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Ray as a Destabilzer

Dec. 29, 2010  8:54 PM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:52 PM)Flame Lion Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:46 PM)Evan Wrote: I've been reading the topic, and I couldn't find a definitive reason why it needs speed. I see your point now, but I still see stamina based destabilzers as a good option. I'm not insisting anything, I'm asking questions and doing tests....


i did tests too... in that topic..

if you use WD or SD it´s not a destabilizer!it´s stamina.. Ray Pegasis 100WD = Stamina Combo

destabilizer have movement tests and videos had been posted so don´t try to change that

You are missing my point. A destabilzer DESTABILZES the opponent. I'm getting good results with a stationary tip. Why are you so bent on destroying this? I would not be using Ray as a standard stamina wheel, it'd be destroyed quickly.....

I'm not testing this as a stamina combo. That would be pointless...
Dec. 29, 2010  9:01 PM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:54 PM)Evan Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:52 PM)Flame Lion Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:46 PM)Evan Wrote: I've been reading the topic, and I couldn't find a definitive reason why it needs speed. I see your point now, but I still see stamina based destabilzers as a good option. I'm not insisting anything, I'm asking questions and doing tests....


i did tests too... in that topic..

if you use WD or SD it´s not a destabilizer!it´s stamina.. Ray Pegasis 100WD = Stamina Combo

destabilizer have movement tests and videos had been posted so don´t try to change that

You are missing my point. A destabilzer DESTABILZES the opponent. I'm getting good results with a stationary tip. Why are you so bent on destroying this? I would not be using Ray as a standard stamina wheel, it'd be destroyed quickly.....

I'm not testing this as a stamina combo. That would be pointless...

put this in your head please:
a destabilizer it´s an attack/stamina combo.. soo to have attack he need to have an attack movement..

also i don´t want to destroy anything.. i believe that Ray maybe have a good perform destabilizing even though that Flame it´s better.. but you need to use SF or WB as i quote on other thread before.. WB has stamina and attack movement so maybe a good choice i posted tests with WB on the other topic..
Dec. 29, 2010  9:25 PM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  9:01 PM)Flame Lion Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:54 PM)Evan Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:52 PM)Flame Lion Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:46 PM)Evan Wrote: I've been reading the topic, and I couldn't find a definitive reason why it needs speed. I see your point now, but I still see stamina based destabilzers as a good option. I'm not insisting anything, I'm asking questions and doing tests....


i did tests too... in that topic..

if you use WD or SD it´s not a destabilizer!it´s stamina.. Ray Pegasis 100WD = Stamina Combo

destabilizer have movement tests and videos had been posted so don´t try to change that

You are missing my point. A destabilzer DESTABILZES the opponent. I'm getting good results with a stationary tip. Why are you so bent on destroying this? I would not be using Ray as a standard stamina wheel, it'd be destroyed quickly.....

I'm not testing this as a stamina combo. That would be pointless...

put this in your head please:
a destabilizer it´s an attack/stamina combo.. soo to have attack he need to have an attack movement..

also i don´t want to destroy anything.. i believe that Ray maybe have a good perform destabilizing even though that Flame it´s better.. but you need to use SF or WB as i quote on other thread before.. WB has stamina and attack movement so maybe a good choice i posted tests with WB on the other topic..

I'll say this now and only once. Evan's combo is a destabilizer. This means that it DESTABILIZES. That is its specialty. Whether it is on SF, RF, CS, WB, or whatever, its purpose is to simply destabilize. He did not say it was a stamina, attack, or defense type. He wants to destabilize the opponent's beyblade by ANY means necessary.
Dec. 29, 2010  9:28 PM
 
of course sd outspins an rsf based defense combo, these results are useless
tbh its pretty sad it lost at all
Dec. 29, 2010  9:29 PM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  9:25 PM)Bluezee Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  9:01 PM)Flame Lion Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:54 PM)Evan Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:52 PM)Flame Lion Wrote:
(Dec. 29, 2010  8:46 PM)Evan Wrote: I've been reading the topic, and I couldn't find a definitive reason why it needs speed. I see your point now, but I still see stamina based destabilzers as a good option. I'm not insisting anything, I'm asking questions and doing tests....


i did tests too... in that topic..

if you use WD or SD it´s not a destabilizer!it´s stamina.. Ray Pegasis 100WD = Stamina Combo

destabilizer have movement tests and videos had been posted so don´t try to change that

You are missing my point. A destabilzer DESTABILZES the opponent. I'm getting good results with a stationary tip. Why are you so bent on destroying this? I would not be using Ray as a standard stamina wheel, it'd be destroyed quickly.....

I'm not testing this as a stamina combo. That would be pointless...

put this in your head please:
a destabilizer it´s an attack/stamina combo.. soo to have attack he need to have an attack movement..

also i don´t want to destroy anything.. i believe that Ray maybe have a good perform destabilizing even though that Flame it´s better.. but you need to use SF or WB as i quote on other thread before.. WB has stamina and attack movement so maybe a good choice i posted tests with WB on the other topic..

I'll say this now and only once. Evan's combo is a destabilizer. This means that it DESTABILIZES. That is its specialty. Whether it is on SF, RF, CS, WB, or whatever, its purpose is to simply destabilize. He did not say it was a stamina, attack, or defense type. He wants to destabilize the opponent's beyblade by ANY means necessary.


with WD? no it´s not sorry.. but to destabilize he needs an attack move to hit with more strenght the track.. a performance tip makes a hugee difference..
Dec. 29, 2010  11:14 PM
 
Maybe it is destabilizing the other blade and maybe it's not. But one thing is for sure and that is that you put it on a stamina bottom so it's no surprise that the one with a rubber bottom lost....
Dec. 29, 2010  11:17 PM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  11:14 PM)Ultrablader Wrote: Maybe it is destabilizing the other blade and maybe it's not. But one thing is for sure and that is that you put it on a stamina bottom so it's no surprise that the one with a rubber bottom lost....

A destabilizer is meant to take down defense types. Then why on earth would I change from a top tier defense tip?

A destabilizer does not need attack to destabilize. It needs to get under the wheel of the other bey.

I will do whatever tests you wish to see, so long as I have the parts. So, what then, should I be testing against?


(Dec. 29, 2010  9:28 PM)Mc Frown Wrote: of course sd outspins an rsf based defense combo, these results are useless
tbh its pretty sad it lost at all

The times SD or WD lost was when no contact was made, so your point is moot. These combos are winning because of their destabilization, not their stamina.
Dec. 29, 2010  11:23 PM
 
Try beating a top tier stamina bey with your 'destabilizer'.
It's not really an accomplishment or a testament to the strength of a stamina combo if it can beat a rubber tipped defense type. The fact that you didn't get 100%'s across the board is pitiful.
Dec. 29, 2010  11:26 PM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  11:23 PM)Mc Frown Wrote: Try beating a top tier stamina bey with your 'destabilizer'.
It's not really an accomplishment or a testament to the strength of a stamina combo if it can beat a rubber tipped defense type. The fact that you didn't get 100%'s across the board is pitiful.

.....did you not understand what I just said. These are not pure-stamina combos, and if they are tested as such they will fail. They are meant as a counter to the nearly immovable MF Earth (2) Bull C145 RSF. I know that against a top tier stamina such as Earth Bull 145WD, they will lose. That's not the point I'm trying to get across.
Dec. 30, 2010  12:14 AM
 
A destabilizer needs speed which you don't get from a stamina bottom. The only bottom which is used for destabilizers atm is SF so use that.
Dec. 30, 2010  12:15 AM
 
Evan: =/ I don't understand what you're saying... An obvious "counter" to a defence type is a pure stamina type. Any good/decent stamina type will win against MF Earth Bull GB145 RSF.

If it doesn't get high win rates against other defence combos and stamina combos, all it is is a mediocre stamina combo.
Dec. 30, 2010  12:30 AM
 
UltraBlader WF works well in MF L-Drago 90WF...
----------------------------------------------------------


KK, at my friends place, some testing...

Flywheel Vs. Destabilizer

Metal Face Light (Metal Ring, Plastic Core) Burn Bull AD145WD vs Metal Face Feather (All Plastic) Ray Cancer 85WD (No SF as well, sorry)

Pics: No video /:

Beylauncher LR Used for Both
MINT WDs
Most Parts from BB-96
MFB Attack Stadium
Draws Redone (If there was any)
10 Rounds
Ray Mold 2
Alternating Shots starting w/ Burn

Ray WR:
Ray [0] OS
Ray [5] KO
-------------
Bull WR:
Bull OS [5]
Bull KO [2]

Pretty self evident. You really dont tend to use flywheels as the wobbling at such an angle exposes the track... Ray scored a few KOs and the recoil of the wheel gave Bull a KO aswell. Ray suffered from a few floor scrapes towards the end of the battle which was what really gave Bull the win, but also wobbling at 145 height. Most of the time, Ray pushed Bull into either the ridge or into one of the wall things, then lose a considerable amount of stamina. The first two hits were always strong, like Nojo? stated. I can do tests in a Hasbro stadium to avoid KO, which really shouldn't happen. These results aren't as good as MF L-Drago 90WF (Which I still need a WF) but its a pretty decent wheel for the aformentioned.

Hmm.

I forget to mention, banking used for both and whenever Ray made contact with the floor, it got under Bull really well, but not enought to outspin it, as it made a severe loss of stamina. Rays KOs where also due to Burns recoil aswell...

Let us all note that had I used 230, Ray wouldnt have stood a chance Uncertain
Dec. 30, 2010  12:37 AM
 
(Dec. 29, 2010  11:26 PM)Evan Wrote: They are meant as a counter to the nearly immovable MF Earth (2) Bull C145 RSF.

First of all thats a lame Defense combo.
But yeah, why not just use a pure Stamina type then? You would do the exact same thing except a helluva lot more consistently.

Bluezee Wrote:I'll say this now and only once. Evan's combo is a destabilizer. This means that it DESTABILIZES. That is its specialty. Whether it is on SF, RF, CS, WB, or whatever, its purpose is to simply destabilize. He did not say it was a stamina, attack, or defense type. He wants to destabilize the opponent's beyblade by ANY means necessary.
Then this combo/this thread is completely pointless, as you might as well just use a pure Stamina combo and manage a perfect win rate.
Dec. 30, 2010  12:41 AM
 
You want an immovable object?

MF-H Libra 230RS
Dec. 30, 2010  12:47 AM
 
You mean Basalt.. I think Libra has gotten to be extremely overrated, exactly like Quetzalcoatl..
Dec. 30, 2010  12:48 AM
 
Meh, its till acheives a near perfect win rate against Vulcan and LL-Drago...

Just to say Basalt is that heavy, what if its not a flywheel?
Dec. 30, 2010  12:54 AM
 
On 230.. That is not surprising, Earth does extremely well too. Did you even try CH120RF Drago? I think it would improve the results a bit especially since it is versatile height-wise.
Dec. 30, 2010  12:57 AM
 
Ha see evan. Littlechipz's(I refuse to call you my name) results would have been better if he had used sf or another plastic attack bottom.
Dec. 30, 2010  1:00 AM
 
Alright I give up.

I love how I start a topic about destabilization and all I get is everyone saying I'm using the wrong bottom. I'm not here to test out SF, obviously we know this a good destabilization bottom. If I had SF, I'd use it. I don't, so I tried some other bottoms and still got good results. I was here to try and find a second destabilizing wheel, but obviously everyone is more interested in getting me to use a standard stamina combo or telling me how mediocre my defense combo is. I'm gonna leave the testing to you "experts".

Now please, someone with SF test Ray Cancer 100SF and Flame Cancer 100SF and post the results. I'd like to see how viable Ray really is as a destabilizer, since my tests can't be used.
Dec. 30, 2010  1:03 AM
 
Indeed, i'm thinking of proposing CS as a destabilizer bottom on 90 or 85 tracks. CS is pretty tall though, the only viable option would be 85...

This seems to be off-topic, but I seem to get better results with RSF rather than RS. You see, at the start the opposition only manages to knock it around, and when its sent into the tornado ridge it circles the stadium on the semi part. The attack custom doesnt have enoi=ugh speed to continue...

But tests are test, RS works alot better...
Dec. 30, 2010  1:07 AM
 
It does a very good job of destabilizing with Vulcan, that I can assure you of. I might help you along the way, Chipz. By the way, isn't 'your' signature actually belonging to someone else? :V
Dec. 30, 2010  1:21 AM
 
Yeah a little off-topic, but I PM'd megablader9 he said its ok, its just so I can Iceburn ultrablader before Megablader9

Hard as it is to admit, I dont have a 100 track, only 90 and 85 o_0

All my 100 tracks dont work properly, no facebolt screws in...

Im getting a WF soon I can test with that...
Dec. 30, 2010  2:29 AM
 
(Dec. 30, 2010  1:00 AM)Evan Wrote: Alright I give up.

I love how I start a topic about destabilization and all I get is everyone saying I'm using the wrong bottom. I'm not here to test out SF, obviously we know this a good destabilization bottom. If I had SF, I'd use it. I don't, so I tried some other bottoms and still got good results. I was here to try and find a second destabilizing wheel, but obviously everyone is more interested in getting me to use a standard stamina combo or telling me how mediocre my defense combo is. I'm gonna leave the testing to you "experts".

Now please, someone with SF test Ray Cancer 100SF and Flame Cancer 100SF and post the results. I'd like to see how viable Ray really is as a destabilizer, since my tests can't be used.

Few things:
1) The only reason it won is because you used a stamina bottom vs a rubber bottom end of. If you tested it against a WB defence combo then you would have seen it's lesser ability.
2) Only MC Frown said your defence combo was bad and that's cause he has a vendetta with C145
3) Any plastic attack bottom can be used for destabilizers. There's tons to chose from. Apparantly WB even works too. So you could still do some worth while testing.

Not trying to beat your opinions down or anything just informing you where you went wrong.
Dec. 30, 2010  5:24 AM
 
(Dec. 30, 2010  1:21 AM)Ultrablader9 Wrote: All my 100 tracks dont work properly, no facebolt screws in...

Off Topic: Thats exactly what happens to my 100 tracks.

On Topic: Noting some of the developments in "destabalizers" someone should test ray on bottoms different than the standard. Maybe on WD of even SD...
Dec. 30, 2010  7:02 AM
 
Wait, in his results he has both a WD and SD, perhaps at the very least Evan could use SD in his defence combo o_0
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