I recently got Phantom Orion, Jade Jupiter, and a pack of MF-2s, and was up late last night messing around with combos. I wanted to see how a low-track defense/balance combo worked against today's top-tiers, and needless to say, it did pretty well. This combo is something I would like to introduce to you as a potential Tier 2 balance type. Let me explain my reasoning behind the parts I chose.

MF-H: It provides extra weight and reduces recoil, both of which are needed in this combo. It's not particularly heavy, so it needed some way to stay in the stadium.

Cancer: I think this CW goes great with Phantom. It's got decent weight, good weight distribution, and since Cancer is two-sided like Phantom, it has pretty nice synergy with it.

Phantom (Stamina): Phantom is the best stamina wheel I own, and I wanted to create a hybrid between stamina and defense. Phantom's weight also plays a part in this; it's heavy enough so that, on a decent defensive tip (like RB), it doesn't get KOed as easily.

85: This is a good height for Phantom in this combo because it doesn't expose the recoily undersides of Phantom, compared to TH170, AD145, etc. It's also a good height for getting up under 145-height combos just enough to tip them over.

RB: As you know, RB is a pretty solid defense tip, similar to RS and RSF. Because of this, it can stay inside the stadium more easily, even if it has less-than-perfect stamina. My RB is a tad aggressive, so I banked when testing against stamina combos.


Parts I don't have: Blitz, RSF, Death, RDF, a second Aquario, a second Cancer, a second Phantom, a second 85, and a second RB.

All tests were done using standard procedure; launches alternated against stamina + defense, and Phantom launched first against attack.


Versus Stamina

Spoiler (Click to View)

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs Basalt Kerbecs AD145WD

Spoiler (Click to View)

Phantom- 14 wins (2 OS, 12 KO)
Basalt- 6 wins (all OS)
1 draw

Phantom win %- 70%

I know this is only decent, but Phantom had very little knockback when KOing Basalt. Very few of the KOs were wall saves, as well.

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs Scythe Aquario AD145WD

Spoiler (Click to View)

Phantom- 15 wins (9 OS, 6 KO)
Scythe- 5 wins (all OS)

Phantom win %- 75%

This is slightly better than it did versus Basalt; reason being is that Scythe was easier to get up under and/or KO. Some of the outspins from either of them were pretty slim.

Versus Attack

Spoiler (Click to View)

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs MF VariAres R145RF (right-spin)

Spoiler (Click to View)

Phantom- 15 wins (6 OS, 9 KO)
VariAres- 5 wins (all KO)

Phantom win %- 75%

To me, these results are pretty solid, seeing as it went up against a top-tier attack type (save for the MF-H ). I'd take 75% against it any day.

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs MF Meteo L-Drago D125XF

Spoiler (Click to View)

Phantom- 15 wins (4 OS, 11 KO)
Meteo- 5 wins (1 OS, 4 KO)

Phantom win %- 75%

I was kind of surprised to see that my RB was kind of aggressive... Some of the otuspins by Phantom were by a hair due to MLD's spin-equalizing.

Versus Defense

Spoiler (Click to View)

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs MF Basalt Aquario BD145CS

Spoiler (Click to View)

Phantom- 18 wins (all OS)
Basalt- 2 wins (1 OS, 1 KO)

Phantom win %- 90%

This actually kind of surprised me, even though Basalt BD145CS isn't hard to outspin. A good portion of Phantom's wins were by destabilizing BD145, though not enough to where it rocketed around the stadium and reduced all of its stamina. Both my CS and RB were calm, by the way.

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs MF Basalt Aquario 230CS

Spoiler (Click to View)

Phantom- 0 wins
Basalt- 20 wins (all OS)

Phantom win %- 0%

I didn't expect it to do this poorly against it... Guess Jan was right about 230 making LTDCs inferior. Then again, every combo has its kryptonite, so I guess this is okay...

MFB Mad Master's Testing

Spoiler (Click to View)

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs. MF Blitz Unicorno (II) 90R2F

Cancer won: 17/20 matches: 85%
Unicorno won: 3/20 matches: 15%

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs. MF-H Vari Ares R145RF

Cancer won: 18/20 matches: 90%
Vari Ares won: 2/20 matches: 10%

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs. MF-H Death (Defense Mode) Aquario BD145RDF

Cancer won: 20/20 matches: 100%
Aquario won: 0/20 matches: 0%

All OS

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs. MF-H Diablo (Defense Mode) Kerbecs BD145CS

Cancer won: 14/20 matches: 65%
Kerbecs won: 6/20 matches: 35%

If there's any testing you need/want me to do, tell me. I'll try to get it done thoroughly and post the results here.

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

Need this against Duo? I can do MFH Phantom Orion 90RB vs Duo BD145CS.

Hold up - Variares 85RB is NOT a top tier combo. Could you test against variares CH120RF?

I meant to type R145RF. Fixed that.

jay- I'd prefer if it was this same combo. You can still test it and post results, though.

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

Jaygrazer Sure, we would like to see this against Duo BD145CS. Also, I am requesting this combo vs Blitz 85RF/R2F.

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Phantom Pegasus II UW145RDF

Also, I am requesting this combo vs Blitz 85RF/R2F.

I don't have Blitz, or another 85, so someone else would have to do it.

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

Also, I am requesting this combo vs Blitz 85RF/R2F.

I don't have Blitz, or another 85, so someone else would have to do it.

Sorry if my post confused you, Kaiba, but this was aimed at Jaygrazer. If he's doing the Duo tests, maybe he can do the vs Blitz test as well ?

I know that you've mentioned in the OP you don't have a second Blitz or 85.
Sorry again :p

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Phantom Pegasus II UW145RDF

Ah, got it. Sorry for that.

Jay, could you also test this against Duo Aquario AD145WD? Hate to bombard you with so many tests, but you're one of the only people here that I know can do that test.

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

Ok. So the to-do list is:

My test

This vs. Blitz Uni II 100RSF (2nd Lowest track available)

This vs Duo AD145WD (S mode?)

This vs Duo BD145CS

*List in order of priority.

You do mean RF/R2F on the Blitz, right? Not RSF?

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(Click to View)

I do not have a spare RF/R2F/LRF. My RSF's are Prime and Used.

Ok. So the to-do list is:

My test

This vs. Blitz Uni II 100RSF (2nd Lowest track available)

This vs Duo AD145WD (S mode?)

This vs Duo BD145CS

*List in order of priority.

Ehh, I'd really prefer an RF/R2F on Blitz, like Imperial said, but if RSF's all you have, that will have to suffice.
And yes, S Mode on both of the Duo combos.

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

I'm interested to do some test but im relatively new to the community,
Not sure u guys will consider my result. Anyway, here it is,


MFB BB 10 Attack Stadium
Launcher grip 3 seg with L/R string launcher
All attack type bey launch with sliding shot
And phantom in attack mode

MFH variares (right spin) CH 120 RF vs MFH phantom cancer 85 RB
Variares win 17KO
Phantom 1KO 2OS
2 draw due to both out the stadium
Variares win rate 85 %

Here is a short ver of my variares test

MFH Beat unicornoII 90 RF vs MFH phantom cancer 85 RB

Spoiler (Click to View)

Beat win 16 KO
Phantom win 4OS
Beat win rate 80 %

MFH blitz unicornoII CH120RF vs MFH phantom cancer 85RB

Spoiler (Click to View)

Blitz win 6 KO
Phantom win 14OS
phantom win rate 70%
I'm not sure about this poor result, someone please test it again.

I also done few round Duo Cancer BD145CS against phantom
duo outspin it 3 times and 1 KO in 5 match.

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I suggest everyone put spin direction when posting up VariAres results..
Remember it is dual-spin.

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Take off the MFH minglok. Ill redo the Blitz. The Duo Ad145WD tests are looking up though

.. MF-H is fine for an attacker. I'm pretty sure all attackers should have one on now.

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shout out 2 kai-v 2.

The Complete Competitive HMS Resource

Just did some tests vs MF MLD D125XF (no CH120, sadly):

MF-H Phantom Cancer 85RB vs MF Meteo L-Drago D125XF
Standard procedure; Phantom launched first
Phantom- 15 wins (4 OS, 11 KO)
Meteo- 5 wins (1 OS, 4 KO)

Phantom win %- 75%

I was kind of surprised to see that my RB was kind of aggressive... Some of the otuspins by Phantom were by a hair due to MLD's spin-equalizing.

jay- By looking up, do you mean Duo is doing good, or Phantom?

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Did some comparitive tests using Basalt in place of Phantom:

MF-H Basalt Cancer 85RB vs MF VariAres R145RF (right-spin)

Spoiler (Click to View)

Basalt- 9 wins (3 OS, 6 KO)
VariAres- 11 wins (all KO)

Basalt win %- 45%[b]

I was really surprised by these results... Basalt's obviously a better defense wheel than Phantom, but it could be that Phantom has less recoil...

[b]MF-H Basalt Cancer 85RB vs Scythe Aquario AD145WD

Spoiler (Click to View)

Basalt- 14 wins (all KO)
Scythe- 6 wins (4 OS, 2 KO)

Basalt win %- 70%

Not much of a difference here. The KOs from Scythe were both wall saves, and some of Basalt's were as well. Seeing as I bank with RB against stamina, which gives RB the aggression of a new RSF, that's what gave Basalt its KOs.

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

Which mold Of phantom was it? I know some of ten can be heavier and that can affect perfromance.

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Mold A1. Would that be one of the heavier ones?

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Wrath|My YouTube Channel|My Selling Thread|My Facebook Page

Mold A1. Would that be one of the heavier ones?

From what I read in the advanced forum the sono kong mold is heavier. I think a1 is the mold of bd that is better.

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Mold A1. Would that be one of the heavier ones?

From what I read in the advanced forum the sono kong mold is heavier. I think a1 is the mold of bd that is better.

I have a SonoKong Phantom. The A<number> determines the B:D mold as well as the Phantom mold, right? Or am I missing something?

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Mold A1. Would that be one of the heavier ones?

From what I read in the advanced forum the sono kong mold is heavier. I think a1 is the mold of bd that is better.

I have a SonoKong Phantom. The A<number> determines the B mold as well as the Phantom mold, right? Or am I missing something?

You are correct. You should have the beqvier version of phantom then.

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Dark_Mousy- A2 for B: D, AFAIK.
Kaiba- Quite nice.
Fusion seemed to do well in a similar LTDC combo.
May I see this thing go up against a TH170/230 please?
As for the combo's performance against Basalt BD145, I've always taken note of this before, but seems like I didn't have enough proof to support my theory....
Destabilization seems to be one of the most effective ways to beat a BD145 combo, as I've noticed.
I've seen many say their BD145 combo lost due to destabilization.
This is yet another combo which claims to destabilize BD145.
Thanks for the tests, Kaiba.

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I know this might be outclassed but, I think it won`t hurt to test this against Bakushin. I find that Bakushin is a really great stamina wheel and a few other members have claimed the same thing. So the best Bakushin combo I can come up with off the top of my head is Bakushin Aquario AD145WD for stamina testing. The only problem is I can't do it because I lost my Jade Jupiter

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