MF-H Phantom (Attack) Cancer/Cygnus 85RB

View All Faces · Oct. 06, 2013 12:16 PM

You mean like Genbull Genbull E230CS?

Threads and combos!

6 God · Oct. 06, 2013 2:33 PM

You can try(for a destabalizer) Girago Genbull E230 MB or Saramanda Saramanda E230 __(cs will work)

6 God is watching and I hope you're prepared to face him

MacDuff · Oct. 08, 2013 9:44 PM

(Oct. 06, 2013 2:33 PM)Kyler_the best Wrote: You can try(for a destabalizer) Girago Genbull E230 MB or Saramanda Saramanda E230 __(cs will work)

I was thinking about that. Yeah, go for destabilizers. By the way, is SP230 a destabilizer?

[Image: 6a34625ebb6dd41f45713dd27d4f8b18]

Threads

Like BB-46 and testing customs in it, come here:

BB-46 Balance Stadium Combo Testing Thread

Wanna know about Tornado Stallers, come here:

Tornado Stallers

Ingulit · Oct. 09, 2013 3:42 AM

There aren't any "destabilizers" as far as I'm aware, and we need to be careful about calling customs that at risk of getting into nickname territory. Just call customs by their proper name.

4D Customs (Click to View)

MFB Customs (Click to View)

View All Faces · Oct. 10, 2013 1:56 AM

(Sep. 21, 2013 3:07 AM)theblackdragon Wrote:
Girago Genbull E230MB

Hey guys! Now that I've finally gotten a decent rubber attack bottom and a good launcher on my hands, welcome to my 10th testing thread! DOUBLE DIGITS!!! W00T W00T! XD

Aaaaaanywho, hope you like it!

The concept:
Spoiler (Click to View)

OK, first off, I know what some of you are probably thinking:

"Rats... there's another testing member down the drain."
"I think you might've gotten a little too much sun today."
"Huh? I think he typed the name wrong..."
"What on earth are you thinking???"
*COUGH* Maniac! *COUGH*

Well, I know it sounds a little weird/funky/crazy/absurd/straight up unnatural, but trust me and the video footage, it's really fun, and IT WORKS.

This combo utilizes the disk of E230, the Girago Chrome Wheel, and the endurance/movement pattern of MB to create a grinding effect that can effectively destabilize and OS any stamina/defense combo below 170 (Duo SR200 will be destabilized to some effect as well), and, in some cases, destabilize even Stamina combos at a 230 height.

This combo's superior weight and highly defensive track allow it to pull significantly above-average results against Flash (and some Synchrom attackers) in comparison to today's top-tier Stamina customs as well.

The launch:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Any right-spin combo TH195- in height will simply be destabilized by E230 with a normal launch, and will stop spinning with no problem as long as your launch is fast and level.

Against E230 defense, the combo must be banked to create an aggressive movement pattern, or high-traction defensive combos will (somehow XD) reverse the combo's effect and cause Genbull itself to become destabilized. However, with a shallow bank, this effect can be completely eliminated, and the custom should have no problem taking down E230 defensive opponents.

Against 230 (and some SR200) stamina opponents, the launch gets a bit hard to explain... i direct you to the video below as a visual reference to help you figure it out. You essentially Bank deeply (not too deeply) near the edge of the tornado ridge, and Genbull should circle around the center of the stadium leaning inward, and eventually scoop around the opposing beyblade and cause it to roll around the stadium on the edge of its bottom (resulting in severe loss of spin velocity and, in some cases, scraping).

Parts choice:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Normal face: I tried MSF, and it just caused the beyblade to wobble a little sooner than I wanted it to, whereas a normal face allowed the combo to lean nicely without wobbling to the ground too early in the match.

Girago: I chose Girago for its grinding properties... the original development of this combo was Genbull Genbull E230MB, but there was nothing above E230 to destabilize Duo ___ 230D/SD/SR200TB. Genbull also has very high recoil when hit from underneath, so on a 230-height combo Girago served to increase its defense slightly as a bonus.

Genbull: ...STAMINA. This thing just has tons of it. I needed a synchrom on this combo to increase the weight (so as to destabilize more effectively), and Genbull was the obvious choice for a top Chrome Wheel where I needed that little extra push in endurance.

E230: E230 is the crux of this combo... it wouldn't do its job without it. E230 can very effectively destabilize lower-height opponents, as well as provide a major resistance to low-protruding attack wheels like Flash and Gryph. Grinding down on your opponent is perhaps the most essential element of this combo, and E230 does an amazing job of it.

MB: MB has great endurance, a slightly aggressive movement pattern, a far above-average height, and the ability to lean over and scoop up/down on a combo without losing much spin velocity... basically every quality that would cause this combo to work to its potential.

Testing videos:
Spoiler (Click to View)

I have yet to find my audio recorder, so no droning commentary this time (). XD I might get a little quiet, so sorry 'bout that.

So, as you can see, the launch against Duo 230D circles wide while leaning in, and then comes to the center and Girago and E230 sort of scoop it around and shove it outward, where D's edge leans down and rolls around, as contact with E230 causes it to tilt over lower and lower. Against Duo W145WD, you can clearly see that all Genbull did was grind it continually until it wobbled around and plopped over.

Hope the video helped!

Tests:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Benchmark:
Spoiler (Click to View)

MF-H Flash Orion GB145R2F vs. Reviser Reviser BD145RDF
Reviser launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, worn-ish RDF.
Orion: wins, 12/10 (All KO)
Reviser: wins, 8/20 (4 KO, 4 OS)
MF-H Flash Orion GB145R2F win rate: 60%

Wow... I was on fire today!

Vs. Stamina:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus W145WD
Beys alternated launching first. Mint WD, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Phantom Cancer W145WD
Beys alternated launching first. Mint WD, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cancer: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus 160D
Beys alternated launching first. New D, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus SA165WD
Beys alternated launching first. Mint WD, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus TH170D
Beys alternated launching first. New D, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Phantom Cancer TH170D
Beys alternated launching first. New D, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cancer: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus SR200TB
Beys alternated launching first. New TB, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 12/20 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 8/20 (All OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 60%

In all these tests, Genbull simply used E230 to grind the opponent into submission. Duo Cygnus SR200TB was a bit more difficult, but Genbull still got the job done, and its wins were by many more rotations than Duo's were.

Here's the mind-boggling one:

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus 230D
Beys alternated launching first. New D, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 12/20 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 8/20 (All OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 60%

This was Girago pushing Duo into a sort of rolling pattern, where it made wide circles around the stadium rolling on D's ridge... To get these results, you must be able to carry out the launch explained in the launch section with great consistency. 70% is achievable (as I found from informal testing), but it shouldn't be expected without practice.

I'm warning you, it's really hard, and you WILL lose to this if you can't get it right.

Observe the results when I use a normal launch:

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Duo Cygnus 230D
Beys alternated launching first. New D, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 0/10
Cygnus: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 0%

See? Ya'll gotta get dat dar launch down. XD

Vs. Defense:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. MF-H Duo Cygnus BD145CS
Beys alternated launching first. Slightly aggro CS, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Yes... I used an aggro CS intentionally. Take a look at this. Anywho, this was basically what happened with all the stamina types (save Duo 230D). E230 destabilizes, and pulls the OS easily. No problem here.

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Reviser Killerken E230RSF
Beys alternated launching first. Slightly worn RSF, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Cygnus: wins, 0/10
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 100%

Believe it or not, Genbull actually did have a bit of trouble with this at first... MB couldn't get RSF to move, so the destabilization effect was sort of reversed, and Genbull lost balance rather than Killerken. However, if I launched Genbull aggressively, no matter how I launched Killerken, Genbull kept its balance and won by a mile... IDK why, but definitely bank when you're taking on this type of thing. XD

Vs. Attack:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. MF-H Flash Orion GB145R2F
Genbull launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 14/20 (All OS)
Orion: wins, 6/20 (All KO)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 70%

THIS is why I would pick this over a normal stamina type in a battle... this thing cuts Flash down to size. Although these are actually kinda awful numbers against Flash for an E230 combo, this thing will definitely get the job done against a 4D attacker in a tournament; I've also observed that it does well against Gryph, but I don't have any formal testing for that.

Here's the not so great part:

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Wyvang Wyvang GB145R2F
Genbull launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 5/20 (All OS)
Wyvang: wins, 15/20 (14 KO, 1 OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 25%

Yah... E230 usually gets around 75-80% against Wyvang for me, but apparently not on MB.
Given that fact that Wyvang beat it so bad, I don't even wanna know what Balro would do to it.

Unfortunately, my R2F is now out of its prime from all the tests I did for this thread, so Balro tests aren't gonna happen right now... but I can almost absolutely guarantee you that it would destroy this thing based on how the E230-hindered Wyvang performed.

Based on this, I'd feel much, much safer against an attack type in a tournament with this thing than I would with any Duo stamina combo.

Vs. Dragooon:
Spoiler (Click to View)

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Wyvang Dragooon SA165R2F
Genbull launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 0/10
Dragooon: wins, 10/10 (1 KO, 9 OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 0%

I don't know why I couldn't get this to KO Genbull... it was really stubborn about going over the tornado ridge; when it got shoved it just rolled over and scraped to death instead. Go figure. XD Well, the important thing is that it lost, reeeeaaaally bad. Don't use this against left-spin attack. bad idea bro.

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Reviser Dragooon SA165EWD
Genbull launched first on all launches. New EWD, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 0/10
Dragooon: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 0%

Yah... fail.

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Reviser Dragooon SA165RDF
Genbull launched first on all launches. Worn-ish RDF, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 0/10
Dragooon: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 0%

Oooh...

Girago Genbull E230MB vs. Wyvang Dragooon BD145RDF
Genbull launched first on all launches. Worn-ish RDF, very slightly worn MB.
Genbull: wins, 0/10
Dragooon: wins, 10/10 (All OS)
Girago Genbull E230MB win rate: 0%

Ow!

Well, that was a very unflattering performance. XD This thing loses to left-spin baaaaad. However, if you consider the stuff it can out-spin in right-rotation, there's not much (if anything for that matter) that can take all that stuff down and beat Dragooon at the same time. It's kinda expected if you ask me. :\

Counters:
Spoiler (Click to View)

(MSF-H/L/F) Wyvang/Reviser/Killerke/Gargole Dragooon BD145/SA165RDF/SA165EWD
Wyvang Dragooon SA165R2F
(MSF-H) Wyvang Wyvang GB145/W145/H145 RF/R2F

This combo is pretty versatile against right-spin combos, and it's a really fun, interesting combo to use if you like to literally grind your opponent into submission. It has its advantages over certain conventional stamina types, and although it does, like all combos, have its disadvantages, I'd say that, if you know the launch right, this would be a cool pick during a stalling clause.

Thanks for reading!

Open up the "the concept" spoiler. Wink

There's been some discussion about E230's use as a destabilizer; it really does work!

Check the E230 thread for more testing and discussion Smile

Also, SP230 would probably not work as a destabilizer; E230's sliding gimmick is important to the destabilizing effect.

Threads and combos!

Spoiler (Click to View)

MacDuff · Oct. 10, 2013 11:24 PM

I feel like there are some flaws in this combo, that I believe can be fixed.
1. IIRC, Phantom is 50 grams, which is probably why it has such a hard time against Wyvang, as shown in theblackdragon's tests.

2.I can understand if Phantom was your choice, but if I had Phantom, I would have chosen something else.

In my taste, I would've chosen Genbull Girago, or maybe Killerken Dragooon, not because I don't like Phantom, but because then it would more likely be able to take out attack, stamina, and maybe even defense combos as well, and would also be immune to spin stealers. Maybe Genbull Wyvang...

I'm just sayin.

But if you want to use Phantom, then be my guest.

Threads

Like BB-46 and testing customs in it, come here:

BB-46 Balance Stadium Combo Testing Thread

Wanna know about Tornado Stallers, come here:

Tornado Stallers

Snoop Dog MS · Oct. 10, 2013 11:30 PM

Actually, these tests are amazing for a Defense Type against Wyvang. The only other thing that gets good results(ties) is Girago*2 BD145RF. Genbull Girago would get destroyed and don't get me started on Killerken Dragooon. This is a Defense combo. Just sayin.

I am your dog.
Thanks for the sig, Rock kyoya!

MacDuff · Oct. 10, 2013 11:32 PM

Where are the tests?! I obviously wasn't looking

Threads

Like BB-46 and testing customs in it, come here:

BB-46 Balance Stadium Combo Testing Thread

Wanna know about Tornado Stallers, come here:

Tornado Stallers

View All Faces · Oct. 10, 2013 11:36 PM

Look at the OP and first page Tongue_out

I didn't choose a Synchrom or Duo because Synchromes are too thick/tall, and Duo overhangs too much for my liking; also Duo can't do a thing against Stamina, since it has zero Attack.

EDIT: theblackdragon's testing gave this 40%, but he said to disregard the OSes. Thus, taking that into account, Phantom got 14/17 wins, or 82.4%.

EDIT2: Oh, and Phantom is 42.6g, plus a 3.3g Cancer wheel for a total of 45.9g.

Threads and combos!

Spoiler (Click to View)