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+---- Thread: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) (/Thread-MF-H-Flash-Orion-W145MF-Help-me-beat-this)
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Tech - Jul. 20, 2012
I guess I'll just wait until Sunday then. I'll still try out AD145, though.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Ingulit - Jul. 20, 2012
(Jul. 20, 2012 4:01 AM)Tech Wrote: I guess I'll just wait until Sunday then. I'll still try out AD145, though.
Oh lord, MF-H Flash ____ AD145MF is good, don't get me wrong; again, it's good enough to be in the Beywiki article, and it'll serve you well, but using W145 once you have it is simply better.
Raigeko, I doubly edited my last post so you might have legit missed this edit, but Saggitario I is a pretty good substitution thanks to its weight distribution. I'm trying to think of what else is good... I know Pisces and Scorpio didn't wow me for this custom, and Horogium is obviously against the idea of OSing anything, so there isn't much else other than Orion and Saggitario I that doesn't get in the way... (I'm open to suggestions here)
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Angry Face - Jul. 20, 2012
I personally love Orion with Flash. It just fits so well, (looks to have) great synergy with Flash, and blocks nothing.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Raigeko13 - Jul. 20, 2012
Alrighty then, I'll try SGTO I.
One last question: what mode should everything be in?
I don't see anywhere what mode Flash is/should be in .-. Or E230. I'm assuming Attack, but I dunno.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Ingulit - Jul. 20, 2012
(Jul. 20, 2012 4:21 AM)Raigeko13 Wrote: Alrighty then, I'll try SGTO I.
One last question: what mode should everything be in?
I don't see anywhere what mode Flash is/should be in .-. Or E230. I'm assuming Attack, but I dunno.
Flash has two modes?
Attack mode for Flash and I was KOing both regular and "boost" mode for E230 (normal mode was harder to KO, but it wasn't impossible by any stretch of the imagination).
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Meow! - Jul. 20, 2012
So I went back to my stadium, and tried to get Flash MF to work. I found that I kinda got the hang of it. Maybe I just wasn't used to MF's movement pattern.
Anyway, I am a little boggled at how Flash W145MF could ko MF-H Duo E230CS reliable, when Duo E230CS was known as barely able defeat Flash on an RF....
Edit: Beaten
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Tech - Jul. 20, 2012
MF-H Flash Orion AD145MF vs MF Diablo Byxis BD145R2F
Flower pattern, trying for KO
Diablo always launched first
LR Launcher, Suspension
Standard Procedure
Spoiler (Click to View)
Flash: 7 (4 OS, 3 KO)
Diablo Win %: 65%
This is pretty much just a random combo I pulled out. Picked Byxis because of it's good Smash Attack, iirc. Forgive me if I'm inaccurate.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Byerg - Jul. 20, 2012
Doesn't really seem like a random combo if it just happens to have all of the right Top-Tier parts (excluding the CW) lol
And you really shouldn't be launching Diablo first for every battle..really messed up the test (seeing how low Diablo's win rate is because of that..), especially when Flash is the one with the MF >_>
Doesn't completely ruin the test, but really handicaps a side.
If W145 consistently gets 0%'s against my Diablo, then I think it shows how much that handicapped Diablo lol, especially since AD145 really doesn't have THAT much more Attack capabilities.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Tech - Jul. 20, 2012
Well, Diablo is what is being put to the test, so I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be launched first either way. I still need to work on my testing, as this was my first real testing, anyways.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Ingulit - Jul. 20, 2012
(Jul. 20, 2012 4:29 AM)Meow! Wrote: So I went back to my stadium, and tried to get Flash MF to work. I found that I kinda got the hang of it. Maybe I just wasn't used to MF's movement pattern.
Anyway, I am a little boggled at how Flash W145MF could ko MF-H Duo E230CS reliable, when Duo E230CS was known as barely able defeat Flash on an RF....
Edit: Beaten
I will say that my tests in the OP are against E230 in Boost Mode where I was KOing it reliably (and I certainly was and am still). I'm going back and re-testing MF-H Duo Cancer E230CS with E230 in normal mode and I will say I'm having a much harder time beating it, but I'm still getting more KOs than not. It's certainly not the 90% winrate I got against "boost mode," though. I'm going to edit the first post now to clarify what mode everything was in, because I'm realizing that especially with E230 it matters a lot.
The lesson to be learned here is that E230 has better defense against 145 Flash opponents in Normal Mode. E230(Normal)CS will OS this custom if it doesn't get KOed, yes, but it's still ending up outside my stadium pretty often. I've been re-trying the other defense tips with E230 on Normal but they still all get OSed.
EDIT: There, I fixed the OP with indications of modes and I put a note under E230CS's results that indicate Normal Mode would have done better against this custom.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Angry Face - Jul. 20, 2012
(Jul. 20, 2012 4:55 AM)Tech Wrote: Well, Diablo is what is being put to the test, so I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be launched first either way. I still need to work on my testing, as this was my first real testing, anyways.
That's okay, Tech; I think we've all got a good understanding of how this combo fares against Anti-Attack now. But thanks for your contribution all the same.
EDIT: Dang, I'm too slow on my phone.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Byerg - Jul. 20, 2012
So let's say a Rock Gasher T125RF is being put to the test, so it should be launched first everytime against MF-H Basalt Bull 230CS?
Yeah..that's not how tests go
Attack always goes second against Defense.
Attack always goes second against Stamina (though in this combo's situation it may be different lol).
Alternating launches for Defense vs. Defense.
Alternating launches for Stamina vs. Stamina.
Alternating launches for Attack vs. Attack.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Angry Face - Jul. 20, 2012
But even with the "handicap," Diablo still won the majority of the time, so the tests still support you in the end (just not a strongly as others).
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Kujikato - Jul. 22, 2012
Quick question,
Has and can this combo been tested against MF-H Basalt Horogium R145 RF/MF? maybe Basalt can take this guy out.
Thanks,
Izuma
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Byerg - Jul. 22, 2012
It's already been seen that the combo you suggested can beat Pure Attack Flash combos on RF, so of course this one is going to be "taken out" by Basalt.
And Diablo has already taken this guy out, but its results more much more decisive and seems a lot more reliable for this situation lol
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Ingulit - Jul. 23, 2012
I hate to post the same post in two separate threads, but technically this IS relevant to both threads it's in:
(Jul. 23, 2012 4:09 AM)Ingulit Wrote: Okay, so I did the testing against MF-H Flash Orion W145MF, and I had to do 30 rounds because I got such incredibly odd results the first 20 rounds:
MF-H Basalt Horogium R145RF vs.
MF-H Flash Orion W145MF
Standard Procedure, BB-10, Beylauncher L/R with Suspension
Flash launched first on even launches, Basalt on odd
Basalt Wins: 15 (14 KO, 1 OS)Detailed Test Results (Click to View)
Flash Wins: 15 (7 KO, 8 OS)
Basalt Win %: 50%
Yep, dead even. This was a very interesting battle, since the first ten rounds Flash dominated, but the second ten rounds Basalt took almost every win. If for some reason neither custom gets KOed, Flash almost always won thanks to its stamina (with only one exception). This is one of the closest non-mirror matchups I've ever seen, heh.
I alternated launches because I treated this like it was an Attack vs. Attack test. It never seemed to matter which was launched first when everything was said and done.
I don't know what to make of these results... 50% win rates always throw me off, since in theory it's a coin toss if the percentage win is correct. So, it looks like the main consistent counter to this is still Diablo Anti-Attack.
I'll do some more requested testing soon, namely Meow!'s requests since he asked for the results so long ago.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - th!nk - Jul. 23, 2012
Ga mentioned his basalt combo handling flash at least somewhat effectively and I don't think he has W145. Flash on 145 heights does have a susceptibility to a bunch of things in that vein, though W145 may nullify it somewhat, those sorts of things are the reason I've stuck to S130. Same kinda reason I use a more worn RF for my flash combo, needs more control and grip to stand up to that sort of thing.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Ga' - Jul. 23, 2012
Oh, now this is a nice matchup haha.
The Basalt combo I made definitely handles the AD145 and RF variants well, but it's surprising to see that Basalt and Flash were so even with W145.
This could reveal potential for other W145 beys if it can handle the weaknesses that Flash presents at said height. Appreciate the testing, Ingulit!
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Kujikato - Jul. 25, 2012
VariAres in right spin comeback? Who knows...
Well, looks like I was kinda right, MF-H Basalt Horo R145 RF can and does have equal ground to this "God-like" combo.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Cake - Jul. 26, 2012
Try reworking your Scythe Uranus combo to OS this. 85CS, maybe?
EDIT: Just throwing random combos out there, but Dragoon Revizer (Dragoon up) E230 EDS/CS might work.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Angry Face - Jul. 26, 2012
The bottom Wheel is always said first, so it would be Revizer Dragooon.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - SoulEater57 - Jul. 26, 2012
So, this OS' E230 combos? mwahahahaha!
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Byerg - Jul. 26, 2012
MF-H Kreis Bull BD145RF vs. MF-H Flash Orion W145MF
Standard Procedure:
BB-32 Attack Type Stadium
BB-32 Beylaunhcer
3-Segment Launcher Grip
RF in Prime
I wouldn't know the name of the mode if my life depended on it, so it's whichever one rotates
Kreis: 19 Wins (15 KO, 4 OS)
Flash: 1 Win (1 KO, 0 OS)
2 Draws, both redone
Yeah, I was as surprised as you are right now..
Was Kreis ever tested for Anti-Attack? If so, I'm guessing it was against Variares?
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - *Ginga* - Jul. 26, 2012
That is actually really interesting, even though I will not use it since I have Diablo.
I'm surprised that Kreis was good in Anti-Attack. Though the way it is shaped, it makes sense.
RE: MF-H Flash Orion W145MF (Help me beat this) - Ingulit - Jul. 27, 2012
(Jul. 26, 2012 11:06 PM)Zancrow Wrote: MF-H Kreis Bull BD145RF vs. MF-H Flash Orion W145MF
Standard Procedure:
BB-32 Attack Type Stadium
BB-32 Beylaunhcer
3-Segment Launcher Grip
RF in Prime
I wouldn't know the name of the mode if my life depended on it, so it's whichever one rotates
Kreis: 19 Wins (15 KO, 4 OS)
Flash: 1 Win (1 KO, 0 OS)
2 Draws, both redone
Yeah, I was as surprised as you are right now..
Was Kreis ever tested for Anti-Attack? If so, I'm guessing it was against Variares?
Whaaaaaaaat
This makes me want to actually get that cheap Kreis I keep eying, good lord!