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Hasbro The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Printable Version

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+---- Thread: Hasbro The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic (/Thread-Hasbro-The-unbanning-of-the-turbo-exclusives-in-burst-classic)

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RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  1:27 AM)bladekid Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  12:19 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: Okay. So let me get this straight. You believe that because the Turbo exclusives are not as good that they should be unbanned, correct? Well I'm saying that because fakes are not as good that they should be allowed. They're essentially the same argument.
No, they should be banned because they are literally fakes! I hate to be mean, but this is the dumbest argument I have ever heard. I'm saying specifically the turbo exclusives should be allowed because they are just new dual layers released and that the fact that they're not old should not effect whether they should be banned or not. legitimately saying "fakes should be unbanned because they aren't as good as the real beys" is such a bad argument to make, it's hard to even rebut. If you don't understand why fakes are banned and/or why I think the turbo exclusives should be unbanned, I don't have the ability to change your mind. Don't mean to be a jerk, but comparing the unjustly banned turbo exclusives to the very justly banned fakes is kinda insulting to me.

Here's the thing, I'm not actually saying that fakes should be unbanned,that was a joke, I'm saying that You're argument is just as silly. So is reality, you just called your own argument dumb. 

https://tenor.com/view/reverse-card-uno-uno-cards-gif-13032597

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Armor - Oct. 05, 2019

Let's just be clear here: Hasbro may not always be good, but they aren't fakes.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - bladekid - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  1:35 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  1:27 AM)bladekid Wrote: No, they should be banned because they are literally fakes! I hate to be mean, but this is the dumbest argument I have ever heard. I'm saying specifically the turbo exclusives should be allowed because they are just new dual layers released and that the fact that they're not old should not effect whether they should be banned or not. legitimately saying "fakes should be unbanned because they aren't as good as the real beys" is such a bad argument to make, it's hard to even rebut. If you don't understand why fakes are banned and/or why I think the turbo exclusives should be unbanned, I don't have the ability to change your mind. Don't mean to be a jerk, but comparing the unjustly banned turbo exclusives to the very justly banned fakes is kinda insulting to me.

Here's the thing, I'm not actually saying that fakes should be unbanned, I'm saying that You're argument is just as silly. So is reality, you just called your own argument dumb. 

https://tenor.com/view/reverse-card-uno-uno-cards-gif-13032597
Ok, the only thing you have proven to me beyond a shadow of a doubt is that you are completely missing the point of this thread if you would say something like that. I'm not even going to bother with you, there is nothing I can do to help you.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  3:10 AM)bladekid Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  1:35 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: Here's the thing, I'm not actually saying that fakes should be unbanned, I'm saying that You're argument is just as silly. So is reality, you just called your own argument dumb. 

https://tenor.com/view/reverse-card-uno-uno-cards-gif-13032597
Ok, the only thing you have proven to me beyond a shadow of a doubt is that you are completely missing the point of this thread if you would say something like that. I'm not even going to bother with you, there is nothing I can do to help you.

The purpose of the thread is to prove that exclusives should be unbanned, correct? If not please correct me.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

Whether you agree with bladekid or not, he started this thread with a lot of testing, which is a lot of work.  This is not a joke to him. To compare Hasbro bey to fakes is a bit unfair.  Hasbro own the rights to produce their beyblades legally unlike the fakes.  The fakes are illegally produced.  The WBO should not promote their use, even if they are at the right power level.  It’s just apple and oranges.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  4:54 AM)Shindog Wrote: Whether you agree with bladekid or not, he started this thread with a lot of testing, which is a lot of work.  This is not a joke to him. To compare Hasbro bey to fakes is a bit unfair.  Hasbro own the rights to produce their beyblades legally unlike the fakes.  The fakes are illegally produced.  The WBO should not promote their use, even if they are at the right power level.  It’s just apple and oranges.
Yeah thanks for stating the obvious.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:11 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  4:54 AM)Shindog Wrote: Whether you agree with bladekid or not, he started this thread with a lot of testing, which is a lot of work.  This is not a joke to him. To compare Hasbro bey to fakes is a bit unfair.  Hasbro own the rights to produce their beyblades legally unlike the fakes.  The fakes are illegally produced.  The WBO should not promote their use, even if they are at the right power level.  It’s just apple and oranges.
Yeah thanks for stating the obvious.
So it was obvious you were comparing apples to oranges and trying to make a point that way?  I don’t understand.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

My point is, burst classic is for classic beyblades. If exclusives are allowed because ''they aren't that strong'' then why not allow Satomb S3? That loses to classic combos. The qestion is, where do we draw the line, Shindog bladekid

?

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:19 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: My point is, burst classic is for classic beyblades. If exclusives are allowed because ''they aren't that strong'' then why not allow Satomb S3? That loses to classic combos. The qestion is, where do we draw the line?
I believe I started my initial comment with “whether you agree with bladekid or not....”.   I haven’t argued one way or the other because I think classic can be fun either way. 

I don’t think anyone here is trying to make this game worse?  Why use an apples to oranges comparison to poke fun at someone’s legitimate suggestion?  If you disagree, simply disagree?  Do testing to prove your point?  Or just make good relevant arguments?

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - bladekid - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  4:42 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  3:10 AM)bladekid Wrote: Ok, the only thing you have proven to me beyond a shadow of a doubt is that you are completely missing the point of this thread if you would say something like that. I'm not even going to bother with you, there is nothing I can do to help you.

The purpose of the thread is to prove that exclusives should be unbanned, correct? If not please correct me.
Yes. But you clearly don't understand the difference between unbanning actually illegal products and perfectly legal beys that are just misunderstood. Well, if there isn't logic to begin with, you can't use logic to beat it.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - CitrusNinja3 - Oct. 05, 2019

I think the point was clearly stated that Burst Classic is meant to bring back Beys that aren't viable anymore, up to the Dual Layers. The argument could be made that the Plastic Gen remakes that don't have metal are allowed regardless of when they were released, but I think that adding in Hasbro exclusive Turbo Beys would make the banlist too complex. for new players, especially if Morrigna was banned. Burst Limited is coming out sometime next year with a focus on God/SwitchStrike/Turbo Beys, so the Turbo exclusives will have another chance at being decent.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - bladekid - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:19 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: My point is, burst classic is for classic beyblades. If exclusives are allowed because ''they aren't that strong'' then why not allow Satomb S3? That loses to classic combos. The qestion is, where do we draw the line, Shindog bladekid

?
Yeah, IDK either tbh, it's kinda the same sort of deal. The difference is that even though I'm completely in favor of allowing things like kS3, gV3, and bR3, I cant deny that satomb is a god/evolution layer through and through, while the turbo exclusives are kinda in a weird spot. IMO, they are most similar to dual layers because of their performance, look, feel, weight, and overall comparability. That's the difference, but personally, I do agree with your point, I just think this argument is stronger than the "put in the weak God layers" argument.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:26 AM)Shindog Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:19 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: My point is, burst classic is for classic beyblades. If exclusives are allowed because ''they aren't that strong'' then why not allow Satomb S3? That loses to classic combos. The qestion is, where do we draw the line?
I believe I started my initial comment with “whether you agree with bladekid or not....”.   I haven’t argued one way or the other because I think classic can be fun either way. 

I don’t think anyone here is trying to make this game worse?  Why use an apples to oranges comparison to poke fun at someone’s legitimate suggestion?  If you disagree, simply disagree?

Okay. Well I disagree. But my point still remains. Also, apples and oranges are both fruit, they still have that in common.
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:27 AM)bladekid Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  4:42 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: The purpose of the thread is to prove that exclusives should be unbanned, correct? If not please correct me.
Yes. But you clearly don't understand the difference between unbanning actually illegal products and perfectly legal beys that are just misunderstood. Well, if there isn't logic to begin with, you can't use logic to beat it.

Bad example. But illegal is whatever the peson in charge chooses illegal to be.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:36 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:26 AM)Shindog Wrote: I believe I started my initial comment with “whether you agree with bladekid or not....”.   I haven’t argued one way or the other because I think classic can be fun either way. 

I don’t think anyone here is trying to make this game worse?  Why use an apples to oranges comparison to poke fun at someone’s legitimate suggestion?  If you disagree, simply disagree?

Okay. Well I disagree. But my point still remains. Also, apples and oranges are both fruit, they still have that in common.
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:27 AM)bladekid Wrote: Yes. But you clearly don't understand the difference between unbanning actually illegal products and perfectly legal beys that are just misunderstood. Well, if there isn't logic to begin with, you can't use logic to beat it.

Bad example. But illegal is whatever the peson in charge chooses illegal to be.
Apples and Oranges are both fruits.... and I was exposed for stating the obvious....

The fakes literally break the law.  Illegal products in that sense.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Dt20000 - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:46 AM)Shindog Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:36 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: Okay. Well I disagree. But my point still remains. Also, apples and oranges are both fruit, they still have that in common.

Bad example. But illegal is whatever the peson in charge chooses illegal to be.
Apples and Oranges are both fruits.... and I was exposed for stating the obvious....

The fakes literally break the law.  Illegal products in that sense.

If your entire point revolves around picking apart a metaphor someone else used, you should probably re-think it

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:49 AM)Dt20000 Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:46 AM)Shindog Wrote: Apples and Oranges are both fruits.... and I was exposed for stating the obvious....

The fakes literally break the law.  Illegal products in that sense.

If your entire point revolves around picking apart a metaphor someone else used, you should probably re-think it

Do you mean the part about fakes being actually illegal?

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - bladekid - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:36 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:26 AM)Shindog Wrote: I believe I started my initial comment with “whether you agree with bladekid or not....”.   I haven’t argued one way or the other because I think classic can be fun either way. 

I don’t think anyone here is trying to make this game worse?  Why use an apples to oranges comparison to poke fun at someone’s legitimate suggestion?  If you disagree, simply disagree?

Okay. Well I disagree. But my point still remains. Also, apples and oranges are both fruit, they still have that in common.
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:27 AM)bladekid Wrote: Yes. But you clearly don't understand the difference between unbanning actually illegal products and perfectly legal beys that are just misunderstood. Well, if there isn't logic to begin with, you can't use logic to beat it.

Bad example. But illegal is whatever the peson in charge chooses illegal to be.
Not with fakes, but like, the whole point of this thread is to convince ~Mana~ that these should be legal even though they aren't now.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Dt20000 - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  5:51 AM)Shindog Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:49 AM)Dt20000 Wrote: If your entire point revolves around picking apart a metaphor someone else used, you should probably re-think it

Do you mean the part about fakes being actually illegal?

I mean the fact that a bunch of the previous posts were about how it was a bad comparison

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  6:03 AM)Dt20000 Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:51 AM)Shindog Wrote: Do you mean the part about fakes being actually illegal?

I mean the fact that the previous ~5 posts were about how it was a bad comparison
I see.  But I was ultimately told Apples and Oranges are both fruits?
(Oct. 05, 2019  6:03 AM)Dt20000 Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:51 AM)Shindog Wrote: Do you mean the part about fakes being actually illegal?

I mean the fact that the previous ~5 posts were about how it was a bad comparison
I see.  But I was ultimately told Apples and Oranges are both fruits?  Who is the one that wouldn’t let the metaphor go?

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  6:04 AM)Shindog Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  6:03 AM)Dt20000 Wrote: I mean the fact that the previous ~5 posts were about how it was a bad comparison
I see.  But I was ultimately told Apples and Oranges are both fruits?
(Oct. 05, 2019  6:03 AM)Dt20000 Wrote: I mean the fact that the previous ~5 posts were about how it was a bad comparison
I see.  But I was ultimately told Apples and Oranges are both fruits?  Who is the one that wouldn’t let the metaphor go?

They are also both able to be eaten.
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:55 AM)bladekid Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  5:36 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: Okay. Well I disagree. But my point still remains. Also, apples and oranges are both fruit, they still have that in common.

Bad example. But illegal is whatever the peson in charge chooses illegal to be.
Not with fakes, but like, the whole point of this thread is to convince ~Mana~ that these should be legal even though they aren't now.

I ment Illegal as in, not being able to use.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - DeceasedCrab - Oct. 05, 2019

I suspect the Turbo exclusives won't be banned in the upcoming Burst Limited format, for whatever that's worth. If enough overpowered God layers are banned (Balkesh B3, Sr3, Garuda, etc.) and any overpowered ChoZs if ChoZs are allowed in the format, then the Turbo exclusives may have the ability to shine in that format, even if they're on the lower tier of things.

I know, it's not what you want, you'd prefer it for Classic. But it's something.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

My comparison to fakes was a bad example. My bad. Also, I'd like to apologise to bladekid for poking fun at his thread. But like I said, where do you draw the line if these beys were allowed?

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  6:28 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: My comparison to fakes was a bad example. My bad. Also, I'd like to apologise to bladekid for poking fun at his thread. But like I said, where do you draw the line if these beys were allowed?

This is a good and valid point.  And your previous mention of extra confusion is important as well (at least I think you mentioned it?).  

To me the most important thing is for the classic format to thrive. If no one plays classic then we are all wasting our time.  Does allowing turbo layers give new players access to viable parts?  Not all top tier classic parts are inexpensive or easy to find (Odin, deathscyther, Neptune, and etc). Is this worth the possible added complexity and confusion?  I tend to favor allowing more things of equal power level in but I do not dislike classic now.  I think ultimately accessibility is king but I see both sides.

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - BoogietheBlader - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  6:41 AM)Shindog Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  6:28 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote: My comparison to fakes was a bad example. My bad. Also, I'd like to apologise to bladekid for poking fun at his thread. But like I said, where do you draw the line if these beys were allowed?

This is a good and valid point.  And your previous mention of extra confusion is important as well (at least I think you mentioned it?).  

To me the most important thing is for the classic format to thrive. If no one plays classic then we are all wasting our time.  Does allowing turbo layers give new players access to viable parts?  Not all top tier classic parts are inexpensive or easy to find (Odin, deathscyther, Neptune, and etc). Is this worth the possible added complexity and confusion?  I tend to favor allowing more things of equal power level in but I do not dislike classic now.  I think ultimately accessibility is king but I see both sides.
Drivers are still allowed. Aren't they something new?

RE: The unbanning of the turbo exclusives in burst classic - Shindog - Oct. 05, 2019

(Oct. 05, 2019  9:58 AM)BoogietheBlader Wrote:
(Oct. 05, 2019  6:41 AM)Shindog Wrote: This is a good and valid point.  And your previous mention of extra confusion is important as well (at least I think you mentioned it?).  

To me the most important thing is for the classic format to thrive. If no one plays classic then we are all wasting our time.  Does allowing turbo layers give new players access to viable parts?  Not all top tier classic parts are inexpensive or easy to find (Odin, deathscyther, Neptune, and etc). Is this worth the possible added complexity and confusion?  I tend to favor allowing more things of equal power level in but I do not dislike classic now.  I think ultimately accessibility is king but I see both sides.
Drivers are still allowed. Aren't they something new?
New drivers are often added to classic and that is great.  But.... why drivers?  Why not disks? Frames? Layers? 

Is it about power level of the parts or just about playing with older parts?  Or it is about making the term “classic” easy to comprehend?  Judgement.Vertical.Accel can make the “classic” driver Accel pretty playable imo.  Why not have a format to pay homage to drivers that no longer have a place instead of layers?  In my opinion, drivers, performance tips, Running cores...and etc (stuff that contacts the stadium the most) are the most defining parts of a beyblade combination anyway.  Personally, single and dual layers are all new to me so it isn’t about new/fresh for me personally.  I know many burst classic players who bought many burst classic parts for the 1st time recently.  

In my opinion, allowing the turbo layers in classic is a fair suggestion.  Personally, I thought the original inclusion of some less powerful God Layers was fine too.  My guess is the turbo layers and bad God layers likely won’t cut it in burst limited.  It would be nice if they can find a home.  But I understand not all beyblade parts are created equal and some just won’t see much competitive play.  I also understand allowing some Turbo layers into classic is confusing, because Hasbro insists on being confusing.  Designing a format hurts my brain and I won’t pretend to know what is best.  I do know that the original post had a ton of testing in it.  The tests were pretty convincing to me.