World Beyblade Organization by Fighting Spirits Inc. Beyblade Discussion Beyblade Customizations Metal Fight Limited Customizations

[LTD] Omega as a Defense type!

Nov. 30, 2014  3:59 AM
 
Hello everyone! As I was testing today, I was trying out new things, and I had a strange feeling. For a while now, I felt like there was something odd about Omega, so I decided to try it as a defense type!

I used MF-H Omega (Assault) Horuseus 85 RSF, against Lightning L-Drago GB145 MF.

The results were that Omega won 18/20 times, with there being 2 ties. 6 of the victories were from Outspinning Lightning, and the remaining 12 were from KOing (By that I mean Lightning hitting Omega, and instead of Omega flying out of the stadium, Lightning did). Lightning's victories was caused by when it hit Omega, it was able to stay inside by hitting the wall, then it tornado stalled until lifestealing to victory.

Of course this is only 1 test, but if it was able to beat a top tier attack ring 90% of the time in this one short test, I think it has potential. Meaning the purpose of this thread is for testing/debating/theorizing the uses of Omega as a Defense type wheel in the Limited meta-game!
Nov. 30, 2014  4:01 AM
 
Very interesting idea, first of all.

But, you got to remember to do 20 tests, rather than just 10. Try working with more "Top Tier" test combos, too- rather than Lightning GB145 MF, try that with RF.

Either way, it's a neat thought, haha.
Nov. 30, 2014  4:07 AM
 
(Nov. 30, 2014  4:01 AM)Leone19 Wrote: Very interesting idea, first of all.

But, you got to remember to do 20 tests, rather than just 10. Try working with more "Top Tier" test combos, too- rather than Lightning GB145 MF, try that with RF.

Either way, it's a neat thought, haha.

Oh, right. I forgot to mention, the only good attack bottom I have is MF atm, all m RF's got chewed up... well, unless you count XF, but I wouldn't.

I am getting some new parts soon (hopefully tomorrow if my TRU delivers), and can do more testing then. Until then, I leave it to you fine curious folk! xD

And I suppose I can do another 10 tests and edit the OP.
Nov. 30, 2014  4:45 AM
 
12 KO's. That sounds more like an anti-attack type. Because of Omega's slopes I may be able to see it as an anti-attacker.

Could you do Omega Orion CH120RF Vs. Lightning H145R2F? Thanks.
Nov. 30, 2014  5:00 AM
 
(Nov. 30, 2014  4:45 AM)Echizen Wrote: 12 KO's. That sounds more like an anti-attack type. Because of Omega's slopes I may be able to see it as an anti-attacker.

Could you do Omega Orion CH120RF Vs. Lightning H145R2F? Thanks.

H145? Are you trying to cause Lightning to knock itself out? I'll get to it as soon as I get the parts, all the parts (except H145, mind if I use GB145? I don't see a reason to ever use H145), and can test it right when I do. Until then, if someone else feels generous or curious enough to do this, go ahead.

I'm assuming you want both the RF and R2F slightly worn for the added attack? And I believe Omega Orion CH120 RF is more of an attack than an anti-attack. Do you want the Metal Face on it or not? I feel like with that much force it would either end up with a lot of ties, or whichever one doesn't hit a wall loses.
Nov. 30, 2014  5:54 AM
 
I believe H145 has been proven to do quite well on Attack customs.
Nov. 30, 2014  6:00 AM
 
By the tests you posted, I wouldn't really consider it defensive. Omega is one of those wheels where it doesn't have to be super aggressive to KO oppoents (like Wyvang). If you were to test against another attack set up using RF/R2F (since MF really doesn't have the grip to withstand aggressive combos like Omega on RSF or a semi-aggressive RB/CS) that might give a better look of it's defensive capability. Even then, since it can KO most stamina and light attackers I'm guessing, I'd lable this balance.
Nov. 30, 2014  6:08 AM
 
(Nov. 30, 2014  6:00 AM)Mehoyminoy Wrote: By the tests you posted, I wouldn't really consider it defensive. Omega is one of those wheels where it doesn't have to be super aggressive to KO oppoents (like Wyvang). If you were to test against another attack set up using RF/R2F (since MF really doesn't have the grip to withstand aggressive combos like Omega on RSF or a semi-aggressive RB/CS) that might give a better look of it's defensive capability. Even then, since it can KO most stamina and light attackers I'm guessing, I'd lable this balance.

I can see what you mean, but my RSF isn't that aggressive at all. But I understand, so I'll do some testing with what you suggested.

(Nov. 30, 2014  5:54 AM)Dual Wrote: I believe H145 has been proven to do quite well on Attack customs.

H145 is good, but I think it's outclassed by GB145. H145 adds a lot of recoil that causes attack type beys to Self-KO a lot more frequently, especially on smaller wheels (like lightning). GB145 adds a lot of smash as well, but doesn't make it nearly as easy to Self-KO as H145. At least, that is what I have gathered. I don't think I'll find an H145 when I go on my shopping spree, but if I do I'll pick it up.
Nov. 30, 2014  7:10 AM
 
Eh, I like H145 better on Lightning.

Oh yeah MF-H on both customs Tongue_out. Well most Anti-Attack customs utilize RF and a BD145. Since, BD145 is banned, CH120 would be good to utilize the slopes of Omega.
Nov. 30, 2014  7:34 AM
 
(Nov. 30, 2014  5:54 AM)Dual Wrote: I believe H145 has been proven to do quite well on Attack customs.

Flash H145 is amazing in action, so yeah.
Nov. 30, 2014  4:16 PM
 
Tbh, the combo in the OP reminds me something of a Rebound Attacker. I made something similar with friends one day after school during one of our Table Top Board Games Club meetings.

That time I brought Beyblades, everybody was using weird stuff with no Left-Spin, so I built the mostly-calm-in-movement Omega Kerbecs H145RSF to KO all the other things without having to use any fancy launching techniques (all 4 of us were using Hasbro ripcord launchers around one stadium; it was pretty cramped), and it actually ended up working pretty well, I'd think similarly to Shinobi Wyvang H145RSF, just heavier.

I don't think I'd use Omega in a conventional Defense setup for straight up Defensive purposes, but I'd think it and possibly Blitz and Beat could be promising on heavy/aggressive-Track + calm/grippy-Bottom setups (i.e. H145RSF).
Nov. 30, 2014  6:42 PM
 
To begin with, I gotta give you your kudos for making this thread. Thanks!

H145 Topic (Click to View)

Now, onto the testings done utilizing Omega Leone II 85RSF.

Omega Leone II 85RSF versus Lightning L-Drago GB145RF
Leone Launched First all Matches - Tips in their Prime
Omega Leone: 17/20 (15 OS'S, 2 KO'S) - 85% Win Rate
Lightning L-Drago: 3/20 (ALL KO) - 15% Win Rate

Omega Leone II 85RSF versus Pegasis GB145RF
Leone Launched First all Matches - Tips in their Prime
Omega Leone: 13/20 (4 OS'S, 9 KO'S) - 65% Win Rate
Pegasis: 7/20 (5 OS'S, 2 KO'S) - 35% Win Rate

Yup, five OS'S were made by Pegasis. While it's quite odd, given its lack of width, it went of balance really easily. What I noticed, too, was that while the majority of the matches for the battle with Lightning were won by OS, the ones with Pegasis were the opposite. Not all that sure what it can be, though. Maybe the difference between Lightning and Pegasis-based Attack? I'm confused.

Overall Thoughts on the Combo (Click to View)
Nov. 30, 2014  7:54 PM
 
(Nov. 30, 2014  6:42 PM)Shido Wrote: To begin with, I gotta give you your kudos for making this thread. Thanks!

H145 Topic (Click to View)

Now, onto the testings done utilizing Omega Leone II 85RSF.

Omega Leone II 85RSF versus Lightning L-Drago GB145RF
Leone Launched First all Matches - Tips in their Prime
Omega Leone: 17/20 (15 OS'S, 2 KO'S) - 85% Win Rate
Lightning L-Drago: 3/20 (ALL KO) - 15% Win Rate

Omega Leone II 85RSF versus Pegasis GB145RF
Leone Launched First all Matches - Tips in their Prime
Omega Leone: 13/20 (4 OS'S, 9 KO'S) - 65% Win Rate
Pegasis: 7/20 (5 OS'S, 2 KO'S) - 35% Win Rate

Yup, five OS'S were made by Pegasis. While it's quite odd, given its lack of width, it went of balance really easily. What I noticed, too, was that while the majority of the matches for the battle with Lightning were won by OS, the ones with Pegasis were the opposite. Not all that sure what it can be, though. Maybe the difference between Lightning and Pegasis-based Attack? I'm confused.

Overall Thoughts on the Combo (Click to View)

I think the shape of L-Drago makes it harder to hit Omega out because of it's extreme slopes? I do know that Lightning has an easier time lifestealing off omega than most other beys, so that explains that. Even though it's not attacking or anything, I still like to use Horuseus on Omega. Oh, I completely forgot to mention this (I'll edit the OP later) but I was using Assault Mode (bolded just to make sure everyone catches that) Omega.
Dec. 01, 2014  5:43 AM
 
I've got some new test results. This has a lot to say (maybe) about Assault v.s. Barrage for Omega Defense. I am too tired to continue testing (I had a lot more planned), so this is what I got done today.

I used MF-H Omega Horuseus with an RSF for every test. For Lightning, the combo was Lightning L-Drago GB145 R2F, for Pegasis it was Pegasis 100 R2F.

Omega 85
Spoiler (Click to View)

Omega 105
Spoiler (Click to View)

Omega D125
Spoiler (Click to View)

So, based on this... Barrage is better defensively with lower trackers, and assault is better with medium tracks... Why this might be, I have no clue.
Dec. 04, 2014  11:25 PM
 
Like Angry Face said, I wouldn't use Omega for a purely defensive approach, but a semi-aggro Attack custom is a different story.

MF-H Omega Horuseus 85RSF/RB actually sounds like an amazing custom to me. I betcha that thing could take a lot of stuff down pretty easily.
Dec. 05, 2014  12:48 AM
 
Wish I had an Omega to test with, but here is my opinion after seeing it in multiple events, using it and borrowing someone else's for a few weeks.

Omega honestly doesn't seem like a defense type like others have stated, especially since most RSF's are pretty aggressive so it isn't to surprising it got some KO's. Now on the other hand I could see it as more of an Anti-Attacker since RSF/RB are both pretty aggressive so it could take out other attacks pretty easy and possibly have more stamina than a RF/R2F/LRF Attack Custom somewhat Similar to what MSF-H Wyvang Wyvang BD145 RSF/RDF is like in Standard. It would be nice if there were a little more tests to look at, but at least a new use for a part was brought up.
Dec. 05, 2014  1:06 AM
 
I'm glad to see more people are learning how amazing RSF/RB-based Attack is. The Stamina boost and improved controllability is awesome.

But yeah, regular defense isn't going to work for Omega. Anti-Attack, maybe, but I personally like just switching RF/R2F out on Attack customs for RB/RSF, and then still using them as Attack.
Dec. 05, 2014  2:06 AM
 
Like Thunder Dome, I do agree that it would make more sense to consider low track Omega RB/RSF as Anti Attack, because again, the two tips are generally aggressive. In my opinion, I also like to consider Limited Format Defense-based setups as round and bulky, like Libra, Earth or Bakushin, which Omega isn't. I feel like because of its lack of bulk, it would have a better chance at getting KO'ed. It'd be pretty risky in comparison to them.

Anyhow, here's this, as well, seeing how it'd manage to do in terms of Anti Attack.

Omega Horuseus 85RSF versus MF-H Burn Cancer AD145WD
Burn Cancer Launched First all Matches - RSF a tad Aggro on Certain Launch
Omega Horuseus: 12/20 (ALL KO) 60% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 8/20 (ALL OS) 40% Win Rate
Dec. 05, 2014  2:10 AM
 
Just so everyone knows, the RSF I use is passive, not one of the more common aggressive ones. It will occasionally move aggressively, but not often and not for long. Omega has so much offensive power that with a defensive performance tip it can be anti-attack.

Every single one of the KOs, Omega sat in the middle like a normal defense bey, maybe a little bit of movement, and when the attack bey hit it, it flew out instead of Omega. Omega usually doesn't go much past the tornado ridge.

I am currently doing testing to find better combos for Omega than Omega Horuseus 85RSF. I also am hopefully going to order some RBs over the weekend! Which will immensely help!

EDIT: Got some more testing done! It's going to take me a while to get all the testing I want done (and I'm still getting new parts!), since Omega takes twice as much testing as other wheels, and I'm starting school again next week, and I'll be getting an instructor soon.

MF-H Omega Horuseus AD145 (Assault)
Spoiler (Click to View)

MF-H Omega Horuseus A230 (Assault)
Spoiler (Click to View)

Lightning just has too much stamina! It's insane! Anyways, more testing will ensue.