World Beyblade Organization by Fighting Spirits Inc. World Beyblade Organization Discuss worldbeyblade.org

WBO, strict or not strict?

Mar. 26, 2012  2:14 AM
 
(Mar. 26, 2012  1:58 AM)Kai-V Wrote:
(Mar. 26, 2012  1:14 AM)ljadams9 Wrote: So you're telling me there's not much debate going on? Okay, if you say so. The page count shows that there's been plenty of posts about discussing whether this place is strict or not. If there's so many people saying "yes it's strict", then comments like "It's not being strict, it's called doing their job" are a little redundant.

They are, in fact, perhaps redundant, but this is a subject we want to let people freely express themselves on, and it is important for us to get this feedback. Honestly, I am generally happy with the reactions we have gotten in this thread, so perhaps you should read all the posts before writing things like that.


Hazel Wrote:Either way, whether or not you think they are worth it is not really up for debate: it does not matter.

It hardly seems important if people expressing their thoughts in a constructive manner, like Ryuutarou did, pretty much get told that their opinion is worthless. I don't think he should have got warned for welcoming someone, that is incredibly strict. Maybe a moderator notice if it's really that much of a heinous crime, but a 10% permanent warning? And instead of listening to his justification and acknowledging that warning him was a mistake, it's 'oh well it's no big deal cos you need ten of those so yeah let's just forget about it'.

Telling someone that something totally unreasonable, like a heavy-handed warning, is not up for debate because they're not a staff member is telling this entire community that their opinions don't mean squat because their name isn't highlighted in blue.
Mar. 26, 2012  2:16 AM
 
At the end of it all, Kai-V, all you're going to do is tell us we're wrong. It's one of those "I'm the superior, so what I say goes, I cannot be wrong" attitudes. Not really surprising for this site.
Mar. 26, 2012  2:33 AM
 
Its not her fault, though. People have the tenadacy to love to be right (kinda like me and my "smart" group in school; all that matters is right or wrong). I understand that giving a warning for welcoming is "unjustified", but if Ryuutarou saw the date of the thread's post, I would be defending Kai-V. I am neutral, well for now.
Mar. 26, 2012  2:51 AM
 
You are demonising a ten-percent warning level. You know that it takes two more of those to even get any suspension, and eight more to get banned permanently ? We completely explained, in Ryuutarou's topic, why we gave a warning for something that could seem "petty" : a lot of people usually do it just to increase their postcount, and that is a fact. It is SPAM, most of the Introduce Yourself! forum is, in fact.


ljadams9 Wrote:At the end of it all, Kai-V, all you're going to do is tell us we're wrong. It's one of those "I'm the superior, so what I say goes, I cannot be wrong" attitudes. Not really surprising for this site.

What ? There were plenty of times where I have admitted that I was wrong, and where I even publicly apologised, but in the case of warnings, I think a lot about them before applying one to a Member.

You write that, but perhaps I also think that you have an attitude of "Everything Kai-V says is wrong and we need to oppose it" ? I do not have the impression that you are taking a moment to understand my side of the story either.

You are judging me incredibly unfairly right now. Anyone who knows me would completely disagree with you on the comment you just did and, in the few cases where I do believe firmly that I am right, they would totally tell you that it has nothing to do with being "superior".

This has really insulted me. I cannot even believe that I, the only one in the Committee who was advocating your return here despite having signed up as "carp" and even though I knew exactly what your situation was with Brad and vaguely remembered who you were from 2003-2005, would apparently deserve this according to you. You do not have to stupidly nod to everything I say, but you do not have to totally offend me whenever you can either.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:03 AM
 
We revoke warnings in the rare event that some miscarriage of justice has occurred - however, this is not one of those scenarios, and thereby, the user's protests are really not going to convince us. It is not unreasonable to expect that people will not be content with being warned, but that doesn't mean they're going to be able to simply talk their way out of what we consider to be a fairly minor disciplinary measure.

Obviously when the Administration makes a decision about a warning, they do assume to be correct at the time they make the decision, and very rarely will that circumstance ever change.

Now then, adams, if you would like to continue your current tone, I can reinforce my original opinion of you being here. Free speech is encouraged, but it should be carried out a good deal more respectfully than you're currently achieving, and my patience with you was thin to begin with, being that I am the one who banned you in the first place.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:08 AM
 
Hazel, this isn't a tone. This is me EXPRESSING what I believe about this website/community being strict. This is the only topic where I have had this said "tone" apart from the time you quoted me on a few weeks ago, in which you realised I was joking. If there's anything else I've been doing to thin your patience even more, feel free to PM me right now and explain to me.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:13 AM
 
(Mar. 26, 2012  2:51 AM)Kai-V Wrote: You are demonising a ten-percent warning level. You know that it takes two more of those to even get any suspension, and eight more to get banned permanently ? We completely explained, in Ryuutarou's topic, why we gave a warning for something that could seem "petty" : a lot of people usually do it just to increase their postcount, and that is a fact. It is SPAM, most of the Introduce Yourself! forum is, in fact.

I understand that people usually do it to increase their post count but that is not always the case, and I think Ryuutarou has proved that. I genuinely think that warning should be taken away, because it's not really a MINOR punishment as it's permanent. It'd be minor if it was temporary or something, but a permanent 10% warning should be reserved for much larger issues. Even if he was trying to bump his post count, a slap on the wrist would be fine, then if he did it again a warning would be justified.

I'm only saying all of this because I think that the warning he received was 100% unfair. I got warned recently, I wasn't exactly sure what it was but it says 'Insulting' and so I guess it was cos I asked that one guy if he was a weeaboo. Fair enough, I don't think I deserved it but I can see it from your side too which is why I didn't cause a fuss, but Ryuutarou's warning was over something very, very minor.

Sometimes warnings are not thought through properly, they're just handed out. I got warned for calling you an antsy little fellow, Hazel, and even though it was revoked it still left an impression on me. I don't feel it should have happened in the first place, and that's what makes me think this place is strict. People have mentioned in this topic how they're afraid to post, eventually all the restrictions stop the site from being fun and everything feels robotic. I reckon this place needs to loosen up.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:17 AM
 
ljadams9, I did very clearly use the word "current", did I not?

I am implying that, even without a past track record of racist behavior and rabblerousing, your current speaking demeanor would not be acceptable.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:26 AM
 
(Mar. 26, 2012  3:13 AM)Zain Wrote: I understand that people usually do it to increase their post count but that is not always the case, and I think Ryuutarou has proved that. I genuinely think that warning should be taken away, because it's not really a MINOR punishment as it's permanent. It'd be minor if it was temporary or something, but a permanent 10% warning should be reserved for much larger issues. Even if he was trying to bump his post count, a slap on the wrist would be fine, then if he did it again a warning would be justified.

I'm only saying all of this because I think that the warning he received was 100% unfair. I got warned recently, I wasn't exactly sure what it was but it says 'Insulting' and so I guess it was cos I asked that one guy if he was a weeaboo. Fair enough, I don't think I deserved it but I can see it from your side too which is why I didn't cause a fuss, but Ryuutarou's warning was over something very, very minor.

Sometimes warnings are not thought through properly, they're just handed out. I got warned for calling you an antsy little fellow, Hazel, and even though it was revoked it still left an impression on me. I don't feel it should have happened in the first place, and that's what makes me think this place is strict. People have mentioned in this topic how they're afraid to post, eventually all the restrictions stop the site from being fun and everything feels robotic. I reckon this place needs to loosen up.

A ten-percent warning is considered a simple "slap on the wrist". It has basically no 'power', within the 'warning world'. I am certain that Ryuutarou will just sleep and go through two or three days and he will just accept it and move on. It might be a huge event when you notice it, just like any form of reprimanding, but then you take some time to relax, think more about it, and it is fine after a while. Actually, the slightest change can cause that in people, even me if you were wondering, and everytime, without exception, the crisis gets extinguished with time, usually within a few hours or days.

This was the post you got warned for, by the way : "Did you even look at who I quoted, you idiot?"

If we did not have such a huge userbase, we could "loosen up", and I wish we could slightly. Any site that has exactly the same circumstances as us, the same demographic, the same purposes, etc. will end up in a similar situation to us right now as they become bigger.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:33 AM
 
I agree with Kai-V. I think that if the site loosened up, it wouldn't be as safe, and posting wouldn't be as organised and civilized as it already is. I have gotten a 10% warning before, and yes, it was a "slap in the wrist". I was tramatized for a while, because I am highly protective of my reputation, but I got over it after maybe two days. I'm telling you, what has been done is for a reason. Sorry if I'm trying to sound too serious.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:43 AM
 
(Mar. 26, 2012  3:26 AM)Kai-V Wrote:
(Mar. 26, 2012  3:13 AM)Zain Wrote: I understand that people usually do it to increase their post count but that is not always the case, and I think Ryuutarou has proved that. I genuinely think that warning should be taken away, because it's not really a MINOR punishment as it's permanent. It'd be minor if it was temporary or something, but a permanent 10% warning should be reserved for much larger issues. Even if he was trying to bump his post count, a slap on the wrist would be fine, then if he did it again a warning would be justified.

I'm only saying all of this because I think that the warning he received was 100% unfair. I got warned recently, I wasn't exactly sure what it was but it says 'Insulting' and so I guess it was cos I asked that one guy if he was a weeaboo. Fair enough, I don't think I deserved it but I can see it from your side too which is why I didn't cause a fuss, but Ryuutarou's warning was over something very, very minor.

Sometimes warnings are not thought through properly, they're just handed out. I got warned for calling you an antsy little fellow, Hazel, and even though it was revoked it still left an impression on me. I don't feel it should have happened in the first place, and that's what makes me think this place is strict. People have mentioned in this topic how they're afraid to post, eventually all the restrictions stop the site from being fun and everything feels robotic. I reckon this place needs to loosen up.

A ten-percent warning is considered a simple "slap on the wrist". It has basically no 'power', within the 'warning world'. I am certain that Ryuutarou will just sleep and go through two or three days and he will just accept it and move on. It might be a huge event when you notice it, just like any form of reprimanding, but then you take some time to relax, think more about it, and it is fine after a while. Actually, the slightest change can cause that in people, even me if you were wondering, and everytime, without exception, the crisis gets extinguished with time, usually within a few hours or days.

This was the post you got warned for, by the way : "Did you even look at who I quoted, you idiot?"

If we did not have such a huge userbase, we could "loosen up", and I wish we could slightly. Any site that has exactly the same circumstances as us, the same demographic, the same purposes, etc. will end up in a similar situation to us right now as they become bigger.

It's not that it's a huge event, it's that it builds up. It's like a strike one, which isn't a warning in my eyes as it accumulates into something more severe without you having the chance to rectify the error.

Also, I got warned for THAT post? rofl the guy I said that to completely took my post out of context and gave me a verbal dressing down for no reason, because he thought I was talking to him when I was actually talking to someone else, making me look very heartless in the process, so ya, that's why I called him an idiot. Was it getting angry or using the word 'idiot' that got me a warning? I didn't think the word 'idiot' was too harsh... how about dumbo head?
Mar. 26, 2012  3:46 AM
 
I'm going to post my views just because it helps some to see an 'outsider's' view.

Is the WBO Strict? Yes. Can it be too strict at times? Of course but in my opinion it's needed. A lot of the time being strict with just one or two people will show that the particular behavior/rule break is not tolerated. The CMs aren't paid anything for monitering this forum but hey...They generally care about Beyblade as much as the majority of us. I for one think it's needed to keep things clear. Does a warning upset people? Yes..but a lot of the time that rule or behavior is never broken/repeated.

If others think the CMs are to strict...well..how many of you have talked to one at length?

As I see it the WBO as a Sanctioning Body HAS to be strict. These forums are lax compared to some i'm apart of. If you want super laxness(Is that even a word? XD) then make your own.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:48 AM
 
Well, the word idiot can be offensive to some people, so others would also reconise it as an insult.
Mar. 26, 2012  3:53 AM
 
(Mar. 26, 2012  3:43 AM)Zain Wrote: It's not that it's a huge event, it's that it builds up. It's like a strike one, which isn't a warning in my eyes as it accumulates into something more severe without you having the chance to rectify the error.

Also, I got warned for THAT post? rofl the guy I said that to completely took my post out of context and gave me a verbal dressing down for no reason, because he thought I was talking to him when I was actually talking to someone else, making me look very heartless in the process, so ya, that's why I called him an idiot. Was it getting angry or using the word 'idiot' that got me a warning? I didn't think the word 'idiot' was too harsh... how about dumbo head?

Ah, a "strike one" is not a warning ? Some boards do not even work with warnings, it is either you behave well or you get banned completely. Others only have five 'levels', too.
As for "loosening up", I think we actually tried to do so recently since things are not as hyper as they used to be, mostly at the beginning of Beyblade Metal Fusion, and it was done by attaching Moderator Notices instead of also applying a warning. Ryuutarou's warning is from January though, so a lot of things have happened since, and at that time it was relevant to give a simple ten-percent warning for it.

I would also like everyone to stop calling things "crimes". The adjective you associate with that word is not particularly great either, but seriously, we are not treating anything like a crime, and I will work in the domain, so it just seems like such an exaggeration to call these incidents like that, even if I compare with the mildest crimes on this planet ...


It was actually the expression "you idiot". It seems a lot worse than just "idiot". Preferably, neither should be used ...
Mar. 26, 2012  4:05 AM
 
Well, I don't think we should compare the WBO forums to other sites with stricter warning systems, most of the members on this site are kids and they're probably much more intimidated by strict modding than the older members, a lot of them are too terrified to even speak out on these topics. I'm not saying we should mollycoddle them and let them spam as much as they want but I think the warnings need to be handed out moderately.

I called it a crime cos I felt the punishment was much too harsh for what Ryuutarou did, so it felt like the committee was treating it like some serious thing. I think the warning system needs to be reworked... if you've gone a month without getting a warning, you should lose 10%. Permanent warnings are a bad idea because good behaviour is not being rewarded. Someone can also turn over a new leaf, their warning level may not reflect their actual behaviour.

Fair enough about the idiot thing, I meant it to sound a little harsh so that the person would realise that they made a huge mistake in acting like I was making a joke of a natural disaster and its victims, so just wanted to clear my name and prevent a hasty post like his in the future, but it is what it is and I accept my warning. :]
Mar. 26, 2012  4:05 AM
 
True, kai-v. The term crime is used for something done that is illegal. Reporting/"punishing" people is not a crime. It is reinformental action used to discipline people.
Mar. 26, 2012  4:06 AM
 
Dude, you have done nothing but re-inforce everything Kai-V has said after every one of her posts. I get that you agree with her, I agree with her on most points too, but it's a little... pointless to see you reply after every one of her posts, parroting what she has just said.
Mar. 26, 2012  4:16 AM
 
Ok. I'm sorry for the "pointless" posts, and they will end here. I will say my opinion now ( please do not kind mistakes, I am typing from a tablet deviece).
Okay. Who, strict? Yes. Well at least its not a military base. The WBO gives users some to most rights. I feel that argueing wont solve much, even though it can settle some things. I reinforced kai-v's posts to show that someone supports her. Its showing that people agree with others opionions. If you think the site is strict, there is no problem. Everyone's philosophy is different.
Mar. 26, 2012  4:23 AM
 
My opinion, which is not involved with the current discussion, is that the WBO is not strict in any shape or form. I don't see why people get so uptight about warnings and stuff, it's as if they've never been grounded or have been that kid that has parents who let them do anything and everything. The way I see it, is take whatever scenario you think is strict, and make it into a real life scenario (as in, apply it to the world outside of the Internet). It all goes into perspective then, in my opinion. If you ain't polite, you can't expect to be treated like a king or queen. So if you act polite, you should be absolutely fine; and if you don't, the strictness is only your fault.
Mar. 26, 2012  4:25 AM
 
(Mar. 26, 2012  4:05 AM)Zain Wrote: Well, I don't think we should compare the WBO forums to other sites with stricter warning systems, most of the members on this site are kids and they're probably much more intimidated by strict modding than the older members, a lot of them are too terrified to even speak out on these topics. I'm not saying we should mollycoddle them and let them spam as much as they want but I think the warnings need to be handed out moderately.

I called it a crime cos I felt the punishment was much too harsh for what Ryuutarou did, so it felt like the committee was treating it like some serious thing. I think the warning system needs to be reworked... if you've gone a month without getting a warning, you should lose 10%. Permanent warnings are a bad idea because good behaviour is not being rewarded. Someone can also turn over a new leaf, their warning level may not reflect their actual behaviour.

Fair enough about the idiot thing, I meant it to sound a little harsh so that the person would realise that they made a huge mistake in acting like I was making a joke of a natural disaster and its victims, so just wanted to clear my name and prevent a hasty post like his in the future, but it is what it is and I accept my warning. :]

Yes, they are kids, so they can be "traumatised" more easily, but they also break the rules a lot more, and most of them never even read the clear private message they get when they register. I think we do try to do the "prevention" part as well as we can in those cases. If someone indeed appears to be young and only has a few posts, we will definitely consider that before giving them a warning, but at some point, it seems that our Moderator Notices reach the ears of a deaf kid, and we have to give them a warning, because we cannot keep closing the million topics they do in some minutes.

Ah, I knew what I had forgotten to write about : revoking warnings. We actually do that : if you have reached fifty or more percents, or especially if you are very close to being banned permanently, if you are a good Member who has definitely improved the quality of their posts since the times of their warnings, we will really consider revoking them, and we do, in the few cases where it happens. To me, this is similar to an expiring date, except that it can take more than one month, and we actually filter which warnings we want to revoke, instead of it happening automatically behind our backs, perhaps for the wrong people. If Ryuutarou's warning level was much higher and that he would be fine for warning-revoking, this would totally be one of the first warnings to go. But right now, as a ten-percent warning, and seeing that this whole aftermath crisis is fresh, it will not be revoked so soon.
I had thought about this as a reply to your "as it accumulates into something more severe without you having the chance to rectify the error", however late this is, hah.
Mar. 26, 2012  4:31 AM
 
I'd also like to point out that we really do have many new users who will absolutely spew new threads almost unendingly until you warn them, which seems to be the only way to reach them, in every single case I've experienced of this.

In one case, I had to disable a user's ability to post entirely while I explained to them what they were doing wrong.
Mar. 26, 2012  4:33 AM
 
Seriously, some kids become blind and deaf to absolutely everything outside when they discover the "New Topic" button. They do not even pause to see how their existing threads are doing.
Mar. 29, 2012  8:55 PM
 
I think that the WBO is strict enough where its not, you know, mayhem, but in one case I do have question. IIRC, the WBO Rules state that profanity is prohibited, but I still see people use it almost every time I go on this site. Was this rule repealed or something? I'd really like some info on this, and thanks in advance.
Mar. 29, 2012  11:26 PM
 
When you see profanity, please hit the report button.
Mar. 29, 2012  11:30 PM
 
For clarification purposes, UGottaCetus, do you mean things like 'Damn' or stuff that gets turned into 'Carp' by the filter?
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