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Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF

Nov. 10, 2012  9:33 AM
 
Killerken Dragooon DF105 LRF vs. MF-H Death Aquario BD145 RDF


Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lH1eXG_IGvg

- Tested and filmed by Arena1138 / lewis1138
- Death is always launched first.
- BB-10 MFB Stadium
- 3 rounds

Results:
Killerken Dragooon DF105 LRF: 0 wins
MF-H Death Aquario BD145 RDF: 3 wins (All OS)
Killerken Win %: 0%


My personal notes: Death is at it again, proving that it is a anti spin-equalizer. I've yet to see Meow and anyone else to try to knockout this Death combo, and take this testing to 10 - 20 rounds. If possible, dual testing and filming will be greatly appreciated.

My personal thanks and shoutouts: Seriously, THANK YOU Arena1138 for taking the time to take my request and film this matchup. He deserves to be known more, since he is active and posts just about anything that is requested. Subscribe to him and make battle requests to his channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/Arena1138?feature=watch
Nov. 10, 2012  10:04 AM
 
(Sep. 14, 2012  1:01 AM)Kain_Highwind Wrote: Got to get a Killerken! How is the recoil with those 2 synchromed? Can you test against Death _____ W145WD?
IT has good recoil and since I watch meow It can also spin steal GrinD
Nov. 10, 2012  10:47 AM
 
To Vixxterity:
what do you think about the MF-H Death Aquario BD145RDF? Tongue_out_wink
What I know: KO = Stadium Out (Knock Out)
OS = Sleep Out (? ?)
Nov. 10, 2012  11:18 AM
 
(Nov. 10, 2012  10:47 AM)lewis1138 Wrote: To Vixxterity:
what do you think about the MF-H Death Aquario BD145RDF? Tongue_out_wink
What I know: KO = Stadium Out (Knock Out)
OS = Sleep Out (? ?)

I won't know how good is Death Aquario is until I actually own Dragooon and other Zero-G competitive parts and test it myself.

OS does mean Sleep Out / OutSpin if that's what you're questioning.

Nov. 10, 2012  9:45 PM
 
Hmm, your LRF is really worn, I wonder if it'll work with a fairly new one like I have...

Could you compare test results to L Drago Guardian DF105LRF? I want to see the difference in performance between the two, and since LDG is the heaviest non-synchrome left spin (I think? Correct me if I'm wrong, maybe Variares is) and the fact that it's my best spin equalizer I have, heh.
Nov. 10, 2012  11:25 PM
 
I don't have much trouble koing it. His LRF is actually way to new for this combo. It's just that he isn't launching hard enough to KO and his slide path is too tight for Killerken Dragooon.

His slide path would be perfect for a smash attacker like Flash, but Killerken Dragooon doesn't aim to directly KO defense types like that. Killerken Dragooon destabilizes its opponent into the tornado ridge and then taps it out from there. You need a sort of wider shoot.

I'll make a video explaining it and demonstrating it.
Nov. 10, 2012  11:38 PM
 
(Nov. 10, 2012  11:25 PM)Meow! Wrote: I don't have much trouble koing it. His LRF is actually way to new for this combo. It's just that he isn't launching hard enough to KO and his slide path is too tight for Killerken Dragooon.

His slide path would be perfect for a smash attacker like Flash, but Killerken Dragooon doesn't aim to directly KO defense types like that. Killerken Dragooon destabilizes its opponent into the tornado ridge and then taps it out from there. You need a sort of wider shoot.

I'll make a video explaining it and demonstrating it.

Okay, what if you made it so that Death would be soft launched to the point where it'll circle around closer to center of the stadium? And plus I've still have yet to see tournament footage of this combo being used.
Nov. 11, 2012  1:05 AM
 
I tried this earlier, and had no problem shoving Death out of the stadium too. It can't OS Death of course, but I have yet to see a left spin combo that could.

Just out of curiosity, what's up with the tournament footage comment? There are a lot of successful combos that don't have actual tournament video proof.
Nov. 11, 2012  2:42 AM
 
(Nov. 11, 2012  1:05 AM)Kain_Highwind Wrote: I tried this earlier, and had no problem shoving Death out of the stadium too. It can't OS Death of course, but I have yet to see a left spin combo that could.

Just out of curiosity, what's up with the tournament footage comment? There are a lot of successful combos that don't have actual tournament video proof.

After the responses so far, I'll take into consideration that this Death combo can be knocked out by Killerken Dragooon. I'll wait for Meow's video on how launching Killerken is properly done.

As for the footage comment, I just want to see credibility is all. And I'm not surprised if there are winning combos out there that hasn't been revealed though here or by footage yet. After all that's the fun of it.

I believe there's a number of bias variables involved with solo-testing, especially when it comes to Attack vs. Defense, but that's for another topic. I just want to ask everyone here, what do you think testing means? Apologies again for going off-topic.
Nov. 11, 2012  3:28 AM
 

The video kinda explains it all. I actully made this before you requesteded to launch lighter with death, but I doubt it would matter because Killerken Dragooon's path goes through the center anyway.
Nov. 11, 2012  3:50 AM
 
Meow!, is there any reason Death was used in attack mode? I always thought defense mode was better but maybe I'm wrong.
Nov. 11, 2012  3:57 AM
 
I tried to keep it consistent with what Lewis1138 used. I do agree though, defense mode is generally better for the particular purpose of that Death combo.
Nov. 11, 2012  4:22 AM
 
Ah... I see.
Nov. 11, 2012  11:27 PM
 
Just curious, is this combo high enough to destablize MF-M Duo 230MB? I'm thinking it can, since synchromes are usually pretty high, and LRF is pretty high itself. Also, you don't have to make a video about it, but as I said in my post above, could you do some unofficial tests with L Drago Guardian DF105LRF and see how it compares?
Nov. 13, 2012  4:53 PM
 
(Nov. 11, 2012  2:42 AM)Vixxterity Wrote: As for the footage comment, I just want to see credibility is all. And I'm not surprised if there are winning combos out there that hasn't been revealed though here or by footage yet. After all that's the fun of it.

I believe there's a number of bias variables involved with solo-testing, especially when it comes to Attack vs. Defense, but that's for another topic. I just want to ask everyone here, what do you think testing means? Apologies again for going off-topic.

I completely agree that there are a lot of defferences between solo testing and testing with a partner. Heck, there are a lot of differences between testing with a partner and playing in a tournament.

Sorry if I came off a little rude, I just also believe a lot of good combos get dismissed as bad because some people lack the skill to make the combo perform like it should. I think these same people put the combo together, try it for a few rounds, and if they don't see immediate results they dismiss it as bad, or demand proof. If I judged Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF by how it performed when I first tried it, then I would have said it was a bad combo. However, after practicing and especially studying Meow!'s original videos, I can see its potential. I am by no means suggesting you are one of these people, but I believe this happens a lot more than we realize.

BladerPegasis Wrote:Just curious, is this combo high enough to destablize MF-M Duo 230MB? I'm thinking it can, since synchromes are usually pretty high, and LRF is pretty high itself. Also, you don't have to make a video about it, but as I said in my post above, could you do some unofficial tests with L Drago Guardian DF105LRF and see how it compares?

I am also curious about this vs. Duo 230MB. However, I believe Killerken Dragooon will have the upper hand because Duo 230MB's biggest weakness is spin stealers. If I get some extra time soon I will give this a shot.
Nov. 14, 2012  4:46 AM
 
(Nov. 13, 2012  4:53 PM)Kain_Highwind Wrote:
(Nov. 11, 2012  2:42 AM)Vixxterity Wrote: As for the footage comment, I just want to see credibility is all. And I'm not surprised if there are winning combos out there that hasn't been revealed though here or by footage yet. After all that's the fun of it.

I believe there's a number of bias variables involved with solo-testing, especially when it comes to Attack vs. Defense, but that's for another topic. I just want to ask everyone here, what do you think testing means? Apologies again for going off-topic.

I completely agree that there are a lot of defferences between solo testing and testing with a partner. Heck, there are a lot of differences between testing with a partner and playing in a tournament.

Sorry if I came off a little rude, I just also believe a lot of good combos get dismissed as bad because some people lack the skill to make the combo perform like it should. I think these same people put the combo together, try it for a few rounds, and if they don't see immediate results they dismiss it as bad, or demand proof. If I judged Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF by how it performed when I first tried it, then I would have said it was a bad combo. However, after practicing and especially studying Meow!'s original videos, I can see its potential. I am by no means suggesting you are one of these people, but I believe this happens a lot more than we realize.

I'm not at all dismissing that this Killerken Dragooon combo is a bad combo, especially seeing as it can spin steal/equalize and KO a great amount of defense combos. I was just wondering if there are defense combos that can anti-spin equalize and maybe have a chance of survival against this thing. So I thought why not the currently known anti-spin equalizer Death wheel?

So far, this combo is still scary on a theoretical level. Shoving off stamina combos with ease, completely negating most defense combos' chance of OSing (most notably defense combos with either the E230 track or the BD145 track), and bringing one of the hardest matchups for Flash.

The real question is, how will it perform in real time? And if ever tested, how will it perform against its left-spin defensive counterpart MSF-H ____ Dragooon BD145 RDF/CS?
Nov. 14, 2012  3:30 PM
 
Equipment
Spoiler (Click to View)
Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF vs Duo Aquario SR200MB
Spoiler (Click to View)
Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF vs Duo Aquario 230MB
Spoiler (Click to View)
Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF vs Duo Aquario E230MB
Spoiler (Click to View)
Nov. 14, 2012  10:17 PM
 
Seems funny how SR200 managed to give it so much trouble. I'll try Duo TH195MB as it is the closest thing I have. Thanks for the tests!
Nov. 14, 2012  10:33 PM
 
(Nov. 14, 2012  10:17 PM)Meow! Wrote: Seems funny how SR200 managed to give it so much trouble. I'll try Duo TH195MB as it is the closest thing I have. Thanks for the tests!

Not long ago, Ingulit and I were discussing SR200 vs. TH195. He actually tried Duo SR200/TH195MB, and said that Duo SR200MB performed better than Duo TH195MB for whatever the reason. He could probably explain better as to why it did better, but he said that Duo SR200MB was no joke.
Nov. 15, 2012  1:08 PM
 
I think that SR200 and 230 are the best track for stamina. Are stronger than TH195 IMHO.
Dec. 16, 2012  7:17 PM
 
Hey can someone test Killerken Dragooon DF105 LRF against MSF-H Saramanda Reviser BD145 RDF ? I'm just wondering if this can get above a 80% win rate against MSF-H Saramanda Revizer BD145 RDF...

Edit: I wonder if Killerken Dragooon can get above a 80% win rate.
Dec. 22, 2012  1:57 AM
 
can you sub revizer for killerken?
Dec. 22, 2012  2:11 AM
 
Sure. You can also sub MSF-H for MSF if you don't have one.
Jan. 21, 2013  9:16 PM
 
I figured I would post a test to help this combo get on the top tier list- because it should be. Unfortunately, I don't own DF105 or LRF, so I had to use W105 R2F.
Killerken Dragooon W105 R2F vs MF-H Death Aquario E230 RDF
 Dragooon:11 Wins(All KO)
Death:9 Wins(All OS)
8 Ties
Too many ties lol
Jan. 27, 2013  4:44 AM
 
(Nov. 13, 2012  4:53 PM)KainHighwind Wrote: Sorry if I came off a little rude, I just also believe a lot of good combos get dismissed as bad because some people lack the skill to make the combo perform like it should. I think these same people put the combo together, try it for a few rounds, and if they don't see immediate results they dismiss it as bad, or demand proof. If I judged Killerken Dragooon DF105LRF by how it performed when I first tried it, then I would have said it was a bad combo. However, after practicing and especially studying Meow!'s original videos, I can see its potential. I am by no means suggesting you are one of these people, but I believe this happens a lot more than we realize.

I had done this myself with DF105. I was for some reason getting better results with the LW105 and traded it off to my nephew for an 85. Eventually I read this thread/post and realized I may have judged it too harshly. Now all I can hope for is that my nephew will trade me back.

Curse me for my ignorance!
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