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[Hasbro]  The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic

Nov. 11, 2019  1:53 AM
 
Does Morrigna beat Satomb/Satan?
Nov. 24, 2019  2:24 AM
 
Deleted Message
Jan. 09, 2020  5:51 AM
 
(Nov. 11, 2019  1:53 AM)Armor Wrote: Does Morrigna beat Satomb/Satan?

Yeah morringna is really good.
Feb. 08, 2020  8:41 PM
 
When I get a B-09, I am planning to do some testings on these parts for burst Classic:

Luinor L4
Dread Phoenix P4
Forneus F4
Roctavor R4
Hazard Kerbeus K4
Orichalcum O3
Salamander S4
Z Achillies A4
Feb. 08, 2020  8:46 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:41 PM)lilphilyb Wrote: After getting a B-09, I am planning to do some testings on these parts for burst Classic:

Luinor L4
Dread Phoenix P4
Forneus F4
Roctavor R4
Hazard Kerbeus K4
Orichalcum O3
Salamander S4
Z Achillies A4

It isn't a good idea to ban these in classic format. We should stick to the turbo exclusives for now.
Feb. 08, 2020  8:52 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:46 PM)#Fafnir Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:41 PM)lilphilyb Wrote: After getting a B-09, I am planning to do some testings on these parts for burst Classic:

Luinor L4
Dread Phoenix P4
Forneus F4
Roctavor R4
Hazard Kerbeus K4
Orichalcum O3
Salamander S4
Z Achillies A4

You're kidding, right? There's no way the committee would even think of allowing those parts.
Spoiler (Click to View)
I mean, performance wise, Z Achilles A4 and Salamander S4 are awful. Forneus F4 would be the only one I would consider doing testing for as it is decent for classic, although it may be too good.
Feb. 08, 2020  9:04 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:52 PM)BuilderROB Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:46 PM)#Fafnir Wrote: You're kidding, right? There's no way the committee would even think of allowing those parts.
Spoiler (Click to View)
I mean, performance wise, Z Achilles A4 and Salamander S4 are awful. Forneus F4 would be the only one I would consider doing testing for as it is decent for classic, although it may be too good.

Not one of the God/Evolution layers are allowed. Salamander is left-rotating, so that probably means it would dominate(Dragoon S and F are the only left-rotating beyblades allowed in classic at this time), and allowing just one of those would make it confusing.
Feb. 08, 2020  9:25 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:41 PM)lilphilyb Wrote: After getting a B-09, I am plnning to do some testings on these parts for burst Classic:

Luinor L4
Dread Phoenix P4
Forneus F4
Roctavor R4
Hazard Kerbeus K4
Orichalcum O3
Salamander S4
Z Achillies A4
I think this is the reason the turbo exclusives haven't been unbanned yet...
Feb. 08, 2020  9:26 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:04 PM)#Fafnir Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:52 PM)BuilderROB Wrote: I mean, performance wise, Z Achilles A4 and Salamander S4 are awful. Forneus F4 would be the only one I would consider doing testing for as it is decent for classic, although it may be too good.

Not one of the God/Evolution layers are allowed. Salamander is left-rotating, so that probably means it would dominate(Dragoon S and F are the only left-rotating beyblades allowed in classic at this time), and allowing just one of those would make it confusing.

Not really. If anything, it’s about as good as Dragoon S and F. I agree with you that they shouldn’t be allowed anyways but I am just saying.
Feb. 08, 2020  9:28 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:52 PM)BuilderROB Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:46 PM)#Fafnir Wrote: You're kidding, right? There's no way the committee would even think of allowing those parts.
Spoiler (Click to View)
I mean, performance wise, Z Achilles A4 and Salamander S4 are awful. Forneus F4 would be the only one I would consider doing testing for as it is decent for classic, although it may be too good.
Yes, but salamander is left spinning, so that wouldn't work. I want to take this whole unbanning fiasco one step at a time, so we should just work on getting the turbo exclusives unbanned first.
Feb. 08, 2020  9:28 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:26 PM)BuilderROB Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:04 PM)#Fafnir Wrote: Not one of the God/Evolution layers are allowed. Salamander is left-rotating, so that probably means it would dominate(Dragoon S and F are the only left-rotating beyblades allowed in classic at this time), and allowing just one of those would make it confusing.

Not really. If anything, it’s about as good as Dragoon S and F. I agree with you that they shouldn’t be allowed anyways but I am just saying.

I personally don't have Heat Salamander, I was just going off of the fact that it was left rotating.
Feb. 08, 2020  9:30 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:28 PM)bladekid Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  8:52 PM)BuilderROB Wrote: I mean, performance wise, Z Achilles A4 and Salamander S4 are awful. Forneus F4 would be the only one I would consider doing testing for as it is decent for classic, although it may be too good.
Yes, but salamander is left spinning, so that wouldn't work. I want to take this whole unbanning fiasco one step at a time, so we should just work on getting the turbo exclusives unbanned first.

Exactly. Tournaments allowing the Turbo layers are happening, so we will probably not have to wait too long before seeing whether or not Turbo exclusives are allowed.
Feb. 08, 2020  9:37 PM
 
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:30 PM)BuilderROB Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:28 PM)bladekid Wrote: Yes, but salamander is left spinning, so that wouldn't work. I want to take this whole unbanning fiasco one step at a time, so we should just work on getting the turbo exclusives unbanned first.

Exactly. Tournaments allowing the Turbo layers are happening, so we will probably not have to wait too long before seeing whether or not Turbo exclusives are allowed.
Yes. This is my hope. Trying to abuse the system and complicate things isn't smart right now.
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:28 PM)#Fafnir Wrote:
(Feb. 08, 2020  9:26 PM)BuilderROB Wrote: Not really. If anything, it’s about as good as Dragoon S and F. I agree with you that they shouldn’t be allowed anyways but I am just saying.

I personally don't have Heat Salamander, I was just going off of the fact that it was left rotating.
I have heat salamander and it is at least bannably better than the dragoons. I would put the dragoons around mid tier, and imo having anything better than the dragoons would be very toxic towards the classic meta. Plus, while light, it's still like 9 or 10 grams, which is too heavy for a classic bey, especially a left spin one.
Oct. 05, 2020  1:10 AM
 
Typhoon T4 can compete with Choz Valkyrie and Archer Hercules! Who agrees?
Oct. 05, 2020  1:28 AM
 
(Oct. 05, 2020  1:10 AM)SunBlader98 Wrote: Typhoon T4 can compete with Choz Valkyrie and Archer Hercules! Who agrees?

I don’t agree that it can compete at that level, but it’s definitely good.
Oct. 06, 2020  8:49 PM
 
So wait, the Hasbro Exclusives are BETTER than the actual canonical beys? Interesting...

Do they have like better attack layers or better slopes, I wanna know.
Oct. 06, 2020  9:41 PM
 
(Oct. 06, 2020  8:49 PM)kasimublue Wrote: So wait, the Hasbro Exclusives are BETTER than the actual canonical beys? Interesting...

Do they have like better attack layers or better slopes, I wanna know.
They aren't, they are in the same level. Only like a couple will even be top tier.
Oct. 06, 2020  11:29 PM
 
(Oct. 06, 2020  9:41 PM)bladekid Wrote:
(Oct. 06, 2020  8:49 PM)kasimublue Wrote: So wait, the Hasbro Exclusives are BETTER than the actual canonical beys? Interesting...

Do they have like better attack layers or better slopes, I wanna know.
They aren't, they are in the same level. Only like a couple will even be top tier.

Ohh I see.
Oct. 07, 2020  12:16 AM
 
(Oct. 06, 2020  11:29 PM)kasimublue Wrote:
(Oct. 06, 2020  9:41 PM)bladekid Wrote: They aren't, they are in the same level. Only like a couple will even be top tier.

Ohh I see.
There are a couple in question that may stay banned, but other than that it's fine
Oct. 07, 2020  1:05 AM
 
Do you think Morrigna should be allowed? It seems too good for classic for me.
Oct. 07, 2020  1:07 AM
 
(Oct. 07, 2020  1:05 AM)6Jupiter5 Wrote: Do you think Morrigna should be allowed? It seems to good for classic for me.
I would say no. Wombat said that it may be good for classic but idk.
Oct. 07, 2020  4:53 AM
 
(Oct. 07, 2020  1:07 AM)bladekid Wrote:
(Oct. 07, 2020  1:05 AM)6Jupiter5 Wrote: Do you think Morrigna should be allowed? It seems to good for classic for me.
I would say no. Wombat said that it may be good for classic but idk.

I keep going back and forth between thinking it might be okay to let in, or thinking it is better off banned. When I recently retested M4.G.Yr-S against the best attackers in Classic, with a good sliding shoot they can achieve a 70% winrate, which is pretty high considering that would probably be one of the best Stamina/Defense hybrids in Classic.

But at the same time, it does seem to overcentralize the stamina meta a bit, as its weight and Stamina are at least good enough to turn an unfavorable driver matchup into a neutral one. Not sure how the introduction of D2 and J2 changes this - I do remember doing a few rounds between M4.G.Et-S and D2.G.O but I don't remember who won, so those two could possibly keep it in check as well. I'd also want to see how something like M4 on Destroy would perform as kind of a big-boi Imperial type, since it does have some attacking power.

Overall, I think that while the spirit of the Limited Format's experimental stage might have been co-opted for Classic a bit (especially with the watchlist), the reality of the situation is that Classic isn't in an experimental stage anymore. And with the higher stakes of ranked tournaments in mind, I think that it would be better to play it safe with something like M4.

Another thing to note is that the tolerance of banworthiness is much lower in limited formats. The WBO always tries to avoid banning things in the standard format of any generation, unless as a last resort. However, in Classic or Limited, which are based on recreating eras with healthy metagames, anything that upsets that balance or tends to dominate the format has the potential to be banned.

EDIT: Actually, hey wait, hasn't RacingCheetahz hosted a few tournaments with these unbanned? How did they perform in comparison to the rest of the meta? I remember you used M4 combos in one of them, did you feel that it was too powerful?
Oct. 07, 2020  8:08 AM
 
(Oct. 07, 2020  4:53 AM)Wombat Wrote: EDIT: Actually, hey wait, hasn't RacingCheetahz hosted a few tournaments with these unbanned? How did they perform in comparison to the rest of the meta? I remember you used M4 combos in one of them, did you feel that it was too powerful?

I had felt Inconclusive about Morrigna as I felt my skills in blading well surpassed the other attendees. I have noticed some weaknesses in Morrigna in tests but I own very little Hasbro Burst so my tests are likely biased with the limited parts I have. The biggest worry combo I saw with Morrigna was on Gravity Octa due to how strangely it acted and winning by a sheer margin.

Edit: I felt the other Slingshock Exclusives fit well within the meta, none of them felt too strong, but that may have been due to the lack of knowledge on what parts to use.
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