Have to disagee with you here Bluezee. Even though i do love you and Completely understand where you are coming from But. I agree with Cye. I believe Tier Beats skill. Or Old Top Tier beys and Very good Not Toptier beys.

Skill and launch are Important Factors but I believe it's the beyblade that does it.

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Credit to Omega.
UniquE - Professional Beyblade team located in Melbourne.

Spoiler (Click to View)

I'd say that i have a equation(s)...
Skill+tier=
No skill +tier=
Skill+tier=
Skill is used to perfectly use a tier. With no skill a tier is useless, and skill needs a tier to completely use it to perfection. Ive laid down my two cents.

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I'm Batman.

I never said tier beats skill. It's not black and white like that.

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Credit for the avatar and sig go to Nic. THANK YOU!

START LIVING BEFORE YOU START DYING

Either is mine. I said (Or meant) That I think Tier Matters more than Skill Not by a Huge Margin but I still think that.

Shame there is Not really any testing we Can do to Prove anything on This Topic.

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Credit to Omega.
UniquE - Professional Beyblade team located in Melbourne.

Spoiler (Click to View)

Couldn't a person have skill and strategy both. I believe that it is possible to have both.

Shame there is Not really any testing we Can do to Prove anything on This Topic.

Except what I posted just a few posts above ? Of course it could be a combination of skills and top-tier customizations, but obviously top-tier does not mean nothing.

I am really wording my things bad today.

There is testing But Its a sort of Delicate and Hard thing to Test.

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Credit to Omega.
UniquE - Professional Beyblade team located in Melbourne.

Spoiler (Click to View)

The whole social sciences rely on statistics like these ...

OK. Its not that Important. I juts think Its harder to test This than say Testing a Combo.

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Credit to Omega.
UniquE - Professional Beyblade team located in Melbourne.

Spoiler (Click to View)

to be fair the only unorthodox part is M145.

It is also the most vital piece of the combo and the reason why it works.

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If that's the case then how come all the other parts are well known for attack?

Surely their attack properties also contribute to the combo's success.

M145 would add weight, and an erratic nature to it's movement.

[quote='Cye Kinomiya' pid='564531' dateline='1299088367']
Then how come you didn't win Battle of the Boroughs 2?

I can vouch for her and say if she had not lost to ikmv with a combo that got stuck under the track, I am absolutely sure she would have been facing me in the final match of the tournament. Also, as far as I know, she used the combo only once and it destroyed the opposition with ease. That top-tier combo looked like trash when it went up against hers. The final match could have gone either way with us especially considering we both had other combos up our sleeves. I didnt use my usual test combo any more than once in the tournament which was against ikmv in the semi-finals even though that one just gives me easy wins. I was actually planning to use my others for a change.

i get that you can make great combos/have god like launches that are always gattyakis/sliding shoots etc, but can't you see how you come off as conceited?

I mean, to argue that "No, I am so good at launching I can defeat anything with my combo as it is designed to defeat everything" isn't exactly a legitimate argument without statistics and results.

Not to mention your unfounded hate of top tier combos as though they're "trash".

Can't you see that in the end of the day, if your opponent stopped to think for even one second, it's pretty simple to avoid any of your gattyakis, and if they saw a few of your matches, your secret combo could probably be countered with an appropriate top tier combo.

But wait, it's designed to defeat everything.

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to be fair the only unorthodox part is M145.

It is also the most vital piece of the combo and the reason why it works.

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If that's the case then how come all the other parts are well known for attack?

Surely their attack properties also contribute to the combo's success.

M145 would add weight, and an erratic nature to it's movement.

[quote='Cye Kinomiya' pid='564531' dateline='1299088367']
Then how come you didn't win Battle of the Boroughs 2?

I can vouch for her and say if she had not lost to ikmv with a combo that got stuck under the track, I am absolutely sure she would have been facing me in the final match of the tournament. Also, as far as I know, she used the combo only once and it destroyed the opposition with ease. That top-tier combo looked like trash when it went up against hers. The final match could have gone either way with us especially considering we both had other combos up our sleeves. I didnt use my usual test combo any more than once in the tournament which was against ikmv in the semi-finals even though that one just gives me easy wins. I was actually planning to use my others for a change.

i get that you can make great combos/have god like launches that are always gattyakis/sliding shoots etc, but can't you see how you come off as conceited?

I mean, to argue that "No, I am so good at launching I can defeat anything with my combo as it is designed to defeat everything" isn't exactly a legitimate argument without statistics and results.

Not to mention your unfounded hate of top tier combos as though they're "trash".

Can't you see that in the end of the day, if your opponent stopped to think for even one second, it's pretty simple to avoid any of your gattyakis, and if they saw a few of your matches, your secret combo could probably be countered with an appropriate top tier combo.

But wait, it's designed to defeat everything.

CLEARLY, you did not pay attention to ANYTHING I said. I did not say I hate top-tier combos and I did not say they are trash. I said the combo made it look like trash. Also, I am not the one who mainly uses gattayaki. In fact, I just launch my own way. You would know that if you read. At the end of the day, the whole "create a top tier combo to kill mine" thing makes no sense. How do you know I actually do not use a top-tier myself that is supposedly outclassed without my launch? You really shouldnt speak as if you know anything when you clearly misread everything. The combo I was speaking of was not mine. Also, I have results. I posted mine. In fact, I have a whole thread on it FYI.

As for the conceited part, I could care less what anyone thinks. Anyone who knows me knows who I am and know why I am the way I am. People tend to throw around the word conceited when someone speaks of their accomplishments and abilities. In fact, I would say I am quite humble. I dont go around saying, "I'm so much better than x, y, and z because I have such an amazing launch and skill." I could do that. But I do not because thats not me.

So I suppose the "It's designed to counter all top tiers" and other such lines are completely humble?

In the end of the day, you launch, and that's the end of it.

The skill needed for this game could be learnt in a week if someone kept at it.

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So I suppose the "It's designed to counter all top tiers" and other such lines are completely humble?

In the end of the day, you launch, and that's the end of it.

The skill needed for this game could be learnt in a week if someone kept at it.

Did I not just say the combo is not mine and I am not the person who said that? Again, you have not read. Maybe you should come see for yourself and stop trying to downplay something that you have never experienced for yourself.

there's something i would like to say.
this isnt related to the posts above me.

combos such as the one that was MF rock bull m145 es can beat a specific combo.
lets just say it can beat burn bull 145 wd.
but it can only do that if you know exactly what you're facing.
it could be completely destroyed by all other combos.

so, the other person(mf rock bull m145 es) starts laying down the law; pulls out some deception.
now they make the rules(not literally) and they're in control.
they use the combo, and win.

but what if the you aren't an idiot.
here: bam, the other person(mf rock bull m145 es) is trying to decieve. you see him/her waiting a tiny bit, so you decide to do the same, so you dont get stuck in a bad situation. bam, stalling clause. now the other person(mf rock bull m145 es) is in a pickle. they have no clue what the other person will use. huge odds are for the you.

so combos like that MF rock bull m145 es are a two way street.
you could screw over the opponent, or get screwed over.

there's something i would like to say.
this isnt related to the posts above me.

combos such as the one that was MF rock bull m145 es can beat a specific combo.
lets just say it can beat burn bull 145 wd.
but it can only do that if you know exactly what you're facing.
it could be completely destroyed by all other combos.

so, the other person(mf rock bull m145 es) starts laying down the law; pulls out some deception.
now they make the rules(not literally) and they're in control.
they use the combo, and win.

but what if the you aren't an idiot.
here: bam, the other person(mf rock bull m145 es) is trying to decieve. you see him/her waiting a tiny bit, so you decide to do the same, so you dont get stuck in a bad situation. bam, stalling clause. now the other person(mf rock bull m145 es) is in a pickle. they have no clue what the other person will use. huge odds are for the you.

so combos like that MF rock bull m145 es are a two way street.
you could screw over the opponent, or get screwed over.

Very good observation. I also noticed this at the last tournament in NY. However, with great gattayaki skills, it should KO the opponent quite easily but it is as you said, a double edged sword.

yep, buts not just assume that the other person has no launching technique

yep, buts not just assume that the other person has no launching technique

Well at that point, its still anyone's game. The momentum M145 creates and the force of the Rock wheel alone could make the battle go any way.

i think i have come to the conclusion where as a person-person with an equal amount of skill but a different bey
the top tier would win
but really skilled bladers would obviously win against a person using a top tier
so it depends on both skill and tier
what matters more?
neither
proof?
get 2 people to launch at the same time with the same bey and the same power
what wins? most of them would be ties but 1 of them would win eventually (duh) it all comes down to (don't know how to say it but maybe luck) it all comes down to luck
i mean seriously beyblade isn't ALL about logic
Edit: more proof with top tier
top tiers are named top tier when they beat a top tier combo but does that make it automatically good? NO because it beat THAT top tier combo and i bet there are a whole bunch of other top tier it can't beat

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signture was too large.read the rules
and that's what happens when your sig is too big

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Click my sig. it won't bite

i'm awesome

yes i am

So I suppose the "It's designed to counter all top tiers" and other such lines are completely humble?

In the end of the day, you launch, and that's the end of it.

The skill needed for this game could be learnt in a week if someone kept at it.

Did I not just say the combo is not mine and I am not the person who said that? Again, you have not read. Maybe you should come see for yourself and stop trying to downplay something that you have never experienced for yourself.

I'm not attempting to downplay your skill, or anyone's for that matter.

It's simply odd to hear someone simply has a combo, NOT YOURS, that counters all top tiers, etc.

It seems you think I have no skills either, hence why I don't believe yours.

But to be honest, I feel I'm in the same situation as you are, except in Sydney.

It's obvious I'm not a bad blader.

And yes, I will book a plane ticket to prove a point about a spinning top game.

Seriously, didn't expect that sort of challenge from a senior member.

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IMHO, every part in beyblading is a sharpened 2-edged sword, it will win or lose, eg my Flame Cancer 130 WD, not everyone trust the tests and uses that combo, only a few of my friends use it. thus any part is a 2 edged sword, IMHO ok, IMHO and i also think that Bull + LTC is bad i think cancer would be better

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||Avatar is a gift not my own work||
||DeviantArt||

IMHO Lol.... Before skill or tier its confidence,if you go in a match nervous hands shaking and not confident in your self your skills or your bey you have no chance of winning. Its like yugioh i've been to so many tournaments and i lost matchs cause i wasnt confident in my deck i was scared to play cards second guessing my moves and my skill but when i was confident in my deck i got the right cards made the right moves and won tournaments so in my opinion its confidents then skill then tier.

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There are no pacts between lions and men

I say skill is more important. Say you have an almost unattainable amout of skill and you can predict exactly where your beyblade will go through math equasions. Then you can make your bey go where you want, when you want it. The only other factor is where the other bey is. Say you are against a stamina combo and you have a midnight based combo. If you have enough skill and launch power you could possibly use midnight`s slopes to use upper attack for an easy win. If you have enough skill I believe that you can make parts that seem like trash beat top tiers. BeyBlade is really more logic based in my eyes.

Why is everyone ignoring the fact that top-tier combinations have made people win almost all of our tournaments, hah ? Of course skill must be mixed with those, but nobody won a tournament with a completely unorthodox customization. People's top-tier combinations might have lost once to one, but essentially it made them win the whole tournament, which is better than focusing on just one battle.

people are just trying to make out this game to be more complicated than it really is.

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http://www.youtube.com/standupthevanguard

It's the blading spirit ~_~
Kidding aside, I think Beyblading is Skill+Customization anyway with a small % of luck