World Beyblade Organization by Fighting Spirits Inc. World Beyblade Organization Discuss worldbeyblade.org News Bey News

Hasbro's Beyblade Burst "Energy Layers" have no teeth, "bursting is rare" [UPDATED]

Sep. 05, 2016  12:05 PM
 
(Sep. 05, 2016  11:05 AM)Alta Wrote: What perplexes me is why Hasbro didn't simply keep the same dimensions of the TT Drivers and just design the slopes of the Energy Layers around that instead of changing both, that way we could have proper cross compatibility.

That's basically it though; why would Hasbro want cross-compatibility with the Japanese releases? They lose out on sales by supporting Japanese releases, as you'll buy those instead of their versions. It's a smart business move, and also a smart move to prevent parents complaining that the toys are basically breaking over time. Also saves you from buying as many parts because they've worn down (e.g Valkyrie, Deathscyther).

In a way, it's all a great thing. In another, it's rather frustrating being locked to the country you bought the parts from.
Sep. 05, 2016  2:07 PM
 
(Sep. 05, 2016  12:05 PM)~Mana~ Wrote:
(Sep. 05, 2016  11:05 AM)Alta Wrote: What perplexes me is why Hasbro didn't simply keep the same dimensions of the TT Drivers and just design the slopes of the Energy Layers around that instead of changing both, that way we could have proper cross compatibility.

That's basically it though; why would Hasbro want cross-compatibility with the Japanese releases? They lose out on sales by supporting Japanese releases, as you'll buy those instead of their versions. It's a smart business move, and also a smart move to prevent parents complaining that the toys are basically breaking over time. Also saves you from buying as many parts because they've worn down (e.g Valkyrie, Deathscyther).

In a way, it's all a great thing. In another, it's rather frustrating being locked to the country you bought the parts from.

Yes and no, because it can make some people, like me, simply dedicate my money to one line, not both. Or none of them, even, that is up to us hah.
Sep. 05, 2016  2:18 PM
 
Totally, I agree with that; it has its positives and negatives. I for one would probably avoid Hasbro parts as I've already invested heavily in the TT products. Unless of course they're all superior; then i'd likely invest in both. Or if the WBO split Hasbro and TT tournaments up, as I wouldn't want to be excluded then, haha.

What I said is just what I think their mindset is, regardless of whether or not it works in a consumer mindset Tongue_out
Sep. 05, 2016  4:41 PM
 
(Sep. 05, 2016  11:05 AM)Alta Wrote: What perplexes me is why Hasbro didn't simply keep the same dimensions of the TT Drivers and just design the slopes of the Energy Layers around that instead of changing both, that way we could have proper cross compatibility.

Because this mechanism can't work with the way Drivers were initially designed. The slope system inherently takes up more room than the teeth system in order to provide the same amount of resistance.
Sep. 05, 2016  5:49 PM
 
I am much of a new player and never tried other formats except Burst, but I think that Hasbro overall did a good job in trying to fix recurring TT issues. I personally like the health bar-like slopes rather than teeth, even though the clicking sound was cool hehe ~

It's really such a shame that this causes them not to be compatible with TT at all though.
Sep. 05, 2016  9:48 PM
 
(Sep. 05, 2016  5:12 AM)Kai-V Wrote: Really interesting video, Nocto. Now I have almost zero reason to purchase any Hasbro Beyblade Burst hah. Although, I am still curious about the way the slope works versus increments...

Glad that my video is giving your wallet a reprieve.

In my very limited experience (playing in a BB-10 is a hassle, to say the least), with the slopes, the Beyblade stops spinning in one of three states: the Energy Layer moved a little; moved halfway; burst.

(Sep. 05, 2016  8:29 AM)TL14 Wrote: Very great video Nocto. It´s very informative. Smile

Happy to help.

Hopefully, the problem of effectively having two systems and having to decide where to spend one's money will be pushed aside if Hasbro's system can be shown to coexist with Takara's. I also hope testing of the Experimental Format can be used as an opportunity to also test how both systems play together, if a decision on the matter hasn't been made before then.

If both systems end up having their own separate formats, then the real problem will most likely be managing newcomers entering tournament communities using different parts than their own, as most communities will likely start revolving around one particular system fairly quickly. (e.g. How do you deal with a player that discovered Beyblade through his local store and who is entering a community having a long history of Burst tournaments hosted before the international release?)
Sep. 05, 2016  10:40 PM
 
This might not be the correct topic to bring this up in, but would the committee think about making all the events Hasbro only when Burst becomes more accessible? I do realize many people will probably disagree because they have spent a decent amount of money on the Takara system. The thing is having 2 co-existing Burst formats one for Takara while the other is for Hasbro would be weird.

First off after the Hasbro release most kids will just have the Hasbro beyblades, not the Takara meaning that you are leaving out a decent part of your community. Generally most of the community won't be the hard core fans like most of our events now are, so I think if we want to see more consistent turnouts for events you should keep it simple and cater more towards the majority, which will more than likely be the casual kids who see beyblades at Toys R' Us and other retail stores. Now you can argue that we can lend these new players parts, but most kids don't want to necessarily use others parts and you might not always want to give a newer member something decent whether its the sake of parts getting worn or the fact that they might accidentally walk off with it. I've also noticed that younger/newer members tend to not read the threads as well as you think and don't always check the format or even understand it. While it might seem obvious to us what a certain format entails they don't. How depressing would it be to show up to an event and not be able to use any of your own Beyblades? How likely do you think they actually want to return after that? Kids and newer members tend to generally be hit or miss. If you get one event that either flops or just doesn't turn out so great they tend to leave and not check back. This has happened at multiple of our events here in NC at least, either the event turn out was low or they didn't understand the format prior to arriving and were disappointed. Don't you think it would be a lot easier to actually play with the parts that are released here? Most other competitive games don't allow items from other countries, especially if its not released here or if the two have some difference in how they actually work, despite being considered the same, like how Hasbro and Takara both have a Valkyrie although they act differently. Now some kids could show up with Takara Tomy Burst, but the majority of players that are new probably won't and I don't think it would be that huge of an issue.

Honestly I assume the reaction to this could be really mixed but it would be nice to hear more people's opinions!

(sorry for the huge block of text by the way, kinda in a rush and really wanted to get the post out there)

@[Bey Brad] @[Kai-V] @[Kei]
Sep. 05, 2016  10:55 PM
 
You definitely make some valid points, Thunder Dome!

For us, the first thing we need to determine at least relatively definitively is what the difference in performance is between each brand. This means that prioritizing the testing and comparison of match-ups between Hasbro parts and TAKARA-TOMY parts is very important right now. We will be working on a series of tests for this comparing, for example: VHA vs. NHR with Hasbro parts versus VHA vs. NHR with TAKARA-TOMY parts (in B-09 with TT launchers), followed by VHA Hasbro vs. NHR TAKARA-TOMY and vice-versa to see if we can observe any significant differences in how the parts perform within the same brand and then when mixed against each other.

Basically, we need to spend more time figuring out how the brands differ in their performance and interact with each other before we can make any decisions about how to integrate the Hasbro Beyblade Burst parts into WBO Organized Play.
Sep. 05, 2016  10:56 PM
 
There's nothing at this point to indicate you couldn't be competitive in a mixed metagame using just the existing Hasbro parts, though. I think we want to make Hasbro-only formats an option, and to encourage it when appropriate, but not to mandate it.

We're going to have some test results up soon to show what we plan on doing with Hasbro Smile
Sep. 05, 2016  11:02 PM
 
^ I definitely agree.

Having a separate format for Hasbro and TT, in my opinion would be fair. Just like you stated, most kids will usually be more familiar with Hasbro Burst beys and not as familiar with our TT formats and rules. Especially new players.

Having some tournaments strictly with Hasbro Burst beys might not at all be bad. We'll still have regular Burst formats for TT. As for a Hasbro Burst format, we could try this out and see how it goes once Hasbro has Burst worldwide (or in NA at least). This might be the best choice for now, until Hasbro can possibly make Burst more compatible. More new players can become more familiar with Burst and thus, more members for the WBO.

That's just my brief opinion for now haha.
Sep. 05, 2016  11:48 PM
 
I agree with Brisk. New players like myself are kind of at a crossroads now. Do we buy TT burst even aside from the durability issues? Or do we wait and buy Hasbro burst? Staying TT only will alienate the newer hasbro players but moving towards hasbro will inconvenience the TT players who have already spent $$$ on the game. Two formats would allow everyone access to the game but of course requires more upkeep.

Plenty of questions and decisions to be made but most importantly we need to give it time and test test test
Sep. 06, 2016  12:08 AM
 
Actually I do believe that we have way too many Metal Fight Beyblade formats even, and it does make sense to have a main, if not only, format exclusively for Hasbro Beyblade Burst. Sure, before, Hasbro's nerfed moulds put new players at a great disadvantage, but at least they could try the best customization possible with those parts. Now, they have pieces that are identical for the most, yet they could not enter a significant number of events simply because their parts' mechanism is incompatible. If we want to claim ourselves as open and welcoming to all Bladers, this is an avenue that will seriously have to be considered.
Sep. 06, 2016  12:11 AM
 
^ Yup, definitely! The WBO is of course welcome to all kinds of Bladers, either with Hasbro and TT, alike.
Sep. 07, 2016  10:52 AM
 
Hasbro only events may or may not make sense, depending on how big the differences actually are but TT only events do not. As you lot say, it would be anti-inclusion of newcomers and doesn't seem to be warranted if TT parts are generally better anyway.
Mar. 20, 2017  9:49 PM
 
you obviously can't get an instant burst. but hey, who knows?
Mar. 21, 2017  3:54 AM
 
I‘m not sure if this is good or bad lol..
Mar. 21, 2017  4:23 AM
 
(Sep. 01, 2016  1:17 AM)Bey Brad Wrote: WBO members @[1234beyblade] and @[Kei] got their hands on the new Hasbro Beyblade Burst releases as well, and we have some really strange and unfortunate news: Hasbro's Beyblade Burst releases seem to have no teeth at all, but are instead solid parts sloped at an incline. Each Layer has a unique slope to offer different burst-resistance.

[Image: hasbro_s2_slopes4.jpg]
(Image source: Nocto)

The instruction guide also includes a note that "bursting is rare", and our preliminary tests indicate the same. There's no indication that this design bursts more often than the Japanese designs.

[Image: 5YyfPAc.jpg]

We can also now confirm that there is no cross-compatibility between Hasbro and Takara-Tomy parts with the exception of Disks. Hasbro Energy Layers work with Hasbro Performance Tips, and Takara-Tomy Layers work with Takara-Tomy Drivers.

However, Japanese launchers will work.
I do not understand this, someone please explain it to me. 

I have no problem fitting my Hasbro drivers onto my Takara layers, and vice-versa, fitting my Takara drivers onto my Hasbro layers. In fact, the latter causes the bey to become virtually impossible to burst, so I must ask why no one else has brought this up?
Mar. 21, 2017  4:28 AM
 
(Mar. 21, 2017  4:23 AM)Cr0w004 Wrote: I do not understand this, someone please explain it to me. 

I have no problem fitting my Hasbro drivers onto my Takara layers, and vice-versa, fitting my Takara drivers onto my Hasbro layers. In fact, the latter causes the bey to become virtually impossible to burst, so I must ask why no one else has brought this up?

This is exactly why mixing the two brands is banned; the two are designed slightly differently because of the different locking mechanisms, so they do not fit properly together. In the case of Hasbro drivers on Takara Layers, this results in a more loose fit than intended, with the Disk getting more wiggle room than it should. As you found out, forcing a Takara Driver onto a Hasbro Layer is a very tight fit and makes the Beyblade extremely difficult if not impossible to Burst. Takara and Hasbro Layers and Drivers simply aren't designed to be cross-compatible without risking damage and/or altering the performance, so mixing the two isn't allowed.
Mar. 21, 2017  5:20 AM
 
Plus, mixing Drivers and Layers from different companies has been proven to significantly wear out Hasbro's Layers' slopes after barely a few assemblies, so overall they were clearly not meant to be mix-matched and the combination of them therefore deserves to be banned.
Mar. 21, 2017  8:57 PM
 
(Mar. 21, 2017  5:20 AM)Kai-V Wrote: Plus, mixing Drivers and Layers from different companies has been proven to significantly wear out Hasbro's Layers' slopes after barely a few assemblies, so overall they were clearly not meant to be mix-matched and the combination of them therefore deserves to be banned.

So, this is in fact banned, yes? The combinations of the two are not allowed at tournaments of any caliber?
Mar. 21, 2017  9:05 PM
 
(Mar. 21, 2017  8:57 PM)Cr0w004 Wrote: So, this is in fact banned, yes? The combinations of the two are not allowed at tournaments of any caliber?

Yes that is banned, and all Hasbro Layers should be examined by judges before any battle, for that matter.
Mar. 22, 2017  12:26 AM
 
(Mar. 21, 2017  9:05 PM)Kai-V Wrote: Yes that is banned, and all Hasbro Layers should be examined by judges before any battle, for that matter.
What should they be checking for? Worn slopes, or driver compatibility?
Mar. 22, 2017  3:31 AM
 
(Mar. 22, 2017  12:26 AM)Cr0w004 Wrote: What should they be checking for? Worn slopes, or driver compatibility?

Both, basically hah?
Nov. 11, 2017  5:32 AM
 
(Sep. 01, 2016  1:17 AM)Bey Brad Wrote: WBO members @[1234beyblade] and @[Kei] got their hands on the new Hasbro Beyblade Burst releases as well, and we have some really strange and unfortunate news: Hasbro's Beyblade Burst releases seem to have no teeth at all, but are instead solid parts sloped at an incline. Each Layer has a unique slope to offer different burst-resistance.

[Image: hasbro_s2_slopes4.jpg]
(Image source: Nocto)

The instruction guide also includes a note that "bursting is rare", and our preliminary tests indicate the same. There's no indication that this design bursts more often than the Japanese designs.

[Image: 5YyfPAc.jpg]

We can also now confirm that there is no cross-compatibility between Hasbro and Takara-Tomy parts with the exception of Disks. Hasbro Energy Layers work with Hasbro Performance Tips, and Takara-Tomy Layers work with Takara-Tomy Drivers.

However, Japanese launchers will work.

Yeah, when I launched with them, it burst instantly and the layers scattered. I found 2 of them, but still cannot find the metal one.
Nov. 11, 2017  6:49 AM
 
(Nov. 11, 2017  5:32 AM)SapphireGaming Wrote:
(Sep. 01, 2016  1:17 AM)Bey Brad Wrote: WBO members @[1234beyblade] and @[Kei] got their hands on the new Hasbro Beyblade Burst releases as well, and we have some really strange and unfortunate news: Hasbro's Beyblade Burst releases seem to have no teeth at all, but are instead solid parts sloped at an incline. Each Layer has a unique slope to offer different burst-resistance.

[Image: hasbro_s2_slopes4.jpg]
(Image source: Nocto)

The instruction guide also includes a note that "bursting is rare", and our preliminary tests indicate the same. There's no indication that this design bursts more often than the Japanese designs.

[Image: 5YyfPAc.jpg]

We can also now confirm that there is no cross-compatibility between Hasbro and Takara-Tomy parts with the exception of Disks. Hasbro Energy Layers work with Hasbro Performance Tips, and Takara-Tomy Layers work with Takara-Tomy Drivers.

However, Japanese launchers will work.

Yeah, when I launched with them, it burst instantly and the layers scattered. I found 2 of them, but still cannot find the metal one.

What is the name of the specific Bey?
Prev
Page 9
Next