(Jun. 21, 2014  8:51 PM)TheWhiteTiger Wrote: If Burn is better, then why suggest it.

Thermal B has only placed becuase of a lack of better options.

(Jun. 21, 2014  9:44 PM)Neo~ Wrote:

(Jun. 21, 2014  8:51 PM)TheWhiteTiger Wrote: If Burn is better, then why suggest it.

Thermal B has only placed becuase of a lack of better options.

Destabilizer combo, with endurance and stamina.
Plus we don't know if he had Burn or Earth. (guy that asked about Thermal)

(Mar. 29, 2014  10:02 PM)Leone19 Wrote:

(Mar. 29, 2014  9:59 PM)The Supreme One Wrote:

(Mar. 29, 2014  9:22 PM)DRAGON KING Wrote: Thermal B: D really does well in CT, eh?

Surprisingly, yes. It came very close to beating Burn on a couple occasions.

Thermal B:D surprisingly defeated my Scythe Cyngus B:D and Meteo L-Drago F230 CF, which beat Akalajian's Thermal B:D at Year of the Bey. His main advantage, it seemed, was that his B:D was a bit worn and often moved to "attack"- it KO'd Meteo several times and OS'ed my Scythe B:D twice.

(Jun. 21, 2014  10:21 PM)Cake Wrote: Thermal is not merely an inferior duplicate of Burn. It is its own Wheel, and can act very differently from Burn. IIRC the entire reason destabilizers existed in the old meta was to get rid of Earth combos, and from my experience Thermal still does that well. It also has good Stamina - not quite to the level of Burn, but still strong. As you can see above, it is also slightly Attack-y against taller things on certain setups (mostly via CW Attack due to exposed top), which is something Burn can do, but not quite as well due to its lack of innate Upper Attack/Upper Smash and higher profile, which somewhat obscures the CW near its base and could reduce Attack a little bit.

(Jun. 21, 2014  10:21 PM)Cake Wrote: As I said, Burn is clearly the better choice for pure Stamina, but it is not necessarily going to directly outclass Thermal in every way. If you choose Thermal, you are also choosing a slightly different wheel where you trade off some pure Stamina for destabilization and Upper Attack. If you are interested in that kind of thing, or deem the trade-off to be worth it, then Thermal is a perfectly usable choice.

(Jun. 21, 2014  10:21 PM)Cake Wrote: Thermal's reason for placing isn't simply because there were no better options; it placed because it is different. The entire reason it placed is because it isn't Burn; it was able to do unusual things that Burn would not have been capable of. However, since the trade-off between it and Burn means you lose Stamina, it predictably lost to Burn itself (though not by much), which makes sense because Thermal can't beat Burn's pure Stamina. But that's just how the trade-off works - you beat some things that you wouldn't have won against otherwise, but lose to things you may have beaten. And, as a matter of fact, if they had chosen Burn instead of Thermal, they would have had about a 50/50 chance against other Burn combos, and then most likely lost to the other two and not placed at all; Thermal was actually probably the better choice.

(Jun. 21, 2014  11:52 PM)Echizen Wrote: There's a reason why no one uses it. Rounder doesn't mean less recoil, always. Take Scythe for example. Or Death.

(Jun. 22, 2014  12:16 AM)Woumb@ Wrote: Thermal is too aggressively designed to be as good as Earth or Burn on a pure Stamina setup, but not aggressively designed or heavy enough to pack a punch consistently. Burn is still better on 85/90MF because its outward weight distribution lets it OS more things. You could use it as a destabiliser but even in their "prime" destabilisers were never really that useful. It will usually just come down to "who gets the lucky uppercut when the WDs start precessing" type of thing.

EDIT: Beaten by Cake on the smoothness thing.

(Jun. 22, 2014  12:11 AM)Cake Wrote: Generally roundness = less recoil. The smoother a beyblade's surface, the less recoil it will have. Death and Scythe are both low recoil... Scythe is top-tier Defense (though arguably that's more due to its PC frame) and Death was top-tier Defense for quite a while. If you are referring to Hasbro Metal Fury (as in Limited), they may be round on the edge, but the reason they have recoil is due to the large protrusions on the top, which will, of course, cause massive recoil (though excellent Attack potential). However, on the topic of Burn vs Thermal, I would also agree that Thermal is rounder than Burn. Though it does have the "gills" and two gaps, Burn has four breaks in its perimeter and an underside that is somewhat recoily; Thermal is pretty much completely smooth on top and bottom; the only significant interruptions are at the gaps, which aren't all that large anyways.

(Jun. 22, 2014  12:21 AM)Echizen Wrote: Scythe is not top-tier defense. And comapred to oher things, Death doesn't have as less recoil. There's a reason why it's outclassed. No I meant the 4D ones. It has those slopes though, making it not very tound, not having good weight distribution.

(Jun. 22, 2014  6:27 PM)Cake Wrote: Ah, that makes more sense. But having the slopes and thicker metal in certain places won't affect weight distribution in terms of Stamina. What matters for Stamina is where the weight is radially- how close it is to the center of the Beyblade. Thermal is quite lightweight in the center due to its hollow shape underneath and holes - similar to Burn, actually. The outer edge is pretty much solid, as you can see underneath quite well. That gives it strong Stamina (though not as strong as Burn).

(Jun. 22, 2014  6:30 PM)Echizen Wrote:

(Jun. 22, 2014  6:27 PM)Cake Wrote: Ah, that makes more sense. But having the slopes and thicker metal in certain places won't affect weight distribution in terms of Stamina. What matters for Stamina is where the weight is radially- how close it is to the center of the Beyblade. Thermal is quite lightweight in the center due to its hollow shape underneath and holes - similar to Burn, actually. The outer edge is pretty much solid, as you can see underneath quite well. That gives it strong Stamina (though not as strong as Burn).

Actually it will. Why do you think all CW's used in Stamina combos are circular?

(Jun. 22, 2014  10:25 PM)Cake Wrote: The moment of inertia (the rotational quantity that defines the flywheel effect and therefore Stamina) for a cylindrical tube is represented by the formula I = 0.5m(r^2 + r^2), where the two r's represent the inner and outer diameter of the cylinder. We'll assume the center of the CW or Beyblade has much less weight as the rest, such as in the case of Phantom, or most Stamina parts for that matter. Note how the height of the cylinder does not matter - all that matters is that the cylinder has rotational symmetry (so as to be balanced while spinning around the axis of symmetry), its mass, and the inner and outer radii - where the mass is positioned relative to the axis of rotation.