Mr. Toto Wrote:Dude carp on kitchen floor after being evicted from apartment.
WHAT
jesus christ
Random Thoughts
jesus christ
I'm caucusing for Obama tonight!
I voted Obama
^^
^^
![[Image: takaoquickiesig1.png]](https://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d30/djsinister14/signatures/takaoquickiesig1.png)
NACHOS, carp YEAH.
You know at first I didn't like Obama as I thought he was stuck up and a bit shady, but the more I look into him the more I'm starting to like him.
Also, I really don't mean any offense to anyone in saying this, but I don't think America is ready for an African American president.
I couldn't care less to be entirely honest. My hope is that if Obama does get elected he'll not only fight for the rights of racial minorities, but for the rights of gays and other minorities as well. Judging from his voting history and information I've found on the internet, this seems to be true.
Although I think his stance on gay marriage (He opposes marriage yet supports strong civil unions that offer the same benefits as marriage -- wtf why not just support marriage?) is confusing, I think he will do a better job at handling gay rights and in this election where I'll be able to vote for the first time in my life, that is a huge issue for me.
Hilary isn't like "carp GAYS THEY'RE SINNERS AND THE ANTI-CHRIST" or anything, she's quite supportive of gay rights as well, but I don't think she's as open to changing traditional laws and views as Obama is.
As far as voting goes at the moment though, I have no idea who my vote will go to, but I know for damn sure a republican won't be getting it.
I'm not a democrat at all, I just relate better to the democratic candidates this election.
Also, I really don't mean any offense to anyone in saying this, but I don't think America is ready for an African American president.
I couldn't care less to be entirely honest. My hope is that if Obama does get elected he'll not only fight for the rights of racial minorities, but for the rights of gays and other minorities as well. Judging from his voting history and information I've found on the internet, this seems to be true.
Although I think his stance on gay marriage (He opposes marriage yet supports strong civil unions that offer the same benefits as marriage -- wtf why not just support marriage?) is confusing, I think he will do a better job at handling gay rights and in this election where I'll be able to vote for the first time in my life, that is a huge issue for me.
Hilary isn't like "carp GAYS THEY'RE SINNERS AND THE ANTI-CHRIST" or anything, she's quite supportive of gay rights as well, but I don't think she's as open to changing traditional laws and views as Obama is.
As far as voting goes at the moment though, I have no idea who my vote will go to, but I know for damn sure a republican won't be getting it.
I'm not a democrat at all, I just relate better to the democratic candidates this election.
![[Image: ww16xw.png]](https://i53.tinypic.com/ww16xw.png)
Quote:(He opposes marriage yet supports strong civil unions that offer the same benefits as marriage -- wtf why not just support marriage?)
Religion.
Man, it was really weird at the polling stations today. They made you ask if you were a Democrat or a Republican when you picked up the ballot. I was like whhhhhhaaaaaaatttt
At mine you had to specify which party you supporting then find your caucus since they each had their own polling places.
Quote:I'm not a democrat at all, I just relate better to the democratic candidates this election.I'm on the same boat with you on this.
in case you didn't check, that link about shitting on the floor was actually about how bush has expanded the budget on the war before he leaves office, which will raise deficits even more and just not be fun for anybody
-A gay president in 2084?
-We're realistic.
If there are no civil/legal differences between a civil union and 'marriage', why would anyone who doesn't belong to a religious affiliation want to get married, let alone gay couples? I'm curious. Is it the whole ceremonious/party deal? You can still have a party with a civil union, I'm sure.
I've always felt 'marriage' and religion went hand in hand, as 'marriage' has a deep-seated meaning in theology (along with the emotional/social meanings).
-We're realistic.
If there are no civil/legal differences between a civil union and 'marriage', why would anyone who doesn't belong to a religious affiliation want to get married, let alone gay couples? I'm curious. Is it the whole ceremonious/party deal? You can still have a party with a civil union, I'm sure.
I've always felt 'marriage' and religion went hand in hand, as 'marriage' has a deep-seated meaning in theology (along with the emotional/social meanings).
Ominous Wrote:-A gay president in 2084?
-We're realistic.
If there are no civil/legal differences between a civil union and 'marriage', why would anyone who doesn't belong to a religious affiliation want to get married, let alone gay couples? I'm curious. Is it the whole ceremonious/party deal? You can still have a party with a civil union, I'm sure.
I've always felt 'marriage' and religion went hand in hand, as 'marriage' has a deep-seated meaning in theology (along with the emotional/social meanings).
*Snaps fingers* On you you di'n't!
It's not so much the benefits that matter. It's more the fact that we have to be considered something separate but equal. Which if you'll recall hasn't exactly gone well for issues in past American history.
I also find your point on a religion a bit slighted. Just because I happen to be gay and don't conform to a religion doesn't mean that all the rest of them don't as well. I know a few gay people who are very religious and they believe that marriage shouldn't be limited to a union between a man and a woman. I know very little about religion so I can't really say much other than that.
Ominous Wrote:-A gay president in 2084?
-We're realistic.
If there are no civil/legal differences between a civil union and 'marriage', why would anyone who doesn't belong to a religious affiliation want to get married, let alone gay couples? I'm curious. Is it the whole ceremonious/party deal? You can still have a party with a civil union, I'm sure.
I've always felt 'marriage' and religion went hand in hand, as 'marriage' has a deep-seated meaning in theology (along with the emotional/social meanings).
Yeah, non-Christians don't celebrate Christmas right?
The meaning of these things is not static over time. Marriage is no longer an exclusively religious event; for most people, it's about the love two people share, not about the love two people share and also God. These things evolve over time and they have to adapt to our progressive culture.
A Christian homosexual cannot get married, but an atheist heterosexual can. So does this really have anything to do with religion?
Tamer Brad Wrote:Ominous Wrote:-A gay president in 2084?
-We're realistic.
If there are no civil/legal differences between a civil union and 'marriage', why would anyone who doesn't belong to a religious affiliation want to get married, let alone gay couples? I'm curious. Is it the whole ceremonious/party deal? You can still have a party with a civil union, I'm sure.
I've always felt 'marriage' and religion went hand in hand, as 'marriage' has a deep-seated meaning in theology (along with the emotional/social meanings).
Yeah, non-Christians don't celebrate Christmas right?
The meaning of these things is not static over time. Marriage is no longer an exclusively religious event; for most people, it's about the love two people share, not about the love two people share and also God. These things evolve over time and they have to adapt to our progressive culture.
A Christian homosexual cannot get married, but an atheist heterosexual can. So does this really have anything to do with religion?
I wasn't discussing rights, though. I was bringing up intent. To me, it seems like the civil union is the 'secular marriage' - the 'Christmas for non-Christians', if you will. If you get the same benefits as a ceremonious marriage, and can pull off the same shindig, does it really matter to you?
At the same time, though, do you feel a church/synagogue/temple has the right to turn down a couple who is trying to get married because they do not share the beliefs of that institution? I know this already happens to some people who are atheists who try to get married at some churches (who refuse to marry you unless one of you is a Christian)? For this question, whether you feel that's fair or not doesn't really apply to what I'm trying to get at. But do you feel they have a right to exercise their beliefs to the fullest within their own place of worship?
Quote:At the same time, though, do you feel a church/synagogue/temple has the right to turn down a couple who is trying to get married because they do not share the beliefs of that institution?
It is absolutely their right to deny that. I don't have the right to force my atheism on a church. I think anyone who feels they should be allowed to force other religious institutions to marry them is being ridiculous.
I suppose they do have the right to exercise their beliefs, but at the same time, some beliefs, in my eyes at least, border on discrimination and use these so called "beliefs" as a means of discriminating legally.
It's like me walking into a gas station and being refused service because I'm gay. They don't get away with it, but somehow churches and the like can? I'm sorry, what?
The simple truth to me is that these religions are so hellbent (pun somewhat intended) on condemning those that stray from their way of life that they don't see the bigger picture here: humanity.
Some of my friend's parents forbid them from speaking to me anymore when they found out I was gay. I don't think you can really understand what it's like to be denied something until you've had it happen to you.
It's not hard for you to take this stance or viewpoint on marriage because it's not an issue you face, it's not something you'll have to deal with. You can waltz right into any old church or what have you and be married. The rest of us have to go through a lengthy and unnecessarily cumbersome process to be "unionized". Think about how that sounds. Would you like to be titled that? Even so, in their current state, civil unions are not equal in rights and benefits to heterosexual marriage. This brings me back to my point of most religious groups being horribly elitist. They're basically saying that because they are religious and are wed in a church or whatever that they are entitled to better rights and benefits (tax cuts, visitation rights, etc.) than everyone else.
This is ridiculous and I can't believe anyone who says they have any sort of morals at all would defend it.
In the end this isn't about religious beliefs or entitlements or any of that carp. This is about a segment of the world's population being done a huge injustice simply because they do not conform to a set of religious beliefs.
Where else in the legal system is this tolerated?
For carp sake, homosexuals aren't even covered against hate crimes by the law.
Augh. I can't even make coherent sentences anymore. This is frustrating me far more than it should.
It's like me walking into a gas station and being refused service because I'm gay. They don't get away with it, but somehow churches and the like can? I'm sorry, what?
The simple truth to me is that these religions are so hellbent (pun somewhat intended) on condemning those that stray from their way of life that they don't see the bigger picture here: humanity.
Some of my friend's parents forbid them from speaking to me anymore when they found out I was gay. I don't think you can really understand what it's like to be denied something until you've had it happen to you.
It's not hard for you to take this stance or viewpoint on marriage because it's not an issue you face, it's not something you'll have to deal with. You can waltz right into any old church or what have you and be married. The rest of us have to go through a lengthy and unnecessarily cumbersome process to be "unionized". Think about how that sounds. Would you like to be titled that? Even so, in their current state, civil unions are not equal in rights and benefits to heterosexual marriage. This brings me back to my point of most religious groups being horribly elitist. They're basically saying that because they are religious and are wed in a church or whatever that they are entitled to better rights and benefits (tax cuts, visitation rights, etc.) than everyone else.
This is ridiculous and I can't believe anyone who says they have any sort of morals at all would defend it.
In the end this isn't about religious beliefs or entitlements or any of that carp. This is about a segment of the world's population being done a huge injustice simply because they do not conform to a set of religious beliefs.
Where else in the legal system is this tolerated?
For carp sake, homosexuals aren't even covered against hate crimes by the law.
Augh. I can't even make coherent sentences anymore. This is frustrating me far more than it should.
Roan, I definitely agree that from a civil rights standpoint, you should be seen as equal. I didn't realize, however, that these rights were not brought up to par as yet, which is a shame.
It is unfortunate that Christians tunnel vision themselves to develop feelings of hate towards gays. It is the antithesis of the sole commandment Christ gave - Love (of God, and of one another). I do agree elitism plays a major role in all of this. Why do you think pride is a 'deadly sin'? D=
It is unfortunate that Christians tunnel vision themselves to develop feelings of hate towards gays. It is the antithesis of the sole commandment Christ gave - Love (of God, and of one another). I do agree elitism plays a major role in all of this. Why do you think pride is a 'deadly sin'? D=
Ominous Wrote:It is unfortunate that Christians tunnel vision themselves to develop feelings of hate towards gays. It is the antithesis of the sole commandment Christ gave - Love (of God, and of one another). I do agree elitism plays a major role in all of this. Why do you think pride is a 'deadly sin'? D=
Suffice it to say that this is why I hate my country with such a burning passion.
It's absolutely run by people like this.
Quote:It's like me walking into a gas station and being refused service because I'm gay. They don't get away with it, but somehow churches and the like can? I'm sorry, what?
1. Businesses have the right to refuse service to anyone.
2. This is totally not the same thing as a church turning down a gay couple.
Tamer Brad Wrote:Quote:It's like me walking into a gas station and being refused service because I'm gay. They don't get away with it, but somehow churches and the like can? I'm sorry, what?
1. Businesses have the right to refuse service to anyone.
2. This is totally not the same thing as a church turning down a gay couple.
Pfft, please.
Try and tell me that businesses don't abuse this right. I know gay people who lost their jobs when they came out at work.
Guess what? Job security for gays isn't something the US government thinks carp of either.
Maybe it's because you don't live in the US, but I don't think you realize how prevalent racism and discrimination in general is here.
Roan Wrote:Tamer Brad Wrote:Quote:It's like me walking into a gas station and being refused service because I'm gay. They don't get away with it, but somehow churches and the like can? I'm sorry, what?
1. Businesses have the right to refuse service to anyone.
2. This is totally not the same thing as a church turning down a gay couple.
Pfft, please.
Try and tell me that businesses don't abuse this right. I know gay people who lost their jobs when they came out at work.
Guess what? Job security for gays isn't something the US government thinks carp of either.
Losing your job is still different from being refused a good/service. I was under the impression that it would be considered wrongful dismissal to be terminated from employment due to sexual orientation (along with race, religion, etc).
Still Roan, you can't say being turned down for gas is the same as being turned down by a priest etc. after you ask them to do something that completely defies the religious beliefs of themselves and of the institution you're asking to MARRY you.
Ominous Wrote:Roan Wrote:Tamer Brad Wrote:Quote:It's like me walking into a gas station and being refused service because I'm gay. They don't get away with it, but somehow churches and the like can? I'm sorry, what?
1. Businesses have the right to refuse service to anyone.
2. This is totally not the same thing as a church turning down a gay couple.
Pfft, please.
Try and tell me that businesses don't abuse this right. I know gay people who lost their jobs when they came out at work.
Guess what? Job security for gays isn't something the US government thinks carp of either.
Losing your job is still different from being refused a good/service. I was under the impression that it would be considered wrongful dismissal to be terminated from employment due to sexual orientation (along with race, religion, etc).
It's different, sure.
But I know that businesses abuse this right. I've seen it happen in the very place I work. I used to have a manager that refused to wait on black people. Yeah, you read that right.
Granted, he was fired eventually for this, but he WOULD NOT wait on them. Wouldn't allow us to either.
Whenever anyone said something to him about it, he'd give us that exact line: "We withhold the right to refuse service" and try and pass it off like he wasn't being a racist prick.
It is considered wrong in many minds, and while I'm not sure of the US as a whole, the state of Michigan offers no protection on the basis of sexual orientation in the workplace. I could legally lose my job if I told the wrong person I was gay.
Luckily I don't work for a big corporate organization so it's not really something I have to worry about too much, but it's still a possibility. I couldn't even do anything about it should it happen. I would have no real legal basis to sue or anything like that.
God, talking about this sort of stuff makes me dread my future that much more. Ever wonder why the suicide rate among gay teens is so much higher than everyone else? Talk about a bleak outlook.
Doesn't help activism on the part of gays if their young and upcoming hopefuls are doing themselves in!
People need to be a bit more proactive about seeing it through. It helps more people than just yourself.
Seems some youth are too easy to accept the world the way it is and are throwing in the towel, rather than seeing it as a project that is ripe for revolution and a brighter future. It's all about perspective.
People need to be a bit more proactive about seeing it through. It helps more people than just yourself.
Seems some youth are too easy to accept the world the way it is and are throwing in the towel, rather than seeing it as a project that is ripe for revolution and a brighter future. It's all about perspective.
Ominous Wrote:It's all about perspective.
Mine sucks; I know. lol
I'd never kill myself over it but really, I don't have a lot of optimism in my life.
/emo moment
People have been calling me gay on XBL all day.
Then I see this, wtf.
Then I see this, wtf.