(Feb. 04, 2014 5:02 PM)TheBlackDragon Wrote: Usually, the more centered your weight, the easier/smoother it is to launch and reach maximum RPM. It's like having a longer winder. The quicker the Beyblade's rotation can accelerate, the faster it will be moving when it leaves the prongs.
Of course, if your an Alabaman with an obsession for little maintenance robots, and you can beat the carp out of competitive Stamina with an RS LTDC, assuming there is a limit to the speed you can launch it doesn't really matter, but yah.
It's mostly the higher velocity that helps the speed. I can personally launch smoother and faster when using MSF-M, and it definitely moves faster (may just be the lighter weight, but regardless it still works better than MSF-L from my experience).
It doesn't take being Ingulit to not be affected by this. At the very least, it means the other options should be slashed on for those of us who have the strength to do this (launching is all about speed once you have the strength to overcome the inertia of the beyblade on the launcher). FWIW, the speed looks very similar to me, with MF-L having a slight edge.
Quote:If something's diameter is shorter, that means the circumference is shorter, which means the outer edge is actually moving slower (unless my math/physics are completely outa-whack right now, but I'm pretty sure that's right).
The closer to the center of the Beyblade the center of weight is, the shorter its diameter. That means that, for every rotation, the center of weight is covering a shorter distance (less use of energy per rotation), which makes the launch easier/multiplies the rotation by a higher number (again, if there is a reachable maximum RPM a string launcher can handle, and you can reach that RPM with any given Beyblade the effect is nullified).
This is actually correct on further googling/thinking it over more (I'm not being super-duper careful with my generally poor grasp of physics in this discussion because a) I'm not writing a formal article or something here and b) because I know you'll correct me if I'm way off-mark and I've wanted to check some of this stuff out for a while anyway, so I hope you don't mind).
There is a maximum amount of force any given launcher can manage as at a certain point they start to skip, at least in my experience (and I've gone through a lot of launchers in my time). Keep in mind that's FORCE, not RPM - I can launch anything in Limited on one of my LL2's but nothing from standard aside from Flash. I can actually get even RPM's out of an oiled up ZG Compact Launcher and a String Launcher because while the former takes more strength, I have that strength and the fastest I can get it to go is still at the same point a string launcher starts to skip anyway (so I have to pull the string at an angle, increasing friction to slow down my launch enough that it doesn't). Might actually be able to get more out of a ZGCL with some particularly wild launching, but it's hard to tell. EDIT: On trying with Gravity AD145WD (as I don't have any left ripcord launchers or right string launchers currently), I actually get slightly more outta the ZGCL, with no skipping. For heavier stuff like ZG, I don't notice a difference but I don't have any dual spin wheels to test that with.
As such, the bigger factor in how hard you can launch is weight. Try launching Bahamdia Orojya D125R2F (I am actually getting pretty good stuff outta it, tbh, it's just something I threw together the other day to test something very related to this idea out, as well as trying to find a use for Orojya (which is like a wide weight disk from plastics basically), that is turning into something I might even work on and then get a thread together for whatever comes of it when I'm not trying to conserve launchers so I can lend some out at my tournament). It's very wide, but it's a lot easier to launch than something like Wyvang Wyvang _____RF and it moves a lot faster.
Obviously launchwise it's a balance of the two, and this doesn't conflict with what you've said (MSF-L is heavier than MSF-M), but what I'm getting at is that it comes down to strength and also how good your launcher is skipping wise (particularly if you're using an LL2 - they start skipping very easily, which is something a lot of the changes between them and the ZGCL are aimed to address, particularly the lower friction, separate plastic pin at the top of the central shaft rather than part of the chassis, which wears down very quickly in LL2s even if oiled up, incredibly so if you're launching Synchromes (same goes for unoiled ZGCL, still super sad I messed up my second Takara one by using it without oiling it up). Once you're in the stadium though, well, I think you can probably dig up the old weight disks on attack combos discussion if you really want to examine the justification for it, but basically, I think we should list both.
Oh, also I'm pretty sure that if you have a more edge-distributed wheel, there's less forces acting on it to slow it back down in the launching process, which balances it out a bit too. But as we can plainly see, my grasp on physics is not the best.
Quote:My point was that the combo will still be able to maintain spin velocity near the beginning of the match when it's attacking (it really isn't supposed to win by OS against anything. It's a pure Attack type). Stamina is required to keep a constant assault going for as long as possible, but with an opposite-spin combo, it'll keep up as long as the opponent is still spinning relatively fast. I just really see no benefit to using MS-L. MSF-M is definitely visibly more effective for me. Faster, more maneuverable, and altogether more devestating.
Spin velocity isn't what you attack with though, your overall speed is. Weight just helps control recoil. This was settled back in the age of plastics and while they had less recoil so a lot of their lighter-weight focused stuff no longer applies so much in the much higher recoil MFB series, the weight distribution stuff still does.
Quote:It would't absolutely kill me to add MSF-L to Bahamdia Dragooon, but MSF-L Bahamdia Dragooon BD145RF... *barf*
The difference between RF/R2F in left speedwise is pretty minimal and a lot of people don't think it's even significant (heck I'm not even sure it's sizeable on Synchromes), so try to consider the other perspective on that part of it in this. Is there really any harm to you in listing them anyway? On playing around with them (and I now get very nice results with Bahamdia Dragooon BD145 RF fwiw) I really don't see a significant difference no matter what face I put on it, I think I can see perhaps that MSF-H is more consistent but less powerful, a regular face can hit really hard but suffers from a bit more recoil, and MSF-M/MSF-L are basically identical, though as I said MSF-L seems a little faster. The only significant difference I get is using R2F over RF, where Bahamdia starts to self-KO regularly (which is just my R2F, really, it just doesn't catch the ridge nicely). No difference at all in the launch, FWIW.
I find it rather amusing (not in an insulting way) that your example of the worst setup out of what we're discussing is not only the permutation of this combo, but probably the Attack combo I'd choose to use if I had a standard format tournament tomorrow. I really think that between the weight similarity and the general long-standing acceptance of weight-further-from-the-centre=faster the "default" shall we say would be to list it unless there's solid evidence that it isn't competitive (FWIW I really cannot do formal testing until my tournament is done and I don't have to worry so much about part/launcher wear). Write it off as a matter of YMMV, your personal favourite setup is there and so are those of others, so everyone is relatively happy, yeah?
Also personally I'd hold off re-adding CS to Reviser E230 unless you're sure it has good enough balance to make any use of the extra stamina, because MSF-H Reviser Reviser E230CS definitely doesn't and is also pitifully easy to KO (that Bahamdia Orojya combo I mentioned is KOing it off disk hits alone). In general, I still stand by the removal of CS from the defense list entirely - it's much more of a balance tip than a serious defense tip - with the weight and aggression being thrown around now, I just do not think plastic, even with rubber around it, stands up any more. Still, if you disagree then I won't argue this, as my CS's have significant rubber wear that could be affecting them somewhat.
Aside from that, I've raised a couple things about that list that are important - LRF on right spin attack types, and Ionis being removed from Flash, replaced with Uranus. I would also really like to get pictures of Beelzeb on it before it goes up but failing that, at least the spelling needs to be fixed (-ub removed), as well as the instances of "Reviser" that need to be changed to "Revizer". The rest, aside from what we're currently discussing with the faces, can wait, but those two things are absolutely essential in my opinion.
Oh and as for Ingulit, he's got some IRL stuff going on at the moment so I would be surprised to see him drop in to further discuss PD. That is something I think could wait for next update anyway.
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