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Competitive Metal Fight Beyblade Combos

Dec. 16, 2010  3:55 AM
 
This is a list of currently competitive combos in the Metal Fight Beyblade metagame. This topic will be updated as new parts are released. Please post your comments and suggestions. :) (Suggestions need to be accompanied by valid test results.)

ATTACK


Wyvang
  • {MSF{-H}} Wyvang Wyvang (GB145/W145/H145) (R2F/RF/LRF)
  • {MSF{-H}} Wyvang Dragooon SA165[Zero-G Attack] (R2F/RF/LRF)

Balro
  • {MSF{-H}} Balro Balro (CH120/D125/T125/W145) (RF/R2F/LRF)

Bahamdia
  • {MSF-M/MSF-L} Bahamdia Dragooon BD145 (LRF/R2F/RF)

Flash
  • MF-H Flash (Orion/Escolpio/Pisces/Beelzeb) (GB145/H145/S130/CH120) (R2F/RF/LRF)


DEFENSE



Duo
  • MF-H Duo (Aquario/Cancer/Hades/Cygnus) BD145 (RDF/RB)
  • MF-H Duo (Aquario/Cancer/Hades/Cygnus) E230 (RDF/RSF/RB/CS)

Revizer/Killerken
  • MSF-H (Revizer/Killerken) (Revizer/Killerken) BD145 (RDF/RB/CS/RSF)
  • MSF-H Revizer (Revizer/Killerken) E230 (RDF/RSF/CS/RB)

Genbull
  • MSF-H Revizer Genbull E230 (RDF/RB/RSF/CS)
  • MSF-H (Revizer/Genbull) Genbull BD145 (RDF/RB/RSF)


STAMINA



Duo
  • Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) W145 (WD/EWD)
  • Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) (TH170/230) (D/SD/TB)
  • Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) SR200 TB
  • Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) B:D
  • Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) 160 PD
  • Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) SA165[Normal] EWD
  • MF(-M/-H) Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) 230 MB

Genbull
  • Genbull Genbull (SR200/TH170) TB

Dragooon
  • {MSF{-H}} (Revizer/Genbull/Killerken/Girago) Dragooon SA165[Normal] EWD
  • {MSF-L} (Girago/Revizer/Killerken) Dragooon SA165[Zero-G Attack] EWD


BALANCE

  • (Girago/Genbull) Genbull E230 MB
  • Girago Girago E230 MB
  • MSF-H Wyvang Wyvang BD145 RSF
  • MF-L Phantom Cygnus 85 MF
  • (MSF-L) Balro Balro BD145MF
  • MF-H Flash (Orion/Escolpio/Pisces/Beelzeb) W145 MF
  • {MF{-L}} Duo (Cancer/Cygnus/Hades) F230* (CF/GCF)
  • {MSF{-L}} (Genbull/Girago/Revizer/Killerken) Dragooon F230* (CF/GCF)
  • {MSF{-L}} Genbull Genbull F230* (CF/GCF)
  • MF-H Diablo (Kerbecs/Unicorno II) BD145 RF
  • MSF-(H/L) Girago Girago BD145 RF
  • MSF-H Wyvang Dragooon BD145 RF
  • MSF-H Wyvang Dragooon BD145 RDF
  • {MSF-H} (Revizer/Killerken) Dragooon SA165[Normal] RDF
  • Genbull Dragooon (T125/D125) GCF
  • (MSF-H) Genbull Genbull (TH120/SR200) CS

* F230 must be one of the orange TAKARA TOMY ones from ZGRBV3, not the brown or red ones.



Previous Lists (Click to View)

The Committee has decided to move all discussion of the Competitive Metal Fight Beyblade Combos list to the Advanced Forum to prevent any of the unsupported arguments for certain customs to be added that have been strewn throughout the old thread. That said, we do not want to discourage members who are not Veterans from suggesting their ideas. They may post their ideas–with test results to support them–in the Beyblade Customizations forum within their own topics. We will see them.
Dec. 16, 2010  4:00 AM
 
DF145<145<AD145
I think 85/AD145/230 should all be listed as Stamina Track heights.
And D<SD<WD
Dec. 16, 2010  4:02 AM
 
A lot more tests need to be conducted before we add 85/90/100/230 to each combination, because most tests that have been posted were individual, and did not use all the top-tier Stamina Wheels.
Dec. 16, 2010  4:06 AM
 
(Dec. 16, 2010  4:00 AM)Mc Frown Wrote: DF145<145
Where are all of the tests to support this notion? I know they must have been posted somewhere, but I can't seem to find them. Regarding DF145 vs. 145 specifically; when I did some tests, both 145 and DF145 seemed to be evenly matched.
Dec. 16, 2010  4:06 AM
 
That's true, except 90/100 should not be included.
I still think that 85 should be added, as well as 145 and DF145 be replaced by AD145, and 230 to be tested more.

Also, it should specify molds:
Defense: Earth (Hasbro) , Bull/Aquario (Hasbro), GB145 (Hasbro)
Stamina: Virgo (4-5 minute mold), Earth (TT Mold 1), Burn (TT Mold 1), and Bull/Aquario (Hasbro)

And finally, C145 should be removed from defense.

/allmygripes

EDIT: There's a lot of tests I remember, some by Nojo I believe, as well as other members. DF145 preformed worse than 145, and 145 preformed worse than DF145. I'll look for some.
Dec. 16, 2010  4:08 AM
 
(Dec. 16, 2010  4:06 AM)Kei Wrote: Where are all of the tests to support this notion? I know they must have been posted somewhere, but I can't seem to find them.
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Corey-s-...0MB-combos
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Stamina-...D145-vs-85
Dec. 16, 2010  4:10 AM
 
Super, thanks.
Also: http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Track-he...#pid369491

http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Track-Te...#pid307688


EDIT: And why no MF-H for Defense?
Dec. 16, 2010  4:45 AM
 
Nojo's tests seem disproportionate in contrast with both mine and other members testing ... I'll try to do more Stamina testing myself soon.

(Dec. 16, 2010  4:10 AM)Mc Frown Wrote: EDIT: And why no MF-H for Defense?

No reason, I just completely forgot about it. Will add it now.
Dec. 18, 2010  7:21 PM
 
I'm having second thoughts on MF Pegasis 145RF
Dec. 18, 2010  11:41 PM
 
About being on the top tier list? IMHO I think its the best one on the list besides Vulcan.

But of course, you should have tests to support your argument if you believe otherwise.
Dec. 19, 2010  4:45 AM
 
See Fyuuor's tests in the Libra thread.
It's preforms pretty poorly.
Dec. 20, 2010  1:33 AM
 
I think that it's more that Pegasis performs poorly against RS, than against specifically Libra. Ray is the same. But do we really want to trim down the list like that?
Dec. 20, 2010  2:29 AM
 
I sort of think so.
There IS a difference between 'Top-Tier' and 'Competitively Viable'.
Maybe we could have a list of viable combos/runner-ups?
Dec. 20, 2010  2:43 AM
 
I'll have to disagree with your last statement Frownie. I think a list of top-tier combos is all we need, and not a list of combos that are 'runner-ups' to the top-tiers. When we have a list of what is best, I think that's the only necessary list.

But, I do agree with what you said about Pegasis. From my testing, I think it does well against WB-based Defense combos, but it doesn't do too well against our current top-tier Attack Types, excluding Ray, which I also have second thoughts about. I haven't tried Pegasis against RS yet though.
Dec. 20, 2010  2:59 AM
 
Yeah I don't really like what i said last, it was more of a compromise thing I guess?
But the top tier list should really only be the best of the best.
Dec. 20, 2010  3:17 AM
 
(Dec. 20, 2010  2:59 AM)Mc Frown Wrote: Yeah I don't really like what i said last, it was more of a compromise thing I guess?
But the top tier list should really only be the best of the best.

What do you mean by "best of the best" though? Do you just want to trim the list down to three Beyblades?
Dec. 20, 2010  5:31 AM
 
I won't put numbers on it, but a part shouldn't be top tier if a fellow top tier trumps it by a matter of 20% or more in it's win rate against all other deserved top tiers, or beats/ties it in every circumstance (except perhaps versus niche combos).
Dec. 21, 2010  3:58 AM
 
I think we need to add RSF and CS in Defense, and remove WB.
Dec. 21, 2010  4:34 AM
 
(Dec. 21, 2010  3:58 AM)Kai-V Wrote: I think we need to add RSF and CS in Defense, and remove WB.

Yes, it's quite clear that both RSF and CS are better. I'll update the list right now.

And now that we're doing that, what do you all think of removing Ray Unicorno 100RF/R2F? And Metal Face Pegasis 145 RF/R2F? Both do not perform well against RS/RSF/CS.

Finally, what do we want to do with the Stamina types? That section is in need of an update. I still need to do DF145 vs. 145 tests, but do we want to add 85 and 230 to the customs?
Dec. 21, 2010  5:02 AM
 
(Dec. 21, 2010  4:34 AM)Kei Wrote: And now that we're doing that, what do you all think of removing Ray Unicorno 100RF/R2F? And Metal Face Pegasis 145 RF/R2F? Both do not perform well against RS/RSF/CS.

Finally, what do we want to do with the Stamina types? That section is in need of an update. I still need to do DF145 vs. 145 tests, but do we want to add 85 and 230 to the customs?
I think those two, especially Pegasis, still need to be tested by more people though, against RS, CS or RSF.

I think we could just skip DF145 and 145 and just add AD145, 85 and 230. What bothers me is that it was not always the same Metal Wheel that was being tested, so from my point of view we are not certain if, for instance, Virgo can really be good in Stamina with AD145, 85 and 230.
Dec. 21, 2010  5:24 AM
 
I agree with the removal of WB in place of RSF and CS along with the addition of 85 and 230 for Stamina and the removal of Ray as Top Tier, though I'm against the removal of Pegasus.


With WB I think it should be noted that when Metal Flat is released it may be the only bottom which can stand a chance with it's improved stamina over RS and RSF. Though until Metal Flat is released WB should be removed, if WB continues to record poor win rates when tested against MF it's removal should remain though if WB records a decent win rate over MF it should then be reinstated as Top Tier.


The 85 and 230 track should definitely be added to the list. While 85 does perform poorly against 230 it is the only track that it does so against. Perhaps if were adding 85 to the list we should consider 90 and 100 for Stamina purposes as well? With the addition of the 230 track to the list I continue to believe that is should be added to the list, but I do think that Kai-V did raise an interesting point about whether or not 230 will perform well with either Virgo or Burn. When I get some time I'll perform some tests but the win rates that occurred with Earth should transpire over to Virgo and Burn. Another thing that should be noted that in a few members testing AD145, 145 and DF145 all performed incredibly close with there win rates being practically identical, I propose that AD145 should be added to the list while still including 145 and DF145.


In regards to Ray I personally think that it should be removed as the win rates it's achieving in comparison to other non Top Tier Wheels isn't as high or as consistent. In place of Ray either MF Meteo L Drago 90/T125RF/R2F or MF Gravity Perseus 85/90/100/CH120/145/RF/R2F should take it's place.


I'm not entirely sure about the removal of Pegasus from the list, perhaps the combo needs some adjusting instead of being removed completely? I record better results with MF Pegsus 85RF/R2F then I do with the 145 equivalent. With the 145 combo Pegasus seems to barely trouble a RS opponent though it's 85 counterpart performs reasonably well.
Dec. 22, 2010  2:15 AM
 
(Dec. 21, 2010  5:24 AM)Fyuuor Wrote: With WB I think it should be noted that when Metal Flat is released it may be the only bottom which can stand a chance with it's improved stamina over RS and RSF. Though until Metal Flat is released WB should be removed, if WB continues to record poor win rates when tested against MF it's removal should remain though if WB records a decent win rate over MF it should then be reinstated as Top Tier.


The 85 and 230 track should definitely be added to the list. While 85 does perform poorly against 230 it is the only track that it does so against. Perhaps if were adding 85 to the list we should consider 90 and 100 for Stamina purposes as well? With the addition of the 230 track to the list I continue to believe that is should be added to the list, but I do think that Kai-V did raise an interesting point about whether or not 230 will perform well with either Virgo or Burn. When I get some time I'll perform some tests but the win rates that occurred with Earth should transpire over to Virgo and Burn.

I'm not entirely sure about the removal of Pegasus from the list, perhaps the combo needs some adjusting instead of being removed completely? I record better results with MF Pegsus 85RF/R2F then I do with the 145 equivalent. With the 145 combo Pegasus seems to barely trouble a RS opponent though it's 85 counterpart performs reasonably well.

I agree about WB vs. MF. I wasn't even thinking about MF when I removed WB, but it doesn't matter because MF has not been released yet. We're just speculating at this point. When it comes out and tests have been conducted, yes, WB might be added again.

90 and 100 are surely good, but doesn't 85 defeat both of them consistently? Kai-V's point about the Metal Wheels is interesting and should be looked into.

Yeah, on 145, Pegasis is useless against RS. Have you posted tests of MF Pegasis 85RF/R2F vs. RS opponents anywhere?
Dec. 22, 2010  2:22 AM
 
He did on the RS vs. CS vs. RSF thread
Dec. 23, 2010  4:42 AM
 
(Dec. 22, 2010  2:15 AM)Kei Wrote: 90 and 100 are surely good, but doesn't 85 defeat both of them consistently? Kai-V's point about the Metal Wheels is interesting and should be looked into.

85 does defeat 90 and 100 consistently, but I was thinking in regards to 90 and 100 against 145 track heights as they achieve a high win rate against their 145 track counterparts.


(Dec. 22, 2010  2:15 AM)Kei Wrote: Yeah, on 145, Pegasis is useless against RS. Have you posted tests of MF Pegasis 85RF/R2F vs. RS opponents anywhere?

These would be the results that Mc Frown was talking about.
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Rubber-o...-RSF-VS-CS

In addition to the 85 spin track being considered for the Pegasus combo, 230 should be added as an option for a Defensive Combinations Spin Track. The win rates 230 achieves against low Track Attacking Beyblades is phenomenal, while 230 still achieves amazing results against 120 - 145 Track height opponents. We must also take into consideration that the majority of Attack combos use a low height spin track.

Based on win rates from my testings and over members testings of MF Meteo L Drago (Absorb Version) 90/T125RF/R2F and MF Gravity Perseus (Right Spin, Counter Mode) 85/90/100/D125/T125/AD145/R145RF they both should be considered for Top Tier status.
Jan. 12, 2011  2:39 AM
 
I've gone ahead and made some updates: Ray Unicorno 100 RF/R2F has been removed from the Attack list, and C145 from the Defense section. 230 has been added in C145's place for Defense.

There is numerous other changes that need to be made, but these seem to be the most generally accepted changes that needed to be made at this point.
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