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CS as a Defense Bottom - Printable Version

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+---- Thread: CS as a Defense Bottom (/Thread-CS-as-a-Defense-Bottom)

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CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 10, 2010

Yes, I know this sounds ridiculous, but I find CS to have pretty good Defense qualities compared to WB.

The rubber on CS constantly helps by gripping onto the Stadium floor when the Bey tilted. This Bottom also gets caught into the Tornado ridge pretty easily, which helps the Bey from getting KOed.

Also, surprisingly, CS circling the Stadium for a few laps after getting hit actually proves to be helpful since Attack Combos moving in a flower pattern had trouble catching up with it and cannot deliver much hits.

(Note: My CS is the type that couldn’t stay in Attack Mode for more than 5 seconds. It’s still pretty new.)

My results (Click to View)

Results by other members (Click to View)

Again, I’m not sure if I’m the only one who is obtaining these results, so it would be great if some members can contribute some test results.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Dirge - Oct. 10, 2010

Intresting, ill try this out tomorrow after school since my CS acts in that way aswell

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - RエスコルピオT125JB - Oct. 10, 2010

!!!I was eager to know last night, and! I'm going to test it now!
Great results, thanks Diamond.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Mc Frown - Oct. 10, 2010

This seems very reasonable.
Thanks for bringing it up.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - RエスコルピオT125JB - Oct. 10, 2010

Ok, some quick tests.

-MFB Attack Type BeyStadium
-BeyLauncher + Launcher Rubber
-Defense combo always launched first with a Straight Shot
-Attack combo always launched second at 100% power with a Banking Shoot
-RF slightly worn
-CS Defense combo launched at 100% power
MF-H Earth Bull R145CS VS MF Pegasis WD145RF (Click to View)
Quite good~
Another legend combo found by Diamond~

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Ultra - Oct. 10, 2010

Can anyone do testing for GB145 as the track for the defence combo? Also very happy about this since my CS is the same and has never really worked for attack(maybe I should use it more).

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 10, 2010

Oh, I forgot to mention, R145 paired with WB was incredibly helpful against MF Lightning L Drago 100R2F.

Since MF Lightning L Drago 100R2F destabilizes and delivers KOs at the same time (when I use it), R145 actually gripped onto the Stadium floor when the Bey was destabilized, preventing KOs and 'popped' the Bey back upright so it's stabilized again.

As for CS, when it's destabilized, it ran out of the Stadium itself since the rubber of CS made contact with the Stadium floor, haha.

Again, this is what I observed, others might experience entirely different outcomes.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - RエスコルピオT125JB - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  8:59 AM)Diamond Wrote: Oh, I forgot to mention, R145 paired with WB was incredibly helpful against MF Lightning L Drago 100R2F.

Since MF Lightning L Drago 100R2F destabilizes and delivers KOs at the same time (when I use it), R145 actually gripped onto the Stadium floor when the Bey was destabilized, preventing KOs and 'popped' the Bey back upright so it's stabilized again.

As for CS, when it's destabilized, it ran out of the Stadium itself since the rubber of CS made contact with the Stadium floor, haha.

Again, this is what I observed, others might experience entirely different outcomes.

Funnily, my MF Lightning LDrago 100R2F acts like a beast, didn't destabilize the defense combos, instead, it KOs directly. :\

Um...MF-H Earth Bull R145CS seems not to perform well against MF Sagittario 105RF in my quick tests... :\

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  9:17 AM)RエスコルピオT125JB Wrote: Um...MF-H Earth Bull R145CS seems not to perform well against MF Sagittario 105RF in my quick tests... :\
Does WB perform better than CS against MF Sagittario 105RF?

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - DrigerGT - Oct. 10, 2010

I already thought at CS as a Defense Bottom, thanks Diamond for testing it.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - RエスコルピオT125JB - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  9:27 AM)Diamond Wrote: Does WB perform better than CS against MF Sagittario 105RF?
Yes, a bit, what I observed is that the height between WB and CS make the difference.
The low height of WB makes Sagittario hit Earth,
oppositely, the height of CS makes Sagittario hit R145, the recoil of R145 bounces itself off, then it seems like a KO round.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  9:40 AM)RエスコルピオT125JB Wrote: oppositely, the height of CS makes Sagittario hit R145, the recoil of R145 bounces itself off, then it seems like a KO round.
Then I guess it's not because of the Defensive capabilities of CS that the Defense combo is performing poorly? Hah.

If you don't mind, could you please do some tests with C145 (or even GB145) instead of R145?
Thanks in advance. Smile

EDIT: BTW, could I please post your results in the OP?

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - RエスコルピオT125JB - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  9:45 AM)Diamond Wrote: Then I guess it's not because of the Defensive capabilities of CS that the Defense combo is performing poorly? Hah.

If you don't mind, could you please do some tests with C145 (or even GB145) instead of R145?
Thanks in advance. Smile

EDIT: BTW, could I please post your results in the OP?

Um...we should say that CS works better for high attackers?

Tests...OK, wait for a while.

Just post them, Tongue_out_wink

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  9:49 AM)RエスコルピオT125JB Wrote: Um...we should say that CS works better for high attackers?
I already stated that in the 3rd paragraph of the OP.

(Oct. 10, 2010  9:49 AM)RエスコルピオT125JB Wrote: Tests...OK, wait for a while.

Just post them, Tongue_out_wink
Thank you.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - OkiBlaze - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  8:29 AM)Diamond Wrote: Also, surprisingly, CS circling the Stadium for a few laps after getting hit actually proves to be helpful since Attack Combos moving in a flower pattern had trouble catching up with it and cannot deliver much hits.

This is what led me on to thinking that SF would be a decent defense bottom as well...

Thanks for the testing Grin

(Oct. 10, 2010  8:29 AM)Diamond Wrote: Another thing to note is that CS works especially well against tall Smash Attackers, but performs worse than WB against destabilizing Attackers like MF Lightning L Drago 100R2F.

Does it really?

With my results, whenever MF-H Earth Bull C145CS is at the brink of destabilizing, the rubber on CS saves the wheel or C145's claws from touching the stadium floor. It pwns against my Meteo LDrago 90R2F. It's a major recovery tool in my book.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Glad Hatter - Oct. 10, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  8:29 AM)Diamond Wrote: Yes, I know this sounds ridiculous, but I find CS to have pretty good Defense qualities compared to WB. The rubber on CS constantly helps by gripping onto the Stadium floor.

Also, surprisingly, CS circling the Stadium for a few laps after getting hit actually proves to be helpful since Attack Combos moving in a flower pattern had trouble catching up with it and cannot deliver much hits.

Another thing to note is that CS works especially well against tall Smash Attackers, but performs worse than WB against destabilizing Attackers like MF Lightning L Drago 100R2F.

(Note: My CS is the type that couldn’t stay in Attack Mode for more than 5 seconds. It’s still pretty new.)

My results (Click to View)

Results by other members (Click to View)

Again, I’m not sure if I’m the only one who is obtaining these results, so it would be great if some members can contribute some test results.

Wow that's exactly what my blade did before my CS tip broke.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Dirge - Oct. 11, 2010

Did a little bit of testing on this

MF earth Bull GB145CS vs Ray pegasis CH120RF
MFB attack, Earth Bull always shot 1st, ray shot with banking

Wins 5 loses 5 50%

Results (Click to View)
50% win rate agaisnt Ray Peg CH120RF is alot better then what WB got when i 1st tested Ray___CH120RF out which only got 20% so i think CS is quite a useable defence bottom and out does WB

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - OkiBlaze - Oct. 11, 2010

I think that you should also mention that CS gets caught in the tornado ridge pretty frequently.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 11, 2010

(Oct. 10, 2010  10:14 AM)OkiBlaze Wrote: Does it really?

With my results, whenever MF-H Earth Bull C145CS is at the brink of destabilizing, the rubber on CS saves the wheel or C145's claws from touching the stadium floor. It pwns against my Meteo LDrago 90R2F. It's a major recovery tool in my book.
Does it really?
Hah.

But I guess the results and outcomes are somehow different for each person.
Anyway, thanks for the information, I will try to edit the OP into a better version.
(Oct. 11, 2010  3:23 AM)OkiBlaze Wrote: I think that you should also mention that CS gets caught in the tornado ridge pretty frequently.
Ah, I occasionally experience that too.
Again, thanks for the reminder, added to the OP.
(Oct. 11, 2010  3:11 AM)Dirge Wrote: *
Thank you for the tests Dirge!

Could I please add this to the OP?

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - RエスコルピオT125JB - Oct. 11, 2010

Ok, some quick tests, again.

-MFB Attack Type BeyStadium
-BeyLauncher + Launcher Rubber
-Defense combo always launched first with a Straight Shot
-Attack combo always launched second at 100% power with a Banking Shoot
-RF slightly worn
-CS Defense combo launched at 100% power
MF-H Earth Bull C145CS VS MF Sagittario 105RF (Click to View)
Actually quite good.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Dirge - Oct. 11, 2010

(Oct. 11, 2010  9:36 AM)Diamond Wrote: Could I please add this to the OP?

sure thing Joyful_2
if you need the test comparing to how WB did agaisnt Ray pegCH120RF its on the ray discussion thread

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Pimpju - Oct. 11, 2010

This is somewhat unrelated to CS' ability as a defensive bottom, but can defence customs using CS KO stamina types when used with banking? I just think it may be the advent of a balance type, rather than simply a defence.

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Diamond - Oct. 11, 2010

(Oct. 11, 2010  11:36 AM)momiji manju Wrote: This is somewhat unrelated to CS' ability as a defensive bottom, but can defence customs using CS KO stamina types when used with banking? I just think it may be the advent of a balance type, rather than simply a defence.
Earth doesn't have any prominent protrusions or slopes to provide any effective Smash or Upper attack, but I would suppose a Defense combo like MF-H Earth Bull GB145CS (when launched with a Banking shoot) can KO Stamina combos with high recoil Wheels (such as Burn). :\
(Oct. 11, 2010  11:30 AM)Dirge Wrote: sure thing Joyful_2
if you need the test comparing to how WB did agaisnt Ray pegCH120RF its on the ray discussion thread
Thank you!
(Oct. 11, 2010  11:26 AM)RエスコルピオT125JB Wrote: *MF-H Earth Bull C145CS VS MF Sagittario 105RF tests
Thanks again for the tests, but could you please do some tests with WB as a comparison (same goes for the previous tests) if it isn't too much work?

Thanks in advance!

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Pimpju - Oct. 11, 2010

I was thinking that simply the momentum or recoil of the opponent's wheel may be enough, seeing as stamina types have minimal friction with ground (stating obvious here hah).

RE: CS as a Defense Bottom - Fyuuor - Oct. 11, 2010

Interesting results. If I get some time I'll do some tests myself Wink