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MF-L Phantom (Attack) Cygnus 85MF - A Combo Revisted

Aug. 15, 2013  3:20 AM
 
I have always been a fan of this custom, as well as other variations, glad to see that it still holds up against top tiers. It is kind of neat that Lower Track's are starting to make a return in terms of testing anyways, not sure if anyone has used them in succession in any tournaments recently.

Cake, have you tried 90 and 100 with MF or 85 and 90 with CF? Curious to see how much of a difference the heights make.
Aug. 15, 2013  3:26 AM
 
I remember him saying he preferred 105 cf over this iirc. And it's in his sig as well.
Aug. 15, 2013  11:43 PM
 
Anything lower than 100 is so low Phantom scrapes before CF's disk touches the ground... otherwise I would be using a lower track. Plus I have a 100 whose color matches Phantom's core quite nicely XD

Using MF on a slightly taller track is OK, but higher tracks make this combo more recoil-y and gives it more Attack power, which works nicely on the wider, more aggressive CF.

Btw this combo helped me place at a tournament; it decimated GuardianRevizer's Revizer Dragoon SA165RDF, but it lost to Shining God MS's somethin Dragoon SA165R2F. It managed to avoid Dragoon on the first round, and won, but got KOed three times afterwards. Unhappy It also took down some other random Defense combos.
Aug. 16, 2013  3:19 AM
 
My combo was Shinobus amazing combo. Wyvang Dragoon SA165R2F
Aug. 16, 2013  3:42 PM
 
(Aug. 15, 2013  11:43 PM)Cake Wrote: Btw this combo helped me place at a tournament; it decimated GuardianRevizer's Revizer Dragoon SA165RDF.

Who in the what now took down which guys what?? Wut!?

Do you mean Phantom CF or MF?
Aug. 16, 2013  5:04 PM
 
Don't be surprised, I've done it too lol. I also like CF more, but I use a different combo ;3
Aug. 16, 2013  9:15 PM
 
I used the exact combo in my sig, MF Phantom Cancer 100CF.
Aug. 16, 2013  9:50 PM
 
Would 85 Really Be The Best Choice? I Agree With Cake Any Thing Lower Than 100 Wouldn't Do To Well. Especially In A Zero-G Stadium.
Aug. 16, 2013  10:16 PM
 
(Aug. 16, 2013  9:15 PM)Cake Wrote: I used the exact combo in my sig, MF Phantom Cancer 100CF.

Oooooooohhhhhh... Tongue_out I thought you used MF XD That makes waaay more sense...
Aug. 17, 2013  2:07 AM
 
(Aug. 16, 2013  9:50 PM)MidnightLWBO Wrote: Would 85 Really Be The Best Choice? I Agree With Cake Any Thing Lower Than 100 Wouldn't Do To Well. Especially In A Zero-G Stadium.

First off, caps spamm. AAAAGHHH
Second, anything below 145 dies in Zero-G, no questions asked. 85 is the better choice with MF, 100 is necessary for CF.

Btw, @theblackdragon:
I bet 85MF could beat Dragoon RDF... RDF has already been shown to have poor Stamina (except for is ability to precess). Simply deprive Dragoon (or any other spin stealer) of contact and RDF will simply not have enough Stamina to win. Ingulit tested with SA165EWD, which does MUCH better against Phantom; poor Phantom can't do a thing against Dragoon on EWD.
Aug. 17, 2013  7:11 AM
 
(Aug. 17, 2013  2:07 AM)Cake Wrote: Btw, @theblackdragon:
I bet 85MF could beat Dragoon RDF... RDF has already been shown to have poor Stamina (except for is ability to precess). Simply deprive Dragoon (or any other spin stealer) of contact and RDF will simply not have enough Stamina to win.

Definitely agree with this.

Gah! I wish I had my collection, I would be tinkering with this, as it has so much potential.

After seeing how it did in ShinobuXD's tests against Duo 230 MB, I am curious how this fairs against the likes of Genbull Genbull SR200/TH170 TB?
Aug. 17, 2013  8:01 AM
 
I don't expect it to do well... Genbull is probably too heavy to KO and impossible to OS.
Aug. 17, 2013  10:32 PM
 
Cake: Hmmm... good point Chief 2002 - Hmm ... IDK if launching RDF aggressively would solve that or not.
Aug. 18, 2013  1:46 AM
 
Launching RDF aggressively can help, because it can sometimes knock Phantom out of its tornado stall, but Phantom usually wins anyways.
Aug. 20, 2013  6:31 PM
 
I like the idea behind 100CF; I'll need to test that myself soon! Some extra LAD could go a long way in left-spin matchups that go too long for whatever reason. I have concerns about if 100CF would have the raw stamina of 85MF to OS stamina types, and about CF's ability to catch the tornado ridge (be it to stall or to catch the ridge after a light blow) compared to MF. Still, it might work!
Aug. 20, 2013  8:42 PM
 
CF usually can't be launched at full power; just a hair lower than a full launch usually works. The nice thing is though, due to CF's lager diameter, it actually stays further out for longer, despite having worse solo time than MF. This is because CF moves faster at lower rotational speeds, meaning it hugs the tornado Ridge for quite a while. However, once it does reach the center, it has much less Stamina remaining than MF would upon reaching the middle. CF's wider diameter and resulting higher speed and grip makes it more effective at KOing combos, and he taller 100 track increases Attack as well. About catching the Tornado Ridge once knocked out of a stall, I'm not sure, it hasn't happened very often. Usually, though, when it does happen, CF pops back in fairly quickly, because of its speed.
Aug. 20, 2013  8:52 PM
 
I have a theory, just a theory, no support from tests or anything, but I am gonna go on ahead and say it, and get yelled it by a experienced member.
What if Phantom 85MF hits Dragooon SA165EWD from below, causing it to tilt and EWD's wide surface to touch the stadium floor, making it go a bit aggro and than tornado stall with EWD stamina decreased. Would that work? It probably won't work against a new EWD but against a slightly used one it may have chance, although in tournament scene you probaby won't be able to tell how used or worn your opponent's EWD is. But if someone could test this theory, it would be appreciated. Smile
Aug. 21, 2013  2:22 AM
 
(Aug. 20, 2013  8:52 PM)diblee123 Wrote: I have a theory, just a theory, no support from tests or anything, but I am gonna go on ahead and say it, and get yelled it by a experienced member.

XD LOL!

I've tried something like that before, but it kinda doesn't work Confused

Plus, if someone's EWD goes aggro like that during a tournament, they'll probably get called for it. :\
If a bottom's behavior is altered significantly by ware, then it's considered illegal. Smile
Aug. 21, 2013  3:18 AM
 
It's spelled wear. I'm guessing that was a typo.

Either way, theblackdragon is right, and Dragooon would just steal all the spin back anyways.
Aug. 21, 2013  3:59 AM
 
Plus, Dragoon being so much heavier than Phantom, physics tells us that Phantom's going to get slammed into the ground and Dragoon is going to just keep on spinning.
Aug. 21, 2013  8:36 PM
 
Yea, knew it, I was dead wrong, but im pretty sure parts can still be a little worn, but not be illegal.
Aug. 21, 2013  8:40 PM
 
(Aug. 21, 2013  3:18 AM)ShinobuXD Wrote: It's spelled wear. I'm guessing that was a typo.

Either way, theblackdragon is right, and Dragooon would just steal all the spin back anyways.

Whoops! Derp Tongue_out

The only way you can get Dragooon to do that is if you destabilize it to the point where it's actually rolling around the tornado ridge almost on its side, but you need something much heavier and faster for that (and it will only happen once in a very, very long while).
Aug. 23, 2013  10:18 PM
 
Just nitpicking one thing, after your reviser dragooon sa165ewd tests, you should say MF has low precision at the end of the battle in it is nothing compared to EWD's high precision.
Aug. 24, 2013  8:00 PM
 
(Aug. 23, 2013  10:18 PM)diblee123 Wrote: Just nitpicking one thing, after your reviser dragooon sa165ewd tests, you should say MF has low precision at the end of the battle in it is nothing compared to EWD's high precision.

You mean precession? Sure! That makes sense, thanks Grin
Aug. 24, 2013  9:49 PM
 
Yes I meant precession, Your welcome.
P.S Credit should go to theblackdragon, his thread on LAD VS Precession was very helpful

Smile
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