(Nov. 12, 2014 6:06 AM)Neo Wrote: You just got Pegasis?Yeah, didn't think I would need it, but it's been coming up a lot in conversation lately so I figured I might as well make the investment. I was messing around with RF and really liked how it was performing (which is a lot coming from me, considering that I'm not a huge rubber tip fan)
It's amazing how good it is today despite being the first MFB.
RF is more reliable for it IMO; needs the friction after taking a hit.
MFB: Limited :: Competitive Customs List and Public Discussion
![[Image: jFAMV2B.png]](https://i.imgur.com/jFAMV2B.png)
(Nov. 12, 2014 4:32 PM)The Supreme One Wrote:(Nov. 12, 2014 6:06 AM)Neo Wrote: You just got Pegasis?Yeah, didn't think I would need it, but it's been coming up a lot in conversation lately so I figured I might as well make the investment. I was messing around with RF and really liked how it was performing (which is a lot coming from me, considering that I'm not a huge rubber tip fan)
It's amazing how good it is today despite being the first MFB.
RF is more reliable for it IMO; needs the friction after taking a hit.
Though not the correct term, the two parts have perfect Synergy.
![[Image: 8mgpgcv.jpeg]](https://i.imgur.com/8mgpgcv.jpeg)
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I've heard about Pegasis. I don't have it, but does it have a lot of recoil like Cosmic?
About Dark Knight, through my battle today, I've realized how easy it is to KO with it. For some reason, it was more consistent than Omega! I love both DK Girago and DK Bahamdia. Dark Knight seriously needs to be added.
About Dark Knight, through my battle today, I've realized how easy it is to KO with it. For some reason, it was more consistent than Omega! I love both DK Girago and DK Bahamdia. Dark Knight seriously needs to be added.
![[Image: Pegasusbanner.png]](https://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090425231631/cybernations/images/2/27/Pegasusbanner.png)
Dark Knight works especially well in many case not just in attack combo.
Really? Like what?
I used it in Stamina and spin stealer as well. I agree with the fact that Dark Knight was really designed for great attack combo. during limited tournament in mtl the MSF-H Dark Knight Killerken B: D(Chrystal up) has won first place and Krusty just used this combo all the time. mainly by OS but makes a lots of K.O. too. i've tryed MSF-(M-L-H) Dark Knight Genbull 85/90 BWD/EWD/WD and has some great results too.
I didn't finished all my tests with Dark Knight now but it'S still really versatile. better than Dragoon can do at this time in limited.
I didn't finished all my tests with Dark Knight now but it'S still really versatile. better than Dragoon can do at this time in limited.
Huh, sounds interesting. If I find the time and motivation I might test that!
I hope you'll get the time hah! at now I have more attack combo finded for Dark Knight, but could be usefull on other type too.
Edit: forget to specify but Dark Knight is on top the genbull combo.
Edit: forget to specify but Dark Knight is on top the genbull combo.
(Nov. 24, 2014 7:09 AM)loyd87 Wrote: I hope you'll get the time hah! at now I have more attack combo finded for Dark Knight, but could be usefull on other type too.
Edit: forget to specify but Dark Knight is on top the genbull combo.
I completely agree with you on this! I use Dark Night for spin steal and stamina as well. I like using it on Reviser and Girago.
Anyways, as far as attack go, I believe it should include this.
-Omega
-Pegasis
-Lightning
-Dragoon
-Scythe (I'm sure a lot of folks would want this tested though)
and maybe Wyvang
This is in no particular order, just wanting to show what I think. Also, I notice this list is currently empty, and hasn't been updated in a while, probably due to his being away, but I would love to see a list up sometime soon
Since I can't post in the Advanced Topic, I figured I'd share something here:
Xtracorruption uses Beat a lot whenever we play Limited. Most of the time, it's 90 RF/R2F. He actually does really well with it, considering it got him into the finals to the Qualifiers, too.
I'll talk to him over the weekend to see if I can get him to post about his experiences with it.
X_C00L_R4NCH_X Wrote:EDIT: Yeah, I just double-checked the Metal Fury Beat discussion and the only valid tests were kind of eh. Though, apparently, TBD has had some success with it. If we could get some more tests done on it, it could be confirmed one way or another, but right now I'm not sure there's enough to stick it on the list. If people who have done well at tournaments with Beat could speak up as well, that would be very useful. ^ looking at you, public discussion ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ^
Xtracorruption uses Beat a lot whenever we play Limited. Most of the time, it's 90 RF/R2F. He actually does really well with it, considering it got him into the finals to the Qualifiers, too.
I'll talk to him over the weekend to see if I can get him to post about his experiences with it.
![[Image: 9ff5d708-ada9-4d9e-a353-d60f3c2fc6a2_zpsf8dc7f76.jpg]](http://s1303.photobucket.com/user/Bakubey13/media/9ff5d708-ada9-4d9e-a353-d60f3c2fc6a2_zpsf8dc7f76.jpg.html)
Honestly I think Screw should not be on the tier list. Omega is a low track attacker and outclasses it so why do we need Screw on the list? Also I second the idea that Burn 230 customs should be taken off the list because the underside has to much recoil.
(Dec. 05, 2014 3:05 AM)Thunder Dome Wrote: Honestly I think Screw should not be on the tier list. Omega is a low track attacker and outclasses it so why do we need Screw on the list? Also I second the idea that Burn 230 customs should be taken off the list because the underside has to much recoil.
I agree with you on Screw. There are much better options given.
By no means is it a bad wheel, but a bit outclassed when compared to others.
If Screw were good on say 145, I think I'd want to leave it, but since it's an LTAC, I agree to have it taken off.
I haven't used much of Burn 230 but it's defenitley recoil-y.
I haven't used much of Burn 230 but it's defenitley recoil-y.
Despite it's recoily-ness described, I've had a good amount of success with Burn 230 D against other (lower) Stamina combinations, personally. I haven't had issues with it, at all.
I still completely vouch for the idea Kei mentioned last month, about only having Omega, Pegasis and Lightning-based Attack on their section of the tier list, given they have much more potential and less risky than other Attack-oriented wheels. As much as I like wheels like Beat, I'm always kind of worried to use it, given I have other options; ones that are generally more frequently used and preferred. Screw, too, should be removed. I think that it's quite reliable against Burn variants, but less against Defense. I may be being kind of bias towards it, though, given almost all Attack don't do that well against Defense (LTDCs in specific), although the ones I mentioned have more a chance.
I started working on tests utilizing some competitive Attack variants, as well, where as I started with Beat Horuseus 105RF, which got trashed real bad. I'll try my best to have 'em up tomorrow.
As for Burn on 230, I've really only noticed the recoil issues on Burn 230MB, nothing else, actually. I guess It'd be necessary for me to do testings with more of them before I say anything else, that in mind.
I started working on tests utilizing some competitive Attack variants, as well, where as I started with Beat Horuseus 105RF, which got trashed real bad. I'll try my best to have 'em up tomorrow.
As for Burn on 230, I've really only noticed the recoil issues on Burn 230MB, nothing else, actually. I guess It'd be necessary for me to do testings with more of them before I say anything else, that in mind.
Hey if you're going to try a Beat Attack combo put GB145 on it. Back when the original Beat was good I'm pretty sure most people used GB145 with it. The Metal Fury Beat could be different but I don't know because I don't own one.
I agree with Lightning, Omega, and Pegasus. Although Screw and Pegasus are supposed to be on the same level I can see why people think Pegasus is better (it can hit from above and below rather than just below). Some people want Wyvang up there, but I personally have never been successful with it. Dark Knight needs to be looked into more.
I agree with Lightning, Omega, and Pegasus. Although Screw and Pegasus are supposed to be on the same level I can see why people think Pegasus is better (it can hit from above and below rather than just below). Some people want Wyvang up there, but I personally have never been successful with it. Dark Knight needs to be looked into more.
(Dec. 05, 2014 4:05 AM)Wombat Wrote: Dark Knight needs to be looked into more.
Definitely agree.
Ronin Zirago 85 RF
I'm going to do more tests with this against Defense soon, probably within the next few weeks. It actually gets really good numbers.
I am going to do the same as Leone19.
I believe CS should be added to Defense customs. After some testing today I saw that CS is actually a better defensive tip than I thought when used on tracks that are 145 height or taller.
I also believe Screw should be removed. It's like a lesser version of Pegasis. Beat is worse than Screw.
And of course I am going to say Omega be added to the Defense customs list.
I am not sure why W145 is being used for Stamina customs, from what I remember there are much better choices for Staminca tracks at 14 height, like AD145. Also, I didn't look into this much myself, but I believe others have had success with using Libra as a stamina wheel? I would also add 90 to the Earth Stamina custom that currently only has 85, same with burn.
That's all I can think of at the moment. I'm not sure what Cosmic is, but I'm pretty sure it's not as good as Omega/Pegasis/Lightning, because I never heard of anyone ever mentioning it before.
I believe CS should be added to Defense customs. After some testing today I saw that CS is actually a better defensive tip than I thought when used on tracks that are 145 height or taller.
I also believe Screw should be removed. It's like a lesser version of Pegasis. Beat is worse than Screw.
And of course I am going to say Omega be added to the Defense customs list.
I am not sure why W145 is being used for Stamina customs, from what I remember there are much better choices for Staminca tracks at 14 height, like AD145. Also, I didn't look into this much myself, but I believe others have had success with using Libra as a stamina wheel? I would also add 90 to the Earth Stamina custom that currently only has 85, same with burn.
That's all I can think of at the moment. I'm not sure what Cosmic is, but I'm pretty sure it's not as good as Omega/Pegasis/Lightning, because I never heard of anyone ever mentioning it before.
(Dec. 05, 2014 7:28 AM)FlyingWaffle Wrote: [...]
And of course I am going to say Omega be added to the Defense customs list.
I disagree, I don't think there's enough testing to warrant Omega's addition to the Defense section. If anything, we're using an Attack Wheel to KO other things, so it's really just a calm/less-aggressive Attack type.
(Dec. 05, 2014 7:28 AM)FlyingWaffle Wrote: I am not sure why W145 is being used for Stamina customs, from what I remember there are much better choices for Staminca tracks at 14 height, like AD145.
[...]
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-W145-Discussion
![[Image: vwa_copy3_by_elcesplooshe_daejy2u-fullvi...Za8ANFHK5M]](https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca887773594c2.wixmp.com/f/0779b042-834a-4ac6-9292-fab88a9af9cb/daejy2u-70e51d94-acbe-4593-ad69-5434d834b672.jpg/v1/fill/w_1024,h_317,q_75,strp/vwa_copy3_by_elcesplooshe_daejy2u-fullview.jpg?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7ImhlaWdodCI6Ijw9MzE3IiwicGF0aCI6IlwvZlwvMDc3OWIwNDItODM0YS00YWM2LTkyOTItZmFiODhhOWFmOWNiXC9kYWVqeTJ1LTcwZTUxZDk0LWFjYmUtNDU5My1hZDY5LTU0MzRkODM0YjY3Mi5qcGciLCJ3aWR0aCI6Ijw9MTAyNCJ9XV0sImF1ZCI6WyJ1cm46c2VydmljZTppbWFnZS5vcGVyYXRpb25zIl19.GJIQK2sXAJm5ScpS3pSVJ8KrA6Ru9qtE4Za8ANFHK5M)
(Dec. 05, 2014 1:08 PM)AÉ´É¢Ê€Ê Fᴀᴄᴇ Wrote:(Dec. 05, 2014 7:28 AM)FlyingWaffle Wrote: [...]
And of course I am going to say Omega be added to the Defense customs list.
I disagree, I don't think there's enough testing to warrant Omega's addition to the Defense section. If anything, we're using an Attack Wheel to KO other things, so it's really just a calm/less-aggressive Attack type.
(Dec. 05, 2014 7:28 AM)FlyingWaffle Wrote: I am not sure why W145 is being used for Stamina customs, from what I remember there are much better choices for Staminca tracks at 14 height, like AD145.
[...]
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-W145-Discussion
Well, I believe that the beywiki track list needs to be updated. That's insane. I'm glad I bought that Samurai Ifraid. And yes, I am currently testing with Omega. It would help if others would too, since there's so much to be done, and I'm sure others could use parts that I don't have (like RB). But don't worry, Omega will be on that list by the time I'm through with this!
Even though I can't post replies in the Advanced Forum's discussion, I may as well post this here.
Relating to Cake's list, I'd say it's pretty accurate in terms of Attack, taking down Beat was a pretty smart decision. While some have had good experiences with it, given most testings done with it were fabricated, we now have very limited information on it, unfortunately. As for Screw, I'm pretty happy to see it gone, too.
I kind of forgot about Ronin Zirago for a while, I'm pretty glad to see it up there. Got these testings done.
Ronin Zirago 85RF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 8/10 (ALL KO) 80% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 2/10 (ALL OS) 20% Win Rate
Ronin Zirago 85RSF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 9/10 (ALL KO) 90% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 1/10 (ALL OS) 10% Win Rate
I myself like it on TH170, TH220, SR200 and 230 variants, but they're considered Balance, not Defense. As for it on LTDCs, I feel like it'd be knocked around the stadium a lot more in comparison to RSF or RB.
EDIT: FlyingWaffle, what I think of when I hear LTDCs in Limited is something round with bulk to it, like Libra, Earth, or Bakushin, for say. I feel like it lies more around being considered an Anti Attack (Balance) or RSF/RB-based Attack.
Relating to Cake's list, I'd say it's pretty accurate in terms of Attack, taking down Beat was a pretty smart decision. While some have had good experiences with it, given most testings done with it were fabricated, we now have very limited information on it, unfortunately. As for Screw, I'm pretty happy to see it gone, too.
I kind of forgot about Ronin Zirago for a while, I'm pretty glad to see it up there. Got these testings done.
Ronin Zirago 85RF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 8/10 (ALL KO) 80% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 2/10 (ALL OS) 20% Win Rate
Ronin Zirago 85RSF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 9/10 (ALL KO) 90% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 1/10 (ALL OS) 10% Win Rate
FlyingWaffle Wrote:I believe CS should be added to Defense customs. After some testing today I saw that CS is actually a better defensive tip than I thought when used on tracks that are 145 height or taller.
I myself like it on TH170, TH220, SR200 and 230 variants, but they're considered Balance, not Defense. As for it on LTDCs, I feel like it'd be knocked around the stadium a lot more in comparison to RSF or RB.
EDIT: FlyingWaffle, what I think of when I hear LTDCs in Limited is something round with bulk to it, like Libra, Earth, or Bakushin, for say. I feel like it lies more around being considered an Anti Attack (Balance) or RSF/RB-based Attack.
(Dec. 05, 2014 11:41 PM)Shido Wrote: Even though I can't post replies in the Advanced Forum's discussion, I may as well post this here.
Relating to Cake's list, I'd say it's pretty accurate in terms of Attack, taking down Beat was a pretty smart decision. While some have had good experiences with it, given most testings done with it were fabricated, we now have very limited information on it, unfortunately. As for Screw, I'm pretty happy to see it gone, too.
I kind of forgot about Ronin Zirago for a while, I'm pretty glad to see it up there. Got these testings done.
Ronin Zirago 85RF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 8/10 (ALL KO) 80% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 2/10 (ALL OS) 20% Win Rate
Ronin Zirago 85RSF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 9/10 (ALL KO) 90% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 1/10 (ALL OS) 10% Win Rate
FlyingWaffle Wrote:I believe CS should be added to Defense customs. After some testing today I saw that CS is actually a better defensive tip than I thought when used on tracks that are 145 height or taller.
I myself like it on TH170, TH220, SR200 and 230 variants, but they're considered Balance, not Defense. As for it on LTDCs, I feel like it'd be knocked around the stadium a lot more in comparison to RSF or RB.
EDIT: FlyingWaffle, what I think of when I hear LTDCs in Limited is something round with bulk to it, like Libra, Earth, or Bakushin, for say. I feel like it lies more around being considered an Anti Attack (Balance) or RSF/RB-based Attack.
How do you guys get RSF to KO? I can't get my RSF to move if I wanted it to. Slide shooting makes it be semi-aggressive for a few seconds, but that's it.
Why would those high track and CS combos be considered balance? The only attribute they are strong in is Defense? And yes, it is knocked around more, but it has a bit more stamina than RSF, and it doesn't normally leave the stadium, though that was with Omega, and not with an LTDC (which I would like know what that stands for, Limited something?).
(Dec. 05, 2014 11:59 PM)FlyingWaffle Wrote:(Dec. 05, 2014 11:41 PM)Shido Wrote: Even though I can't post replies in the Advanced Forum's discussion, I may as well post this here.
Relating to Cake's list, I'd say it's pretty accurate in terms of Attack, taking down Beat was a pretty smart decision. While some have had good experiences with it, given most testings done with it were fabricated, we now have very limited information on it, unfortunately. As for Screw, I'm pretty happy to see it gone, too.
I kind of forgot about Ronin Zirago for a while, I'm pretty glad to see it up there. Got these testings done.
Ronin Zirago 85RF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 8/10 (ALL KO) 80% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 2/10 (ALL OS) 20% Win Rate
Ronin Zirago 85RSF versus MF-M Burn Cancer 160WD
Both Bottoms in their Prime • Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches
Ronin Zirago: 9/10 (ALL KO) 90% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 1/10 (ALL OS) 10% Win Rate
FlyingWaffle Wrote:I believe CS should be added to Defense customs. After some testing today I saw that CS is actually a better defensive tip than I thought when used on tracks that are 145 height or taller.
I myself like it on TH170, TH220, SR200 and 230 variants, but they're considered Balance, not Defense. As for it on LTDCs, I feel like it'd be knocked around the stadium a lot more in comparison to RSF or RB.
EDIT: FlyingWaffle, what I think of when I hear LTDCs in Limited is something round with bulk to it, like Libra, Earth, or Bakushin, for say. I feel like it lies more around being considered an Anti Attack (Balance) or RSF/RB-based Attack.
How do you guys get RSF to KO? I can't get my RSF to move if I wanted it to. Slide shooting makes it be semi-aggressive for a few seconds, but that's it.
Why would those high track and CS combos be considered balance? The only attribute they are strong in is Defense? And yes, it is knocked around more, but it has a bit more stamina than RSF, and it doesn't normally leave the stadium, though that was with Omega, and not with an LTDC (which I would like know what that stands for, Limited something?).
I have similar experiences to yours with RSF. I can't get mine to move around aggressively for any length of time, no matter what I do. On the other hand, I can easily control my RB and get it to make some nice aggro movement patterns, so I use it instead.
CS Defense is technically Balance at this point, because CS has a whole lot less Defensive ability than RSF or RB, and has a whole lot more Stamina. CS is basically the perfect example of a Defense/Stamina hybrid - it has excellent Defense but also has better Stamina than most of the bottoms in the meta. CS is fairly easy to KO at this point, unfortunately.
Regarding the term "LTDC", that's a common abbreviation for Low Track Defense Combo. It also is the same format for other heights and types - like HTSC referring to high-track Stamina (High Track Stamina Combo). Basically, it's just a fast way to indicate you are talking about a certain type and height.
Oh, I didn't notice any activity in this thread until just now! I must have completely missed it...
Can someone point me to Kei's post where he talked about limiting the Attack section to Lightning, Pegasis and Omega? I really want to see that.
Oh, and guys, if you want to do some testing for the competitive list, any of the stuff listed in this post would be awesome.
I personally still absolutely love Cosmic. MF-H Cosmic Unicorno II R145RF is one of the most high-powered Attack combinations in Limited Format, definitely on level with Pegasis if you ask me.
Can someone point me to Kei's post where he talked about limiting the Attack section to Lightning, Pegasis and Omega? I really want to see that.
Oh, and guys, if you want to do some testing for the competitive list, any of the stuff listed in this post would be awesome.
I personally still absolutely love Cosmic. MF-H Cosmic Unicorno II R145RF is one of the most high-powered Attack combinations in Limited Format, definitely on level with Pegasis if you ask me.
![[Image: 68vfxj.jpg]](https://oi57.tinypic.com/68vfxj.jpg)
(Dec. 06, 2014 2:44 AM)TheBlackDragon Wrote: Oh, I didn't notice any activity in this thread until just now! I must have completely missed it...
Can someone point me to Kei's post where he talked about limiting the Attack section to Lightning, Pegasis and Omega? I really want to see that.
Oh, and guys, if you want to do some testing for the competitive list, any of the stuff listed in this post would be awesome.
I personally still absolutely love Cosmic. MF-H Cosmic Unicorno II R145RF is one of the most high-powered Attack combinations in Limited Format, definitely on level with Pegasis if you ask me.
Here is Kei's post. I would love to help with testing, but I am still doing Omega testing (I think it will never end! xD). Can you link me to an article or picture of cosmic?