Hello Everyone It's TheBeyBladeGuy So now that Chouzetsu is starting and metal beys are becoming a cool thing again, I feel they should be counted as there own separate tournaments and I will list why it should be counted like that.

Reasons

• Well First of all It's Metal and most of the previous System are basically powerless against these Beys and only two Beys stand a chance Spriggan Requiem & Nightmare Longinus. 
  
• Spam!! People are literary going to spam these Beys until they get to thr finals which means all the time people spent working on we're a wast of time 
  
• People who want to have fun trying out combos for next time or if they just to have fun are going to be ruin with these powerful Beys because they destory every bey which means that the combo they we're working so hard on was ruin by Chouzetsu Beys
  

Conclusion
So I hope you enjoyed these reasons & I hope you agree with me but discussion is always welcome here 
Just really feel that sense they are so overpowered and more are going to be better and overpowered I just feel they should be put as there own tournament category

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TheBeybladeGuy

Me and my friends were discussing about this ever since the Cho-Z release... I'm in favor of having a separate format for the Cho-Z as well. Despite the fact that every new release overshadows another, Cho-Z takes it to another level by being metal. Only a few Beys can withstand them without any causing any breakages of some sort. It won't be also a "healthy" format for me since it usually results to a community where "only the blader who gets it first, wins the tournament" kind of thing.

Although I'm open for other opinions about this as well so that we can gather enough data and information to actually have its own format.

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// filipino blader since 2011 //



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You're suggesting something like have everything up to God be the "Limited" format for Burst? Yeah, I could get behind that. I'm a Hasbro blader for the most part, so I most likely wouldn't get the TT Chou-Z beys due to part incompatability.

I think we should do the inverse: wait to see the end of cho z and then make a limited format to redeem the now useless parts.

By the end of Cho Z, I am pretty sure everyone else will be using Cho Z, so then it is once again fun for everyone.

Aside from that, Cho Z layers are already nerfed because of poor balance. They tend to wobble and make random, sporadic movements because they are off balanced. Consequently, this opens up the opportunity for them to be outspun and be bursted faster.

I just suggest we wait before we make any final verdicts. We dont have enough Cho Z tops to make a final determination.

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First and foremost, let me make sure you're on the right page. Cho-Z Beyblades aren't a thing of "metal beys are becoming cool again". They just have more metal than God Layers. I wouldn't call them metal Beyblades any more than I would call God Layers the same. I mean, does Nightmare Longinus look like an exception?

And then:

We'll be permitting them in the same format for now. Nothing has fundamentally changed for this system, so there's no reason to split it into it's own format yet, haha.

And I have to agree with that.

Open question to everyone: Did you feel the same when God Layers were released and dominated the Single and Dual Layer formats? God Layer System destroys those so much harder than Cho-Z does to it.

Standard is about allowing the latest and greatest. It is pretty much the equivalent to OU/Standard tiers in Pokémon, if you're familiar with that at all. (I'm sorry, can't think of a more known equivalent.)  And even if Cho-Z did or eventually does eclipse the God Layer system....isn't that how it always is? New Beyblades overcome old Beyblades.

People are already talking about making a Pre-God Layer Limited Format to allow Single and Dual Layers to be usable again (because they're that badly eclipsed by God Layers). But before you go and try to make a God Layer Limited Format suggestion, I think you should try to do better to understand Cho-Z. I might be wrong, but that's the vibe I'm getting, and I apologize if I am wrong.

Fortunately, the WBO staff seems to like to have actual proof before doing things, and so I'm not worried about what happens. So long as decisions are made by evidence and not by guesses, I'm fine.

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Ah, @[Sıon] jumped in saying something similar. So yeah, I agree there.

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Also, an important note: Hasbro Beybladers who fear being eclipsed once again (as what happened when God Layers were initially introduced) should try to set up Hasbro-only tournaments. I have TT Beyblades, but I would 100% support any Hasbro-only tournaments also existing, and I'm sure many other TT Beybladers would as well.

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[[ Michigan Blader | Avatar photo by Ivan Kislov ]]

First and foremost, let me make sure you're on the right page. Cho-Z Beyblades aren't a thing of "metal beys are becoming cool again". They just have more metal than God Layers. I wouldn't call them metal Beyblades any more than I would call God Layers the same. I mean, does Nightmare Longinus look like an exception?

And then:

We'll be permitting them in the same format for now. Nothing has fundamentally changed for this system, so there's no reason to split it into it's own format yet, haha.

And I have to agree with that.

Open question to everyone: Did you feel the same when God Layers were released and dominated the Single and Dual Layer formats? God Layer System destroys those so much harder than Cho-Z does to it.

Standard is about allowing the latest and greatest. It is pretty much the equivalent to OU/Standard tiers in Pokémon, if you're familiar with that at all. (I'm sorry, can't think of a more known equivalent.)  And even if Cho-Z did or eventually does eclipse the God Layer system....isn't that how it always is? New Beyblades overcome old Beyblades.

People are already talking about making a Pre-God Layer Limited Format to allow Single and Dual Layers to be usable again (because they're that badly eclipsed by God Layers). But before you go and try to make a God Layer Limited Format suggestion, I think you should try to do better to understand Cho-Z. I might be wrong, but that's the vibe I'm getting, and I apologize if I am wrong.

Fortunately, the WBO staff seems to like to have actual proof before doing things, and so I'm not worried about what happens. So long as decisions are made by evidence and not by guesses, I'm fine.

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Ah, @[Sıon] jumped in saying something similar. So yeah, I agree there.

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Also, an important note: Hasbro Beybladers who fear being eclipsed once again (as what happened when God Layers were initially introduced) should try to set up Hasbro-only tournaments. I have TT Beyblades, but I would 100% support any Hasbro-only tournaments also existing, and I'm sure many other TT Beybladers would as well.

Amen.

I mean, I would maybe consider a semi-limited (most or all god layers permitted), depending on the Cho Z eclipse. But then you eclipse all the Single and Dual layers in a format where they should shine for the most part.

I really think burst is just a poor system when it comes to even balancing because of the burst mechanism it prides itself so strongly on, and this is why I chose not to actively participate in it. I might get more active in the fourth generation if it is more balanced, or if there is one at all.

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I mean, I would maybe consider a semi-limited (most or all god layers permitted), depending on the Cho Z eclipse. But then you eclipse all the Single and Dual layers in a format where they should shine for the most part.

I really think burst is just a poor system when it comes to even balancing because of the burst mechanism it prides itself so strongly on, and this is why I chose not to actively participate in it. I might get more active in the fourth generation if it is more balanced, or if there is one at all.

I could see doing multiple limited formats, with just the way Burst's different systems are. No reason you must stick to just one. It's just a matter of what people will actually play and if there is proof that they can't compete. (Single and Dual Layers have already met the burden of proof for not competing, just needing to prove the interest, IMO.)

Might even be cool to figure out something like how Pokémon fan groups have it. (Standard/Over Used, Under Used, Never Used, etc.) Because the idea there is to have multiple tiers that try to find use for as many Pokémon as possible, so then you can (hopefully) have some place to play with your favorite Pokémon, however powerful it is.

But still, I think the idea of a Pre-God and God Limited Formats might work nicely on its own, because there are clear lines of difference between parts between generations. Maybe not the best names to use if exceptions to the rules are made, but yeah. Then you can better tailor a balanced environment because it's more acceptable to ban and not ban things, as opposed to a format that tries to allow as much as possible.

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[[ Michigan Blader | Avatar photo by Ivan Kislov ]]

Okay fffffbhv

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I don’t know I think they should be with the others

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I don't know, but a couple of things that concern me is can the Cho-Z beys damage the older ones and are the older ones capable of bursting the Cho-Z beys? If that's the case, then yes they should be separate from the older Burst beys. As Cho-Z is a new generation of bladers and beys, maybe they should be treated separately?

I don't know, but a couple of things that concern me is can the Cho-Z beys damage the older ones and are the older ones capable of bursting the Cho-Z beys?  If that's the case, then yes they should be separate from the older Burst beys.  As Cho-Z is a new generation of bladers and beys, maybe they should be treated separately?

While a few Beys of God gen can easily take on the Cho Z , making the metal game balanced, I don't think that another format in Burst should exist. Also the damaging part (12) is banned, and other future parts which can cause damage shall be banned too. Also layers don't do any damage, as contact points are not metal.

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I don't know, but a couple of things that concern me is can the Cho-Z beys damage the older ones and are the older ones capable of bursting the Cho-Z beys?  If that's the case, then yes they should be separate from the older Burst beys.  As Cho-Z is a new generation of bladers and beys, maybe they should be treated separately?

While a few Beys of God gen can easily take on the Cho Z , making the metal game balanced, I don't think that another format in Burst should exist. Also the damaging part (12) is banned, and other future parts which can cause damage shall be banned too. Also layers don't do any damage, as contact points are not metal.

Not banned but restricted and should be covered with a frame.

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~Thunder

While a few Beys of God gen can easily take on the Cho Z , making the metal game balanced, I don't think that another format in Burst should exist. Also the damaging part (12) is banned, and other future parts which can cause damage shall be banned too. Also layers don't do any damage, as contact points are not metal.

Not banned but restricted and should be covered with a frame.

It's a sort of ban I'll say as per Kei's news

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don’t be afraid of super z until you buy them and test them against what you have

the elite Sr and mG/G3 combos still reign supreme

the super z beys are strong, but the only change is perhaps wV outclassing sX by a hair.

i’m not one for pushing bans, but Sr.7.Br (in left) is my main concern right now tbh.  that combo is spammed far harder than even G3.

don’t be afraid of super z until you buy them and test them against what you have

the elite Sr and mG/G3 combos still reign supreme

the super z beys are strong, but the only change is perhaps wV outclassing sX by a hair.

i’m not one for pushing bans, but Sr.7.Br (in left) is my main concern right now tbh.  that combo is spammed far harder than even G3.

Prohibiting the use of Sr in left spin would render that combo useless because it can't spinsteal.

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don’t be afraid of super z until you buy them and test them against what you have

the elite Sr and mG/G3 combos still reign supreme

the super z beys are strong, but the only change is perhaps wV outclassing sX by a hair.

i’m not one for pushing bans, but Sr.7.Br (in left) is my main concern right now tbh.  that combo is spammed far harder than even G3.

Prohibiting the use of Sr in left spin would render that combo useless because it can't spinsteal.

yes, obviously and among other reasons...

but like i said, i’m not one for pushing bans and to be clear i am not pushing one here.

i guess i need to explain what i meant to you: there are far more dominant combos already in the game *already* being spammed.

if those aren’t banned (and again i don’t believe they should be), i cannot support the banning of a bunch of non-top tier super z beys.

Were people ever this afraid of the God Layer System? Or is Cho-Z just creating scary vibes for some reason?

I don't know, but a couple of things that concern me is can the Cho-Z beys damage the older ones and are the older ones capable of bursting the Cho-Z beys?  If that's the case, then yes they should be separate from the older Burst beys.  As Cho-Z is a new generation of bladers and beys, maybe they should be treated separately?

As already mentioned, only disc 12 does damage and this can be prevented by using a frame--which the WBO rules now make required. 12 isn't competitively good anyway, so anyone who wants competitive combos wouldn't be using it to begin with.

The Cho-Z Beyblades seem to be no less burstable than the God Beyblades.

If we use "generation" to mean like "Original Generation", "Metal Generation", and "Burst Generation"....no, Cho-Z is not a new generation. It is a new system within the Burst Generation. Just like the God Layer System was a new system when it came out, and I don't seem to see anyone saying that should've gotten its own system when it overthrew the Single and Dual Layer systems.

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[[ Michigan Blader | Avatar photo by Ivan Kislov ]]

Just like the God Layer System was a new system when it came out, and I don't seem to see anyone saying that should've gotten its own system when it overthrew the Single and Dual Layer systems.

Maybe because almost 50%+ of the God Layer System's Gimmicks are nonfunctional/don't work as intended? The GLS as a whole is a lot less threatening when the only real Meta is Spriggan Requiem, Maximum Garuda, and Drain Fafnir

Just like the God Layer System was a new system when it came out, and I don't seem to see anyone saying that should've gotten its own system when it overthrew the Single and Dual Layer systems.

Maybe because almost 50%+ of the God Layer System's Gimmicks are nonfunctional/don't work as intended? The GLS as a whole is a lot less threatening when the only real Meta is Spriggan Requiem, Maximum Garuda, and Drain Fafnir

But GLS actually kicked previous systems to the curb just from being heavier. Cho-Z's not doing that. GLS meta still stands.

Even in Hasbro now, the only reason to buy Single and Dual Layer sets at all is for Xtreme or the like. With layers, it's all Switchstrike now competitively. The Single and Dual Layers are outclassed. (And this means Hasbro players had no chance when GLS was released for TT.)

What is Cho-Z doing? What do you think is threatening about it? The Beyblades all wobble. 12 is the most threatening thing I've seen, and that's been taken care of.

Maybe you see something I don't, and so that's why I'm asking.

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[[ Michigan Blader | Avatar photo by Ivan Kislov ]]

Were people ever this afraid of the God Layer System? Or is Cho-Z just creating scary vibes for some reason?

I don't know, but a couple of things that concern me is can the Cho-Z beys damage the older ones and are the older ones capable of bursting the Cho-Z beys?  If that's the case, then yes they should be separate from the older Burst beys.  As Cho-Z is a new generation of bladers and beys, maybe they should be treated separately?

If we use "generation" to mean like "Original Generation", "Metal Generation", and "Burst Generation"....no, Cho-Z is not a new generation. It is a new system within the Burst Generation. Just like the God Layer System was a new system when it came out, and I don't seem to see anyone saying that should've gotten its own system when it overthrew the Single and Dual Layer systems.

I meant generation as in characters (bladers) and system, not as in Beyblade as a whole.  Afterall, when the anime moves on to the next system, all the characters either upgrade their beys to it, or they get their first bey in that system.  But nobody pits a pervious version bey against the new one, unless it's the main character (Valt) to show they are behind the times and then their bey gets destroyed, in order for them to upgrade.

I still think that big anime sized stadiums should only be for fun, not competitive because defense and stamina beys have a clear advantage.

I can see why there should be a different tournament for Chozetsu, but they can be countered since they are unbalanced (until Level Up Chip comes out). Plus, some of the overpowered God beys can beat them.

I still think that big anime sized stadiums should only be for fun, not competitive because defense and stamina beys have a clear advantage.

Sorry about that, I posted it in the wrong thread. My mistake

I meant generation as in characters (bladers) and system, not as in Beyblade as a whole.  Afterall, when the anime moves on to the next system, all the characters either upgrade their beys to it, or they get their first bey in that system.  But nobody pits a pervious version bey against the new one, unless it's the main character (Valt) to show they are behind the times and then their bey gets destroyed, in order for them to upgrade.

Yeah, I tried to hit both possible, which is why I talked about "generations" and "systems". That's the words I would use, but I can't be sure what everyone else means since there seems to be no clear universal definitions.

It is so important to make sure we understand what we're talking about...to actually talk about it, haha.

But I still responded to what you said:

Just like the God Layer System was a new system when it came out, and I don't seem to see anyone saying that should've gotten its own system when it overthrew the Single and Dual Layer systems.

No one is saying that Cho-Z won't eclipse God Layers eventually (they probably will, like usually happens). I'm all for multiple limited formats, but Cho-Z shouldn't be taken out of Standard. Cho-Z is no different from any other evolved version, that God Layers was actually a whole lot worse and didn't allow the same kind of transitioning as we're seeing here.

And so I'm confused, because if God Layers came here without something special for Single and Dual...then nobody really cared. When it was worse. But Cho-Z's not as bad...and this? I wish someone would explain the threat I'm not seeing.

God Layers are still kicking butt. They should be able to play together as the norm, and it should be like how the WBO has always handled the Standard Format, IMO. Cho-Z is nothing special.

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To be clear, this is just me clarifying my stance. It's OK if you don't agree.

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[[ Michigan Blader | Avatar photo by Ivan Kislov ]]

I meant generation as in characters (bladers) and system, not as in Beyblade as a whole.  Afterall, when the anime moves on to the next system, all the characters either upgrade their beys to it, or they get their first bey in that system.  But nobody pits a pervious version bey against the new one, unless it's the main character (Valt) to show they are behind the times and then their bey gets destroyed, in order for them to upgrade.

Yeah, I tried to hit both possible, which is why I talked about "generations" and "systems". That's the words I would use, but I can't be sure what everyone else means since there seems to be no clear universal definitions.

It is so important to make sure we understand what we're talking about...to actually talk about it, haha.

But I still responded to what you said:

Just like the God Layer System was a new system when it came out, and I don't seem to see anyone saying that should've gotten its own system when it overthrew the Single and Dual Layer systems.

No one is saying that Cho-Z won't eclipse God Layers eventually (they probably will, like usually happens). I'm all for multiple limited formats, but Cho-Z shouldn't be taken out of Standard. Cho-Z is no different from any other evolved version, that God Layers was actually a whole lot worse and didn't allow the same kind of transitioning as we're seeing here.

And so I'm confused, because if God Layers came here without something special for Single and Dual...then nobody really cared. When it was worse. But Cho-Z's not as bad...and this? I wish someone would explain the threat I'm not seeing.

God Layers are still kicking butt. They should be able to play together as the norm, and it should be like how the WBO has always handled the Standard Format, IMO. Cho-Z is nothing special.

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To be clear, this is just me clarifying my stance. It's OK if you don't agree.

Totally agree with you, God beys have a major advantage in stability, cho-z might have more weight but it’s basically a dual later with metal, just like lost Longinus, they aren’t that special

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And I have to agree with that.

Open question to everyone: Did you feel the same when God Layers were released and dominated the Single and Dual Layer formats? God Layer System destroys those so much harder than Cho-Z does to it.

Yes. When god layers were released the only bey that had a fighting chance was l2. Now history is repeating itself. With Cho Z the beys hit so hard that all dual layers are outclassed and most god layers have no chance. If 12 was allowed to be  used without a frame most dual layer beys would be shredded.