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+--- Thread: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) (/Thread-Beyblade-Burst-Sparking-Episode-22-August-21-2020)
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - snoc - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 8:50 PM)Admiral W Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2020 8:45 PM)snoc Wrote: How he can always use his blader instincts to make new strategies out of nowhere and win battles. Its not bad, its just plot armor he can always do that to pull off a win.
Valt is literally the strongest Blader in the world. It's not unreasonable that he would defeat his opponents. As far him supposedly winning battles our of nowhere, Valt worked to the bone to become as good as he is after many setbacks. He gradually improved his skills and learned from his losses. That's not plot armor.
No, you're ignoring my point. Its not that he cant just use his normal strength to win, but when he cant he somehow always uses his blader instincts to make a new strategy, which happens to apply to the battle and help him win.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 8:51 PM)snoc Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2020 8:50 PM)Admiral W Wrote: Valt is literally the strongest Blader in the world. It's not unreasonable that he would defeat his opponents. As far him supposedly winning battles our of nowhere, Valt worked to the bone to become as good as he is after many setbacks. He gradually improved his skills and learned from his losses. That's not plot armor.
No, you're ignoring my point. Its not that he cant just use his normal strength to win, but when he cant he somehow always uses his blader instincts to make a new strategy, which happens to apply to the battle and help him win.
That's called putting your experience to good use.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - snoc - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 8:52 PM)Admiral W Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2020 8:51 PM)snoc Wrote: No, you're ignoring my point. Its not that he cant just use his normal strength to win, but when he cant he somehow always uses his blader instincts to make a new strategy, which happens to apply to the battle and help him win.
That's called putting your experience to good use.
Its not experience. He just uses his blader instinct to always win. That's not a bad thing, and Im not saying he cant win with just his strength and bond. But he does have a little plot armor. Putting your experience to use would be like seeing this situation before or putting past things together to make a strategy. Valt just uses blader instinct to make a random strategy, which always works.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 8:54 PM)snoc Wrote:Let's take this convo to pm. This is technically off topic.(Aug. 05, 2020 8:52 PM)Admiral W Wrote: That's called putting your experience to good use.
Its not experience. He just uses his blader instinct to always win. That's not a bad thing, and Im not saying he cant win with just his strength and bond. But he does have a little plot armor. Putting your experience to use would be like seeing this situation before or putting past things together to make a strategy. Valt just uses blader instinct to make a random strategy, which always works.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Zeutron - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 5:58 PM)Valtryek Aoi Wrote:Well actually im pretty sure Valt was in the main cast listing for sparking.(Aug. 05, 2020 5:45 PM)Ali Baba Wrote: rank doesn't matter but valt has plot armor
Like as if he has plot atm. He's not even a main character now. We don't even know how this tournament will turn out either. They could throw a ball or something and make Lane champion.
Anyways I am seeing people say Valt will win due to “plot armour” while others are saying that he won’t but the fact is, using plot armor as an excuse for a blader winning a battle is stupid because it really doesn’t change the fact that the blader is stronger and would have won anyways because that’s just what the writers wanted. Like for real, think about it, what if I said something like “Sisco would beat Hyuga in the final episode of it wasn’t for plot armor.” See? That makes zero sense because then the story is then just stupid and broken. As we all know having plot armour is just there to protect characters who are meant to be stronger/more successful in the story so we should just accept that and stop saying it like it’s a bad thing. So after all of that regardless of how Valt wins (assuming he definitely wins the battle royale) we should just go with the story writing.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - snoc - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 9:10 PM)Zeutron Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2020 5:58 PM)Valtryek Aoi Wrote: Like as if he has plot atm. He's not even a main character now. We don't even know how this tournament will turn out either. They could throw a ball or something and make Lane champion.Well actually im pretty sure Valt was in the main cast listing for sparking.
Anyways I am seeing people say Valt will win due to “plot armour” while others are saying that he won’t but the fact is, using plot armor as an excuse for a blader winning a battle is stupid because it really doesn’t change the fact that the blader is stronger and would have won anyways because that’s just what the writers wanted. Like for real, think about it, what if I said something like “Sisco would beat Hyuga in the final episode of it wasn’t for plot armor.” See? That makes zero sense because then the story is then just stupid and broken. As we all know having plot armour is just there to protect characters who are meant to be stronger/more successful in the story so we should just accept that and stop saying it like it’s a bad thing. So after all of that regardless of how Valt wins (assuming he definitely wins the battle royale) we should just go with the story writing.
Yes, regardless if he has it or not its not a bad thing. the only time when its a bad thing is when Aiga had it, because they used it as an excuse for him to BS his way through every battle by spamming the same move.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Isaiah.burley - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 8:50 PM)Admiral W Wrote:Your excuse for him not having plot armor makes no sense.(Aug. 05, 2020 8:45 PM)snoc Wrote: How he can always use his blader instincts to make new strategies out of nowhere and win battles. Its not bad, its just plot armor he can always do that to pull off a win.
Valt is literally the strongest Blader in the world. It's not unreasonable that he would defeat his opponents. As far him supposedly winning battles our of nowhere, Valt worked to the bone to become as good as he is after many setbacks. He gradually improved his skills and learned from his losses. That's not plot armor.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 05, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 9:40 PM)Isaiah.burley Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2020 8:50 PM)Admiral W Wrote: Valt is literally the strongest Blader in the world. It's not unreasonable that he would defeat his opponents. As far him supposedly winning battles our of nowhere, Valt worked to the bone to become as good as he is after many setbacks. He gradually improved his skills and learned from his losses. That's not plot armor.Your excuse for him not having plot armor makes no sense.
It's not an excuse. It's logical reasoning when you examine the series. But as I mentioned above, this is technically off topic.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Isaiah.burley - Aug. 06, 2020
(Aug. 05, 2020 9:44 PM)Admiral W Wrote:Well your reason for him “not” having plot armor makes no sense. But anyway Valt’s now going to lose to anyone besides Hyuga and Hikaru. I don’t think they’ll make him vs Lane. (We know why)(Aug. 05, 2020 9:40 PM)Isaiah.burley Wrote: Your excuse for him not having plot armor makes no sense.
It's not an excuse. It's logical reasoning when you examine the series. But as I mentioned above, this is technically off topic.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 06, 2020
(Aug. 06, 2020 1:36 AM)Isaiah.burley Wrote:(Aug. 05, 2020 9:44 PM)Admiral W Wrote: It's not an excuse. It's logical reasoning when you examine the series. But as I mentioned above, this is technically off topic.Well your reason for him “not” having plot armor makes no sense. But anyway Valt’s now going to lose to anyone besides Hyuga and Hikaru. I don’t think they’ll make him vs Lane. (We know why)
When people usually mention plot armor, its in relation to the character's capabilities of winning an engagement. All of Valt's wins were reasonable because of the natural skill and his intense and concerted training he put in over the course of years. So to say that Valt is going to win his battles during the festival beacuse of plot armor is an unreasonable claim that completely disregards the fact that Valt's strength as a blader is the reason for his wins. His capabilities more than make it reasonable that he would win his battles not some convenience of plot. He strength is supported by his record. Why does that not make sense? If you wish to continue this converstaion, we can take this to pm. As I said, this is off topic.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - snoc - Aug. 06, 2020
(Aug. 06, 2020 2:00 AM)Admiral W Wrote:(Aug. 06, 2020 1:36 AM)Isaiah.burley Wrote: Well your reason for him “not” having plot armor makes no sense. But anyway Valt’s now going to lose to anyone besides Hyuga and Hikaru. I don’t think they’ll make him vs Lane. (We know why)
When people usually mention plot armor, its in relation to the character's capabilities of winning an engagement. All of Valt's wins were reasonable because of the natural skill and his intense and concerted training he put in over the course of years. So to say that Valt is going to win his battles during the festival beacuse of plot armor is an unreasonable claim that completely disregards the fact that Valt's strength as a blader is the reason for his wins. His capabilities more than make it reasonable that he would win his battles not some convenience of plot. He strength is supported by his record. Why does that not make sense?
After this I don't feel like going on with this conversation since last time during a debate you never got my point and it went on for 2 days, so yeah.
1. Valt is very strong but he can not win every battle just from experience and strength alone(woah no way)
2. Hiro Morita knows this and lives with it, Valt loses. The anime writers don't want Valt to lose since he's popular so they give him some plot armor to win.
3. This plot armor is a small amount, however its usually a main reason he wins various battles. It can be everything from getting some random power boost cause I guess the stars aligned and a thing decided to happen at that 1 specific battle, to pulling random strategies from nowhere and winning.
4.This type of plot armor is not a bad thing, there's not much of it anyway.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 06, 2020
(Aug. 06, 2020 2:11 AM)snoc Wrote:Its not that I didn't get your points, I didn't agree with them. I don't think the reasons given equaled a reasonable conclusion. The fact that Valt has lost battles and had to learn from them gives credence to the fact that he's not winning his battles via plot armor. Valt combines natural skill, hard work and experience. He learns from each battle. It seemed to me that you attributed most of Valt's wins to convenience of the plot. (It possible I misread you and you don't think that) That takes away all agency and accomplishment from the character. Valt losses helped him to grow as a balder to the point where we rarely losses. If he wins all his battles in the festival, I don't see how that's unreasonable. He's grown so much that he now stands above all other bladers. But We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't think were going to see eye to eye, which is fine. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.(Aug. 06, 2020 2:00 AM)Admiral W Wrote: When people usually mention plot armor, its in relation to the character's capabilities of winning an engagement. All of Valt's wins were reasonable because of the natural skill and his intense and concerted training he put in over the course of years. So to say that Valt is going to win his battles during the festival beacuse of plot armor is an unreasonable claim that completely disregards the fact that Valt's strength as a blader is the reason for his wins. His capabilities more than make it reasonable that he would win his battles not some convenience of plot. He strength is supported by his record. Why does that not make sense?
After this I don't feel like going on with this conversation since last time during a debate you never got my point and it went on for 2 days, so yeah.
1. Valt is very strong but he can not win every battle just from experience and strength alone(woah no way)
2. Hiro Morita knows this and lives with it, Valt loses. The anime writers don't want Valt to lose since he's popular so they give him some plot armor to win.
3. This plot armor is a small amount, however its usually a main reason he wins various battles. It can be everything from getting some random power boost cause I guess the stars aligned and a thing decided to happen at that 1 specific battle, to pulling random strategies from nowhere and winning.
4.This type of plot armor is not a bad thing, there's not much of it anyway.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Needforspeed - Aug. 06, 2020
Im surprised that this episode still haven't decided the director and art i only wish for yamato(from ep8 of sparking) because his art is so takahasi
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Zeutron - Aug. 06, 2020
Honestly both sides of the argument are kind of off. Does Valt have a lot of plot armour? Absolutely. Is plot armour a handicap? No it’s just the way writers highlight the prominent characters and move them throughout the storylines. It’s wrong to use plot armour as an excuse as to why a blader wins since it doesn’t change the fact that that blader is really strong/superior and it’s also wrong to say Valt doesn’t use plot armour because as a usual main cast member and prominent character he totally does.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 06, 2020
To be honest, I think part of the problem is rooted in differing thoughts on what plot armor means. Does the main character in story have to reach their goal? For the most part, yes. If that's what a person wants to call plot armor, then that's perfectly fine and that wouldn't be incorrect. But it's how the character reaches that goal and the degree of difficulty they experience in reaching it that will really make it unreasonable or not. With Valt I think they reasonably scaled his power over the course of the series by making him really have to work to attain it. Did we know that Valt was going to reach his goal by the end? Of course we did, but what makes it well done is that he had to really earn it, it wasn't handed to him on a platter.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Vtryuga - Aug. 07, 2020
Well looking at the fact that aiga is debuting in this episode ig we will have him win the Tag battle
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Zeutron - Aug. 07, 2020
(Aug. 07, 2020 9:53 AM)Vtryuga Wrote: Well looking at the fact that aiga is debuting in this episode ig we will have him win the Tag battleIt’s possible Aiga will just destroy him in the training battle(s) and then in the battle royale Valt wins.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Vtryuga - Aug. 07, 2020
(Aug. 07, 2020 10:38 AM)Zeutron Wrote:(Aug. 07, 2020 9:53 AM)Vtryuga Wrote: Well looking at the fact that aiga is debuting in this episode ig we will have him win the Tag battleIt’s possible Aiga will just destroy him in the training battle(s) and then in the battle royale Valt wins.
i feel that it is improbable that that is the case as the trend has been that the episode in which the legends bey first appears doesnt loose... Btw do you still think that aiga is thhe wbba champ
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Zeutron - Aug. 07, 2020
(Aug. 07, 2020 10:46 AM)Vtryuga Wrote:That’s actually a good point, maybe he will win then.(Aug. 07, 2020 10:38 AM)Zeutron Wrote: It’s possible Aiga will just destroy him in the training battle(s) and then in the battle royale Valt wins.
i feel that it is improbable that that is the case as the trend has been that the episode in which the legends bey first appears doesnt loose... Btw do you still think that aiga is thhe wbba champ
As for him being the wbba champion, I doubt it. The things is, the whole title + regular world ranking thing seems to have been abolished in favour of the tier ranking system new to this season. In the manga the tier ranking system uses specific ranks while the anime is trying to make all the legends save for Valt somewhat slightly equal meaning that bladers at the top level don’t have a specific title and are just categorized as “legend ranked blader.” Either that or it’s possible to that the festival is going to decide the new top blader following the recent introduction of the tier system. If he still is the champ, then I’m sure as you already know he isn’t really superior to the other legends but just holds the title since nobody else has challenged hm for a title match. And they may bring it up as a sort of crazy fact about him kinda like how they mention Shu owning the raging bulls, Wakiya being the chairman of the wbba and Drum being the saviour of the wbba.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Legend Red Eye - Aug. 10, 2020
Bro imagine Hyuga pulling a win...I am willing to bet Hyuga is gonna get this dub. I want to see him win by flukes lol....but all jokes aside I want to see his development he is just riding behind his brother's shadow.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - g2_ - Aug. 11, 2020
(Aug. 10, 2020 5:36 AM)Legend Red Eye Wrote: Bro imagine Hyuga pulling a win...I am willing to bet Hyuga is gonna get this dub. I want to see him win by flukes lol....but all jokes aside I want to see his development he is just riding behind his brother's shadow.I really don't think he is gonna win this, but who knows.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - DranzerX13 - Aug. 14, 2020
Episode tentative title changed now changed to
22) Super Z! Infinite Achilles!!
超ゼツ！インフィニットアキレス！！
Chōzetsu! Infinitto Akiresu!!
August 21, 2020
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - g2_ - Aug. 14, 2020
Unfortunately Aiga might win this, since this is Achilles debut. But it may not, since TT couldn't care less about the new Achilles, putting it in a Random Booster. If the rankings are canon, Valt has this in the bag.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Admiral W - Aug. 14, 2020
(Aug. 14, 2020 8:42 AM)g2_ Wrote: Unfortunately Aiga might win this, since this is Achilles debut. But it may not, since TT couldn't care less about the new Achilles, putting it in a Random Booster. If the rankings are canon, Valt has this in the bag.
Even if the rankings weren't canon (I feel strongly that they are) Valt is still the strongest legendary blader. I hope Valt wipes the floor with him.
RE: Beyblade Burst Sparking Episode #22 (August 21, 2020) - Vtryuga - Aug. 14, 2020
(Aug. 14, 2020 8:46 AM)Admiral W Wrote:(Aug. 14, 2020 8:42 AM)g2_ Wrote: Unfortunately Aiga might win this, since this is Achilles debut. But it may not, since TT couldn't care less about the new Achilles, putting it in a Random Booster. If the rankings are canon, Valt has this in the bag.
Even if the rankings weren't canon (I feel strongly that they are) Valt is still the strongest legendary blader. I hope Valt wipes the floor with him.
That will unfortunately not happen. I think the debut of the bey is more important most of the times