145 (and if it's re-balancing, there's no stamina loss), though GB145 could be putting more weight behind contact points than R145 would, so be mindful of that.

I wish I could recommend something more concrete but honestly what I've found so far is that even the same wheel can prefer even the opposite orientation of R145 depending on whether it is in crystal or chrome up (after chatting to Uwik, it seems that chrome wheels are very finicky about this stuff), so it might not even apply to wyvang (samurai dragooon for example has decent solo spin in crystal up with ad145 and R145/GB145 only worsen it, significantly), but I think it's worth giving it a shot.
Easiest way to work out what is balanced best is solo spins, using a stamina tip generally, I was using GB145, R145 in both orientations and AD145 as a baseline to test my theory that tracks could compensate for imbalanced chrome wheels (I intend to write a thread on it, but as I said, these things are so finicky it's doing my head in, and I'm having trouble with consistency in the solo spins I need to do to test this stuff properly; still, everything I've written in this post should be accurate). Personally, I'm very interested in what works best for Wyvang in particular, so yeah.
Dec. 18, 2013  2:12 PM
 
Whenever Galaxy is available and free, I'll ask if he'll be able to test.

I experimented when first creating this, for me, GB145 worked best (since Wyvang had to be at a 145 height to perform the best), I especially liked it since it added weight to it, not mention its used in the Wyvang Wyvang combo.

But I'll definitely get back to you on R145. Grin
Dec. 18, 2013  2:31 PM
 
Synchromes have fewer balance issues than Chrome+Crystal wheel setups, and due to their increased weight, the weight and distribution of a track has a much smaller effect on them (and Wyvang Wyvang Balances itself out pretty well too). R145 is heavier than GB145, too, which would probably be helpful for any recoil issues. That said, it could also possible obstruct contact points on wyvang used to hit LTDC, depending where they're located. But yeah, giving it a shot is the only way to find out, haha.
Jan. 01, 2014  6:51 PM
 
(Jan. 01, 2014  6:50 PM)Coach Wrote: MSF-H Samurai Wyvang (crystal mode up) GB145R2F vs. MF-H Bakushin Leone 90RSF
Wyvang: 7 wins (0 OS, 7 KO)
Bakushin: 13 wins (10 OS, 3 KO)
Wyvang Win %: 35%

GB145 didn't have as much problem as the R145 did with this combo but it still wasn't the greatest. Wyvang needed to hit it up out of the middle then hit it again to KO it otherwise there were recoil issues. One of Bakushins KO's actually put Wyvang up over a wall. Yet like I said if Wyvang hit it where it needed to it could send Bakushin 5 feet away from the stadium.
Jan. 01, 2014  7:04 PM
 
There's quite a simple solution to that...

Slap CH120 on this puppy. Eee
Jan. 01, 2014  7:05 PM
 
I still think that Shinobi matches up wayyyyyyy better with Wyvang than Samurai guys.
Jan. 01, 2014  7:06 PM
 
(Jan. 01, 2014  7:04 PM)TheBlackDragon Wrote: There's quite a simple solution to that...

Slap CH120 on this puppy. Eee
I agree that's what I use, or H145 has proven effective for me as well. not a fan of too many other tracks 145 or above on attack beys.
(Jan. 01, 2014  7:05 PM)*Ginga* Wrote: I still think that Shinobi matches up wayyyyyyy better with Wyvang than Samurai guys.
could be but the test vs Bakushin was an LTDC and the crystal could have been anything at all.
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