World Beyblade Organization by Fighting Spirits Inc. Beyblade Discussion Beyblade Hobby Q&A

[Answered]  Gauging Driver Tightness?

Apr. 07, 2018  7:56 PM
 
So I was wondering about how exactly do you determine how "tight" a driver is? Do you try wiggling it? Is it something you feel in the overall build of the Beyblade?

I'm currently trying to determine if the idea that keeping a Bey assembled over a long period of time messes with the driver is true. I'm comparing between my old and new God Customize Set parts. I'm having difficulty trying to judge whether the older parts lost tightness or not, so any pointers would be appreciated.
Apr. 07, 2018  8:40 PM
 
There are 2 ways to do so.
1. By seeing how more often it burst vs unassembled one
2. Feel carefully and see which of them is harder (even if to the slightest level) to assemble/disassembly

Optionally you can press the spring and see if it's any harder to press.
Apr. 07, 2018  9:10 PM
 
(Apr. 07, 2018  8:40 PM)FIREFIRE CPB Wrote: There are 2 ways to do so.
1. By seeing how more often it burst vs unassembled one
2. Feel carefully and see which of them is harder (even if to the slightest level) to assemble/disassembly

Optionally you can press the spring and see if it's any harder to press.

Thanks, I appreciate it!

I've done some different combo testings with Atomic and Bearing, but I'm not finding any discernible difference. If someone has any recommended combos with God Customize Set drivers to test, I'm open for it. I've also got Sr and nL sets and the mG layer, if those might be thought helpful in testing.

I'll try poking around at the other testing options a little later, as I'm about to head out the door here in a bit.

The thing I find interesting to think on is, if anything gets distorted, it would have to be the plastic unless the spring is not well-made in material (or at least not built strong enough for the level of compression it deals with). Otherwise, unless great heat or some corrosion occurs, a good spring can go several if not many, many years of compression before losing just 1% of its ability at room temperature.

This is according to some readings:
So if it does happen, I imagine the plastic it pushes against bends/indents. But that should still probably be somewhat noticeable with the different mentioned tests, I would think.
Apr. 07, 2018  10:15 PM
 
The most common cases of loose springs are usually just mold defects or differences. I have a Hold Driver that has the same amount of spring compression as a normal Bearing Driver.

Some decent combos that use the parts in the God Customize Set would be...
Sr.7B/7.Br/At
mG.4/7.At
nL.M.Ds/Sp(only good against other Ds combos)
aB.7B/7/4/4B.At/Br
Apr. 08, 2018  1:33 AM
 
(Apr. 07, 2018  10:15 PM)Mage Wrote: The most common cases of loose springs are usually just mold defects or differences. I have a Hold Driver that has the same amount of spring compression as a normal Bearing Driver.
That's something I started thinking about earlier. When I was trying to look up how to check tightness, there was a lot of discussion here on WBO about Hasbro having different molds or quality in general with the drivers, and this original idea did begin from a couple Hasbro Atomics....

(Apr. 07, 2018  10:15 PM)Mage Wrote: Some decent combos that use the parts in the God Customize Set would be...
Sr.7B/7.Br/At
mG.4/7.At
nL.M.Ds/Sp(only good against other Ds combos)
aB.7B/7/4/4B.At/Br

I think the tricky thing is deciding what to use for testing. Do I want to use something at least somewhat burst prone and just seeing if it bursts more often? Or what's good at bursting other beys so that I know bursting can happen?

So any recommended vs. for that sort of thing might be helpful. I'll play with the Ds/Sp thing, as well as the rest, thanks!
Apr. 18, 2018  3:26 AM
 
Thanks everybody for the input. I'd like to report back to say that there is no discernible difference between my old Atomic and Bearing and my new ones. I did bursting tests, I tried pressing down the springs directly, and I'm not noticing anything.
Apr. 18, 2018  5:43 AM
 
IMO keeping the bey in its assembled state doesn't mess with the driver because it does not keep it in a pressed state. The driver is only pressed the moment it passes the teeth.
Apr. 24, 2018  3:41 PM
 
(Apr. 18, 2018  5:43 AM)Kyle.ph Wrote: IMO keeping the bey in its assembled state doesn't mess with the driver because it does not keep it in a pressed state. The driver is only pressed the moment it passes the teeth.

It doesn't? I never knew that. I was curious about that thinking it would wear out the spring. But in the above post Fox says it doesn't really happen so that's good news too.
(Apr. 07, 2018  9:10 PM)Frostic Fox Wrote: The thing I find interesting to think on is, if anything gets distorted, it would have to be the plastic unless the spring is not well-made in material (or at least not built strong enough for the level of compression it deals with). Otherwise, unless great heat or some corrosion occurs, a good spring can go several if not many, many years of compression before losing just 1% of its ability at room temperature.

I didn't know that! That's super interesting. I guess I don't have to worry about keeping my beyblades assembled.
Apr. 24, 2018  4:20 PM
 
i know from nerf blasters that storing full magazines over time does kill the steel coil spring inside, leading to jams and misfeeds.   but this correlation not causation. 

i don’t know from experience that same occurs to whatever degree for drivers

either way i think there are advantages to storing in the disassembled state anyways.  it’s just easier to find things.
Apr. 24, 2018  6:04 PM
 
I unfortunately know a lot about springs due to my previous job...
Generally there's different types of processes involved with creating springs.

The types of springs I worked with were double tempered, a process of heating and cooling it it twice in succession to reinforce the internal structure, which prevents spring sag over time due to wear and retains spring rebound. Double tempering is generally done for more expensive springs, but even with double tempered springs, they would break down due to metal fatigue over time.

Spring failure occurs over compressions by either "per actuation basis" or "constant pressure" past it's yield limit and is affected differently per use case. I'm not sure what the yield limit is for burst driver springs. I'd venture to say that single tempering is most likely done in toys, but who knows it could just be a standard spring without tempering – which to answer your question:

Yes, keeping your bey built most likely reaches or surpasses the driver's spring yield limit due to the type of spring, which will inevitably wear it down over time – but it's likely that the threshold for when it will wear down from "constant pressure" will likely exceed the durability of the actual toy's/tip's lifespan.

I could be wrong though, I wouldn't know even by touch how a spring was created.
Apr. 24, 2018  7:14 PM
 
Yes, I think it's pretty practical to keep the parts separated anyway. And it's true that we don't know if the springs are rightly made for the job they do.

In this case, I had my Beyblades assembled, barring bursting and swapping, for about a month and that didn't seem to affect them, at least as far as I could tell. But I have come to like keeping my parts unassembled and I figure I'll take no risks in the process. But I think we'd be noticing a lot if short-term assembly caused issues, so no reason to get too paranoid.


(Apr. 24, 2018  3:41 PM)Arcosst Wrote:
(Apr. 18, 2018  5:43 AM)Kyle.ph Wrote: IMO keeping the bey in its assembled state doesn't mess with the driver because it does not keep it in a pressed state. The driver is only pressed the moment it passes the teeth.

It doesn't? I never knew that. I was curious about that thinking it would wear out the spring. But in the above post Fox says it doesn't really happen so that's good news too.

I think the spring is compressed the whole time, isn't it? It would take a lot of work to make the Beyblade compress it as it turns, I would think. You can feel the spring being compressed as you assemble the Beyblade.
Apr. 25, 2018  2:17 AM
 
The spring is compressed the moment it passes the teeth and only that moment. after passing the teeth it goes back to its orginal uncompressed state when it is locked or in the ridges of the beyblade. If it makes sense. it's like uncompressed, click(compressed), uncompressed, click(compressed), uncompessed, click(compressed), finally locked compressed.
(Apr. 24, 2018  7:14 PM)Frostic Fox Wrote: Yes, I think it's pretty practical to keep the parts separated anyway. And it's true that we don't know if the springs are rightly made for the job they do.

In this case, I had my Beyblades assembled, barring bursting and swapping, for about a month and that didn't seem to affect them, at least as far as I could tell. But I have come to like keeping my parts unassembled and I figure I'll take no risks in the process. But I think we'd be noticing a lot if short-term assembly caused issues, so no reason to get too paranoid.


(Apr. 24, 2018  3:41 PM)Arcosst Wrote: It doesn't? I never knew that. I was curious about that thinking it would wear out the spring. But in the above post Fox says it doesn't really happen so that's good news too.

I think the spring is compressed the whole time, isn't it? It would take a lot of work to make the Beyblade compress it as it turns, I would think. You can feel the spring being compressed as you assemble the Beyblade.

The spring is somewhat only compressed the moment it comes contact with the teeth of the layer. So if the driver is in the ridges of the layer it's teeth has space to rest on, allowing it to be in an uncompressed state. its like click(compressedd), uncompressed, click(compressed), uncompressed,(click compressed), lock uncompressed.
Apr. 25, 2018  2:43 AM
 
What I do is I put the driver on my Hasbro H1(if that's even a thing) the tighter it is, the better the springs condition. To prove this, I lost my Trans for a week and at that time it was super loose. When I found it, I tried to put it on my H1 and it was SUPER TIGHT.
Apr. 25, 2018  3:06 AM
 
The moment you put the Driver in, it's always going to be compressed. Keep in mind that you have to push it in to assemble it, and that when it clicks it only compresses more for the moment it's on the tooth.
Apr. 26, 2018  3:13 AM
 
(Apr. 25, 2018  3:06 AM)Mage Wrote: The moment you put the Driver in, it's always going to be compressed. Keep in mind that you have to push it in to assemble it, and that when it clicks it only compresses more for the moment it's on the tooth.
Really is that what is happening? 
Thanks for the correction. I always thought that beys assembled are in an uncompressed state. Might as well keep my beys disassembled.
Apr. 26, 2018  3:30 AM
 
(Apr. 26, 2018  3:13 AM)Kyle.ph Wrote: Really is that what is happening? 
Thanks for the correction. I always thought that beys assembled are in an uncompressed state. Might as well keep my beys disassembled.

I'd venture to say they were about near 75% compressed.