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+---- Thread: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion (/Thread-Rubber-Defense-Flat-Discussion)
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Galaxy - Nov. 04, 2011
Can someone try MF-H VariAres xx RDF vs MF-H VariAres xx RF?
Tracks must be the same.
Also, can someone try MF-H VariAres xx RDF vs MF-H VariAres xx R2F ?
Track must be always the same!
In both tests be sure to use an aggressive sliding shoot for both combos,thanks!
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Glowfire1 - Nov. 04, 2011
I will make it galaxy and dan: I often said that my english is bad, but you understand my mine, or?
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Dan - Nov. 04, 2011
I understood it, yeah, but it would be best you practice writing so you can improve.
Could you also do: MF VariAres CH120RF vs. MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145RDF and MF VariAres CH120RDF vs. MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS, please?
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Uwik - Nov. 04, 2011
(Nov. 04, 2011 7:25 PM)Galaxy Wrote: Can someone try MF-H VariAres xx RDF vs MF-H VariAres xx RF?
Tracks must be the same.
Also, can someone try MF-H VariAres xx RDF vs MF-H VariAres xx R2F ?
Track must be always the same!
In both tests be sure to use an aggressive sliding shoot for both combos,thanks!
Banking needed for sliding shot is barely doable with RDF, but the plastic that surrounds the rubber scrapes the stadium half the time.
Center shoot RDF is probably better.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Glowfire1 - Nov. 04, 2011
(Nov. 04, 2011 7:32 PM)Dan Wrote: I understood it, yeah, but it would be best you practice writing so you can improve.
Could you also do: MF VariAres CH120RF vs. MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145RDF and MF VariAres CH120RDF vs. MF-H Basalt Kerbecs BD145CS, please?
okay, sorry again for my bad English
I will make the tests
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - sum 472 - Nov. 05, 2011
Oh, so RDF is kinda like a CS that scrapes and beats RB. Glowfire can you also test MF- Basalt Aquario 100RDF Vs MF Gravity Perseus BD145MF thanks!
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - gibsonmac - Nov. 05, 2011
(Nov. 04, 2011 7:32 PM)Uwik Wrote: Banking needed for sliding shot is barely doable with RDF, but the plastic that surrounds the rubber scrapes the stadium half the time.
Center shoot RDF is probably better.
I do not agree, I can slide RDF all day without problems, though I can slide XF with great success too, so its something I've practiced a whole bunch...
Center shooting RDF is preferred for defense combos, but not attack combos... not sure if thats what you meant or not...
Just an aside, when the RDF wears down past the little nub(or to the last 'legal' point normal wear), do you think it will perform like an XF from hell??? I'm thinking so, after some tests of Death Quetz that made the RDF plastic part hook-up to the tornado ridge... it went wild on a whole other level... 'flying' out of the stadium, literally, not a KO from the opposing bey, but riding the ridge around maybe once, then air born like a snowboard off a launch box...
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Uwik - Nov. 05, 2011
(Nov. 05, 2011 6:53 AM)gibsonmac Wrote:(Nov. 04, 2011 7:32 PM)Uwik Wrote: Banking needed for sliding shot is barely doable with RDF, but the plastic that surrounds the rubber scrapes the stadium half the time.
Center shoot RDF is probably better.
I do not agree, I can slide RDF all day without problems, though I can slide XF with great success too, so its something I've practiced a whole bunch...
Center shooting RDF is preferred for defense combos, but not attack combos... not sure if thats what you meant or not...
Just an aside, when the RDF wears down past the little nub(or to the last 'legal' point normal wear), do you think it will perform like an XF from hell??? I'm thinking so, after some tests of Death Quetz that made the RDF plastic part hook-up to the tornado ridge... it went wild on a whole other level... 'flying' out of the stadium, literally, not a KO from the opposing bey, but riding the ridge around maybe once, then air born like a snowboard off a launch box...
Hmm, that is indeed strange. I meant as in scraping, unlike a normal plastic bottom (XF, WF, F, etc). It actually makes scraping noises. The flower pattern is there though, but the noise is also there.
However, I can not slide shoot XF... ever. It's too fast for me. It just stalls.
Originally, I also thought that RDF with the rubber worn down would act like HF on steroid, but after few limited personal testings, and witnessed the potential scrapes instead of the glides, it made me think twice.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Dracomageat - Nov. 05, 2011
Apparently I'm to ask here for testing of Phantom Libra 85 RDF against Basalt combos since most of the people in the testing thread lack RDF.
The idea behind the combo being simply that, if Burn Libra 100 SF can nearly get the win (and it can), this next step up should do the job nicely (85 instead of 100 due to the height of RDF but that may be too low).
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Hazel - Nov. 07, 2011
I can officially support the claim that RDF can OS a Calm/Semi-Aggro CS with a strong enough launch(on a stock DQ125RDF), but I could not get much aggression out of it whatsoever, compared to RF, R2F, MF, WF, XF, HF, and even RSF. Even with an extremely hard TS-style launch, it was very, very tame.
RDF also soared clean out of the Stadium like a surface to air missile when I tested it out on MF-H DQTH170RDF against MF Blitz 100R2F.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Nov. 08, 2011
Curious, Hazel, or anyone really, can you launch with severe banking, severe enough that the outside ring/D-part contacts the stadium surface, as does the edge of the tip? Not even in testing, but may as well launch some kind of defense bey in there first to see if it's possible to KO with it.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Hazel - Nov. 08, 2011
When I deep banked it, the plastic contacted the Stadium and caused it to spin wide and then re-stabilize.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Nov. 08, 2011
Aww, Lame-O. was hoping it'd go ballistic but the rubber part would anchor it enough to be somewhat directable, even if only for a quick KO through the centre of the stadium.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 09, 2011
I hope this isn't too close to double posting, considering it's been about a month and this post should be somewhat useful, being my impressions of RDF, and stuff.
Basically, RDF is a very nice part, however, it has a couple of weaknesses, like all pure-rubber tips (though it compensates for them better). Basically, it is just short of the stamina safety level for me, Hell Libra 100R2F can OS it sometimes (on MF-H Duo Aquario BD145RDF) and MF-F Phantom Cancer AD145RF (Attack mode) does so even more regularly. It also has all the opposite-spin weakness of RS/RSF, it seems. That said, I do prefer it to RS, it seems to have better stamina, as it has better balance due to the plastic ring, which also gives it a little extra Life-After-Death.
More importantly, I aim to try to do this thing from the advanced forum tomorrow, to provide the required data. The rest of you should try to do so too, with whatever parts you have (a wheel like Death, or Libra if it doesn't get blown away too bad (Arupaeo mentioned not using Basalt (and obviously not BD145 as it introduces too many variables)). Something like MF-H Libra GB145RS/RSF/CS/RDF or MF-H Death Aquario GB145RS/RSF/CS/RDF against whatever attacker you use (in right spin, and left, if you can).
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Kujikato - Dec. 09, 2011
So ya want a whole bunch of tests on
MF-H Phantom/Earth/Basalt Aquario GB145 RS/CS vs my best attacker? to get base data for RDF?
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 09, 2011
Obviously one of the tested bottoms would have to be RDF. I'm assuming most will have the common sense to work that out for themselves, given this is a thread about RDF and that is the point of the testing.
Also, I would not suggest using Phantom, it's not that great a defense part.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Kujikato - Dec. 09, 2011
I understand the RDF part, but we need to have the control as is found in the first set of tests, using RS/CS/RSF/RB, correct?
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 09, 2011
Yes, tests against an identical combo on as many of the other staple defense tips as possible is the other half of the analysis, though not RB, as it is not considered top-tier, and is not really popular/well known enough.
I'd also suggest not using Earth, it is too weak to give valid results, as no matter what tip, MF-H Earth __GB145 cannot stand up to top tier attack. Libra, if it isn't just getting 100%'d, would be good, or Death. Scythe may work, I'm not really sure, without BD145, and Duo may work as well.
So yeah, nothing too weak defensively, top tier attack, and no BD145, as it introduces other variables. IIRC Arupaeo asked for plain 145 tracks, though personally, I'd use GB145 for a better idea, as it doesn't really introduce any extra variables. But, you're free to use whatever as long as it doesn't introduce extra variables (sorry M145 lovers, you'll have to put it away), just keep it the same through all the tests.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Kujikato - Dec. 09, 2011
RB=/= Top Tier!?! What has the metagame turned into? BWHAHAHAHAHA sure, I;ll get the base tests done, as I dont have RDF yet
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 09, 2011
Check the competitive combo's discussion in the advanced forum, it skips the ridge too easily, and it becomes far too aggressive with relatively minor wear. Either way, we don't really know much about it (relatively) so it introduces another unknown variable.
And yeah, thanks, just hold onto those results til you get RDF and test it too
(it's a very good part, especially against Blitz).
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Kujikato - Dec. 10, 2011
gotcha, really have to get Death, Duo, and Blitz for christmas then.....
btw, how does RDF fare on Perseus BD145?
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 10, 2011
Honestly haven't tried it, but gravity isn't really that great a defensive wheel
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Kujikato - Dec. 10, 2011
Quasi Attack, Like Bakushin ___ BD145 RSF
Balance if you please
List of RDF Testing I am requesting
MF-L L-Drago Destroy/Guardian BD145 RDF
(Reasons: Spin stealing Left Spin Defense Attack Combos)
MF-L Hell Kerbecs BD145 RDF
(Reasons: CS variant says hello, RDF says let me try)
MF-L Gravity Perseus BD145/GB145 RDF
(Reasons: gravity was a passable Defense Wheel during the days of MF LLD BD145 LRF, it maybe still has the smash, Defense - Attack hybrid)
MF-L Phantom Cancer BD145 RDF
[Reasons: (ANYTHING + Phantom: Better Stamina) + (RDF + Most decent stuff: Better Defense and some Attack) + (BD145 + CS/RDF/RS/RSF + Phantom/Basalt/Earth/Libra: A Top Notch Defense Type) = Attack, Stamina, and Defense pure hybrid]
balance breeds
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - th!nk - Dec. 10, 2011
GP only worked for defence because LLD couldn't get past BD145.
Honestly, phantom's Defensive abilities are overrated, it has too much recoil.
RDF has two weaknesses compared to CS: It has less stamina, so it falls just short of the mark against a few things, and it has a reverse-spin weakness.
RE: Rubber Defense Flat Discussion - Kujikato - Dec. 11, 2011
Well then RDF aint as good as CS then?Can ya at least try the LDG/LDD variant or the Hell Kerbecs one?