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+--- Thread: Should we ban Basalt? (/Thread-Should-we-ban-Basalt--38423)
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - H8R - Aug. 14, 2011
50% against it is good because most combos that were godly in our book are now scrap metal I meant that lots of combos can beat it easily such as the CH120XF range of left spinners and MF LLD BD145RF
lots of combos can beat it was what I meant to say
such as the CH120XF left spinners
and MF LLD BD145RF
And MF Beat Lynx GB145RF
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - lord Wolfblade - Aug. 14, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 10:25 AM)Shadow Scythe Wrote: MF-H Variares R145RF/MF beats MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS/MB
i did that and my veriares lost...
really in this lazy society, people would rather win the easy way (using basalt/defence/stamina. you just launch), then work (practice launching) and then hope there hard work pays off (for using attack)
IMO the best way to fix this problem is the double format. though it isn't the easiest way (it is most likely the hardest), i think it will work the best. and it will keep both those who want basalt banned and those who don't both happy
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - H8R - Aug. 14, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 6:04 PM)lord Wolfblade Wrote: i did that and my veriares lost...the best way to solve this is banning basalt as you said people are lazy and those lazy people would prefer to use the format which has basalt the other format would be ignored.
really in this lazy society, people would rather win the easy way (using basalt/defence/stamina. you just launch), then work (practice launching) and then hope there hard work pays off (for using attack)
IMO the best way to fix this problem is the double format. though it isn't the easiest way (it is most likely the hardest), i think it will work the best. and it will keep both those who want basalt banned and those who don't both happy
I'm not like those people I would never resort to Basalt as I despise using defense types its very boring indeed.attack types are the way to go
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - lord Wolfblade - Aug. 14, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 6:07 PM)H8R Wrote: the best way to solve this is banning basalt as you said people are lazy and those lazy people would prefer to use the format which has basalt the other format would be ignored.
I'm not like those people I would never resort to Basalt as I despise using defense types its very boring indeed.attack types are the way to go
i use attack myself, heck i don't even own a basalt, yet i did not get into the final
and IIRC, at the tournament people only got into the finals using sythe and basalt, even though they had attackers like lighting Ldrago BD145RF...
even with combos like lighting Ldrago BD145RF are around, the ones winning are still using stamina and defence. IMO banning basalt will be the same. though attackers will do better, people will still use defence and stamina. and like i said, most have a hasbro stadium to test in, and you cant really learn how to do a perfect attack type launch in a hasbro stadium, so they use stamina and defence, because they are more comfortable with it
even if basalt is banned, hell, scythe, and maybe even libra combos will replace it, and other good wheels like earth, virgo, and burn will only be used by people who do not have hell or scythe
really, doing the double format is the best way to go, no matter how complicated it is.
edit: personally i think this thread should be closed now, people keep saying the same thing every page
oh, i just want to point out, a tournament scene is much different from testing. one wrong move and you can self KO and not get into the finals with your attack combo, and there is no "redo self KOs" at a tournament. thats what happened with me once...
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - H8R - Aug. 14, 2011
close this thread the last opinion I have is .....
Ban Basalt!
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - AwesomeFufu - Aug. 14, 2011
You should restrict it and change the rules into "Basalt can not be used as a combo with other maximum series parts".
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - bumpyfelon - Aug. 14, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 6:49 PM)AwesomeFufu Wrote: You should restrict it and change the rules into "Basalt can not be used as a combo with other maximum series parts".I completely agree with this. If this would also cover the use of Basalt TH170, then I honestly think this would be the way to go.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Temporal - Aug. 14, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 11:52 AM)H8R Wrote: people here are the details of what shall happen in the future.
READ!!! THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT
if basalt is banned: more people would feel safer using stamina combos.As a result people would start using attack combos to overcome the new generation of stamina types.the increase of attack types leads to the usage of more reliable and soon more to be invented defense combos.Thus created the best possible metagame:
ATTACK>STAMINA>DEFENSE>ATTACK
if it isnt banned: people would still be using basalt. Most basalt combos have the ability to KO stamina combos.
stamina combos will thus be unreliable. Attack combos would be risky because most people dont know how to use them completely even though these attack combos can beat basalt. The only way to win would be to use Basalt.
now what do you think and dont say restrict it cause that isn't gonna happen
I have been saying the bolded since the time it was brought up in the Random Thoughts thread. About a week, overall. Restricting it will only cause people to find different Basalt combos, and we solve nothing. Leaving it be means we allow Basalt to win everything. The only logical choice made in the interest of the metagame is to ban Basalt temporarily.
(Aug. 14, 2011 9:08 AM)Mushy Wrote: But thats just speculation based on RB vs righty spin.
BUTS, I'm scared of stamina types. Cause this is what happened with Libra, everyone ran to the next best RELIABLE solution. Scythe... BAN SCYTHE
One: RB+Basalt in pure Defense=ByeBye Attacker!
Two: Scythe can get KOed by Basalt. Especially TH170 (220 Mode) Basalt. Banning Scythe wouldn't help. Unless B
is beyond amazing, and Scythe B wins all of the time.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Nojo294 - Aug. 14, 2011
IMO Basalt should be left until there is a clear indicator of how well B : D does with other stamina wheels like scythe and earth... theres no point in banning it for 2 weeks and unbanning it later if B : D turns out to be better with scythe or earth than Basalt... I say just wait like 3 weeks...
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Shabalabadoo - Aug. 14, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 10:48 PM)Nojo294 Wrote: IMO Basalt should be left until there is a clear indicator of how well B : D does with other stamina wheels like scythe and earth... theres no point in banning it for 2 weeks and unbanning it later if B : D turns out to be better with scythe or earth than Basalt... I say just wait like 3 weeks...
it wont be 2 or three weeks though.
it comes out in a month and a half, and by the time it actually would take to balance things out, it could be 2 months from now.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Ultra - Aug. 15, 2011
That's just stamina though. B:D will make no difference to defence. I don't really see how B:D would perform better on earth or Scythe than on Basalt. More likely that it will still be the best for stamina. I really have to wonder how many people want Basalt not to be banned just cause it's powerful and therefore easy to win with. I mean the same thing happened with the libra banning where the vote was more for it not being banned but the ban made a big difference which was a good one.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Nojo294 - Aug. 15, 2011
Personally banning Basalt when viewed from a perspective of wanting to advance (or at least create some sort of) the metagame is entirely necessary at this moment. I suggested to wait and see how B : D does but that in itself apparently will take a while. Assuming B : D is as influential as bearing core, and what ultrablader said holds to be true (B : D will be better on basalt than on earth/scythe) then of course banning it is the right thing to do... why allow a part that is pretty much the epitome of 2 types in a 3 type metagame (not counting balance types)?
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - KyubiBey - Aug. 15, 2011
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - RustyXD - Aug. 15, 2011
It has RS which will obviously get OS by stamina.
Waiting for B : D is to long of a wait , it is 'dominating' now and who knows maybe Phantom will be even better then basalt.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Flame Aries - Aug. 15, 2011
(Aug. 15, 2011 6:29 AM)RustyXD Wrote: It has RS which will obviously get OS by stamina.I agree with this, I just recently looked at the Phantom wheel as is may have great stamina and attack capabilities. The new Saggitrio wheel
Waiting for B : D is to long of a wait , it is 'dominating' now and who knows maybe Phantom will be even better then basalt.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - tehfez - Aug. 15, 2011
Here are my personal opinions on this:
Yes in theory banning basalt should lead to an increase in use of attack type combos, but in real life it probably won't, as people will still not be confident enough to use them.
Banning basalt will lead to a whole bunch of other wheels being used instead eg, scythe,burn, hell, virgo and maybe even earth and libra. I think that this is good, at the moment it is non stop basalt combos (at least in melbourne) being spammed.
By banning basalt we will see a larger variety of parts become viable again. Yes use of attackers will probably not increase by much but at least we will see a more diverse meta game.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Taj12 - Aug. 15, 2011
As many people have mentioned, attack types aren't the safe option. Why? Because, like others have also mentioned, no one is confident enough. This lack of confidence is due to the lack of practice, which in turn gives credit to the expensive MFB attack stadium. A simple, yet appropriate thing to do would be to create a format where basalt is disadvantaged via the use of different stadiums. If not, of course there is the resort of banning BD145 and basalt combos, or even CS and MB and basalt combos, seeing that some other Basalt based combos require skill. All the same we can wait until all the 4D system beys have been released and thoroughly tested before making a decision
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Cye Kinomiya - Aug. 15, 2011
In the last New York tourney, Scythe combos consistently took out Basalt combos
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - RustyXD - Aug. 15, 2011
Exactly i have been saying it for a while but scythe does beat basalt.
Taj12 we should not wait for the rest of the 4D beys to be released as it is dominating now.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Taj12 - Aug. 15, 2011
I said as an alternative, not a direct solution. Anyways its, just an opinion and I second... er... third Cye's comment. (awkward silence)
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Flame Aries - Aug. 15, 2011
I say let's take a look at the past take a look at the MWs that's been overlooked. The lost MWs (wheels that haven't been tested deeply enough with new parts). I would test it myself, but I don't have a TT Attack Type Stadium. Can someone test this out
Bakushin_____BD145/TH170/R145 RF/R2F/CS/XF/MB(Don't know why I choose this)
And
Mercury______BD145/TH170/R145 RF/R2F/CS/XF/MB
Against
Basalt______ BD145/TH170/230 MB/CS/RB
I put my money on Bakushin because as far as I know it has lower recoil...
If this works, then, hey, we got something, and if this has already been done before or doesn't work, then I apologize for wasting your time and I'll agree to ban Basalt temporally.
This is a suggestion, but at least try it, please.
I personally want Basalt here and I don't even have it, heh.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Taj12 - Aug. 15, 2011
(Aug. 13, 2011 4:35 PM)Bey-Heart Wrote:(Aug. 13, 2011 3:48 PM)lord Wolfblade Wrote: how about instead of banning or restricting basalt, we try out the double format idea?I vote for this idea.
one format where you can use the maxmum series and beyond, and one where you can only use parts from before maximum like in Yamislayer's thread http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Beyblade-Rebirth-Format-testing ? i think it would be a better idea
edit: thanks for making this thread heart
Instead of banning basalt, we should give tournament organizers a choice. They can choose to have a tournament where you can use the new, current top-tier combos, or you can have a "classic" tournament where you can only use Beyblades released before the maximum series.
I dont see how either solution helps. Either way, there is still basat dominance in the 2nd format
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Super%Sayian - Aug. 15, 2011
(Aug. 15, 2011 10:30 AM)taj12 Wrote:What hes saying is that they would not be able to use basalt in 1 format but the problem with that is a lot of tournament organizers use basalt in maryland but i really dont no about anywhere else(Aug. 13, 2011 4:35 PM)Bey-Heart Wrote:(Aug. 13, 2011 3:48 PM)lord Wolfblade Wrote: how about instead of banning or restricting basalt, we try out the double format idea?I vote for this idea.
one format where you can use the maxmum series and beyond, and one where you can only use parts from before maximum like in Yamislayer's thread http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Beyblade-Rebirth-Format-testing ? i think it would be a better idea
edit: thanks for making this thread heart
Instead of banning basalt, we should give tournament organizers a choice. They can choose to have a tournament where you can use the new, current top-tier combos, or you can have a "classic" tournament where you can only use Beyblades released before the maximum series.
I dont see how either solution helps. Either way, there is still basat dominance in the 2nd format
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - Bleik - Aug. 15, 2011
(Aug. 14, 2011 10:25 AM)Shadow Scythe Wrote: I was a BAN BASALT guy. Then I realised this.People really need to think about this. I just gave you a list of counters. Use them for mothercarpin' sake. Stop complaining about Basalt making the game boring and its so hard to beat. Use the damn counters! That's why we have them.
Sure, its very hard to beat but there are counters:
MF-H Variares R145RF/MF beats MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS/MB
MF-M Beat Lynx GB145R2F beats MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS/MB
MF-M Meteo L-Drago ED145EWD beats MF-H Basalt Kerbecs TH170/230CS/D
MF Meteo L-Drago CH120XF beats MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS
MF-L Gravity Perseus STM BD145EDS (Left) beats MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS (My own combo! It might work against TH170)
C'mon people! If you dont have the parts go buy/borrow them. If people generally have these parts, Basalt will become overpowered then there is no point banning it. Then we all need the find new combos...
I dont have a Basalt so I understand you people.
RE: Should we ban Basalt? - blah - Aug. 15, 2011
You don't get it.
Most people cannot successfully counter Basalt.
Only some experienced people can and even they can't super consistently do it.
Get a Basalt before you keep talking ... :\