I've wanted to comment on this thread for a while just to show that I 100% support these parts being unbanned in Classic (unless further testing suggests that some of them are too powerful for the format), but I just haven't bothered to fully organize my thoughts on the issue until now I guess (so this post is going to be pretty
lost long). If anyone wants more tests against competitive Classic combos, I've tested
Ogre and
Kraken pretty extensively, and they both seem to have their niches in the metagame.
Allowing Turbo Layers, generally speaking, into Burst Classic makes the banlist no more complicated than the banlist for MFB Limited. Explaining to people that you can use Hasbro's light, hollowed out Fang, Death, and Duo wheels, but not Takara Tomy's heavier ones is no different of a ban condition, and is actually significantly less confusing considering that in MFB these parts not only shared the same names, but later on into the Metal Fury line Hasbro
actually released the Takara Tomy versions of some of the parts they had nerfed earlier. It's much easier to say "Achilles A4 is allowed, but Z Achilles is not" than to say "TT Phantom is not allowed, and neither is the Hasbro Metal Fury Legends Phantom, but you can use the Hasbro Metal Fury non-Legends Phantom", so this is in reality less complicated than an already existing rule in an already existing format. What Hasbro essentially has done, during both Metal Fury and Turbo (or like the entirety of Burst to an extent) is create completely new parts that should be evaluated on their own merits.
I'm well aware that not every part is going to be viable, as some parts are just poorly designed and aren't likely to be chosen no matter what you ban or unban, but that isn't the point of the argument. The release of Hasbro's Turbo line, which is in itself a glaringly obvious parallel to their Metal Fury line way back in the day, was in fact one of the main catalysts that led to the creation of Burst Classic. And similarly to the Metal Fury wheels, these Turbo Layers are much weaker than things that already exist. No one will use them in Burst Limited, and definitely no one will use them in Burst Standard. Without Classic, no one would care about these Layers at all, and any information about their performance would eventually be lost, or just never come to exist in the first place. So literally, it almost makes too much sense that these Turbo Layers, which are "conveniently" power scaled to a Single/Dual Layer level, are allowed in Burst Classic, the format that is
also power scaled to a Single/Dual Layer level and was "conveniently" developed around the exact same time as their release. Ignoring the similarities in playstyle, relative power scaling, and even the context and purpose of their development between Burst Classic and MFB Limited is, in my opinion, incredibly foolish, and will only hinder the format in the long run.
(Oct. 04, 2019 2:13 PM)Dt20000 Wrote: I’ve said this before, but I’ll say it again:
Burst Classic does not need new parts. It is a Format for older parts. Adding new parts just because they are weaker, in my opinion, kinda ruins the point of a classic format. If we add in all the weak new parts, it basically becomes a second Burst Limited, and we don’t need a second Burst Limited.
I've also said this before, and I'll say it again, because apparently some people did not get the memo the first time:
Burst Classic is, by definition as a format with a banlist, a Limited Format. The only reason it isn't called "Burst Limited" to match the MFB Limited format is because it was originally proposed alongside a second Limited Format which is based around the Late God/Early Cho Z era, and having two formats with the same name would be confusing. The "Classic" name was chosen to indicate that this format is power scaled to an era before the other Limited format, and isn't meant to be taken so ignorantly literally.
Though it's lost traction over the years, there was once a similar proposal for a "
4D Limited" format that would serve as a format where parts that are too strong for Limited, but too weak for Standard (mainly the 4D Series) could shine. If this format was to be made official, and we were to follow the naming scheme used in the Burst Formats for consistency's sake, it would become MFB Limited, and what is currently known as MFB Limited would be referred to as MFB Classic. Now, does this mean that we would have raging normies screeching for Jade, all of the Metal Fury, and Zero-G/Shogun Steel parts to be banned from MFB Classic, simply because they aren't older parts and are perfectly legal (albeit useless) in Limited? Possibly, but would that argument be well received? Not at all, because those parts are already right at home in Classic, and it would make no sense to unnecessarily remove them as viable options from the metagame that they've been balanced for.
(Oct. 05, 2019 5:19 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: My point is, burst classic is for classic beyblades. If exclusives are allowed because "they aren't that strong" then why not allow Satomb S3? That loses to classic combos. The qestion is, where do we draw the line, Shindog bladekid
?
Let the record show that many of the weaker God Layers, like Satomb S3, were originally allowed in Classic. Halfway through the unranked experimental phase, there was a trial ban on them, to see how the format would play without them, similarly to how most of the Dash Drivers were trial banned for the first half of the experimental phase. When this phase ended and the format became ranked, they simply remained on the current banlist because some people preferred the way the format played without them. That doesn't mean that there's no chance that they will be unbanned at some point in the future, though. We're still keeping an eye on Zeta' and Bullet, two currently legal parts that may become banned if they prove too be too powerful.
However, reducing the argument for including them to just that "they aren't that strong" is a bit ingenuous. The Turbo Exclusive Dual Layers add more depth and variety to the Classic metagame, introducing several viable new parts for players to use and just making it overall a better, more fun game to play. They give some much needed accessibility to the format as well - Some of the older Hasbro and Takara releases, especially Takara single Layers, are becoming more difficult and expensive to obtain and having Beyblades that anyone can buy at their local store and use makes the format lot more appealing.
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