Well yes attack is "Dominating" in testing. At tournament a lot of people including myself have the tournament jitters and get self K.O.'d with attack combos a decent amount of times. The same thing with Daegor, Kei, etc. In essence at tournaments every type is equal due to that fact. Trust me I don't suck with attack types though. When free battling I barely ever self K.O.
Libra Re-instatement Discussion
Fine but personally I think if we bring back Libra then Defence will be a usable type then. Atm there are tons of wheels for Attack and stamina and one proper one for Defence. Compared to when it was banned it isn't such an unbeatable wheel now. It's stamina is outclassed and Libra CH120RF will not stand up to a decent attack type like MF Pegasis 145RF. Like I said I think we need testing to be done not more arguements between the few people on this thread which aren't getting us very far.
Well but the defense metagame is much more simple than the attack metagame. Basically get a wheel with weight focused around the outside and little to no recoil. I.E. Virgo, Earth. After that it's simple, add friction and weight. That doesn't mean that we cant change other parts though. The wheel is just one of the 6 part defense system. (counting the metal face as a part). So you got, MF-2 which someone did testing on and it wrecked on top tier attack. R145 that will aid against high attackers such Pegasis because it's the heaviest track available. MB that may add extra weight making it more viable vs. attack types. A new, heavier clear wheel than bull may come out adding even more weight. So think outside the box, just because you cant find a replacement for the wheel doesn't mean that you can't change the other five parts. (Again counting the face because with the MF-2's they added a whole new layer to the metagame.)
(Aug. 15, 2010 12:04 PM)Cpt. Squirrel Wrote: I think it'd be too much work, but I'd do it if others want me to.
No one person has to do it in particular, heck I'd be up to write it, I'd just need a team of anti-banners behind me giving me info and protips.
Same goes for pro-ban
In pretty much every competitive community ever, whenever there's a banning/unbanning discussion, both sides take the time to create a post that thouroughly summarizes there side of the argument, then has a poll, then the hierarchy makes the final decision.
Temporary un-ban maybe?
I agree with the temporary unban. This would make us able to see how it would be used in tourneys and how it now performs.
I would have to disagree. Since no formal testing has been done and it's still as game-breaking as before and someone wins with Libra then it wouldn't be fair to the others because they didn't get libra because it's banned. This is totally impartial as I have a Libra.
Any arguments pertaining to cost is a moot point, imo:
If you want to succeed, it's a financial commitment you have to make.
This isn't anybody's fault; the WBO isn't responsible for who is able to obtain certain parts or not, within a given timeframe. If Pisces had turned out to be a superb Wheel for Defense when it was RBV2 exclusive, should we have banned it, since "it wouldn't be fair to the others" because they couldn't buy Random Booster Volume 2s?
Dirge Wrote:[ ... ]Also with what LVJ post see my response for that.Also people who want to use attack types are they expected to fork out 100's of dollars on storm pegs to replace RFs and the spend hours wearing them to the point where they can be used correctly? Doesnt seem logical to me. [ ... ]
If you want to succeed, it's a financial commitment you have to make.
(Aug. 15, 2010 6:31 PM)Marco Wrote: I would have to disagree. Since no formal testing has been done and it's still as game-breaking as before and someone wins with Libra then it wouldn't be fair to the others because they didn't get libra because it's banned. This is totally impartial as I have a Libra.
This isn't anybody's fault; the WBO isn't responsible for who is able to obtain certain parts or not, within a given timeframe. If Pisces had turned out to be a superb Wheel for Defense when it was RBV2 exclusive, should we have banned it, since "it wouldn't be fair to the others" because they couldn't buy Random Booster Volume 2s?
Honest question- What is the point of using a defense type at tournaments? Apparently, virtually no one uses attack types and when they do, they end up hurting themselves. At the same time, many will use stamina types. I seriously don't understand the state of the tourney scene.
Here, in the UK at least, Stamina types are generally the choice. A well customised Stamina type such as Earth Bull DF145SD is an extremely "safe" choice, which has the best chance of winning. I prefer to just let it withstand any rare Attack types which crop up. It's interesting, anyway.
On an unrelated note, I would speculate that that Attack types may perform significantly differently if they are launched at the same time as the opposing Bey. I'm pretty sure it is much easier to KO a Defense/Stamina when the Attack customisation is launched after. Additionally, I will concede that it is much harder to Sliding Shoot successfully when you have an opponent opposite you, jostling for territory, as it were.
On an unrelated note, I would speculate that that Attack types may perform significantly differently if they are launched at the same time as the opposing Bey. I'm pretty sure it is much easier to KO a Defense/Stamina when the Attack customisation is launched after. Additionally, I will concede that it is much harder to Sliding Shoot successfully when you have an opponent opposite you, jostling for territory, as it were.
(Aug. 15, 2010 6:51 PM)♥ Wrote: On an unrelated note, I would speculate that that Attack types may perform significantly differently if they are launched at the same time as the opposing Bey. I'm pretty sure it is much easier to KO a Defense/Stamina when the Attack customisation is launched after. Additionally, I will concede that it is much harder to Sliding Shoot successfully when you have an opponent opposite you, jostling for territory, as it were.
Yes, exactly. People need to realize that the conditions in a tournament are completely different than in the controlled "testing" environment, and thus I would argue that all win percentages garnered through that method are skewed towards the Attack type.
And besides, not that Attack types are "dominating" tournaments by any means, but I would rather Attack types "dominate" than any other type because it takes more skill to be effective with them. If a player is skilled with an Attack type, they deserve to win.
![[Image: beybase-signature-is-beyblade-a-sport-Article.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/VLksgt2k/beybase-signature-is-beyblade-a-sport-Article.jpg)
(Aug. 15, 2010 7:03 PM)Kei Wrote: And besides, not that Attack types are "dominating" tournaments by any means, but I would rather Attack types "dominate" than any other type because it takes more skill to be effective with them. If a player is skilled with an Attack type, they deserve to win.
As something to reinforce this:
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Attack-T...e-Balancer
I don't want to necro that thread, but that is really why I just go for attack customs all the time.
I haven't commented on this yet, but, personally, I don't think the confidence of the player using an RF should be accounted for, since they know the risks and benefits of using it, regardless of being against Libra or Earth.
I haven't commented on this yet, but, personally, I don't think the confidence of the player using an RF should be accounted for, since they know the risks and benefits of using it, regardless of being against Libra or Earth.
![[Image: pakistandonationcopy.jpg]](https://a.imageshack.us/img841/8365/pakistandonationcopy.jpg)
One of my earliest points.
Blader skill is not a variable that should be accounted for when determining the legality of a part.
Blader skill is not a variable that should be accounted for when determining the legality of a part.
Ugh, I'm not really feeling up to testing today. I'll get the Libra results up eventually though.
(Aug. 15, 2010 6:31 PM)Marco Wrote: it's still as game-breaking as before
You have no proof to back that up that statement and futhermore that has been disproven since testing has shown to some degree that it isn't the best stamina wheel anymore and that the attack combos now are strong enough to beat libra defence combos. I'll do some testing soon to prove you wrong. Although it won't be till Friday cause i'm going on holiday till then from Tuesday.
Sorry Megablader I forgot to put an if before that. My bad. Also testing environments are totally different from tournament environments. Don't believe all the testing you see, it usually doesn't do nearly as well in actual tournaments. Talking about attack types here of course.
Can you come up with a different arguement? That's all you ever say. It gets really boring.
The fact that Libra's existence necessitates "Libra-killers" is the exact reason it was banned in the first place.
But it obviously doesn't if stamina is already the number one choice.
Might as well ban Burn : /
Might as well ban Burn : /
(Aug. 16, 2010 2:29 AM)Mc Frown Wrote: But it obviously doesn't if stamina is already the number one choice.
Might as well ban Burn : /
its possible to beat Burn___DF145SD with Earth Bull GB145WB
launching Earth Bull at full power alows it to move around and get hits on burn____DF145SD i know this doesnt show much but just did a quick play around
it was 2-1 to earth bull.
![[Image: Raykon-Flash-Signature.gif]](https://dmsss.webs.com/Raykon-Flash-Signature.gif)
Those are some valid results right there : |
If anything that would prove Earth Bull is better than Libra as Burn Bull dominated Libra.
Plus 145 > DF145
EDIT: What mold burn anyways?
If anything that would prove Earth Bull is better than Libra as Burn Bull dominated Libra.
Plus 145 > DF145
EDIT: What mold burn anyways?
The reason that no one uses attack types at tournaments is because no one is taking the time out to perfect their sliding shoot.
I agree with a temporary unban with some restrictions.
Does anyone know what the japanese tournament scene is like after the 47g weight restriction? I think if Libra is still continuing to dominate it then it should remain banned under the WBO, but if the game isn't broken with the weight restriction then it should be allowed.
I agree with a temporary unban with some restrictions.
Does anyone know what the japanese tournament scene is like after the 47g weight restriction? I think if Libra is still continuing to dominate it then it should remain banned under the WBO, but if the game isn't broken with the weight restriction then it should be allowed.
![[Image: IkkiSignature.jpg]](https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v653/Gigamew/IkkiSignature.jpg)
Holy carp, 47kg?
But yeah, temp. unban seems like the way to go, test results are showing it's really not overpowered.
But yeah, temp. unban seems like the way to go, test results are showing it's really not overpowered.
The Japanese scene is nothing like ours. Theirs is full of random combos and matches conducted in stadiums we deem illegal.
My bad, 47g