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Phantom Orion 230 HF/S

Dec. 30, 2012  6:38 AM
 
Phantom Orion 230 HF/S
¤The Idea
basically,I asked in the Build Me A Combo #2 Thread-which is the longest possible combo that can be made.The answer came any E230 combo with a synchrom of high width;I don't have E230 but a 230,I won't get a synchrom early i suppose.I had an HF/S.I wanted a really tall combo,with high stamina potential(hence,phantom),and as you may know,HF/S provides a nice gimmick-from being at Hole Flat to Sharp,and at HF,a good height is achieved,so i came up with this combo
FACE
any one will do.A Metal Face will be quite good
CLEAR WHEEL-
Orion;I'm out of good clear wheels
FUSION WHEEL
Phantom;stamina potential and all you know
SPIN TRACK
230;A high combo,remember?
PERFORMANCE TIP
HF/S;gimmick and height.
TESTING
PROCEDURE
BB-10
string launcher R
string launcher LR

ASSISTANCE
by Sharven12.
Vs Diablo Kerbecs BD145RF
in S
10-0(10 OS)
in HF
9-1(8OS,1KO||1KO)

Vs Revizer Dragoon B: D
in S
8-2(8OS||2OS)
in HF
7-3(4OS,3KO||3OS)

Vs Flash Escolpio S130RF
in S
9-1(9OS||1KO)
in HF
5-5(3OS,2KO||5KO)

Vs Meteo L-Drago B: D
in S
3-7(3OS||7OS)
in HF
6-4(5KO,1OS||4OS)

Vs Phantom Orion AD145WD
in S
9-1(9OS||1OS)
in HF
10-0(8OS,1KO)

CLOSING REMARKS
-without Sharven12,and his arsenal of bey parts,and of course his BB-10,this testing wouldn't be possible
-against Diablo and Flash,in S,the technique is to launch slow,but it's a risk in HF
-The combo is a waste against spin-stealers
-pretty mediocre combo.I used it to get 2 bronze faces
Dec. 30, 2012  7:14 AM
 
I think you should really read this for your layout :

http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Posting-Test-Results


Anyways, I'll try this out now, since I'm testing out a few combos. But I have a feeling this won't do well .. If it gets knocked over, that is basically an instant loss. That's just a feeling though; tests will prove it.
Dec. 30, 2012  7:16 AM
 
Can't u just use phantom_____230 d?
Dec. 30, 2012  7:23 AM
 
Well, that was quick ..

Phantom Cygnus 230HF/S (Sharp) VS MF-H Diablo Kerbecs BD145R2F (Near-mint)
Phantom Cygnus 230HF/S: 0 Wins
MF-H Diablo Kerbecs BD145R2F: 10 Wins (10 KO)
Ties Redone: 0
Phantom Win Rate: 0%


....

Are you sure your tests were correct ? Unless I'm reading your tests wrong (it wasn't clear).
Dec. 30, 2012  7:31 AM
 
uhm,Cannon,RF was used;HF/S was unused;slow launch for phantom.phantom was in stamina mode throughout;I admit this combo is pretty mediocre,it's not going to be top-tier
by the way,did you test in HF or S?
I believe you have some good parts,so can you test it against some top-tier combos?
Yuko Ray14,i don't have D to complete the top tier combo
ok,sorry for the S or HF question,i missed that.you should test it with HF as well before you come to a conclusion.thanks.
Dec. 30, 2012  6:27 PM
 
Benchmark test for attack please. I find it hard to believe that Phantom on S utterly destroyed Flash, no matter how weakly it was launched.
Dec. 30, 2012  6:32 PM
 
Can you please reformat these results? They're readable, but not easy on the eyes...

You should do some benchmark tests as well. I also find Phantom not being destroyed by Flash a bit... odd. Even in HF mode on HF/S.
Dec. 30, 2012  7:05 PM
 
Yeah, a bit suspicious that an S tip on a high track could win against Flash.
The height of HF/S is a huge balance issue as well...
Dec. 30, 2012  7:33 PM
 
This kind of reminds me of Kei's trolling MLMPPCRTTH combo, haha.

Yeah, I very highly doubt these results. You're getting wins like 100% against Flash with Phantom. On 230HF/S, in S mode. Right.

We even have contradictory results courtesy of Cannon, so right now I'm finding the credibility of this combo to be extremely questionable...
Dec. 30, 2012  8:28 PM
 
I was quite bored, so I decided to do some of my own testing

Procedure (Click to View)


Phantom Orion 230 HF/S (Sharp) VS MF-F Flash Elscolpio R145 R2F (Near Mint) (Click to View)


VS Duo Cancer 230 D (Near Mint) (Click to View)


I will have more time to test later, but so far Phantom's not doing so well......
Dec. 31, 2012  1:28 AM
 
(Dec. 30, 2012  6:38 AM)zeneo Wrote: Phantom Orion 230 HF/S
¤The Idea
basically,I asked in the Build Me A Combo #2 Thread-which is the longest possible combo that can be made.The answer came any E230 combo with a synchrom of high width;I don't have E230 but a 230,I won't get a synchrom early i suppose.I had an HF/S.I wanted a really tall combo,with high stamina potential(hence,phantom),and as you may know,HF/S provides a nice gimmick-from being at Hole Flat to Sharp,and at HF,a good height is achieved,so i came up with this combo

Okay, so you wanted to make the tallest combo. But what's the point? What is it supposed to do? If you wanted it to have Stamina potential, you wouldn't have chosen HF/S. The S tip has terrible balance, as I'm sure you're aware of. And just because it is versatile (through its "nice gimmick") doesn't mean it's going to be useful for your combo; you should provide a reason for why the versatility is useful.

(Dec. 30, 2012  6:38 AM)zeneo Wrote: -against Diablo and Flash,in S,the technique is to launch slow,but it's a risk in HF

Launch slow? But that would only worsen the balance of the S tip.

(Dec. 30, 2012  7:33 PM)GaHooleone Wrote: This kind of reminds me of Kei's trolling MLMPPCRTTH combo, haha.

Yeah, I very highly doubt these results. You're getting wins like 100% against Flash with Phantom. On 230HF/S, in S mode. Right.

We even have contradictory results courtesy of Cannon, so right now I'm finding the credibility of this combo to be extremely questionable...

That thread is legendary.

Anyways, I'm highly skeptical of them as well. There's no way that anything on 230HF/S could stand up to Diablo and Flash, and I doubt that it would have any success against Phantom Orion AD145WD and Revizer Dragoon B:D. There must be something wrong ...
Dec. 31, 2012  1:54 AM
 
(Dec. 31, 2012  1:28 AM)Kei Wrote: There must be something wrong ...

zeneo, do you know how to Sliding Shoot? If not, that would be an explanation of why Phantom 230HF/S beat Flash and Diablo RF so easliy. It would also be a reason that HF OSs so many other things, just through not making contact.
Dec. 31, 2012  1:57 AM
 
Yeah, I just did a few rounds against Reviser Dragooon B:D, and this combo didn't have a chance. I mean after Phantom loses I could run to store, get some cookie dough, come back home and bake some cookies before RD stops spinning.
Dec. 31, 2012  6:21 AM
 
well,I was testing the combo with Sharven12,we both launched together at the same time,and possibly there might be a problem with his string launcher LR...
he should've told me if there actually was a problem.in most of the testing,the RF wasn't performing the flower pattern,in diablo and flash,hence,less contact and phantom's chance of winning,maybe?
To be honest,i was able to defeat gameboysuperman at the 16th tourney(he used L-Drago Guardian BD145RDF,which happens to be a good combo)
Kei-phantom was used for the 'stamina potential' thingy.
as for making the tallest combo,i used phantom on stamina mode,the attack mode facing downwards,potentially doing a smash attack(possibly,that's what it's called if i'm not mistaken)
HF/S provided that 'extra' height i needed to smash attack.As i've said earlier,my HF/S is pretty new,not worn out.
Maybe that's what explains phantom getting a clean sheet against(or atleast a nice win rate against) flash and diablo
Kei-phantom was used for the 'stamina potential' thingy.
as for making the tallest combo,i used phantom on stamina mode,the attack mode facing downwards,potentially doing a smash attack(possibly,that's what it's called if i'm not mistaken)
HF/S provided that 'extra' height i needed to smash attack.As i've said earlier,my HF/S is pretty new,not worn out.
Maybe that's what explains phantom getting a clean sheet against(or atleast a nice win rate against) flash and diablo
Dec. 31, 2012  5:56 PM
 
... Could you at least provide some video proof to show what you are saying is true...?
Dec. 31, 2012  6:02 PM
 
that would cause me to do the testing all over again,then uploading the video.uploading is one big problem as it's impossible for me to upload the video through my cell phone;That also explains my inability to post test results correctly(lack of text-only 510 words...)
Dec. 31, 2012  6:31 PM
 
When I first came here, I thought thiswas a Zero G combo.
If it isn't, then the results are outrageous.
The.combo screams BAD BALANCE!

Well, if you are saying that your combo "performs smash attack" - which I assume, is Force Smash(?) - then I wouldn't believe it tbh.
Phantom isn't quite heavy, and on such a setup, it would get destabilised by almost any 4D wheel. It isn't thr grinder that Duo is....
I need to know how this combo works....

As for beating gbsuperman, tourney conditions differ from tests...
Dec. 31, 2012  6:44 PM
 
i guess tests results differ as well....
even i felt something was wrong as phantom got those win rates,hence i decided to create the thread.
i know this combo shouldn't be helpful but was working for me somehow,blader's spirit maybe
Tongue_out
jan-that reminds me,'can anyone test it in zero-g?anyone!?'
Dec. 31, 2012  6:50 PM
 
Even with a bad launcher, there is no way it could have beat Reviser Dragooon B:D. Lets look at that situation real quick. Lets say his launcher is so bad that RD gets launched at only 20% power, Phantom 230 HF/S (S mode) would go straight to the middle and give RD the chance to spin steal/equalize it's way to an easy win. In HF mode the only possible way it could win, would be for him to have a bad launch and Phantom tornado stall to victory. Which at that point y'all should have realized something was wrong, and it should have been stated in your results that that's how it won.
Jan. 01, 2013  10:34 AM
 
well,the only reason i posted this combo was due to getting unusual wins.
I just wanted to confirm the results with others.
Smile
Jan. 01, 2013  10:48 AM
 
Umm, no offense, but common sense...

Phantom: Recoil Happy Wheel, especially with the designs on it's bottom.
230: Decent Defense track, but is still easy to KO, especially with a plastic only tip and Phantom.
HF/S: Interesting gimmick, outdated and outclassed parts, low grip and bad balance.

Summary: Easy to KO, bad balance = almost no competitive or realistic value. Sorry man, but this should be closed, really. HF/S is fun to use, but with 230 and Phantom, nah.
Jan. 01, 2013  11:27 AM
 
And as for your original plan to use a Synchrom on this- A combo doesnt turn unbeatable if it has a synchrom, no.
Actually, synchroms themselves suffer from severe imbalance. So you would just add to the misery of this combo by using a synchrom...
However, I do wonder if it'd do any good in the Zero G stadium. But it doesnt seem quite promising even then.
Then again, it might be effective in our "Indian Metagame"- something that might have been your focus while making this thread.
Jan. 01, 2013  11:32 AM
 
Oh yeah, dat is true, Indian meta was struck by a negative ion barrage eh? Turned everything topsy turvy? XD

But honestly, if Flash/Blitz/VariAres/Phantom on the 145 Gimmick tracks with an dedicated attack tip cannot KO this... Indian Meta is super duper funky... (No offense)
Jan. 01, 2013  11:35 AM
 
Well, I tested it out a little yesterday.
It does have moderate stamina(at least it could OS Death Aquario AD145 WD).
But, it has almost no defense and bad balance.
It fails against most spin-stealers due to its bad balance, against attackers it fails due to low grip and it is also easy to OS if destabilized early on.
It only stands a chance at beating combos that cannot KO it and do not have top-tier level Stamina.
And since such combos are prevail in the Mumbai community, it worked for him very well there.

BTW, this combo loses quite easily to Gravity BD145 MF as well so..

EDIT: Those who use attack in the tourneys in India always place in top 3. So, you cant really say that the Indian meta is bad. In fact, Relic and BladingSpirit5 have won almost all their events with just pure attackers.
It's just the Mumbai and Pune community that lag behind in terms of attack-type usage
Jan. 01, 2013  11:39 AM
 
Ah, thanks for clearing out that metagame issue N0body.

C'mon attack types!
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