RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - Dracieleone - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 3:01 PM)BuilderROB Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 2:56 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: Istros is a decent defense layer when used with a good free-spinning driver. Since Atomic is banned, Hold is pretty much the only option.
You also have Orbit, atomic’s predecessor. I think Orbit still produces too much friction.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 2:56 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 4:37 AM)bladekid Wrote: That is a hell to the no. Bad stamina and defence.
Istros is a decent defense layer when used with a good free-spinning driver. Since Atomic is banned, Hold is pretty much the only option. It's not a good defense layer though and hold isn't good for defence. Also, orbit is most like At when it comes to that, not hold. Also what are you testing this combo against.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - Dracieleone - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 3:14 PM)bladekid Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 2:56 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: Istros is a decent defense layer when used with a good free-spinning driver. Since Atomic is banned, Hold is pretty much the only option. It's not a good defense layer though and hold isn't good for defence. Also, orbit is most like At when it comes to that, not hold. Also what are you testing this combo against.
R.C.E., the Istros combo was I2.L.At., and I managed to have consistent wins with it; winning 8 out of 10 with 2 draws.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 3:16 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 3:14 PM)bladekid Wrote: It's not a good defense layer though and hold isn't good for defence. Also, orbit is most like At when it comes to that, not hold. Also what are you testing this combo against.
R.C.E., the Istros combo was I2.L.At., and I managed to have consistent wins with it; winning 8 out of 10 with 2 draws. Not only is At banned, but R.C.E is probably the worst combo I could see on R.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - Dracieleone - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 5:22 PM)bladekid Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 3:16 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: R.C.E., the Istros combo was I2.L.At., and I managed to have consistent wins with it; winning 8 out of 10 with 2 draws. Not only is At banned, but R.C.E is probably the worst combo I could see on R.
What would recommend then?
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 5:34 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 5:22 PM)bladekid Wrote: Not only is At banned, but R.C.E is probably the worst combo I could see on R.
What would recommend then? Honestly, just R stock is probably the best if not one of the best. R.H.S is really good even though I can't really get it to work.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - Dracieleone - Nov. 18, 2019
(Nov. 18, 2019 10:00 PM)bladekid Wrote: (Nov. 18, 2019 5:34 PM)Dracieleone Wrote: What would recommend then? Honestly, just R stock is probably the best if not one of the best. R.H.S is really good even though I can't really get it to work.
Well, my R is from a thrift shop, and it came with edge.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Nov. 19, 2019
I had done some previous Dragoon Fighter testing (click here if you're interested) and I wanted to try out a Driver I got recently to see if the matchup would differ.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K.Y.R: 5 OS (50% Win Rate)
Unlike previous Drivers I used on Dragoon Fighter (those being Xtend-S (Battle Ring Mode), Destroy, and Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode)), Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) actually helped DGF get wins against Kerbeus. There were also lots of ties as well.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Nov. 19, 2019
(Nov. 19, 2019 2:45 AM)kjrules17 Wrote: I had done some previous Dragoon Fighter testing (click here if you're interested) and I wanted to try out a Driver I got recently to see if the matchup would differ.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K.Y.R: 5 OS (50% Win Rate)
Unlike previous Drivers I used on Dragoon Fighter (those being Xtend-S (Battle Ring Mode), Destroy, and Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode)), Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) actually helped DGF get wins against Kerbeus. There were also lots of ties as well. Ok, I personally think that DGF.Y.Et-S is better, but that's just me, maybe it's not.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Nov. 19, 2019
(Nov. 19, 2019 4:33 AM)bladekid Wrote: Ok, I personally think that DGF.Y.Et-S is better, but that's just me, maybe it's not. That's good to know, I'll try testing that too when I get a chance, thanks.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Nov. 19, 2019
(Nov. 19, 2019 4:53 AM)kjrules17 Wrote: (Nov. 19, 2019 4:33 AM)bladekid Wrote: Ok, I personally think that DGF.Y.Et-S is better, but that's just me, maybe it's not. That's good to know, I'll try testing that too when I get a chance, thanks. Yeah, I just feel like polish is too light to be properly used with DGF since it's shape and weight make it worse than other layers by default, but I could be wrong there.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Nov. 19, 2019
Alright, I tried out Dragoon Fighter Yell Eternal-S against Kerbeus Yell Revolve.
Dragoon Fighter Yell Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
While it can also get wins against K.Y.R, it seemed to do better on Absorb-S.
I also wanted to try out DGF on some other Drivers as well to see if they could perform better than Absorb-S as well as get more data to compare Polish and Yell on DGF against K.Y.R.
Dragoon Fighter Yell Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Ab-S: 7 OS (70% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
This seems to be the best Classic-legal DGF setup from my testing so far as it got the most wins against K.Y.R compared to the many other DGF combos I've tried. I also weighed Yell and Polish and Yell is like 1-2 grams heavier.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Et-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
I also tried Polish on the Yell Eternal-S combo and it did worse lol.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Dimension-S (Tightest Low Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- DGF.P.Dm-S: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
I also tried Dragoon Fighter on Dimension-S using Polish and Yell. I only used 4 modes: Tightest Low Mode (Battle Ring Mode but pushed as far as it can go), Battle Ring Mode (tabs are aligned with the square holes with the plastic spike tip out), Highest SlingShock Mode (the highest it can go as well as pushed as far as it can go), and Lowest SlingShock Mode (Battle Ring Mode plus one full rotation so the tabs are still aligned with the square holes but the plastic spike tip isn't there, leaving only a hole flat).
Dragoon Fighter Polish Dimension-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Dm-S: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Polish Dimension-S (Highest SlingShock Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Dm-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Polish Dimension-S (Lowest SlingShock Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Dm-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Yell Dimension-S (Tightest Low Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Dm-S: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 7 OS (70% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Yell Dimension-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Dm-S: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Yell Dimension-S (Highest SlingShock Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Dm-S: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Yell Dimension-S (Lowest SlingShock Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Dm-S: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Polish Hold (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.H: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
I also tried Dragoon Fighter on Hold with Polish and Yell.
Dragoon Fighter Yell Hold (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.H: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
Even though the difference seems to only be like 1-2 more wins, Yell gave Dragoon Fighter a higher chance of winning against the Kerbeus combo. I also am really liking the Yell Absorb-S setup for Dragoon Fighter and I should be posting some testing I've done with Absorb-S pretty soon™.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Nov. 21, 2019
Did some more Dragoon Fighter testing to see if I could find any other combos that might be better than Yell Absorb-S. But it winded up turning into something else lol.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Octa (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Ω: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Yell Octa (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Ω: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
I started off by testing Dragoon Fighter on Polish and Yell Octa against the usual benchmark combo: Kerbeus Yell Revolve. Neither one did well, however, this time, their win rates were the same. Usually Yell helps Dragoon Fighter a little more than Polish but ok.
Dragoon Fighter Yell Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Nepstrius Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF.Y.Ab-S: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
- N.Y.R: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
With this test, I wanted to see how Nepstrius compared to Kerbeus. Neptune is used in Classic, so even though Nepstrius is worse Burst Resistance-wise, I wanted to see if it could defeat Dragoon Fighter like Neptune can defeat Dragoon Fantom. Didn't go so well.
Dragoon Fighter Yell Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Ab-S: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- K.Y.Et-S: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
After testing Nepstrius, I decided to try Eternal-S on the Kerbeus benchmark. One of the Drivers Neptune is used on in Classic is Eternal, so I wanted to see how Kerbeus on Eternal-S would do against Dragoon Fighter, since Kerbeus seems to be better than Nepstrius when I compared their performance on Yell Revolve against Dragoon Fighter Yell Absorb-S. So this shocked me. I haven't done much testing with Eternal-S but I definitely will soon™.
Dragoon Fighter Yell Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Nepstrius Yell Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even Weak)
- N OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- DGF OS
- N OS
- N OS
- N OS
- DGF OS
- DGF.Y.Ab-S: 6 OS (60% Win Rate)
- N.Y.Et-S: 4 OS (40% Win Rate)
I also decided to try Nepstrius on Yell Eternal-S, while it did get wins against Dragoon Fighter, Kerbeus still did better.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Absorb-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Ab-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.Et-S: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
I also decided to try Dragoon Fighter on Polish Absorb-S against Kerbeus Yell Eternal-S, still got bodied. With Yell, it did a little bit better.
Like I said, I was pretty shocked about how well Kerbeus Yell Eternal-S did. This will probably be the new benchmark I use to test Classic-Legal Hasbro Left Spin Combos against. This also means I gotta go back to the drawing board with Dragoon Fighter to try to find a combo to counter Kerbeus Yell Eternal-S.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Dec. 20, 2019
Due to Hello321 placing in some of the Maryland Burst Classic tournaments recently with Liner or Liner-S (not 100% sure which one), I decided to do some tests just to see how they compare to some of the other Hasbro Drivers that may be used in Burst Classic (Orbit, Revolve, Eternal-S, and Yard-S). I also tested Liner against Liner-S at the end of the tests just to see how they fare against each other.
For these tests, I'm using the red Liner from the Betromoth B2 Single Pack as well as the red Liner-S from the Master Set. Both are super tight, but other Liner and Liner-S Drivers felt pretty tight to me too.
Here are some other things I've observed as well. Liner-S seems to be heavier and a little taller than Liner, which probably played a role in the outcome of its matchups.
But now, let's get into the tests.
Against Orbit
Unicrest Gravity Liner (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Orbit (Even)
- O OS
- L OS
- O OS
- L OS
- O OS
- L OS
- O OS
- L OS
- O OS
- L OS
- U.G.L: 5 OS (50% Win Rate)
- U.G.O: 5 OS (50% Win Rate)
Unicrest Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Orbit (Even)
- O OS
- L-S OS
- O OS
- L-S OS
- O OS
- O OS
- O OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- U.G.L-S: 5 OS (50% Win Rate)
- U.G.O: 5 OS (50% Win Rate)
Both Liner and Liner-S had a 50% Win Rate against Orbit. The only difference was that Orbit and Liner-S had consecutive wins against one another during their battle but it was always back and forth with Orbit and Liner.
Against Revolve
Unicrest Gravity Liner (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Revolve (Even)
- R OS
- R OS
- R OS
- R OS
- R OS
- L OS
- R OS
- R OS
- R OS
- R OS
- U.G.L: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- U.G.R: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
Unicrest Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Revolve (Even)
- R OS
- R OS
- R OS
- L-S OS
- R OS
- L-S OS
- R OS
- L-S OS
- R OS
- R OS
- U.G.L-S: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
- U.G.R: 7 OS (70% Win Rate)
While Revolve still had more wins against both Drivers, Liner-S did a tad bit better compared to Liner. Perhaps it was due to the taller height of Liner-S.
Against Eternal-S
Unicrest Gravity Liner (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- L OS
- Et-S OS
- L OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- L OS
- Et-S OS
- U.G.L: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
- U.G.Et-S: 7 OS (70% Win Rate)
Unicrest Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- Et-S OS
- U.G.L-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- U.G.Et-S: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
In this matchup, I think the taller height of Liner-S was a disadvantage compared to Liner, as Eternal-S being shorter allowed it to Destabilize Liner-S and prevent it from winning. When I first tested this matchup, I was using an Eternal-S that was a little worn. Its sharp tip was rounding out which meant it'd take longer to take the center when launched. This caused Liner to beat it more often. So I switched to another Eternal-S of mine that was basically like new and had its sharp tip and redid the matchup, which is what you see here.
Against Yard-S
Unicrest Gravity Liner (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- L OS
- Yr-S OS
- L OS
- L OS
- L OS
- L OS
- L OS
- L OS
- L OS
- Yr-S OS
- U.G.L: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
- U.G.Yr-S: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
Unicrest Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- Yr-S OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- Yr-S OS
- Yr-S OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- Yr-S OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- U.G.L-S: 6 OS (60% Win Rate)
- U.G.Yr-S: 4 OS (40% Win Rate)
Here's another matchup where the taller height of Liner-S seemed to affect it negatively compared to Liner. Yard-S looks taller than Liner but seems to be around the same height as Liner-S, which I guess made the matchup closer.
Against Each Other
Unicrest Gravity Liner (Odd) vs. Unicrest Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- L OS
- L-S OS
- L OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- L-S OS
- L OS
- U.G.L: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
- U.G.L-S: 7 OS (70% Win Rate)
I was coming into this thinking the taller height of Liner-S would lead to it losing, but it was actually the opposite most of the time. Liner-S just Destabilized Liner more often and got more wins.
Overall though, this was pretty interesting. I was originally of the mindset that these Drivers were trash. And while they probably are in the grand scheme of things, they definitely have a chance in Burst Classic, which is why I like Burst Classic so much. It gives parts another opportunity to potentially see use, which in turn, allows us to learn more about them and their matchups. It seems to me that these two will generally do better against Ball Drivers like Orbit, Yard-S, etc. compared to Cone Drivers like Revolve, Eternal-S, etc. As far as which one is better, it really depends on the matchup. Sometimes Liner might be better, other times Liner-S might be better. And against each other, it seems that Liner-S has the advantage. But you gotta test stuff and see what happens. But like I said before, pretty interesting nonetheless. I might try using Liner or Liner-S at a future Burst Classic tournament. Hopefully I don't get oofed.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Dec. 31, 2019
So not too long ago, I had tested Liner and Liner-S against some Drivers used in Burst Classic.
I then decided to expand upon that and test some specific combos and stuff.
Something I wanted to try out was Caynox, as I wanted to see if the tightness of Liner-S could perhaps help in lowering the likelihood of Caynox being Burst in battle, which could help put its sharp contact points to good use.
In addition to Caynox, I also tried out Dranzer Flame and Unicrest, 2 Hasbro Layers with pretty decent Stamina in Burst Classic, on Liner-S.
I tested these Liner-S combos against Yegdrion Heavy Yard-S, a combo that's been used several times in Burst Classic tournaments, as well as (Hasbro Exclusive) Orpheus O2 Down Yard-S, a combo used by bladekid, UltimateMaster, and maybe others too at the Burst Classic tournament in Los Angeles a while back. It seems to be a more Burst Resistant version of the Yegdrion combo and it can also Destabilize stuff as well.
Yegdrion Heavy Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Caynox Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- C Burst
- C OS
- Y OS
- C OS
- Y OS
- C Burst
- Y OS
- C OS
- C Burst
- C OS
- Y.H.Yr-S: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
- C.G.L-S: 4 OS, 3 Burst (70% Win Rate)
(Hasbro Exclusive) Orpheus O2 Down Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Caynox Gravity Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- (HE) O2 Burst
- C OS
- C OS
- (HE) O2 Burst
- C Burst
- C Burst
- C OS
- C OS
- (HE) O2 OS
- (HE) O2 Burst
- (HE) O2.D.Yr-S: 3 Burst, 1 OS (40% Win Rate)
- C.G.L-S: 4 OS, 2 Burst (60% Win Rate)
I tried using Gravity at first and while it did do good, it didn't feel super tight. I also tried Heavy and that didn't feel tight either.
Yegdrion Heavy Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Caynox Knuckle Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- C OS
- C Burst
- C Burst
- C OS
- C Burst
- C Burst
- C Burst
- C Burst
- C Burst
- Y Burst
- Y.H.Yr-S: 1 Burst (10% Win Rate)
- C.K.L-S: 7 Burst, 2 OS (90% Win Rate)
(Hasbro Exclusive) Orpheus O2 Down Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Caynox Knuckle Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- C OS
- C OS
- C OS
- C OS
- C OS
- (HE) O2 OS
- C Burst
- C OS
- (HE) O2 Burst
- C OS
- (HE) O2.D.Yr-S: 1 OS, 1 Burst (20% Win Rate)
- C.K.L-S: 7 OS, 1 Burst (80% Win Rate)
I then switched to Knuckle and I was happy with the results. It only Burst twice and it was able to Burst Yegdrion a ton and Out-Spin it as well. It not getting a lot of Bursts on Orpheus O2 made sense because that combo is harder to Burst, but Caynox was still able to Out-Spin it, which is just as good.
Yegdrion Heavy Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Dranzer Flame Heavy Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- DZF Burst
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- Y OS
- Y OS
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- Y.H.Yr-S: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- DZF.H.L-S: 7 OS, 1 Burst (80% Win Rate)
(Hasbro Exclusive) Orpheus O2 Down Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Dranzer Flame Heavy Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- (HE) O2 OS
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- (HE) O2 OS
- (HE) O2 OS
- DZF OS
- DZF OS
- (HE) O2 OS
- (HE) O2.D.Yr-S: 4 OS (40% Win Rate)
- DZF.H.L-S: 6 OS (60% Win Rate)
I wanted to also try Dranzer Flame and Unicrest on Liner-S because I wanted to see how other Layers with pretty good Stamina would do. It did pretty good against Yegdrion. Its matchup against Orpheus O2 was closer than I expected but that might be because of Dranzer Flame getting Destabilized frequently by Orpheus O2. The matchup is still winnable though.
Yegdrion Heavy Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Unicrest Heavy Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- U OS
- U Burst
- U OS
- U OS
- Y OS
- U OS
- U OS
- Y OS
- U OS
- U OS
- Y.H.Yr-S: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- U.H.L-S: 7 OS, 1 Burst (80% Win Rate)
(Hasbro Exclusive) Orpheus O2 Down Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd) vs. Unicrest Heavy Liner-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Even)
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- U OS
- (HE) O2.D.Yr-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- U.H.L-S: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
Unicrest also did pretty good overall.
Overall, I think Liner and Liner-S, when used with other good parts, definitely have a shot at taking down some common Burst Classic combos. While Caynox does have the potential to Burst its opponent, it is still risky at the end of the day, so you can always use other Layers like Dranzer Flame, Unicrest, Yegdrion, etc. if you really just want to go for the Out-Spin. I just wanted to try to turn Caynox's contact points from a disadvantage to an advantage and I think it did pretty good.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Jun. 07, 2020
Something I talked about with others is the comparison of Polish and Yell in Burst Classic. For Takara Tomy's Dragoon Fantom, I see Polish used more on things like Absorb. But for Hasbro's Dragoon Fighter, recent combos using it have used Yell, like on Absorb-S or Eternal-S for example. Earlier in this thread, I compared Polish and Yell on a variety of Dragoon Fighter setups against Kerbeus Yell Revolve. Some recent discussion on Discord about Polish and Yell on Dragoon Fantom with Destroy made me think about the Polish vs. Yell comparison again. I hadn't tested Yell Destroy for Dragoon Fighter but I had done so with Polish Destroy in the past so I wanted to compare the two.
Dragoon Fighter Polish Destroy (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.P.Ds: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
Dragoon Fighter Yell Destroy (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGF.Y.Ds: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
So neither was able to win against the Kerbeus combo. This post would've ended with that but I had also realized that I hadn't tested Dragoon Storm in a while. I've obtained many new parts since the last time I tested it so I wanted to try it out on some previous setups I also used on Dragoon Fighter to get more data comparing the two. I used Polish and Yell on Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode), Hold, and Octa.
Dragoon Storm Polish Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS.P.Et-S: 0 Wins (0% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 10 OS (100% Win Rate)
Comparison: Dragoon Fighter Polish Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) had 0 Wins in this matchup.
Dragoon Storm Yell Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS OS
- DGS OS
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS.Y.Et-S: 4 OS (40% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 6 OS (60% Win Rate)
Comparison: Dragoon Fighter Yell Eternal-S (Battle Ring Mode) had 2 OS in this matchup.
Dragoon Storm Polish Hold (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS.P.H: 1 OS (10% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 9 OS (90% Win Rate)
Comparison: Dragoon Fighter Polish Hold had 0 Wins in this matchup.
Dragoon Storm Yell Hold (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- K OS
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS.Y.H: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
Comparison: Dragoon Fighter Yell Hold had 1 OS in this matchup.
Dragoon Storm Polish Octa (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS.P.Ω: 2 OS (20% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 8 OS (80% Win Rate)
Comparison: Dragoon Fighter Polish Octa had 2 OS in this matchup.
Dragoon Storm Yell Octa (Odd Weak) vs. Kerbeus Yell Revolve (Even Weak)
- DGS OS
- K OS
- DGS OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- K OS
- DGS OS
- DGS.Y.Ω: 3 OS (30% Win Rate)
- K.Y.R: 7 OS (70% Win Rate)
Comparison: Dragoon Fighter Yell Octa had 2 OS in this matchup.
This is pretty interesting ngl. For a while I had thought that Dragoon Fighter was the way to go due to Dragoon Storm having worse Burst Resistance than Dragoon Fighter. And that is still the case. Dragoon Storm can still potentially Burst against Opposite-Spin stuff, even late game. But maybe I'll try out Dragoon Storm at the next Burst Classic tournament I attend and see what happens.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - Nitrogenic - Jun. 07, 2020
Is Spread viable in classic? I think it's good. Could you do some testing against Polish and Yell?
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Jun. 07, 2020
I haven't seen Spread used much in Classic compared to things like Gravity, Heavy, Knuckle, Polish, Yell, Armed, Down, etc. And I've also heard it's worse than Yell in Opposite Spin so idk lol.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Jun. 07, 2020
(Jun. 07, 2020 12:43 AM)kjrules17 Wrote: I haven't seen Spread used much in Classic compared to things like Gravity, Heavy, Knuckle, Polish, Yell, Armed, Down, etc. And I've also heard it's worse than Yell in Opposite Spin so idk lol. It's good, just kinda outclassed. But I'm the type who uses down on everything so weird niche disks like spread can still work and will work.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - kjrules17 - Jun. 08, 2020
Wanted to try Tower-S on Caynox to see how it compared to Liner-S from testing earlier in this thread.
Yegdrion Heavy Yard-S (Battle Ring Mode) (First) vs. Caynox Knuckle Tower-S (Battle Ring Mode) (Second)
- Y OS
- C Burst
- C Burst
- C Burst
- Y OS
- Y OS
- C Burst
- C Burst
- Y OS
- Y Burst
- C.K.Tw-S: 5 Burst (50% Win Rate)
Not as many Bursts compared to Caynox on Liner-S but good to know. I used the blue Tower-S from Dullahan D4, it's pretty tight. Tower-S in Battle Ring Mode doesn't seem to hold a flower pattern well. When flat launched, it may stall for a bit before coming to the center.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Jun. 08, 2020
This is just some testing for Tyros T2. I'm also putting this in the Tyros T2 testing and discussion thread so people looking for specifically T2 can find it. Enjoy the tests!
Test 1: (T2 med launched, X sliding shot)
T2.H.U VS X.H.X
T2 Winrate: 80% (OS:7, KO:0, B:9)
X1 Winrate: 20% (OS:0, KO:4, B:0)
Ties: 2 (2 B)
Test 2: (T2 med launched, V2 sliding shot)
T2.H.U VS V2.K.X
T2 Winrate: 90% (OS:10, KO:0, B:8)
V2 Winrate: 10% (OS:0, KO:2, B:0)
Ties: 6 (6 B)
Test 3:
T2.D.Yr-S VS R.H.S
T2 Winrate: 65% (OS:12, KO:0, B:1)
R1 Winrate: 35% (OS:6, KO:0, B:1)
Ties: 0 (0 B)
Test 4a: (T2 med launched, S2 sliding shot, 10 battles)
T2.G.D-S VS S2.G.Ir
T2 Winrate: 100% (OS:2, KO:1, B:7)
S2 Winrate: 0% (OS:0, KO:0, B:0)
Ties: 1 (1 B)
Test 4b: (T2 hard we launched, S2 hard flat launched, 10 battles)
T2.G.D-S VS S2.G.Ir
T2 Winrate: 60% (OS:6, KO:0, B:2)
S2 Winrate: 20% (OS:2, KO:0, B:0)
Ties: 0 (0 B)
Here are some G2 tests to compare:
Test 5: (X sliding shot)
G2.H.U VS X.H.X
G2 Winrate: 80% (OS:4, KO:1, B:11)
X1 Winrate: 20% (OS:0, KO:4, B:0)
Ties: 0 (0 B)
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - bladekid - Sep. 04, 2020
Hi, so I was curious about the down VS armed disk comparison, but I was wondering how Vertical fit into all this, so I tested it for both stamina and burst defense compared to down, here are the tests:
Test 1:
A2.D.O VS A2.V.O (alternating launches, ties, redone switched disks halfway, 20 battles)
D Win rate: 15% (OS: 3, KO: 0, BST: 0)
V Win rate: 85% (OS: 15, KO: 0, BST: 2)
Ties: 2
Test 2:
A2.V.O VS R.H.S (ties redone, A2 launched first, 20 battles)
A2 Win rate: 50% (OS: 10, KO: 0, BST: 0)
R1 Win rate: 50% (OS: 1, KO: 0, BST: 9)
Ties: 0
Test 3:
A2.D.O VS R.H.S (ties redone, A2 launched first, 20 battles)
A2 Win rate: 20% (OS: 4, KO: 0, BST: 0)
R1 Win rate: 80% (OS: 3, KO: 1, BST: 12)
Ties: 5
I was very surprised to be perfectly honest, maybe my verticals are weird, but even when just loosely testing my other vertical disks it had a similar experience. Sometime I'll test vertical and down against things like Knuckle and heavy to get a feel for stamina. But yeah, something I noticed was that down kept getting destablized against vertical, and vertical barely got destabilized at all, so maybe it has a use as an anti destabilizer. That's why I was originally using down for but it appears I was mistaken. Alright, thanks for reading and let me know if you got the same results if you tested it! Thanks.
RE: Burst Classic Testing and Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 30, 2021
Bringing this thread back from the dead - I have been testing a few God era layers (TT/Hasbro) lately to see how they fit in classic. I will have more coming in future, but here are a couple early ones of Valkyries.
Victory Valkyrie/Shining God Valkyrye Knuckle Xtreme' (red rubber)/Wonder Valtryek V4 Knuckle Hunter-S vs Driger S Heavy Orbit
B09, Driger launched first. Sparking string launchers used. NOTE: sgV is missing its springs. This should have a minimal effect on its performance, but must be kept in mind.
V2 - 7W (3ko 4b) 3L (all OS)
sgV - 6W (5ko 1b) 4L (all OS)
Note: Pretty similar, feels like it has a little less smash but also doesn't burst opponents nearly enough.
wV4 - 7W (4ko 3b) 3L (2os 1b)
Has more raw smash than TT V2, with higher burst risk. Less smash than Ogre (which is way too bursty sadly), probably also fine.
I think all of these honestly fit fine tbh
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