Okay, the last thing I've seen posted on the subject by Leonewind is the following quote:

The Hasbro sub forum would include the following.

•Located in the Customization Forum
•All normal threads would he combo testing threads
•Important threads would be Rules, Hasbro Build Me a Combo, for exampe

Look, the idea isnt perfect yet, and sitting here debating over an incomplete idea is stupid. thats why Lord Wolfblade, Ga'Hooleone, hopefuly MoonAlchemist, and I are going to work on it outside the WBBA and when we are finished, present it to the Comitee.

Also, I think there has been a misunderstanding. This sub forum we want so badly is strictly for combo making, not all aspects of beyblade.

If anyone else would like to help in the creation of this sub forum, pm me and I will brief you on all the details regarding the project.

I fear that this conversation is more or less consuming this thread, and there are plenty of more productive things to be doing so agian, lets end it.

So, I believe, it is completely unnecessary to create a Hasbro Sub-forum.

As I have spelt out in a post earlier within the topic linked to in the quote, the following reasons are why:

1) The only stadium which would be acceptable would be the Max Stampede Stadium, with no guarantee that any stadium better will come out.

Furthermore, due to the similar aesthetics of most of Hasbro stadiums, it is highly unlikely that any "Hasbro blader" will be able to purchase one if they already have a stadium.

Therefore, would this drop in quality lead only to a small amount of only one group of bladers to conduct tests?

Rather, is there any problem with submitting a request in the Combo testing requests thread if the combo in question is recieving good results within a hasbro stadium?

2) There is already a thread for top tier Hasbro BMF combos, as well as a testing thread for them, what need is there for more?

3) Any new releases and information from Hasbro are already recorded within the appropriate thread.

What else is needed?

By creating a sub-forum, it would create further work for the committee, while also further dividing the Beyblade community.

The argument that those without access to TT stadiums suffer a disadvantage since they "can't practice at home" is also invalid, as no one is allowing or disallowing you from practicing in any stadium you want, as long as it's not an official match you could practice on your lap.

Creating a sub-forum also leads to the need for more moderators, and not to be offensive, I do not think any of the advocators for Hasbro are up to being a mod.

In conclusion, anything provided by a sub-forum is already provided in the appropriate threads, and there is no need for a Hasbro sub-forum. The only other positive is the self satisfaction of those who do not have access to TT or SK beys saying "I'm a Hasbro blader", and the furtherance of the misconception that Hasbro beys are indestructible compared to their TT and SK counterparts.

Anyway, I guess discussion is in order, but from the replies I've seen in the topic where Leonewind's post is linked from, I haven't seen any points come up which have brought anything new to the picture.

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1. the LF is also legal as it is almost as good as the MXS

2. that top tier thread was bad so it was closed, that thread is no longer in use. at this moment we are trying to test combos for a new and better list

3. also the sub-forum would be for tests only, not all hasbro stuff

but, i do not think a hasbro sub-forum should be opened (yet) as we dont even have a tier list yet (there are some other reasons but i just woke up and thats the only one i can think of

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1. No, this was established a long time ago in Leone's own thread, and he has recognised this.

2. it doesn't take much to create a top tier list, just use the outclassed normal one.

3. there's already a test thread, why would you need a whole forum for testing?

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1. No, this was established a long time ago in Leone's own thread, and he has recognised this.

2. it doesn't take much to create a top tier list, just use the outclassed normal one.

3. there's already a test thread, why would you need a whole forum for testing?

1. hmm i am the one making the rules for the meta-game right now (until me and others start it together), and i say it is legal

2. a combo needs 4 tests in total, and be tested be 3-4 people

3. IIRC so that hasbro tests dont get mixed with TT tests

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1. So, despite the fact that, long ago we found it far from satisfactory, you are the benefactor of "Hasbro beyblading", so rich in it's knowledge so you think it's okay.

2. So you think there was less than 4 tests for the old top tier lists to be made?

There was muchmore than that.

3. Oh my bad, I can see how you think the HASBRO TESTING THREAD wasn't obvious enough, or how this title could be mistaken for TT or SK.

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I am not sure how good this topic will turn out to be ...

Anyway, as I already wrote, you can only have one stadium for testing, because there are always some conditions that can vary between BeyStadiums, and results would therefore not be comparable.

Hah I was aware of the potential for arguments, but there were thinngs I wanted to point out without cluttering up the other thread further.

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While I understand all your points, I did say that all further discussion about this should be on hold. Currently, myself, lord Wolfblade, Ga'Hooleone, and Moon Alchemist are perfecting a draft for the sub forum outside of the WBBA. Personaly, polite discusions about this are nice and prductive, but It will soon be ineviyavly ruined by noobs and people who have no idea wht they are saying. My POV is that hasbro has seperate tiers, arent you tired of noobs making combos for PTW that serve no purpose what so ever? When you mix real productive posys with unproductive useless posts, informatipn gets cluttered and confusing, hence why some people still think PTW is the same as Max Stampede or Lightning Force. What is wrong about having the customization thread organized. in trurh it equally benifits hasbro testers as it does normal testers. and we arent saying that Attack Stadium combos should ignore hasbro, that would be dumb. what we are saying is that hasbro needs a extremly small space to post its own combos

While I understand all your points, I did say that all further discussion about this should be on hold. Currently, myself, lord Wolfblade, Ga'Hooleone, and Moon Alchemist are perfecting a draft for the sub forum outside of the WBBA. Personaly, polite discusions about this are nice and prductive, but It will soon be ineviyavly ruined by noobs and people who have no idea wht they are saying. My POV is that hasbro has seperate tiers, arent you tired of noobs making combos for PTW that serve no purpose what so ever? When you mix real productive posys with unproductive useless posts, informatipn gets cluttered and confusing, hence why some people still think PTW is the same as Max Stampede or Lightning Force. What is wrong about having the customization thread organized. in trurh it equally benifits hasbro testers as it does normal testers. and we arent saying that Attack Stadium combos should ignore hasbro, that would be dumb. what we are saying is that hasbro needs a extremly small space to post its own combos

While you are "perfecting a draft for the sub forum outside of the WBBA." why not ask other players for input? I think you are missing out on many other people's talent. I think you are just elitist and prejudiced if you think it will be "neviyavly ruined by noobs and people who have no idea wht they are saying."

Just make a thread for each different stadium thatll discuss tiers, combos and testing. Pretty simple.

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http://www.youtube.com/standupthevanguard

You've said i's a draft, LeoneTempest, but you have yet to say there will be anything new at all within the sub-forum? Wouldn't a draft mean you're only fine tuning ideas? Not coming up with whole other things you need the sub-forum for.

Besides, I believe I've already countered the entirety of your concept since it was only for customisation, well, we have appropriate threads.

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I completely agree with momiji manju, why would we need a Hasbro Subforum? We already have many Hasbro-oriented threads.

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1. So, despite the fact that, long ago we found it far from satisfactory, you are the benefactor of "Hasbro beyblading", so rich in it's knowledge so you think it's okay.

2. So you think there was less than 4 tests for the old top tier lists to be made?

There was muchmore than that.

3. Oh my bad, I can see how you think the HASBRO TESTING THREAD wasn't obvious enough, or how this title could be mistaken for TT or SK.

1. they found if far from satisfactory because it was tested with combos that do good in TT stadiums, not combos that do good in hasbro stadiums

also the balance stadiums is slighty worse then the TT attack but it is legal, the LF is slightly worse then the MXS but the difference is very, very small

2. yeah all by one person, when others got different results. for a combo to be top tier it needs to be tested by many and all get close to the same results for accuracy, not just allot by one person...

3. yet still people make threads with hasbro testing even though we have that thread

and i am not for the sub-forum, nor am a against it, i myself think it is all that needed... yet

The argument that those without access to TT stadiums suffer a disadvantage since they "can't practice at home" is also invalid, as no one is allowing or disallowing you from practicing in any stadium you want, as long as it's not an official match you could practice on your lap.

to bad that playing in a hasbro stadium is different then playing in a TT stadium in some ways

also it more meant that people without TT stadiums may feel like they cant contribute at all because there stadium is fail like most say, yet it is not fail (the SVS and PTW kinda are though) it is just different

the furtherance of the misconception that Hasbro beys are indestructible compared to their TT and SK counterparts.

that has not and will not happen...

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1. So you're saying it's acceptable if you have lower standards?

It was tested with classic attack, defence and stamina combos.

"Hasbro combos" that do well there are only F/HF/ HF/S versions of attack types (even this is dubious, I definitely wouldn't say well) and destabilisers.

So then the entire Hasbro metagame would be stamina and destabilisers, in a metagame where attack is already rare in tournaments despite their high win rates.

How is that conducive to any sort of metagame?

2. That makes no sense whatsoever? Why would it be best from one person? Top tiers were made so after dozens of tests, and furthered as they were used as the basis of testing new combos, and constantly triumphing.

3. Yet people still spam "How do I get a beypointer", that's irrelevant. If they can't seem the large "Hasbro", they won't see a sub-forum. The threads provide all that which a sub-forum would, minus all the administrative work, and drop in standards of the beyblading community as a whole.

I already pointed out the flaw in that, in which if someone finds a combo they find is very good, use the parts testing requests thread. I even linked to it in the OP. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, except for those trying to garner attention and claim their combo is instantly top tier. No one is stopping them from testing, it's just not formal testing and won't be taken seriously. That fits pretty much perfectly into the aim of the parts testing requests thread.

And yes, it is common misconception that they break less easily. It's an obvious exaggeration that they are indestructible, but slightly better materials equate to parts that won't break as easily as TT or SK parts. However if you abuse parts to the point they break, Hasbro parts will break anyway. You really can't argue this, it's seen in almost every post asking whether hasbro is better or TT/SK.

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1. i do not have low standerds, the LF is almost the same as the MXS, so close that they are almost the same

also are attack types KO, destablizers do not, and in hasbro stadiums attack>stamina>defence>attack...

2. how? the first list was filled by the test of 1-2 members, but others got different results. top tiers are from lots of tests, but those test should be from more then one person

how about this, Bluezee has a "special" launch that lets him get 85 to beat 230, does that mean that 85>230, no, why? because for everyone else 230>85

3. i dont see how it will, and i do not really care if hasbro sub forum is made

dude, whenever i posted tests before i was told "oh you did it in a hasbro stadium therefore your tests are fail" (i wasn't told exactly that)

yes hasbro parts are a bit better then TT and SK, but not by much, and many still say TT parts are better (well for burn and earth...)

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Then MXS should not even be considered as legal as it's a lot less balanced than the Attack stadium.

And that's why it failed.

Because there's the need to moderate it, as it would definitely be filled with more SPAM.

That's because you posted up a thread, not in the parts testing request thread.

It's obvious noone will consider your combo if it's like "Hey guys! New defence combo absolutely destroys attack...in a Hasbro stadium".

post worthwhile combos like attack types that do well in a Hasbro stadium, or stamina types or destabilisers.

If you post for attack though, be sure to at least pit it against a top tier opponent.

If you can't, then how can you be sure your combo is that good in anycase? I.e, Ray may have good results against WB, but it's dismal against any rubber defence bottoms.

Thus if you found a combo that worked well with Ray as an attack type, and tried to post about it, of course you would be dismissed.

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Then MXS should not even be considered as legal as it's a lot less balanced than the Attack stadium.

And that's why it failed.

it isn't that much less balanced at all, it is just different, so the combos need to be different as well

Because there's the need to moderate it, as it would definitely be filled with more SPAM.

spam is not much of a problem

That's because you posted up a thread, not in the parts testing request thread.

It's obvious noone will consider your combo if it's like "Hey guys! New defence combo absolutely destroys attack...in a Hasbro stadium".

uh i did not make a thread, i posted in the parts testing request thread FYI, no matter where you post people will say the same thing

post worthwhile combos like attack types that do well in a Hasbro stadium, or stamina types or destabilisers.

If you post for attack though, be sure to at least pit it against a top tier opponent.

we do :\

If you can't, then how can you be sure your combo is that good in anycase? I.e, Ray may have good results against WB, but it's dismal against any rubber defence bottoms.

Thus if you found a combo that worked well with Ray as an attack type, and tried to post about it, of course you would be dismissed.

by having others test it as well obviously

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Someone would only test it if it got exceptional results.

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Someone would only test it if it got exceptional results.

that is the problem, people should test anyways. by doing so the person who made the combo can see if their combo is truly good or not by having another's test results <- offtopic, and i do not see any more reason for this thread, it is obvious a hasbro sub-forum wont happen anytime soon.

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in regards to it being off the WBO, if you read my sig (which needs to be shortened) it does say if you want to help out, PM me so dont say we wont let people join. ANYONE CAN JOIN THIS PROJECT BY PMING ME!

and Momiji, this argument isnt productive anymore. You refuse to accept any pros this idea has. I gave you my arguments, and you gave yours. Now let it go, and lets close this thread. You are viewing this from a completely negative point of view. I have read all your posts regarding this and I understand what you are trying to say, but please make the attempt to understand what others say as well. I am not trying to insult you, I am merley pointing out that you musttry to see from our side of the argument.

and i repeat, ANYONE INTERESTED IN PARTICIPATION CAN PM ME.

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Ill tell you what Momiji, if you can learn at least 5 things after reading the entire Hasbro combo thread without thier being a single rulebreak or contridiction, then yes, I will agree with you. But oh wait...that possibility doesnt exist. Everything in the current hasbri thread is cluttered, disorganized and just plain sloppy. We arent asking to divide the metagame. We just wanr information to be organized!!! Can you atleast agree on that with me???

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and agian, a good 50% of this forum are hasbro bladers. I dont care if MXS islegalized or not, but can we atkeast let players know which beyblades are good for recreational play. is that suitable????????

in regards to it being off the WBO, if you read my sig (which needs to be shortened) it does say if you want to help out, PM me so dont say we wont let people join. ANYONE CAN JOIN THIS PROJECT BY PMING ME!

and Momiji, this argument isnt productive anymore. You refuse to accept any pros this idea has. I gave you my arguments, and you gave yours. Now let it go, and lets close this thread. You are viewing this from a completely negative point of view. I have read all your posts regarding this and I understand what you are trying to say, but please make the attempt to understand what others say as well. I am not trying to insult you, I am merley pointing out that you musttry to see from our side of the argument.

it's still productive, it's actually getting to a point where all points are being brought up. He's definitely not being negative, he's just showing his point of view. And his point of view is different from yours which causes you to see it as negativity.
He's looking at it from a What is best for the WBO, and will this benefit us, point of view, whereas you are looking at it from a Will this help the people with hasbro-only parts, and organize clutter, point of view.

and i repeat, ANYONE INTERESTED IN PARTICIPATION CAN PM ME.

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Ill tell you what Momiji, if you can learn at least 5 things after reading the entire Hasbro combo thread without thier being a single rulebreak or contridiction, then yes, I will agree with you. But oh wait...that possibility doesnt exist. Everything in the current hasbri thread is cluttered, disorganized and just plain sloppy. We arent asking to divide the metagame. We just wanr information to be organized!!! Can you atleast agree on that with me???

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well, that's sorta why there isn't a hasbro sub-forum. That's like saying that people don't make topics like "is flame byxis good to buy". It's still going to happen. If it were the way you are describing it, then the WBO would have absolutely no spam, except for hasbro spam. Let's face it, a young kid who doesn't know any better will make a stupid topic.
And, organization, how else could it be organized? If the disorganization is in a topic, then how would a sub-forum change that? There would still be the same topic, such as "Competitive BMF combos" and any clutter on this side of the field would just shift over to the hasbro side.
And that is why there will also need to be more moderating.

and agian, a good 50% of this forum are hasbro bladers. I dont care if MXS islegalized or not, but can we atkeast let players know which beyblades are good for recreational play. is that suitable????????

Yes, I agree, there are a ton of hasbro only players, but what more can be done to let people know what is good, than the things we have now?

ok i see your point. Momiji, I am sorry.

Now i must ask, how do we organize the clutter that is the hasbro testing thread without making a subforum? My argument has shifted towards lord Wolfblade's side a bit more, saying that I guess we really dont need a Hasbro sub forum, but something must be done. lord Wolfblade and I, as well as a few others who have been asked/asked to join, will continue to work on perfecting the rules of Hasbro testing and that only. Our goal will no longer be towards a sub forum. But agian, I think we should use this thread now to come up with an idea to solve the Hasbro Combo thread disorganization and clutter. Any thoughts?

I completely see what you're saying Leonetempest, the truth of the idea is that your concept is poorly formed, and already provided.

You can't give a point such as "I want a thread for customisation of Hasbro only" when you have a thread for that, which is blatantly obvious.

Everything you want, is already provided for you.

This is what I'm saying.

The attempt at a Hasbro thread was pitiful, and will continue to be so under the way it's managed.

It would be so simple to write down a list of proven combos, and have a test page for all those who have exceptional test results, and then just copy them to the OP.

I don't see how your cluttered attempt changes things.

If anything, wouldn't it show that if a few threads can't be managed then a whole sub-forum would be impossible?

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I guess you are right for the most part. But do you think there is anyway possible to somehow organize the hasbro thread in the slightest?

Report posts.
That's pretty much all you can do.