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Duo Cygnus 160PD

Aug. 07, 2012  10:31 PM
 
Duo Cygnus 160PD

While this might seem like an obvious Stamina custom, I'm posting this to show that PD and 160 put up results to be considered top-tier, which they are currently not.

PD deserves some love. I've done a lot of testing with PD, and as I've mentioned before it performs splendidly but just isn't as good as WD on 145-height and lower and not as good as D on 170-height and higher. This led me to believe that PD's magic height lies somewhere in between, and now that I have 160 I can finally say that this is the case.

This custom only really works with Duo instead of Phantom for two reasons:
  • Duo overhangs the track which saves it from the destabilization by 145-height foes
  • Duo has almost zero recoil, which is very important since PD is made of a material with less friction than the rest of the D family. It's not as bad as Bearing Drive, but Phantom self-KOs on this setup too often.
tl;dr: 160PD only works with Duo, not Phantom.

Cygnus is used because it's one of the best wheels (if not the best) for Duo. Cancer/Gasher and Aquario work too.

160 and PD work very well together. PD is wider than D but thinner than WD, and as such it displays properties of both when used on the correct height (160). It has both D's ability to right itself and WD's ability to precess at very low spin rates. While D is a competitive choice for 160, PD is still far and away the best of the D series for this height.

I'm aware that PD is not an easy to get or cheap piece, so if you're looking for a less-expensive way to make a Stamina custom you probably should look more into AD/W145WD. However, if you already have PD and 160, I personally think this is one of the best Stamina customs you can make.

I said this already, but you don't have PD but have 160, D is still really good on 160, just not as good as PD.


Test Results

I do not have two Duos to test with, unfortunately, so all my testing is against top-tier Phantom stamina customs.

BB-10 Attack Stadium
Beylauncher LR with Suspension
Standard Procedure
Duo is always in Stamina Mode
Phantom is always in Stamina Mode
_______________________________

Duo is always launched first on even rounds
Opposing custom always launched first on odd rounds

Duo Gasher 160PD vs. Phantom Hades W145WD
Spoiler (Click to View)
Phantom: 4 (4 OS)
Duo: 16 (15 OS, 1 KO)
Duo Win %: 80%

I realized after I noticed this custom was beating W145 (which, to use another user's words, is essentially "steroids for Beyblades") that this was an effective Stamina setup worth posting.

Duo Gasher 160PD vs. Phantom Hades TH220D
Spoiler (Click to View)
Phantom: 3 (3 OS)
Duo: 17 (17 OS)
Duo Win %: 85%

This was almost no contest. There was a lot of destabilizing going on and Phantom would stop with Duo still having many, many rotations left.

Duo Gasher 160PD vs. Phantom Hades 85WD
Phantom: 0
Duo: 20 (20 OS)
Duo Win %: 100%

This really was no contest, lol. It wasn't even close, 85WD would stop spinning wayyyyy sooner than 160PD. All wins were OS.

_______________________________

Test Results

I did these tests to show that PD is important to this custom's effectiveness.

Duo Gasher 160WD vs. Phantom Hades W145WD
Spoiler (Click to View)
Duo: 6 (6 OS)
Phantom: 14 (14 OS)
Duo Win %: 30%

I also did comparative tests with Duo Cygnus 160D but got similar results to 160PD, except that Duo was winning by fewer rotations. Just don't use WD, heh.
Aug. 07, 2012  11:36 PM
 
Stop with all of these good threads, kid.
Only 1 good thread in Beyblade Customizations is supposed to be made every 2 Months.
NOW GO BE AN INACTIVE ADVANCED MEMBER, YOU NUB.









please face MSF Revizer Dragooon BD145MF against this pl0x
Aug. 07, 2012  11:49 PM
 
PD is definitely worth the while for testing. I'd be mainly worried about its Defense and how it would do against attackers.
Aug. 07, 2012  11:50 PM
 
He was joking, and good job as always Ingulit Grin
Aug. 07, 2012  11:54 PM
 
Oh, something diffrent in a while. I see your point, and unfortunatly, I do not own any of the parts to test.
Aug. 07, 2012  11:57 PM
 
Zancrow, I'll do your request vs. this combo and your other Dragooon requests now Grin

(Aug. 07, 2012  11:49 PM)BeybladeStation Wrote: PD is definitely worth the while for testing. I'd be mainly worried about its Defense and how it would do against attackers.

PD isn't that much worse than WD from my testing. Yes, it's made of slicker material, but it's not that noticeable. If a Beyblade is using any member of the D family is hit by an attacker it'll go flying no matter which D it is.

What I DID notice is that PD has worse recoil handling, and as such I was getting a few too many self-KOs with Phantom that I wasn't with Duo. This is much more important than any potential defense loss since, again, all D tips have bad defense anyway.
Aug. 08, 2012  12:22 AM
 
As much as I know it's not possible, at least with Duo, I would like to see tests against the same combo with D to be sure that it is PD, or at the very least, some tests that work around the inability to do mirror tests.

(Aug. 07, 2012  11:49 PM)BeybladeStation Wrote: PD is definitely worth the while for testing. I'd be mainly worried about its Defense and how it would do against attackers.
... Why does it matter? If you're facing an attacker with a stamina type, you're screwed unless your opponent is incompetent as heck anyway. Aggressive defenders, maybe, but Duo generally handles them well...

Aug. 08, 2012  12:30 AM
 
Can ya do these test: this combo vs Phantom Hades W145EWD
Aug. 08, 2012  12:47 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  12:22 AM)th!nk Wrote: As much as I know it's not possible, at least with Duo, I would like to see tests against the same combo with D to be sure that it is PD, or at the very least, some tests that work around the inability to do mirror tests.

Trust me, I wish I could do this and I know it's important. The closest thing I have to being able to answer this request is to say that D will win about as much as PD, but it won't win by nearly as many rotations. If anyone can do this test it would be hugely appreciated.

What I can say about this is that 160 could probably be added to the top-tier list based on its performance with D alone, but especially with PD.

(Aug. 08, 2012  12:30 AM)SoulEater57 Wrote: Can ya do these test: this combo vs Phantom Hades W145EWD

My EWD is really worn and moves aggressively, so I'll have to get a new one (something I was planning on doing anyway) before I can do this request.
Aug. 08, 2012  1:57 AM
 
Do some attack tests against this combo please.
Aug. 08, 2012  1:59 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  1:57 AM)[Pyro] Wrote: Do some attack tests against this combo please.

Why? Do you honestly expect a stamina combination to take a hit?

Sorry, but between you and BeyBladeStation I'm starting to wonder if anyone actually knows their type matchups any more.
Aug. 08, 2012  2:11 AM
 
Why, of course we know! Even Most of the people new to beyblade(like me) know the basics! We just don't like using our common knowledge And/or want a laugh as he quickly describes what happened during the massive stamina destruction. Now to what was tested:
Personally, I will never really be able to make this combo since I only have access to hasbro stuff, But this is very useful information for those who can get Takara tomy parts. I'm mainly waiting for more testing of hasbro parts, but I'm glad to store more customizing information from this thread. Smile
Aug. 08, 2012  2:13 AM
 
Haha, yeah, this is a pure Stamina custom. I did tests of it against Dragooon and Dragooon KOed it every time:

MSF-H Reviser Dragooon BD145MF vs. Duo Cygnus 160PD
Spoiler (Click to View)
Dragooon: 10 (10 KO)
Duo: 0
Dragooon Win %: 100%

If Dragooon is this dominate against this Duo custom I don't see why a true attack type would do any worse.
Aug. 08, 2012  2:17 AM
 
Hmmm, I know I'm a complete noob and all, But Wouldn't a Balance type of Stamina and defence do well against this combo? It would have enough weight to knock cygnus out of the center and take control of the middle, lasting longer than if it was moving, right? Please do tests if you can! JUST DON'T USE WD! maybe SD would work... What do you think?
Aug. 08, 2012  2:21 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  2:17 AM)Zanymidgt Wrote: Hmmm, I know I'm a complete noob and all, But Wouldn't a Balance type of Stamina and defence do well against this combo? It would have enough weight to knock cygnus out of the center and take control of the middle, lasting longer than if it was moving, right? Please do tests if you can! JUST DON'T USE WD! maybe SD would work... What do you think?

You actually make a good point about Balance customs, though I don't have two Duos to test with or I'd see how this custom does against our resident Balance bey MF-L Duo Cygnus 230MB.

There aren't many other Balance Beys floating around right now (unless you count anti-attack as Balance), but you have a good idea going. This really is just a pure stamina custom in every sense of the word, though its height is rather unique and might show some interesting results.
Aug. 08, 2012  2:26 AM
 
Could you try it against MF-H Phantom Cancer/Gasher TH170D/230CS, please?
Aug. 08, 2012  2:26 AM
 
Yeah, I'm just suprised you agree with me. I've only been blading since a bit before I made my account. I think that maybe instead of duo, something of similar weighting/ shape like bakushin could work with a virgo clear wheel, an MF-L, an SD tip, and maybe a C145 track. I'm not so good with customizing, this was mainly to try and give you ideas.
Aug. 08, 2012  2:29 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  2:26 AM)Zanymidgt Wrote: Yeah, I'm just suprised you agree with me. I've only been blading since a bit before I made my account. I think that maybe instead of duo, something of similar weighting/ shape like bakushin could work with a virgo clear wheel, an MF-L, an SD tip, and maybe a C145 track. I'm not so good with customizing, this was mainly to try and give you ideas.

That's an interesting thought, and you mentioning C145 gives you brownie points in my book since that's one of my favorite parts, though I'm not so sure Basushin would do the job. It has an awesome shape, but it's just too light. I mean, I could try it, sure, though the custom is kind of all over the place Tongue_out

(Aug. 08, 2012  2:26 AM)Zancrow Wrote: Could you try it against MF-H Phantom Cancer/Gasher TH170D/230CS, please?

Yeah, I'll get on it now. I will say that Hades is much, much better on Phantom than Cancer/Gasher, but I'll test with those to see how it does.
Aug. 08, 2012  2:35 AM
 
Ingulit Wrote:That's an interesting thought, and you mentioning C145 gives you brownie points in my book since that's one of my favorite parts, though I'm not so sure Basushin would do the job. It has an awesome shape, but it's just too light. I mean, I could try it, sure, though the custom is kind of all over the place
Like I said, I just wanted to give you an idea. maybe fusion could stand a chance. Again, I don't really know my parts. MY JOB IS TO INSPIRE PEOPLE TO FIND SOMETHING THAT CAN DEMOLISH A GOOD COMBO! I really like chaos, but balance is need to every good combo. There must always be something that can defeat it.


[Image: yinYang.gif]
Aug. 08, 2012  3:20 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  2:29 AM)Ingulit Wrote:
(Aug. 08, 2012  2:26 AM)Zancrow Wrote: Could you try it against MF-H Phantom Cancer/Gasher TH170D/230CS, please?

Yeah, I'll get on it now. I will say that Hades is much, much better on Phantom than Cancer/Gasher, but I'll test with those to see how it does.

Annnnnd done. I only did ten rounds each since the results seemed pretty stacked in Duo's favor.

Duo Cygnus 160PD vs. MF-H Phantom Gasher TH170D
Spoiler (Click to View)
Duo: 9 (9 OS)
Phantom: 1 (1 OS)
Duo Win %: 90%

This match-up was closer than I expected. The one win for Phantom was a really clean hit that knocked Duo off balance and then Phantom managed to keep it from standing back up.

This match reminded me of another of PD's strengths over the rest of the D clan: when PD is precessing at really low spin rates, PD seems to lose much less spin than WD when it's scraping. I'm assuming this is because of PD's material.

Duo Cygnus 160PD vs. MF-H Phantom Gasher 230CS
Spoiler (Click to View)
Duo: 10 (10 OS)
Phantom: 0
Duo Win %: 100%

My poor Cygnus's stickers... They were all new and pretty before this match ;_;

This wasn't very close at all. Phantom was getting some hits that looked like they should destabilize Duo, but it never actually happened. CS just doesn't have the stamina to OS this custom.
Aug. 08, 2012  3:28 AM
 
Now How about that? Duo demolished! Is Gasher a stamina type? Oh, who cares. I need to think of a way to DESTROY THIS COMBO! MWUAHAHHAA! I seriously think something like fusion virgo 145SD or something like that might do some good. But I don't know, I'm a noob beyblader, and I'm no expert at making balance combos.
Aug. 08, 2012  3:30 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  3:28 AM)Zanymidgt Wrote: Now How about that? Duo demolished! Is Gasher a stamina type? Oh, who cares. I need to think of a way to DESTROY THIS COMBO! MWUAHAHHAA! I seriously think something like fusion virgo 145SD or something like that might do some good. But I don't know, I'm a noob beyblader, and I'm no expert at making balance combos.

Gasher is good for stamina, yes. And almost any attack type can KO it.
Aug. 08, 2012  3:32 AM
 
Can You test this Against MF-H Duo(If you have another) Aquario BD145CS?
Aug. 08, 2012  3:39 AM
 
SoulEater57 Wrote:
Zanymidgt Wrote:Now How about that? Duo demolished! Is Gasher a stamina type? Oh, who cares. I need to think of a way to DESTROY THIS COMBO! MWUAHAHHAA! I seriously think something like fusion virgo 145SD or something like that might do some good. But I don't know, I'm a noob beyblader, and I'm no expert at making balance combos.

Gasher is good for stamina, yes. And almost any attack type can KO it.
I meant a balance combo of Defence and stamina. I wasn't going for an attack type. I guess I really do stink at making balance combos...
But, er, yeah, read above. You'll see what I was going for earlier in some other posts.
And Prodigy, he said he did not have a second duo. sorry. Tongue_out
Aug. 08, 2012  4:05 AM
 
(Aug. 08, 2012  3:32 AM)The Prodigy Wrote: Can You test this Against MF-H Duo(If you have another) Aquario BD145CS?

Yeah, sorry, I don't have another, though I'm almost certain this custom would beat that just because this is a stamina custom vs. defense.
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