Jan. 26, 2015 12:07 AM
Figured it was time we finally get an initial list posted, so I've gone ahead and done that! My notes and a link to the thread can be found here: http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Limited-...pid1254353
Quote:MF-H Pegasis CH120R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 90RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Pegasis: wins, 17/25 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 8/25 (1 KO, 7 OS)
MF-H Pegasis CH120R2F win rate: 68%
Quote:MF-H Pegasis CH145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II GB145RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Pegasis: wins, 8/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 12/20 (1 KO, 11 OS)
MF-H Pegasis CH145R2F win rate: 40%
Quote:MF-H Pegasis R145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II GB145RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Pegasis: wins, 12/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 8/20 (All OS)
MF-H Pegasis R145R2F win rate: 60%
Quote:MF-H Pegasis R145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 230RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Pegasis: wins, 8/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 12/20 (1 KO, 11 OS)
MF-H Pegasis R145R2F win rate: 40%
Quote:MSF-H Thief Phoenic [Crystal-Up] H145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 90RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Phoenic: wins, 13/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 7/20 (3 KO, 4 OS)
MSF-H Thief Phoenic [Crystal-Up] H145R2F win rate: 65%
Quote:MSF-H Thief Phoenic [Crystal-Up] H145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II GB145RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Phoenic: wins, 10/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 10/20 (3 KO, 7 OS)
MSF-H Thief Phoenic [Crystal-Up] H145R2F win rate: 50%
Quote:MSF-H Thief Phoenic [Crystal-Up] H145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 230RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Phoenic: wins, 12/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 8/20 (2 KO, 6 OS)
MSF-H Thief Phoenic [Crystal-Up] H145R2F win rate: 60%
Quote:MSF-H Shinobi Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 90RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Wyvang: wins, 11/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 9/20 (All OS)
MSF-H Shinobi Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145R2F win rate: 55%
Quote:MSF-H Shinobi Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II GB145RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Wyvang: wins, 12/20 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 8/20 (1 KO, 7 OS)
MSF-H Shinobi Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145R2F win rate: 60%
Quote:MSF-H Shinobi Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145R2F vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 230RB
Sagittario launched first on all launches. Prime R2F, slightly worn RB.
Wyvang: wins, 11/15 (All KO)
Sagittario: wins, 4/15 (All OS)
MSF-H Shinobi Wyvang [Crystal-Up] R145R2F win rate: 73%
Quote:Vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 90RB
1st - Pegasis (68%)
2nd - Phoenic (65%)
3rd - Wyvang (55%)
Vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II GB145RB
1st - Wyvang (65%)
2nd - Draw between Phoenic (50%) and Pegasis (average of 50%)
Vs. MF-H Earth Sagittario II 230RB
1st - Wyvang (73%)
2nd - Phoenic (60%)
3rd - Pegasis (40%)
Overall average win percentages:
1st: - Wyvang (64%)
2nd - Phoenic (58%)
3rd - Pegasis (53%)
Kei Wrote:Figured it was time we finally get an initial list posted, so I've gone ahead and done that! My notes and a link to the thread can be found here: http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Limited-...pid1254353
The Supreme One Wrote:Libra may not be suited for most stamina set-ups, but I'm still backing this one.
(Jan. 26, 2015 3:34 AM)Shido Wrote: [ -> ]I don't mean to come off sounding rude, TSO, but any specific reason why, though? We were already able to see that in mirror matches along with other Libra B:D tests that it wasn't really any good. TheBlackDragon did some W145WD testings, whereas it did successfully against Duo stamina in a mirror match.Why do I like Libra B:D? I've seen it do quite well in Limited and I've heard of this being the case in others' experiences, as well. There was a lot of talk about Dark_Mousy's success using Libra combinations (Libra B:D being one of them) at GBT2.
Honey Wrote:~•~big quote~•~Wow, those tests were sad..
(Jan. 29, 2015 10:12 PM)Honey Wrote: [ -> ]Here are some Thief Phoenic (Crystal Mode Up) H145R2F tests I got done. (Click to View)
Bakushin Leone 100RSF versus Thief Phoenic H145R2F
Both bottoms mint. Bakushin Leone launched first all matches.
Thief Phoenic: 8/30 (ALL KO) 27% Win Rate.
Bakushin Leone: 22/30 (16 OS, 6 KO) 73% Win Rate.
Phoenic did very poorly these matches. It had a lot of recoil, causing Bakushin to get KO's off of it; 5 of the 6 of them that happened were because of it. I did notice that it provided a bit of smash, but even still, it's not the smartest of options for attack when against LTDC; not saying attack should ever be the option against defense, though.
Earth Leone GB145RSF versus Thief Phoenic H145R2F
Both bottoms mint. Earth Leone launched first all matches.
Thief Phoenic: 5/30 (ALL KO) 17% Win Rate.
Earth Leone: 25/30 (22 OS, 3 KO) 83% Win Rate.
Note 2 of the 3 of Earth Leone were caused by Phoenic's recoil.
Libra 230RSF versus Thief Phoenic H145R2F
Both bottoms mint. Libra launched first all matches.
Thief Phoenic: 9/30 (ALL KO) 30% Win Rate.
Libra: 21/30 (19 OS, 2 KO) 70% Win Rate.
Note Libra's KO's weren't out of Phoenic's recoil.
Overall, Thief Phoenic-based attack definitely isn't the greatest; it's interesting, not tier-list worthy, though. May I ask, why do you like it so much, @[TheBlackDragon], like have you ever had tournament experience with one? I think you too can agree that it's not the best of choices, seeing as we have safer, already known-to-do-well options.
Time Wrote:May I ask why you used a 2-sided track on a 3 sided wheel? Also, if I remember correctly wasn't the proper height for thief phoenic 130ish?
(Jan. 29, 2015 10:29 PM)Time Wrote: [ -> ](Jan. 29, 2015 10:12 PM)Honey Wrote: [ -> ]Here are some Thief Phoenic (Crystal Mode Up) H145R2F tests I got done. (Click to View)
Bakushin Leone 100RSF versus Thief Phoenic H145R2F
Both bottoms mint. Bakushin Leone launched first all matches.
Thief Phoenic: 8/30 (ALL KO) 27% Win Rate.
Bakushin Leone: 22/30 (16 OS, 6 KO) 73% Win Rate.
Phoenic did very poorly these matches. It had a lot of recoil, causing Bakushin to get KO's off of it; 5 of the 6 of them that happened were because of it. I did notice that it provided a bit of smash, but even still, it's not the smartest of options for attack when against LTDC; not saying attack should ever be the option against defense, though.
Earth Leone GB145RSF versus Thief Phoenic H145R2F
Both bottoms mint. Earth Leone launched first all matches.
Thief Phoenic: 5/30 (ALL KO) 17% Win Rate.
Earth Leone: 25/30 (22 OS, 3 KO) 83% Win Rate.
Note 2 of the 3 of Earth Leone were caused by Phoenic's recoil.
Libra 230RSF versus Thief Phoenic H145R2F
Both bottoms mint. Libra launched first all matches.
Thief Phoenic: 9/30 (ALL KO) 30% Win Rate.
Libra: 21/30 (19 OS, 2 KO) 70% Win Rate.
Note Libra's KO's weren't out of Phoenic's recoil.
Overall, Thief Phoenic-based attack definitely isn't the greatest; it's interesting, not tier-list worthy, though. May I ask, why do you like it so much, @[TheBlackDragon], like have you ever had tournament experience with one? I think you too can agree that it's not the best of choices, seeing as we have safer, already known-to-do-well options.
May I ask why you used a 2-sided track on a 3 sided wheel? Also, if I remember correctly wasn't the proper height for thief phoenic 130ish?
(Jan. 29, 2015 10:26 PM)UW Officer Wrote: [ -> ]I was playing around yesterday with combos (and remember that my stadium is not a real Takara Tomy stadium) and I thought I would make a left spin variation of W145 WD: LW160 WD. I used Ronin Genbull/ Killerken LW160 WD vs Omega Kerbecs R145 RF/ R2F. The Killerken variation was better to stadium outs, but I don't have a MSF to try it out with... I think some testing may be able to determine possibly? Even if I could test in a legal stadium, my LW160 is real beat up from Omega...
(Jan. 29, 2015 11:03 PM)Honey Wrote: [ -> ]Not to go off-topic, but relating to Bakushin, have Bakushin RF tests actually been conducted by anyone? I believe we had Kaneki's opinion it (which shouldn't mean much because he didn't actually own the parts) and maybe some of his fakes with them that I don't know of, but, what else of it, realistically? I happen to like RF-based defense and don't see why it shouldn't be up there, but even so .. still?
(Jan. 30, 2015 5:47 AM)Wombat Wrote: [ -> ](Jan. 29, 2015 10:26 PM)UW Officer Wrote: [ -> ]I was playing around yesterday with combos (and remember that my stadium is not a real Takara Tomy stadium) and I thought I would make a left spin variation of W145 WD: LW160 WD. I used Ronin Genbull/ Killerken LW160 WD vs Omega Kerbecs R145 RF/ R2F. The Killerken variation was better to stadium outs, but I don't have a MSF to try it out with... I think some testing may be able to determine possibly? Even if I could test in a legal stadium, my LW160 is real beat up from Omega...
If you have a PD, try using that instead of WD. I know Ingulit found that PD is the best tip for 160, but I'm not so sure about LW160. Maybe EWD instead, because most left-spinning things are going to be spin-equalizing?
(Jan. 29, 2015 10:12 PM)Honey Wrote: [ -> ]May I ask, why do you like it so much, TheBlackDragon, like have you ever had tournament experience with one? I think you too can agree that it's not the best of choices, seeing as we have safer, already known-to-do-well options.
(Jan. 30, 2015 9:17 PM)Leone19 Wrote: [ -> ](Jan. 30, 2015 5:47 AM)Wombat Wrote: [ -> ](Jan. 29, 2015 10:26 PM)UW Officer Wrote: [ -> ]I was playing around yesterday with combos (and remember that my stadium is not a real Takara Tomy stadium) and I thought I would make a left spin variation of W145 WD: LW160 WD. I used Ronin Genbull/ Killerken LW160 WD vs Omega Kerbecs R145 RF/ R2F. The Killerken variation was better to stadium outs, but I don't have a MSF to try it out with... I think some testing may be able to determine possibly? Even if I could test in a legal stadium, my LW160 is real beat up from Omega...
If you have a PD, try using that instead of WD. I know Ingulit found that PD is the best tip for 160, but I'm not so sure about LW160. Maybe EWD instead, because most left-spinning things are going to be spin-equalizing?
Yeah, if it was for Spin Steal EWD is the best option, for sure (over WD and PD).
(Jan. 31, 2015 12:16 AM)UW Officer Wrote: [ -> ](Jan. 30, 2015 9:17 PM)Leone19 Wrote: [ -> ](Jan. 30, 2015 5:47 AM)Wombat Wrote: [ -> ]If you have a PD, try using that instead of WD. I know Ingulit found that PD is the best tip for 160, but I'm not so sure about LW160. Maybe EWD instead, because most left-spinning things are going to be spin-equalizing?
Yeah, if it was for Spin Steal EWD is the best option, for sure (over WD and PD).
So, MSF Ronin Killerken/Genbull LW160 EWD would be a decent combo? The point for this combo is to be stamina based and for spin equalizing; left spin opposite of Earth ___ W145 WD. Now, for the big question (which is probably a no): possibly top tier?
(Jan. 31, 2015 3:25 AM)The Supreme One Wrote: [ -> ]L-Drago Guardian/Destructor is pretty sucky for spin steal. Meteo is really your best bet for Limited, period. I've tried Dark Night for stamina before and I wasn't a huge fan, but my experience is Limited ("Oops... I Did It Again")
(Jan. 31, 2015 3:50 AM)loyd87 Wrote: [ -> ](MSF/L)ronin zirago/killerken/genbull B: D chrystal up as good spin stealLast time I tried this combo it was way to light and got banged around the stadium so easily even by non attack types. I didn't like it at all.
(Jan. 31, 2015 3:45 PM)|BeyBouncer| Wrote: [ -> ]Hum yeah, but, this combo can face F230(G)CF combinations without losing... I think it definetly need more official testings.