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+--- Thread: Answered Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? (/Thread-Answered-Do-frames-increase-stamina-or-decrease-it)
Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - Rebel Blader - Dec. 29, 2017
Does frames increase stamina or decrease it? I mean which would be better for stamina dC 7 revolve or dC 7 glaive revolve
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - Ice_blade13 - Dec. 29, 2017
It decreases it not by a lot but its really depends on what frame your gonna use. by default the frames act like an assist for the layer instead of spread knuckle ect.
in other words star frame works well on amaterios increaseing its power semi slightly or tripple on valtryek
( if this is hard to understand i'm sorry )
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - Tornadomist147 - Dec. 29, 2017
As he said frames doesn't matter they have types if they are rich in attack they may collapse and decrease stamina.
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - XYZ-Jaden - Dec. 29, 2017
Frames primarily affect weight and LAD. More weight generally means more stamina, but the heaviest frames meteor, vortex, and bump are all pretty roughly shaped, so they tend to reduce the overall LAD of a combo. LAD is pretty important for stamina, so for combos that need more LAD, frames that are lighter, like Glaive and Cross are used instead for their smooth, round shape. In some cases, like in the case of dC.7.R, frames can actually reduce the amount of LAD the combo has, so while dC.7B.R would have the most weight, and therefore technically the most overall stamina, and dC.7G.R would have a middle ground between weight and LAD, I've heard that dC.7.R is most popular because Deep Chaos has its best LAD when it doesn't have a frame.
tl;dr: frameless Deep Chaos combos are popular and generally seen as best because of dC's high LAD, so I'd go with dC.7.R
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - V2KX - Dec. 29, 2017
Usually Increase it unless pair a frame with 1 [As 1 is Unbalanced]
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - Rebel Blader - Dec. 30, 2017
(Dec. 29, 2017 9:38 PM)XYZ-Jaden Wrote: Frames primarily affect weight and LAD. More weight generally means more stamina, but the heaviest frames meteor, vortex, and bump are all pretty roughly shaped, so they tend to reduce the overall LAD of a combo. LAD is pretty important for stamina, so for combos that need more LAD, frames that are lighter, like Glaive and Cross are used instead for their smooth, round shape. In some cases, like in the case of dC.7.R, frames can actually reduce the amount of LAD the combo has, so while dC.7B.R would have the most weight, and therefore technically the most overall stamina, and dC.7G.R would have a middle ground between weight and LAD, I've heard that dC.7.R is most popular because Deep Chaos has its best LAD when it doesn't have a frame.So that means dC 7 R would a little bit less stamina than dC 7g r?
tl;dr: frameless Deep Chaos combos are popular and generally seen as best because of dC's high LAD, so I'd go with dC.7.R
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - MonoDragon - Dec. 30, 2017
(Dec. 30, 2017 2:46 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote:(Dec. 29, 2017 9:38 PM)XYZ-Jaden Wrote: Frames primarily affect weight and LAD. More weight generally means more stamina, but the heaviest frames meteor, vortex, and bump are all pretty roughly shaped, so they tend to reduce the overall LAD of a combo. LAD is pretty important for stamina, so for combos that need more LAD, frames that are lighter, like Glaive and Cross are used instead for their smooth, round shape. In some cases, like in the case of dC.7.R, frames can actually reduce the amount of LAD the combo has, so while dC.7B.R would have the most weight, and therefore technically the most overall stamina, and dC.7G.R would have a middle ground between weight and LAD, I've heard that dC.7.R is most popular because Deep Chaos has its best LAD when it doesn't have a frame.So that means dC 7 R would a little bit less stamina than dC 7g r?
tl;dr: frameless Deep Chaos combos are popular and generally seen as best because of dC's high LAD, so I'd go with dC.7.R
If Stamina did not include LAD, potentially yes.
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - XYZ-Jaden - Dec. 30, 2017
(Dec. 30, 2017 2:46 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: So that means dC 7 R would a little bit less stamina than dC 7g r?
Like MonoDragon said, technically yes, but the difference is so small the added LAD from going frameless with dC outweighs it.
Basically, more weight usually means the bey will spin longer, but when the weight difference comes down to 2~ grams, it's better to prioritize other aspects of your combo, which is why you don't see 7B as the disk for every bey. Think of it as trading in a second or two of upright spin time for a couple more seconds LAD and a better chance of out-spinning opposite-spin combos.
(Disclaimer: I haven't had the chance to test this myself, so I'm going off tournament results)
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - Rebel Blader - Dec. 30, 2017
(Dec. 30, 2017 3:06 AM)MonoDragon Wrote:(Dec. 30, 2017 2:46 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: So that means dC 7 R would a little bit less stamina than dC 7g r?
If Stamina did not include LAD, potentially yes.
(Dec. 30, 2017 3:22 AM)XYZ-Jaden Wrote:Ok thanks to both of u(Dec. 30, 2017 2:46 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: So that means dC 7 R would a little bit less stamina than dC 7g r?
Like MonoDragon said, technically yes, but the difference is so small the added LAD from going frameless with dC outweighs it.
Basically, more weight usually means the bey will spin longer, but when the weight difference comes down to 2~ grams, it's better to prioritize other aspects of your combo, which is why you don't see 7B as the disk for every bey. Think of it as trading in a second or two of upright spin time for a couple more seconds LAD and a better chance of out-spinning opposite-spin combos.
(Disclaimer: I haven't had the chance to test this myself, so I'm going off tournament results)
RE: Do frames increase stamina or decrease it? - Wombat - Dec. 30, 2017
(Dec. 30, 2017 3:22 AM)XYZ-Jaden Wrote:(Dec. 30, 2017 2:46 AM)Rebel Blader Wrote: So that means dC 7 R would a little bit less stamina than dC 7g r?
Like MonoDragon said, technically yes, but the difference is so small the added LAD from going frameless with dC outweighs it.
Basically, more weight usually means the bey will spin longer, but when the weight difference comes down to 2~ grams, it's better to prioritize other aspects of your combo, which is why you don't see 7B as the disk for every bey. Think of it as trading in a second or two of upright spin time for a couple more seconds LAD and a better chance of out-spinning opposite-spin combos.
(Disclaimer: I haven't had the chance to test this myself, so I'm going off tournament results)
Just a minor nitpick, more weight doesn't always equal more Stamina, and I've seen a worrying amount of people becoming trapped in the "heavier = better" mindset, especially when it comes to Burst. Usually it is weight distribution that is more important - it's why Disks like Spread and Knuckle were able to outspin Heavy despite being lighter, or why Yell has bad same-spin Stamina despite weighing almost as much as Heavy, and it's the same reason why the Phantom Wheel from MFB has more Stamina than something like Genbull Genbull.
I also think that dC.7.R would outspin dC.7G.R every time, all other things being equal. Depending on the shape of the Disk/Driver/whatever, having LAD can also result in a huge hit to same-spin performance (Polish is the best example of this in Burst). Basically what happens is that when the dC combos start precessing, 7G will scrape and lose Stamina before 7 does because the Frame is lower to the ground, meaning that it not only has less Stamina but also a lower upright spin time. I've actually been skeptical of right spin Glaive (especially on Revolve) for a long time because its points go in the wrong direction for LAD, so it's definitely satisfying to see others getting the same results after testing it. In my experience 8 >= 7 (8 has slightly better LAD but bursts more) > Yell > Spread for Revolve Stamina setups.