MFB: Limited :: Competitive Customs List and Public Discussion

(May. 28, 2016  1:54 AM)Hato Wrote:
(May. 28, 2016  1:50 AM)ForZ Wrote: Hey guys, I noticed that for the 4th competitive listing under the defensive category the Leone clear wheel is used. I was always under the impression that Leone was a sub-par wheel that was too light and a little unstable. Does Leone have some synergy with Bakushin I don't know about? I assume that it's not put there for no reason.

Leone lines up nicely with Bakushin, and it is probably the best option.

Gotcha, I don't have a Leone on hand so I didn't really have a chance to look at them together. Thanks for the response so quick.
(May. 28, 2016  2:01 AM)ForZ Wrote:
(May. 28, 2016  1:54 AM)Hato Wrote:
(May. 28, 2016  1:50 AM)ForZ Wrote: Hey guys, I noticed that for the 4th competitive listing under the defensive category the Leone clear wheel is used. I was always under the impression that Leone was a sub-par wheel that was too light and a little unstable. Does Leone have some synergy with Bakushin I don't know about? I assume that it's not put there for no reason.

Leone lines up nicely with Bakushin, and it is probably the best option.

Gotcha, I don't have a Leone on hand so I didn't really have a chance to look at them together. Thanks for the response so quick.

Personally, I've found that Leone is actually decent when paired with Screwl. So is Unicorno with Screw, but mostly Screw is best paired with Pisces or Horogium.

It's also interesting to note, that Gemios goes perfectly with Vulcan, another metal wheel of a similar caliber. Lines up perfectly with the slopes/contact points. Not sure if anyone else has noticed this before.
(Jun. 02, 2016  8:19 PM)Sapphire Wrote:
(May. 28, 2016  2:01 AM)ForZ Wrote:
(May. 28, 2016  1:54 AM)Hato Wrote: Leone lines up nicely with Bakushin, and it is probably the best option.

Gotcha, I don't have a Leone on hand so I didn't really have a chance to look at them together. Thanks for the response so quick.

Personally, I've found that Leone is actually decent when paired with Screwl. So is Unicorno with Screw, but mostly Screw is best paired with Pisces or Horogium.

It's also interesting to note, that Gemios goes perfectly with Vulcan, another metal wheel of a similar caliber. Lines up perfectly with the slopes/contact points. Not sure if anyone else has noticed this before.

on Screw. Dragonis and Escorpio also worked great for me.

i tried using Geminos on Vulcan but i think it's too light. we tried a vulcan combo with scorpio and it came 3rd at last event
(Jun. 02, 2016  8:26 PM)FIREFIRE Wrote:
(Jun. 02, 2016  8:19 PM)Sapphire Wrote:
(May. 28, 2016  2:01 AM)ForZ Wrote: Gotcha, I don't have a Leone on hand so I didn't really have a chance to look at them together. Thanks for the response so quick.

Personally, I've found that Leone is actually decent when paired with Screwl. So is Unicorno with Screw, but mostly Screw is best paired with Pisces or Horogium.

It's also interesting to note, that Gemios goes perfectly with Vulcan, another metal wheel of a similar caliber. Lines up perfectly with the slopes/contact points. Not sure if anyone else has noticed this before.

on Screw. Dragonis and Escorpio also worked great for me.

i tried using Geminos on Vulcan but i think it's too light. we tried a vulcan combo with scorpio and it came 3rd at last event

Well the problem with putting Escolpio on Vulcan is that it's protrusions cover Vulcan's contact points in an opposite way compared to Gemios, but I guess that's the whole point. I tried that, but a piece of my Escolpio clear wheel actually broke off! Unhappy
(Jun. 03, 2016  7:49 PM)Sapphire Wrote:
(Jun. 02, 2016  8:26 PM)FIREFIRE Wrote:
(Jun. 02, 2016  8:19 PM)Sapphire Wrote: Personally, I've found that Leone is actually decent when paired with Screwl. So is Unicorno with Screw, but mostly Screw is best paired with Pisces or Horogium.

It's also interesting to note, that Gemios goes perfectly with Vulcan, another metal wheel of a similar caliber. Lines up perfectly with the slopes/contact points. Not sure if anyone else has noticed this before.

on Screw. Dragonis and Escorpio also worked great for me.

i tried using Geminos on Vulcan but i think it's too light. we tried a vulcan combo with scorpio and it came 3rd at last event

Well the problem with putting Escolpio on Vulcan is that it's protrusions cover Vulcan's contact points in an opposite way compared to Gemios, but I guess that's the whole point. I tried that, but a piece of my Escolpio clear wheel actually broke off! Unhappy

The Elscopio clear wheel probably worked due to its aggression. It is one of the best attack type clear wheels.
I'm actually pretty surprised you didn't have success with Gemios! That thing has insane upper attack! The little weight different should effect too much.
(Jun. 03, 2016  8:35 PM)Mitsu Wrote: I'm actually pretty surprised you didn't have success with Gemios! That thing has insane upper attack! The little weight different should effect too much.

Agreed - revealing those contact points is much more important for Vulcan than the extra weight from a bigger CW.

Vulcan is a bit of an oddball, though; the way it's lined up limits your CW choices to a handful of unusual choices. If Gemios isn't working for you, try Uranus, Pisces, Horuseus, or Byxis.
I'm developing a combo: Bakushin Elscopio 85RF. It's a limited anti-attacker. I will be making a thread soon so feel free to post results and PM me them.
It's been far too long since the top-tier list was updated, seriously... Libra and Omega are still on there lol

Here's my proposed revision, assuming Dark Knight is banned and Gravity is unbanned:
(additions are blue and removals are red)

Limited Top Tier List Wrote:
Attack


REMOVED OMEGA

Pegasis

MF-H Pegasis (CH120/R145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Lightning

MF-H Lightning L-Drago [Upper] (85/90/CH120/R145/TR145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)

Wyvang
MSF-H (Shinobi/Gladiator) Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145 (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB) Removed Dark Knight
MSF-H Samurai Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145 (RSF/RB)

REMOVED DARK KNIGHT

Gravity

MF-H Gravity Perseus (S130/CH120/R145/TR145) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)


Vulcan
MF-H Vulcan (Byxis/Pisces/Uranus/Horuseus) (85/90/CH120) (RF/R2F/LRF/RSF/RB)



Defense


Earth
MF-H Earth (Aquario/Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (85/90/R145/GB145/TH170/230) (RSF/RB)

REMOVED LIBRA

Scythe (Metal Fury)
MF-H Scythe (Aquario/Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (R145/GB145) (RSF/RB)

Bakushin
MF-H Bakushin Leone (85/90) (RSF/RB) Removed RF

Jade (4D / Hyperblades?)
MF-H Jade (Pisces/Horogium/Cygnus/Uranus) (85/90) (RSF/RB)



Stamina


Burn
Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) W145 (WD/EWD)
Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D
Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) 85 (WD/EWD)

Earth
Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) W145 (WD/EWD)
Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D
Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) 85 (WD/EWD)
Earth (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/230) (D/SD)

Scythe (Metal Fury)
Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) W145 (WD/EWD)
Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D
Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/230) (D/SD)

Duo (Metal Fury)
Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) W145 (WD/EWD)
Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) B:D
Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/230) (D/SD)
Duo (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) 230 MB

Meteo
Meteo L-Drago (TR145/ED145/CH120/S130) (EWD/CF/GCF/GF)


Balance


{MF-H} (Scythe/Earth) (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (TH170/SR200/230) CS
Burn (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) (85/90) MF
MF-H Scythe (Cygnus/Cancer/Hades) CH120 RF
Meteo L-Drago F230 (CF/GCF)
(Duo/Scythe) (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) F230 (CF/GCF)
Gravity Perseus F230 (CF/GCF)
Gravity Perseus (S130/CH120/TR145/ED145) (CF/GCF/GF)

Vulcan Attack, Jade Defense, and RSF/RB Attack are definitely good enough to be top-tier, IMO (with Jade being the strongest candidate; from my experience it's stronger than any other defensive option out there by a wide margin). Also for consideration in the absence of Dark Knight are Quetzalcoatl, Cosmic, and possibly Screw and Jade (again) for Attack.
I'm on board with the edits.

One thing we could maybe talk about a bit more is Gemios on stationary combos. The thing has crazy good upper attack and can put a stop to HTSCs quite consistently. Things like Scythe Gemios B:D have been used quite a bit in Toronto. 1234beyblade probably has the most experience with them. How do you feel about it?

Will post some more of my thoughts on Gravity later today. :)
I know we are all about unbanning Gravity... and in my heart I would like it to be unbanned...

But it really shouldn't be unbanned...

I was a proponent for it's banning in the beginnings of Limited and with good reason. Gravity is just way too versatile. It has: both spin rotations (but you could probably just spam it in left spin and win vs everything since right spin is so weak atm), a ton of smash due to plastic on metal contact with very little recoil (the very problem DK/Lightning has), an extremely low bowl shape with a deep set connection point (most tracks sink deep into it giving it ideal height and center of gravity), and insane reach because of it's overall height. It'd be crazy to add something infinitely stronger than the thing we are proposing to ban (which I am not really a fan of that decision as well)...

Gravity can be used in every situation, with any setup... literally. Spin Equalizing, Attack, Defense, Stamina, Balance. Whatever you want. And it's the safest option being able to spin in both directions. Why does this format want that? Is that healthy for the format?

I know I don't really have much say in where the format will go and I don't really have the answers to make the format better, but I definitely think that Gravity isn't what we need... But maybe I'm just indifferent to the Format's current direction and how swiftly we ban things. When you ban something of power (especially in a fragile Format like this one), something else will come into power. When will we stop banning?

Also, I'm not sure about Vulcan and that list. IIRC, Thief Phoenic, Beat, and a lot of other options have much more testing and are more worthy of being on that list than Vulcan.
(Aug. 04, 2016  9:28 PM)Mitsu Wrote: I'm on board with the edits.

One thing we could maybe talk about a bit more is Gemios on stationary combos. The thing has crazy good upper attack and can put a stop to HTSCs quite consistently. Things like Scythe Gemios BGrin have been used quite a bit in Toronto. 1234beyblade probably has the most experience with them. How do you feel about it?

Will post some more of my thoughts on Gravity later today. Smile

I definitely use Escolpio a lot for the same reasons, so I would be on board for adding aggressive CWs to non-Attack combos.

(Aug. 04, 2016  10:05 PM)juncction Wrote: I know we are all about unbanning Gravity... and in my heart I would like it to be unbanned...

But it really shouldn't be unbanned...

I was a proponent for it's banning in the beginnings of Limited and with good reason. Gravity is just way too versatile. It has: both spin rotations (but you could probably just spam it in left spin and win vs everything since right spin is so weak atm), a ton of smash due to plastic on metal contact with very little recoil (the very problem DK/Lightning has), an extremely low bowl shape with a deep set connection point (most tracks sink deep into it giving it ideal height and center of gravity), and insane reach because of it's overall height. It'd be crazy to add something infinitely stronger than the thing we are proposing to ban (which I am not really a fan of that decision as well)...

Gravity can be used in every situation, with any setup... literally. Spin Equalizing, Attack, Defense, whatever you want. And it's the safest option being able to spin in both directions. Why does this format want that? Is that healthy for the format?

I know I don't really have much say in where the format will go and I don't really have the answers to make the format better, but I definitely think that Gravity isn't what we need... But maybe I'm just indifferent to the Format's current direction and how swiftly we ban things. When you ban something of power (especially in a fragile Format like this one), something else will come into power. When will we stop banning?

Also, I'm not sure about Vulcan and that list. IIRC, Thief Phoenic, Beat, and a lot of other options have much more testing and are more worthy of being on that list than Vulcan.

I was initially uneasy about unbanning Gravity, and I still am, but following a long session of testing and playing around with different combos, it just didn't seem as threatening as it used to be, or even as dangerous as Dark Knight. I think it's because of the shift (mostly caused by pressure from Dark Knight) to extremely low and extremely tall combos; Gravity really seems to struggle with LTDC from what I've tried, and was not sufficiently effective at OSing LTDC (or anything else, really) via spin steal to be frightening. My main concern (unless further testing, which I will definitely be doing, reveals something worrisome) is that people will immediately flock to Gravity because of its reputation and ignore all the other viable choices.
Pretty sure Screw is noticeably better than Vulcan. Whether Vulcan should even be on the list at all is up for debate, but if it goes on, Screw LTAC should be a shoo-in.

Here, I'll throw some tests at the problem (credit to th!nk of course):

(Mar. 04, 2014  9:15 AM)th!nk Wrote: MF-H Vulcan (Mold 1) Giraffe 90RF vs MF-H Libra 90RS
Mold 1 Vulcan: 17/30 = 56.67% (All KO)
Libra: 13/30 = 43.33% (10KO, 3OS)

MF-H Vulcan (Mold 2) Giraffe 90RF vs MF-H Libra 90RS
Mold 2 Vulcan: 16/30 = 53.33% (All KO)
Libra: 14/30 = 46.67% (5KO, 9OS)

MF-H Vulcan (Mold 1) Giraffe 90RF vs MF-H Libra R145RS
Vulcan (Mold 1): 11/20 = 55% (All KO)
Libra: 9/20 = 45% (5KO, 4OS)

MF-H Vulcan (Mold 2) Giraffe 90RF vs MF-H Libra R145RS
Vulcan (Mold 2): 15/20 = 75% (All KO)
Libra: 5/20 = 25% (4KO, 1OS)

MF-H Screw Pisces 90RF vs MF-H Libra R145RS
Screw: 16/20 = 80% (All KO)
Libra: 4/20 = 20% (3KO, 1OS)

MF-H Screw Pisces 90RF vs MF-H Libra 90RS
Screw: 15/20 = 75% (All KO)
Libra: 5/20 =25 % (All OS)

(Source post.)

I understand Libra is banned, but surely it can still be used for comparing Attack types.
(Side note: would anyone be opposed to adding Giraffe to the Vulcan CW list? Hah.)

(Aug. 04, 2016  10:06 PM)Cake Wrote: My main concern (unless further testing, which I will definitely be doing, reveals something worrisome) is that people will immediately flock to Gravity because of its reputation and ignore all the other viable choices.

Pretty much guaranteed to happen.
I've always found Screw to be rather ineffective outside of a small range of matchups where it's Upper Attack shines, while Vulcan has excellent Upper Attack as well as Smash Attack. I'll try out Screw some more, though. The version of the top-tier list I posted is by no means final, haha, I just put up what I've found to be exceptionally effective.
(Aug. 04, 2016  10:06 PM)Cake Wrote: I was initially uneasy about unbanning Gravity, and I still am, but following a long session of testing and playing around with different combos, it just didn't seem as threatening as it used to be, or even as dangerous as Dark Knight. I think it's because of the shift (mostly caused by pressure from Dark Knight) to extremely low and extremely tall combos; Gravity really seems to struggle with LTDC from what I've tried, and was not sufficiently effective at OSing LTDC (or anything else, really) via spin steal to be frightening. My main concern (unless further testing, which I will definitely be doing, reveals something worrisome) is that people will immediately flock to Gravity because of its reputation and ignore all the other viable choices.

I think that's the very problem though. Limited is supposed to be a format that promotes creativity (among a lot of other things). Unfortunately, "flavor of the month" is a very prevalent thing. I think, it's easy to mistake "flavor of the month" with "ban-worthy."

However, I think the decision for me is very clear for Gravity. Regardless of if it excels with one field or the other, or if it beats the best or doesn't, if you can slap that wheel on every possible imaginable setup and have above average success with it... then it is something that shouldn't exist in this format. Stamina Gravity SW145EWD? Sure. Defense Gravity GB145RS? Sure. LTAC Gravity? Sure. I know it might not excel at every single one combo to 100% capacity... but it should be VERY alarming that this one part can be used on so many different viable setups.. don't you think?




Nocto Wrote:First, I think the nature of Limited lends itself well to experimentation. While there are decisions that may benefit from longer deliberation, I think there could be an argument in the case of Limited for a more organic approach: notice a trend; deal with it; analyze the repercussion; deal with them consequently (proceed forward or take a step back).

That being said, since you're also considering reintroducing a part--a versatile part--it would be interesting to see tests pitting same and opposite-spin Gravity against Dark Knight, to see if that renders Dark Knight a much less safer option. I've read the last three pages of the discussion thread, and most discussion involving the two pertain to how they individually compare to other parts; I've noticed only one instance where they are compared to how they play against each other.

Sorry I grabbed this from the Mentor Circle because I couldn't post there, but... [Link]

I think that currently there's a single track mind in Limited of "stepping forward" and banning to get rid of the "problems" that we have. I know that we have gone a long way from where we started. While banning does solve some issues, it's only temporary. I have said before that banning does lead to other parts becoming "too powerful." It's just how any competitive game fundamentally works. Banning Omega was a definite necessity because it did completely shut out every other option and that was bad for the format, but the banning of Libra is somewhat questionable to me. "Stepping back" and unbanning certain things might prove to be more beneficial or exciting and possibly open up the format to more creativity.

Libra kept DK in check. I know it was quite bad for the format because it shut out a lot of other options... but what if we unbanned Libra, Hell, and Gravity in one go? How would DK or Libra fare? Would Hell or Gravity keep things in check? I know we all dream of a Vulcan or Screw world, but sometimes it's really not possible without being overly stifling and being ban-heavy. I think it be more interesting to see how the game could have progressed if we had a more fluid and organic system of banning and unbanning. Stepping forwards and stepping backwards. Reflecting and assessing.
I just have a few adjustments I want to make to that list, mainly just a few small nitpicks about part choice and a few Balance customs you left out.

Tier List thoughts (Click to View)

As for controversy over Attack Type Wheels, I want people to keep in mind that as weird as it sounds, people get different results for different Wheels. This is not supposed to be a sarcastic statement. For some unexplainable reason, people tend to have preferences for Attack (or any combo) based on what "works" for them even if they are using the exact same combos. For example, I don't find Gravity particularly impressive for Attack despite others saying it is at least Lightning-Tier. I prefer Quetzalcoatl or Screw as I get better results with them, while Vulcan appears to work better than Screw for Cake. Some people think Pegasis is amazing but for me it's frustratingly inconsistent even on a proper Smash Attack setup. Over the course of the Limited Tier List history people have long argued the viability of Hasbro Beat, Cosmic, and Phoenic. Until fairly recently the majority of players preferred Lightning L-Drago over Dark Knight. Obviously, there are going to be a few candidates that always rise to the top, but determining "the best of the best" is difficult when user experiences with parts vary so much. Discrepancies like this were what I suspect kept Pegasis off the Top Tier list in favor of Storm during the early days of MFB (along with the fact that people were putting Pegasis on 90).

(Aug. 04, 2016  11:05 PM)juncction Wrote:
Long quote (Click to View)

Replies/thoughts on these posts (Click to View)

spoilered a bunch of things because this post got unnecessarily verbose.
Guys, this isn't the banlist discussion thread, so go there if you want to discuss banning and unbanning certain parts.
https://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-MFB-Lim...Discussion?

On the record though, since when was Gravity effective for Defense? On Gravity GB145RS it's RS doing all the work as it's crazy difficult to KO.

EDIT: Argh, beaten by WombatChocked_2
I'm pretty much fully on board with Wombat's tier list. I just have a few tweaks:

Gemios fits perfectly on Vulcan and I think it should be added to it's clear wheels.

I think the Meteo CF/GCF combos are more balance and straight up stamina.

And what about what people call the limited anti-attackers: Bakushin/Scythe Gemios/Elscopio 85/90 RF/R2F?
Cake. Can I ask why Pieces on Jade? isn't it's little too jaggy for LTDC?

Can someone tell me which Fusion Wheel works both for Escorpio and Geminos? for MF based combo. I can do test to compare both Geminios and Scorpio

also I still think Gravity will be a problem if got unbanned
Revised list to include most of the suggestions from the last few posts:


Changes:
+ Added Bandid to Wyvang Crystal Wheel options
+ Added a bunch of Tracks to some Attack and Stamina setups
+ Added optional MF-L to a lot of things
+ Added Giraffe and Gemios to Vulcan Clear Wheel options
+ Added Screw (let me know if there are any setups missing)
+ Added Sagittario II to Earth combos
+ Added tall Scythe Defense
+ Added aggressive Clear Wheel options to Bakushin and Jade
+ Added super-tall Flame to Balance
+ Added EDS to tall combos
+ Added Metal Faces to low/mid Meteo because it desperately needs more weight and can spin steal effectively enough to not be hurt badly by the Stamina loss
* Merged Wyvang Attack
* Merged LTSC and MTSC
* Merged Duo MB with the rest of the tall setups (may not be the best idea because MB is different than D/SD/EDS)
* Moved flat-tipped Meteo to Balance (though idk if it belongs there, it can't KO and can't defend)
- Removed Gravity

(Aug. 05, 2016  4:55 PM)FIREFIRE CPB Wrote: Cake. Can I ask why Pieces on Jade? isn't it's little too jaggy for LTDC?
The spikes almost never get hit; it's almost always the smooth outer parts that take the hits, so it's excellent for minimizing Jade's already incredibly flat profile.
My thoughts:

-Kinda on the fence here but I did some impromptu battles of W145 against SW145. From what I gathered W145 is better but not by much- it simply had the virtue of not having those wings that strike the floor when the bey is low on spin, resulting in massive spin reduction or outright cessation of spinning. Both were using Earth Beafowl ___WD so i dunno.
-I agree on ED/TR145 though- Earth ED/TR145WD/EWD is good against Meteo- a lesson I learnt from Indonesia's meta back when it was still active when we used Basalt F230CF to counter Killerken Dragoon B : D in both zero g and BB-10. (It was in the standard and zero g formats respectively). I can link you to the top tier customs in Indonesia for proof.
-IIRC Kujikato once told that Earth BGrin is utter fail (it was in LTD's random thoughts thread) and th!nk mentioned that Bearing Drive isn't very good on smaller, lighter wheels. I dunno if this has changed or not though.
-Vulcan on Gemios: aren't those spirit heads kinda in the way? It's the same with Aquila; they jut out juuussssttt abit whereas Byxis and Horuseus don't.
-I agree with Bakushin on anti-attack- it's extremely explosive. I used Bakushin Leone (II) 90RF in the past, and even some of the stronger Earth defense customs (GB145RSF/RS) are getting tossed around like ragdolls. Considering my average attack-using skills though, they could definitely do better. But since anti-attack are balance, shouldn't the Bakushin RF customs belong there instead?
-No idea about Girrafe on Vulcan.

Then again I'm only starting to spool back up on Limited knowledge and I don't own any Hasbro beys. So your thoughts everyone!

And where's Meteo CH120XF ?
Oh got it thanks for info.

My thoughts on Revised ver.:-
1. I completely agree with Bandid on Wyvang. it has awesome smash/recoil. just works well Smile

2. I doubt CH120 would work well on Screw. I know it was top-tier and would be good against 230CS but Screw needs to be lower then it's opponent in order to use it's upper attack or else it's smash in not best. how about DF105? it did awesomely for me, still KOs LTC just well and still have some chances to KO 230 [not CS or taller one].

3. How about adding Escorpio to Screw? it just expose contact points of Screw well but it is extremely aggressive and great smash attack.

4. Ah. Well I 100% agree with Sagirterio 2 and TH170/230 on Sythe Wink.

5. Well I also like Escorpio on Jade and Bakushin

6. how about adding LW165PD/SD there? it's great for stamina

7. Isn't EDS is too wobbly on 230?

(Aug. 05, 2016  6:23 PM)RDF3 Wrote: My thoughts:

-Kinda on the fence here but I did some impromptu battles of W145 against SW145. From what I gathered W145 is better but not by much- it simply had the virtue of not having those wings that strike the floor when the bey is low on spin, resulting in massive spin reduction or outright cessation of spinning. Both were using Earth Beafowl ___WD so i dunno.
-I agree on ED/TR145 though- Earth ED/TR145WD/EWD is good against Meteo- a lesson I learnt from Indonesia's meta back when it was still active when we used Basalt F230CF to counter Killerken Dragoon B : D in both zero g and BB-10. (It was in the standard and zero g formats respectively). I can link you to the top tier customs in Indonesia for proof.
-IIRC Kujikato once told that Earth BGrin is utter fail (it was in LTD's random thoughts thread) and th!nk mentioned that Bearing Drive isn't very good on smaller, lighter wheels. I dunno if this has changed or not though.
-Vulcan on Gemios: aren't those spirit heads kinda in the way? It's the same with Aquila; they jut out juuussssttt abit whereas Byxis and Horuseus don't.
-I agree with Bakushin on anti-attack- it's extremely explosive. I used Bakushin Leone (II) 90RF in the past, and even some of the stronger Earth defense customs (GB145RSF/RS) are getting tossed around like ragdolls. Considering my average attack-using skills though, they could definitely do better. But since anti-attack are balance, shouldn't the Bakushin RF customs belong there instead?
-No idea about Girrafe on Vulcan.

Then again I'm only starting to spool back up on Limited knowledge and I don't own any Hasbro beys. So your thoughts everyone!

And where's Meteo CH120XF ?

Well I don't think SW145 ever scrapes on WD, it may do at last few wobble but it doesn't seems like that much noticable

also GCF and XF are basicly same Smile
Yes, that's what I meant. At the end of a match (or when heavily destabilized), SW145's wings scrape the floor, whereas W145's wings don't since they are relatively close to the body of the track. While it doesn't seem much, it will matter in serious matches where one or two micro-factors like this make the difference between victory and defeat. I dunno if it actually helps LAD or not though, since the shape does not seem condusive for it.
I did some more informal testing today, and I can now personally say that Screw should definitely be top-tier. Whenever I used it before, it never seemed to be able to do anything against same-height combos, which made it inferior to Vulcan in my opinion, despite the fact that it did have better Upper. But today, Screw was clearly hitting harder vs Earth Defense, whether the matchup was low track vs low track or LTAC vs MTDC. Vulcan still seems to do better against Bakushin, though (I think the reverse slope helps make better contact against Bakushin's slopes) but Screw was hitting harder more consistently, and with less recoil. I wouldn't rule out Vulcan, personally, but Screw is definitely a much more compelling option for me now.

Also, I did some quick Stamina tests a while back to compare different Stamina tracks, namely W145 vs TR145 vs SW145; here's a repost:

Spin times are measured across an average of 5 tests using Burn Cygnus ____ WD. (not that rigorous, I know)

W145:
+ Great solo spin time (3:30)
+ Not very wide, so opponents can't hit it
* Provides no support against floor scrapes
- Not particularly heavy (2.2g)

TR145:
+ Better solo spin time (3:44)
+ Moderately heavy (3.2g)
+ Circular shape and rollers reduce loss of spin when touching the floor
+ Circular shape and rollers reduce loss of spin when contacting opponents

SW145:
! Worse solo spin time (2:41)
+ Moderately heavy (3.6g)
- Angular shape isn't great for LAD
- Angular shape is a bit recoily if hit

It might just be that my SW145 is loose and rattly, but my SW145 gets substantially worse solo spin time than W145, while TR145 reliably outperforms it (slightly). I planned to get around to some additional tests comparing W145 and TR145 today, as well as some official tests on Vulcan and Jade, but house work took up the greater part of my day today DJ - Sad.