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+---- Thread: Takara Tomy Hell Salamander Testing Thread (/Thread-Takara-Tomy-Hell-Salamander-Testing-Thread)
Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 11, 2018
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Nightmare Longinus Bump Jolt
hS7CAt: 8 SF, 11 Bursts
nLBJt: 1 KO
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 95%
I could be possible that my Nightmare Longinus is worn out, but I can't tell. But right now my current thoughts are that Nightmare Longinus doesn't have the recoil needed, let's try something a bit more recoil heavy shall we?
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Bloody Longinus 0Bump Jolt
hS7CAt: 9 SF, 2 Bursts
bL0BJt: 5 KO, 3 SF, 1 Burst
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 55%
A lot better, If you can control Jolt a lot better than me you probably can bring the win rate down to 40%. And if you're wondering about the Spin Finishes, turns out Bloody Longinus' wings can create some Upper Attack, though it's not very consistent.
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Bloody Longinus 0Bump Orbit
hS7CAt: 12 SF
bL0BO: 5 SF, 1 Burst
2 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 60%
Not as good as I would have liked (and I probably should have switched the Disk and Frame with 7Cross for Bloody Longinus).
Hell Salamander (Attack Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Bloody Longinus 0Bump Jolt
hS7CAt: 8 SF, 8 Bursts
bL0BJt: 2 KO
2 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 80%
Okay, looks like the Attack Mode has more recoil than I thought. But that's on Jolt which is looser than Xtreme
Hell Salamander (Attack Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Bloody Longinus 7Bump Xtreme
hS7CAt: 5 SF, 3 KO, 1 Burst
bL7BX: 1 SF, 8 KO, 2 Bursts
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 45%
Much better, though it does concern me that Bloody Longinus is the only thing that can KO and Burst Hell Salamander consistently. Why 7 though? For some reason, Xtreme does not want to move when Bloody Longinus and 0 are used together.
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Sieg Xcalibur 0Bump Jolt
hS7CAt: 14 SF, 2 KO
sX0BJt: 3 KO, 1 Burst
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 80%
To be expected, Sieg Xcalibur does not perform well at all in opposite spin match-ups
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Twin Nemesis (Upper Mode) 7Cross Destroy
hS7CAt: 1 KO, 2 SF, 3 Bursts
tN7CDs: 3 KO, 7 SF
4 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 25%
Without rubber parts, Hell Salamander can't Burst Twin Nemesis even with a spin speed difference (And I'm using the Booster version of Twin Nemesis which many say is inferior to the Random Layer Collection version due to its clear teeth) and Destroy simply outdoes Atomic in Life-After-Death. Though I'm not sure how this would go with a different Driver on Hell Salamander.
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Twin Nemesis (Upper Mode) 7Cross Orbit
hS7CAt: 17 SF, 1 KO
2 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 90%
Yeah, you need better Life-After-Death to beat Hell Salamander with Twin Nemesis
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Deep Chaos 7 Revolve
hS7CAt: 12 SF
dC7R: 4 SF
4 Draws
So Hell Salamander outclasses Deep Chaos for Stamina as well (and this is Atomic vs. Revolve where Revolve normally wins) and that also means that Hell Salamander will out spin Maximum Garuda
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Spriggan Requiem (Left Spin) 7 Bearing
hS7CAt: 16 SF, 4 Bursts
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 100%
This I'm not too surprised at, rubber in same spin battles doesn't work out very well.
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Spriggan Requiem (Right Spin) 7 Bearing
hS7CAt: 7 SF
Sr7Br: 4 SF
9 Draws
This however, is concerning. The Defense Mode is just so smooth there's little for Spriggan Requiem's rubber to catch onto and Hell Salamander has so much Outward-Weight-Distribution it can out spin Spriggan Requiem even when on Bearing
Hell Salamander (Attack Mode) 0Bump Jolt vs. Drain Fafnir (Hasbro) 7Cross Atomic
hS7CAt: 7 KO, 7 SF, 3 Bursts
dF7CAt: 1 Burst
2 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 85%
Where does the recoil come from!? If you're wondering why I'm using the Hasbro version, it's because the only Takara Tomy Drain Fafnir I have is the red version from the God Customize Set which has clear teeth syndrome and that I've found Hasbro's Drain Fafnir to be more Burst resistant (It stone walls Nightmare Longinus pretty hard). But this was Hell Salamander on Jolt which was a pretty loose fit for an Attack Type, and Hell Salamander barely lost any clicks throughout the whole battle. Furthermore, Hell Salamander was out spinning Drain Fafnir quite a lot, ON JOLT. I'm just confused.
Hell Salamander (Attack Mode) 0Bump Jolt vs. Emperor Forneus 7Cross Atomic
hS0BJt: 5 KO, 3 SF
eF7CAt: 6 SF, 3 KO, 3 Bursts
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 40%
Where does the recoil come from!? Where!?
Final Thoughts
It's frustrating how good Hell Salamander is. It's basically a metal lined, left spin Wyvern (Single Layer) and as it stands now, only Bloody Longinus has the recoil needed (and Bloody Longinus is terrible at Opposite Spin match-ups).
I'm pretty sure this is the final nail in the coffin for pre-Chou-Z Layers (sans Twin Nemesis). This Layer has absurd Outward Weight Distribution, its Attack mode somehow has incredible recoil with little damage to itself (on Jolt) and its Defense mode is too smooth for Spriggan Requiem to spin-equalize with.
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - ThePheonix - Jun. 11, 2018
Thank You so much for this testing trial! @[MonoDragon]! I'm REALLY looking forward to the Attack Mode Test Trial as I believe it will have a similar effect as Neptune I as the shape is similar and I think it will actually do BETTER than N because of the fact that is one of the - or if not - THE heaviest layer in the Burst System... But we shall wait...
Also, can you test it out against Sr.7/0B.Br? I am aware that it is on a trial ban but we can get a fair idea through this in terms of the META... It's Ok if you don't do it though.
Thanks Again For The Test!
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - kjrules17 - Jun. 11, 2018
Awesome tests! If you can, do you think you could hS against mG or G3 (depending on which one you have of course)? It'd be interesting to see how hS does against mG/G3.
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - ThePheonix - Jun. 11, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 3:59 AM)kjrules17 Wrote: Awesome tests! If you can, do you think you could hS against mG or G3 (depending on which one you have of course)? It'd be interesting to see how hS does against mG/G3.
Again that's also banned but it'll give us a good competitive idea. A combo can be G3(mG).P/5/7.Y/O/At
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - RedPanda2 - Jun. 11, 2018
look at all these thirsty bladers begging for an unban....
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - kjrules17 - Jun. 11, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 4:05 AM)RedPanda2 Wrote: look at all these thirsty bladers begging for an unban....I have no idea if you're talking about me or not, but wanting to see mG/G3 unbanned isn't really a priority for me. I just wanted to see how hS does against it, that's all.
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 11, 2018
If Hell Slamander can outspin Deep Chaos, then it will outspin Maximum Garuda. But I will do the Spriggan Requiem test
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - kjrules17 - Jun. 11, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 4:08 AM)MonoDragon Wrote: If Hell Slamander can outspin Deep Chaos, then it will outspin Maximum Garuda. But I will do the Spriggan Requiem testGotcha. In that case, I'm looking forward to that hS vs dC test then. Thanks again for the tests!
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - ayggdrasilgy - Jun. 11, 2018
Hey what about testing it’s attack mode in attack and defense aspects
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - ThePheonix - Jun. 11, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 4:15 AM)ayggdrasilgy Wrote: Hey what about testing it’s attack mode in attack and defense aspects
He/She mentioned the upcoming tests has that in it...
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - ptf606 - Jun. 11, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 4:05 AM)RedPanda2 Wrote: look at all these thirsty bladers begging for an unban....
Not really. They're just seeing how good it is by putting it up against the best.
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - RedPanda2 - Jun. 11, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 10:55 PM)ptf606 Wrote:(Jun. 11, 2018 4:05 AM)RedPanda2 Wrote: look at all these thirsty bladers begging for an unban....
Not really. They're just seeing how good it is by putting it up against the best.
lol yeah right
glad you know that as a fact tho
thanks for sharing
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 11, 2018
Updated and you will not believe the results
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - kjrules17 - Jun. 12, 2018
That's crazy. Quick question though, why didn't you just redo the battles where you had draws? And this is just me but when you said "You will not believe the results", it just made me think of the Ali-A intro. I'm sorry, that had me laughing for a bit.
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - ThePheonix - Jun. 12, 2018
(Jun. 11, 2018 3:30 AM)MonoDragon Wrote: Why 7 though? For some reason, Xtreme does not want to move when Bloody Longinus and 0 are used together.
Giving an explanation, the reason why 0 is good for defense is that it has the opposite of OWD and has what I like to call IWD(Inward Weight Distribution, I have no idea if that's even a thing). This helps keep the core of the bey strong and focuses weight to the centre and makes the bey do the same in a stadium perspective. 7 has OWD which makes room for agility...
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - XYZ-Jaden - Jun. 12, 2018
Any chance we could see some tests done with hS on bearing and/or destroy? I'm curious to see how well hS can resist bursting on bearing, and if destroy can give it a bit more of a defensive/lad edge than atomic
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - Rebel Blader - Jun. 12, 2018
I would say we should test hS vs dC on a mirror setup because atomic usually beats revolve in opposite spin.
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 12, 2018
(Jun. 12, 2018 9:21 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: I would say we should test hS vs dC on a mirror setup because atomic usually beats revolve in opposite spin.
I only have one Revolve and one Atomic
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - Rebel Blader - Jun. 12, 2018
(Jun. 12, 2018 12:44 PM)MonoDragon Wrote:How about orbit?(Jun. 12, 2018 9:21 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: I would say we should test hS vs dC on a mirror setup because atomic usually beats revolve in opposite spin.
I only have one Revolve and one Atomic
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 12, 2018
(Jun. 12, 2018 3:14 PM)Rebel Blader Wrote:(Jun. 12, 2018 12:44 PM)MonoDragon Wrote: I only have one Revolve and one AtomicHow about orbit?
Only one of those too
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 12, 2018
One last test (Attack Mode vs Right Spin Defense)
This Layer gives me a headache
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - BurstMaster - Jun. 13, 2018
Capricorn v2
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - MonoDragon - Jun. 21, 2018
Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Maximum Garuda (Hasbro) 7Cross Atomic
mG7CAt: 17 SF
3 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 0%
Dang...
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - kjrules17 - Jun. 21, 2018
(Jun. 21, 2018 3:22 AM)MonoDragon Wrote: Hell Salamander (Defense Mode) 7Cross Atomic vs. Maximum Garuda (Hasbro) 7Cross AtomicWow, that's crazy. I wonder how hS will do against Spryzen Requiem S3.
mG7CAt: 17 SF
3 Draws
Hell Salamander Win Rate: 0%
Dang...
RE: Hell Salamander Testing Thread - RichieBoi - Jun. 21, 2018
Does Hell Salamander have good teeth? If it does, try the combo Hell Salamander (defence mode) 7 Cross/Bump bearing
You can try thaat combo against Emporer Forneus 0Bump Atomic