(Apr. 24, 2021 6:54 PM)i\m batman Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 6:10 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]People are always talking about legends getting done dirty but truth be told, rookies are always beating opponents who should be leagues above them, they just hate it now because they have become particularly fond of certain characters.
Valt beats the supreme four members Zac and Xhaka who have been sitting at the top for a while and he also beat Ben, who was a former supreme four member. Then, he surpasses Lui (he obviously would have beat him, they had him lose by accident for development) who was been blading at national level for 4 years and was powerful enough to challenge Free at the world tournament.Â
Valt and Silas go around beating big five members within a single season and Valt eventually surpasses Free who has been sitting at the top ever since the very existence of the world league. He beats Kurt, who has been dominating the underground beyblade world for years and he even beats a Requiem project enhanced Shu who is said to be more powerful than Free and Lui.
In season 3 Aiga beats Lui and Valt (twice) and effectively surpasses Free and Shu by beating Phi. He also beats Kitt, who happens to be the European champion and he even beats the z4. Quite literally everyone in this season has been blading for longer than Aiga, it's even more ridiculous than it is in s5.
Season 4 is not as bad since Drum has been blading for a while and has been training under Valt in BC Sol (plus the people he fights are evidently pretty new as well, so I will give it a pass).
I don't need to explain season 5
I won't deny that fondness plays a huge part towards the hate (at least for me), but it does have some merit. For one, episode length. We are effectively getting half the episodes, so it feels more rushed. Another thing is how they lost.
S1:Â Zac would have won if not for the touch. Valt had to devise a new launch form on the spot (a very difficult thing to do), Sprint Boost, to beat Xander. He had to devise another one, this time strong enough to damage the stadium to even go up against Lui. And the match with Ben was extremely close as well.
S2: For Valt, he's already near the top in terms of potential as evidenced by his wins in S1. Yes, he surpasses Free, but Free still had the upper hand before he injured himself.
Kurt is not the strongest among the cast anyway because as Xander and Ren Wu pointed out, the competition has only gotten tougher while Kurt was busy beating up weaklings. Silas was a very powerful blader from the get go and was probably only not in the rankings because he was not in any team and didn't participate in tournaments. He also never surpassed Lui or Free in this season.
S3: This, I acknowledge has genuine problems with it's pacing (beating Lui in Ep 15, almost tying with Valt in Ep 1). However, at the same time, the 24 minute episodes make it seem somewhat longer.
S4: Nothing to say, really.
S5: Hyuga and Hikaru beat the Kiyama bros in Ep 2. Hyuga beats Silas in Ep 4. In the Tag League, the bros burst Aiger-Ranjiro and Lui-Dante. I don't remember their battle with V&R that well.
These are some points I have to say that the opponents were not disrespected at least in S1 and S2.
Oh no I understand. Just to be clear, i'm not really calling out the idea of people hating the season itself. Just don't see an issue with strong bladers losing seeing as it was inevitable and has been happening since forever.
It's all in how it's done. It's in the execution, and S5 did not execute that well.
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:03 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]It's all in how it's done. It's in the execution, and S5 did not execute that well.
Surely it is, I don't disagree with that part. It has just become clear that the arguments have shifted from Hyuga and Hikaru having bad development to legends losing as easily as they did being ludicrous and I don't agree with that part.
I'm fine with legends losing battles as they're not invincible, I mean valt, shu, free and Lui are going to lose battles despite being the best. Just in the way it's shown is the main thing. Imo.
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:07 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 7:03 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]It's all in how it's done. It's in the execution, and S5 did not execute that well.
Surely it is, I don't disagree with that part. It has just become clear that the arguments have shifted from Hyuga and Hikaru having bad development to legends losing as easily as they did being ludicrous and I don't agree with that part.
My main problem was with Lain. Everything regarding him was ridiculous. My problem with the bros was whenever we had a flare=win situation.
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:14 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 7:07 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]Surely it is, I don't disagree with that part. It has just become clear that the arguments have shifted from Hyuga and Hikaru having bad development to legends losing as easily as they did being ludicrous and I don't agree with that part.
My main problem was with Lain. Everything regarding him was ridiculous. My problem with the bros was whenever we had a flare=win situation.
Pretty much that, yeah. I don't mind Legends losing frequently (heck, it'd make me happy if it meant new characters can grow from their battles with them), but the way they plowed through them in Sparking with little to no character development on both ends was simply bad writing. The goal shouldn't be to just beat the Legends, it should be learning to become better Bladers by defeating the Legends and climbing to the top. The Flare=Win situations obviously glossed over that part (except for like, 1 or 2 instances throughout the whole season)
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:18 PM)PinkRose Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 7:14 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]My main problem was with Lain. Everything regarding him was ridiculous. My problem with the bros was whenever we had a flare=win situation.
Pretty much that, yeah. I don't mind Legends losing frequently (heck, it'd make me happy if it meant new characters can grow from their battles with them), but the way they plowed through them in Sparking with little to no character development on both ends was simply bad writing. The goal shouldn't be to just beat the Legends, it should be learning to become better Bladers by defeating the Legends and climbing to the top. The Flare=Win situations obviously glossed over that part (except for like, 1 or 2 instances throughout the whole season)
Now I'm not really saying I'd like to the see the legends losing frequently. They are
Legends after all. That has to mean something. Honestly Sparking is behind us, let's see what DB has to offer. Hopefully they don't go down the same route Sparking went.
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:22 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 7:18 PM)PinkRose Wrote: [ -> ]Pretty much that, yeah. I don't mind Legends losing frequently (heck, it'd make me happy if it meant new characters can grow from their battles with them), but the way they plowed through them in Sparking with little to no character development on both ends was simply bad writing. The goal shouldn't be to just beat the Legends, it should be learning to become better Bladers by defeating the Legends and climbing to the top. The Flare=Win situations obviously glossed over that part (except for like, 1 or 2 instances throughout the whole season)
Now I'm not really saying I'd like to the see the legends losing frequently. They are Legends after all. That has to mean something. Honestly Sparking is behind us, let's see what DB has to offer. Hopefully they don't go down the same route Sparking went.
Fair enough. From what I've seen, aside from some miiiiinor issues with the pacing, DB is off to a good start and I hope they keep up the quality for the rest of the season.
(Apr. 24, 2021 6:57 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 6:48 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]I was mainly referring to Hyuga and Hikaru, not Lane (he's even dumber though). Nonetheless Valt and Aiga were still newbies beating pros within the span of a single season which is the issue being addressed. The arguments people are making against Hyuga and Hikaru all revolve around the fact that they are beating blading legends.
I didn't particularly have a problem with Hyuga and Hikaru on that score. Neither of them really defeated many Legends solo and most times they were flukes because they were swiftly defeated soon after. Most of their wins against Legends were as a team. My issue was when the wins were a result of foolish flare shenanigans. That stuff with Lain on the other hand just didn't make any sense. In addition, it's all in how it's done. Valt worked to the bone to get as good as he did, thus making his wins believable, something we didn't see with Aiger. He was just defeating people left and right which was ridiculous. It's all in how it's executed.
HYuga and Hikaru aren't even strong. They're like mid-tier. No actual amazing feats.
(Apr. 24, 2021 6:54 PM)i\m batman Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 6:10 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]People are always talking about legends getting done dirty but truth be told, rookies are always beating opponents who should be leagues above them, they just hate it now because they have become particularly fond of certain characters.
Valt beats the supreme four members Zac and Xhaka who have been sitting at the top for a while and he also beat Ben, who was a former supreme four member. Then, he surpasses Lui (he obviously would have beat him, they had him lose by accident for development) who was been blading at national level for 4 years and was powerful enough to challenge Free at the world tournament.Â
Valt and Silas go around beating big five members within a single season and Valt eventually surpasses Free who has been sitting at the top ever since the very existence of the world league. He beats Kurt, who has been dominating the underground beyblade world for years and he even beats a Requiem project enhanced Shu who is said to be more powerful than Free and Lui.
In season 3 Aiga beats Lui and Valt (twice) and effectively surpasses Free and Shu by beating Phi. He also beats Kitt, who happens to be the European champion and he even beats the z4. Quite literally everyone in this season has been blading for longer than Aiga, it's even more ridiculous than it is in s5.
Season 4 is not as bad since Drum has been blading for a while and has been training under Valt in BC Sol (plus the people he fights are evidently pretty new as well, so I will give it a pass).
I don't need to explain season 5
I won't deny that fondness plays a huge part towards the hate (at least for me), but it does have some merit. For one, episode length. We are effectively getting half the episodes, so it feels more rushed. Another thing is how they lost.
S1:Â Zac would have won if not for the touch. Valt had to devise a new launch form on the spot (a very difficult thing to do), Sprint Boost, to beat Xander. He had to devise another one, this time strong enough to damage the stadium to even go up against Lui. And the match with Ben was extremely close as well.
S2: For Valt, he's already near the top in terms of potential as evidenced by his wins in S1. Yes, he surpasses Free, but Free still had the upper hand before he injured himself.
Kurt is not the strongest among the cast anyway because as Xander and Ren Wu pointed out, the competition has only gotten tougher while Kurt was busy beating up weaklings. Silas was a very powerful blader from the get go and was probably only not in the rankings because he was not in any team and didn't participate in tournaments. He also never surpassed Lui or Free in this season.
S3: This, I acknowledge has genuine problems with it's pacing (beating Lui in Ep 15, almost tying with Valt in Ep 1). However, at the same time, the 24 minute episodes make it seem somewhat longer.
S4: Nothing to say, really.
S5: Hyuga and Hikaru beat the Kiyama bros in Ep 2. Hyuga beats Silas in Ep 4. In the Tag League, the bros burst Aiger-Ranjiro and Lui-Dante. I don't remember their battle with V&R that well.
These are some points I have to say that the opponents were not disrespected at least in S1 and S2.
Another reason why Gachi is goddamn awesome.
(Apr. 24, 2021 6:10 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]People are always talking about legends getting done dirty but truth be told, rookies are always beating opponents who should be leagues above them, they just hate it now because they have become particularly fond of certain characters.
Valt beats the supreme four members Zac and Xhaka who have been sitting at the top for a while and he also beat Ben, who was a former supreme four member. Then, he surpasses Lui (he obviously would have beat him, they had him lose by accident for development) who was been blading at national level for 4 years and was powerful enough to challenge Free at the world tournament.Â
Valt and Silas go around beating big five members within a single season and Valt eventually surpasses Free who has been sitting at the top ever since the very existence of the world league. He beats Kurt, who has been dominating the underground beyblade world for years and he even beats a Requiem project enhanced Shu who is said to be more powerful than Free and Lui.
In season 3 Aiga beats Lui and Valt (twice) and effectively surpasses Free and Shu by beating Phi. He also beats Kitt, who happens to be the European champion and he even beats the z4. Quite literally everyone in this season has been blading for longer than Aiga, it's even more ridiculous than it is in s5.
Season 4 is not as bad since Drum has been blading for a while and has been training under Valt in BC Sol (plus the people he fights are evidently pretty new as well, so I will give it a pass).
I don't need to explain season 5
To be fair in valt's defense he was not really what you called a Real newbie he was beyblading as a kid prior the story after all.what happen with him is If he wasnt goofing off And thinking Just launch the bey an boom he wins without actually thinking of a strategy or having a Real proper launch shoot. He would ve been strong from the start. We saw what happen when he started to fight bladers Who or either better at beyblading cause the actually understood what they were doing or the bladers Who are born prodigy his instincts kicks in which makes his body do certain things that he Normally would'nt do, the even use shu to explain to is that valt body is adapting to the situation cause of his battle instincts is awakening we saw that when he was battling don't remember against Who his instincts kicks in which results of valt changing his launch style by the end the scene when they show Valkyrie spiritly using her sword to adjust valt launch to which shu even said valt might actually be a genius blader. Valt was just what you called a late bloomer. Besides all of his were really close in S1 barely winning some of them. Now an S2 i'm going to be honest valt being this weak was stupid he shouldve only been 1 tier below free, shu And lui but equal to xhaka, ruway And joshua same with sisco. S1 valt beat xhaka but xhaka is big 5 while valt isnt even rank? At least valt should be top 16 climbing up, now For season 3 with aiga well thats a mess so i'll skip this. But out of all the cast aiga was the pure amateur cause he didnt even know what a beyblade is after that is the bros although they knew how to beyblade it was nothing special about them which makes this 3 issues
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:10 PM)Free... Hoya Wrote: [ -> ]I'm fine with legends losing battles as they're not invincible, I mean valt, shu, free and Lui are going to lose battles despite being the best. Just in the way it's shown is the main thing. Imo.
Yes I agree. It'll be stupid if these couple of characters win and barely lose.
(Apr. 24, 2021 10:18 PM)God Dragruler Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 6:10 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]People are always talking about legends getting done dirty but truth be told, rookies are always beating opponents who should be leagues above them, they just hate it now because they have become particularly fond of certain characters.
Valt beats the supreme four members Zac and Xhaka who have been sitting at the top for a while and he also beat Ben, who was a former supreme four member. Then, he surpasses Lui (he obviously would have beat him, they had him lose by accident for development) who was been blading at national level for 4 years and was powerful enough to challenge Free at the world tournament.Â
Valt and Silas go around beating big five members within a single season and Valt eventually surpasses Free who has been sitting at the top ever since the very existence of the world league. He beats Kurt, who has been dominating the underground beyblade world for years and he even beats a Requiem project enhanced Shu who is said to be more powerful than Free and Lui.
In season 3 Aiga beats Lui and Valt (twice) and effectively surpasses Free and Shu by beating Phi. He also beats Kitt, who happens to be the European champion and he even beats the z4. Quite literally everyone in this season has been blading for longer than Aiga, it's even more ridiculous than it is in s5.
Season 4 is not as bad since Drum has been blading for a while and has been training under Valt in BC Sol (plus the people he fights are evidently pretty new as well, so I will give it a pass).
I don't need to explain season 5
To be fair in valt's defense he was not really what you called a Real newbie he was beyblading as a kid prior the story after all.what happen with him is If he wasnt goofing off And thinking Just launch the bey an boom he wins without actually thinking of a strategy or having a Real proper launch shoot. He would ve been strong from the start. We saw what happen when he started to fight bladers Who or either better at beyblading cause the actually understood what they were doing or the bladers Who are born prodigy his instincts kicks in which makes his body do certain things that he Normally would'nt do, the even use shu to explain to is that valt body is adapting to the situation cause of his battle instincts is awakening we saw that when he was battling don't remember against Who his instincts kicks in which results of valt changing his launch style by the end the scene when they show Valkyrie spiritly using her sword to adjust valt launch to which shu even said valt might actually be a genius blader. Valt was just what you called a late bloomer. Besides all of his were really close in S1 barely winning some of them. Now an S2 i'm going to be honest valt being this weak was stupid he shouldve only been 1 tier below free, shu And lui but equal to xhaka, ruway And joshua same with sisco. S1 valt beat xhaka but xhaka is big 5 while valt isnt even rank? At least valt should be top 16 climbing up, now For season 3 with aiga well thats a mess so i'll skip this. But out of all the cast aiga was the pure amateur cause he didnt even know what a beyblade is after that is the bros although they knew how to beyblade it was nothing special about them which makes this 3 issues
I agree drag. Valt wasn't a newbie, just needed to work harder. Reaching World Champion or becoming the Legend of Legends isn't something a normal blader can do.
Also Drag, can you like put periods and capitalize the first letter of the first word of a sentence? Just a request.
(Apr. 24, 2021 10:18 PM)God Dragruler Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 6:10 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]People are always talking about legends getting done dirty but truth be told, rookies are always beating opponents who should be leagues above them, they just hate it now because they have become particularly fond of certain characters.
Valt beats the supreme four members Zac and Xhaka who have been sitting at the top for a while and he also beat Ben, who was a former supreme four member. Then, he surpasses Lui (he obviously would have beat him, they had him lose by accident for development) who was been blading at national level for 4 years and was powerful enough to challenge Free at the world tournament.Â
Valt and Silas go around beating big five members within a single season and Valt eventually surpasses Free who has been sitting at the top ever since the very existence of the world league. He beats Kurt, who has been dominating the underground beyblade world for years and he even beats a Requiem project enhanced Shu who is said to be more powerful than Free and Lui.
In season 3 Aiga beats Lui and Valt (twice) and effectively surpasses Free and Shu by beating Phi. He also beats Kitt, who happens to be the European champion and he even beats the z4. Quite literally everyone in this season has been blading for longer than Aiga, it's even more ridiculous than it is in s5.
Season 4 is not as bad since Drum has been blading for a while and has been training under Valt in BC Sol (plus the people he fights are evidently pretty new as well, so I will give it a pass).
I don't need to explain season 5
To be fair in valt's defense he was not really what you called a Real newbie he was beyblading as a kid prior the story after all.what happen with him is If he wasnt goofing off And thinking Just launch the bey an boom he wins without actually thinking of a strategy or having a Real proper launch shoot. He would ve been strong from the start. We saw what happen when he started to fight bladers Who or either better at beyblading cause the actually understood what they were doing or the bladers Who are born prodigy his instincts kicks in which makes his body do certain things that he Normally would'nt do, the even use shu to explain to is that valt body is adapting to the situation cause of his battle instincts is awakening we saw that when he was battling don't remember against Who his instincts kicks in which results of valt changing his launch style by the end the scene when they show Valkyrie spiritly using her sword to adjust valt launch to which shu even said valt might actually be a genius blader. Valt was just what you called a late bloomer. Besides all of his were really close in S1 barely winning some of them. Now an S2 i'm going to be honest valt being this weak was stupid he shouldve only been 1 tier below free, shu And lui but equal to xhaka, ruway And joshua same with sisco. S1 valt beat xhaka but xhaka is big 5 while valt isnt even rank? At least valt should be top 16 climbing up, now For season 3 with aiga well thats a mess so i'll skip this. But out of all the cast aiga was the pure amateur cause he didnt even know what a beyblade is after that is the bros although they knew how to beyblade it was nothing special about them which makes this 3 issues
Valt didn't start blading long before s1, it was mentioned somewhere-Â and besides, part of being a good blader is actually having good strategy, proper resonance (beyond simply calling your bey partner) and the right maturity. Since he didn't actually have those things, he wasn't good. He didn't have these requirements and he instead acquired them awfully quickly (as all anime protagonists do) through the course of the series as he grew so he would still lose even if he was serious because he would ultimately be an empty shell. The fact is, he was still beginner level in episode one and rose up to defeat bladers who had been dominating for years.Â
Anyways, people seem to be missing the argument i'm trying to make. What I am trying to say is that new/low level bladers beating bladers who have been training/remaining strong for years is common in burst.
(Apr. 24, 2021 10:28 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 10:18 PM)God Dragruler Wrote: [ -> ]To be fair in valt's defense he was not really what you called a Real newbie he was beyblading as a kid prior the story after all.what happen with him is If he wasnt goofing off And thinking Just launch the bey an boom he wins without actually thinking of a strategy or having a Real proper launch shoot. He would ve been strong from the start. We saw what happen when he started to fight bladers Who or either better at beyblading cause the actually understood what they were doing or the bladers Who are born prodigy his instincts kicks in which makes his body do certain things that he Normally would'nt do, the even use shu to explain to is that valt body is adapting to the situation cause of his battle instincts is awakening we saw that when he was battling don't remember against Who his instincts kicks in which results of valt changing his launch style by the end the scene when they show Valkyrie spiritly using her sword to adjust valt launch to which shu even said valt might actually be a genius blader. Valt was just what you called a late bloomer. Besides all of his were really close in S1 barely winning some of them. Now an S2 i'm going to be honest valt being this weak was stupid he shouldve only been 1 tier below free, shu And lui but equal to xhaka, ruway And joshua same with sisco. S1 valt beat xhaka but xhaka is big 5 while valt isnt even rank? At least valt should be top 16 climbing up, now For season 3 with aiga well thats a mess so i'll skip this. But out of all the cast aiga was the pure amateur cause he didnt even know what a beyblade is after that is the bros although they knew how to beyblade it was nothing special about them which makes this 3 issues
Valt didn't start blading long before s1, it was mentioned somewhere-Â and besides, part of being a good blader is actually having good strategy, proper resonance (beyond simply calling your bey partner) and the right maturity. Since he didn't actually have those things, he wasn't good. He didn't have these requirements and he instead acquired them awfully quickly (as all anime protagonists do) through the course of the series as he grew so he would still lose even if he was serious because he would ultimately be an empty shell. The fact is, he was still beginner level in episode one and rose up to defeat bladers who had been dominating for years.Â
Anyways, people seem to be missing the argument i'm trying to make. What I am trying to say is that new/low level bladers beating bladers who have been training/remaining strong for years is common in burst.
Valt was a natural blader as was mentioned early on. He'd been balding for at least a year and a half before the season began, that was mentioned in a particular episode. What he lacked was the fundamentals and the understanding for his need to train. He already had strong Resonance. His bond with Valtryek was already powerful and only grew. Once he grasped the fundamentals, he started to progress and even in that progression it was shown over and over that he wasn't at the level he needed to take down the top tier bladers, so he worked harder and it was only after working like a dog that he really began to reach their level and there were still setbacks along the way. And it took a further season before he reached the level of someone like Free, someone who'd been ragdolling Lui for years. He trained and worked through five tournaments before reaching the top. There's a big difference between that, and a newbie blader coming out of nowhere without that same level of hard work and training and beating the best.
(Apr. 24, 2021 11:06 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 10:28 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]Valt didn't start blading long before s1, it was mentioned somewhere- and besides, part of being a good blader is actually having good strategy, proper resonance (beyond simply calling your bey partner) and the right maturity. Since he didn't actually have those things, he wasn't good. He didn't have these requirements and he instead acquired them awfully quickly (as all anime protagonists do) through the course of the series as he grew so he would still lose even if he was serious because he would ultimately be an empty shell. The fact is, he was still beginner level in episode one and rose up to defeat bladers who had been dominating for years.Â
Anyways, people seem to be missing the argument i'm trying to make. What I am trying to say is that new/low level bladers beating bladers who have been training/remaining strong for years is common in burst.
Valt was a natural blader as was mentioned early on. He'd been balding for at least a year and a half before the season began, that was mentioned in a particular episode. What he lacked was the fundamentals and the understanding for his need to train. He already had strong Resonance. His bond with Valtryek was already powerful and only grew. Once he grasped the fundamentals, he started to progress and even in that progression it was shown over and over that he wasn't at the level he needed to take down the top tier bladers, so he worked harder and it was only after working like a dog that he really began to reach their level and there were still setbacks along the way. And it took a further season before he reached the level of someone like Free, someone who'd been ragdolling Lui for years. He trained and worked through five tournaments before reaching the top. There's a big difference between that, and a newbie blader coming out of nowhere without that same level of hard work and training and beating the best.
He didn't already have strong resonance, the reason why we see more from him than we do other bladers (which is what makes it seem like his resonance it stronger than most) is simply because he was the main character, if you notice, Valkyrie and Valt hardly have any moments in Gt and Sparking for a reason, all these people are resonating you just don't see it. Lui openly told him that he didn't understand his bey in the season and Shu told him that he hadn't awakened as well. Fundamentals and general understanding are not something you acquire all that quickly, each season of burst doesn't span over very long being a month to 3 at most. Free has been working hard for over 4 years and loses to Valt who has been blading seriously for about a month. Valt is called a natural sure, so are Hyuga and Hikaru, as a matter of fact they are stated to have high potential just about all the time. But out of all of this do you notice the pattern in my replies? I am not denying the points you make, I am trying to say that realistically, Valt beating top tier bladers who have been working hard and remaining strong for far longer than he has makes no sense the same way Hyuga and Hikaru do. Sure, hes training hard but at the end of the day, that just makes him a better developed character and doesn't change the fact that what he was doing was unrealistic.
(Apr. 24, 2021 10:28 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]Valt didn't start blading long before s1, it was mentioned somewhere-Â and besides
Anyways, people seem to be missing the argument i'm trying to make. What I am trying to say is that new/low level bladers beating bladers who have been training/remaining strong for years is common in burst.
For your argument I agree but In season 1 episode 14 (anime) you can actually see valt playing beyblade with shu a year before the rose up aka the year where shu start getting all of the cloud and got scared by lui. I think it's apply for the manga as well but it was rather unclear.
(Apr. 24, 2021 10:28 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 10:18 PM)God Dragruler Wrote: [ -> ]To be fair in valt's defense he was not really what you called a Real newbie he was beyblading as a kid prior the story after all.what happen with him is If he wasnt goofing off And thinking Just launch the bey an boom he wins without actually thinking of a strategy or having a Real proper launch shoot. He would ve been strong from the start. We saw what happen when he started to fight bladers Who or either better at beyblading cause the actually understood what they were doing or the bladers Who are born prodigy his instincts kicks in which makes his body do certain things that he Normally would'nt do, the even use shu to explain to is that valt body is adapting to the situation cause of his battle instincts is awakening we saw that when he was battling don't remember against Who his instincts kicks in which results of valt changing his launch style by the end the scene when they show Valkyrie spiritly using her sword to adjust valt launch to which shu even said valt might actually be a genius blader. Valt was just what you called a late bloomer. Besides all of his were really close in S1 barely winning some of them. Now an S2 i'm going to be honest valt being this weak was stupid he shouldve only been 1 tier below free, shu And lui but equal to xhaka, ruway And joshua same with sisco. S1 valt beat xhaka but xhaka is big 5 while valt isnt even rank? At least valt should be top 16 climbing up, now For season 3 with aiga well thats a mess so i'll skip this. But out of all the cast aiga was the pure amateur cause he didnt even know what a beyblade is after that is the bros although they knew how to beyblade it was nothing special about them which makes this 3 issues
Valt didn't start blading long before s1, it was mentioned somewhere-Â and besides, part of being a good blader is actually having good strategy, proper resonance (beyond simply calling your bey partner) and the right maturity. Since he didn't actually have those things, he wasn't good. He didn't have these requirements and he instead acquired them awfully quickly (as all anime protagonists do) through the course of the series as he grew so he would still lose even if he was serious because he would ultimately be an empty shell. The fact is, he was still beginner level in episode one and rose up to defeat bladers who had been dominating for years.Â
Anyways, people seem to be missing the argument i'm trying to make. What I am trying to say is that new/low level bladers beating bladers who have been training/remaining strong for years is common in burst.
Valt defitively knew how to beyblade before the S1 (he started is a kid in the Manga in fact Valkyrie was given yo him by his dad) the amime Just age up valt to when he got Valkyrie but even them he still knew about beyblade prior. Remember shu became a supreme 4 a year ago, and Valt was one Who brought shu in the world of beyblade so he still knew about it prior S1. Yea thats why I said valt is what you called a late bloomer he always had talents For it because of that his growth wasnt that big of an issue the only difference he had with the rest of the cast was the battle an tournaments but 90% of S1 bladers wasn’t op. They only op bladers were Lui and shu while lui was the only blader that was dominating For 4 years was only lui with shu the only blader to be a challenge For him their they only 2, The rest was not really dominating we know the supreme 4 wasnt always the same as well to support that, Unlike free in S2 Who was nearly booked to be invincible in fact he was the only blader in S2 Who was booked that way. People arent missing what you meant we understand. I don't know if you realize they only characters brought up when the say newbie beating legends are the bros & aiga back an cho z plus lane (even though he always knew how to beyblade they Just never mentioned how long but he was no newbie). Most people are fine with Bell. Years doesn’t really matter what matter is how their getting beat no one is invincible nor unbeatable you can have 20+ year an lose to someone Who's whole career is that 20 plus year but if its written correctly theirs no issues.
(Apr. 25, 2021 12:08 AM)God Dragruler Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 10:28 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]Valt didn't start blading long before s1, it was mentioned somewhere- and besides, part of being a good blader is actually having good strategy, proper resonance (beyond simply calling your bey partner) and the right maturity. Since he didn't actually have those things, he wasn't good. He didn't have these requirements and he instead acquired them awfully quickly (as all anime protagonists do) through the course of the series as he grew so he would still lose even if he was serious because he would ultimately be an empty shell. The fact is, he was still beginner level in episode one and rose up to defeat bladers who had been dominating for years.Â
Anyways, people seem to be missing the argument i'm trying to make. What I am trying to say is that new/low level bladers beating bladers who have been training/remaining strong for years is common in burst.
Valt defitively knew how to beyblade before the S1 (he started is a kid in the Manga in fact Valkyrie was given yo him by his dad) the amime Just age up valt to when he got Valkyrie but even them he still knew about beyblade prior. Remember shu became a supreme 4 a year ago, and Valt was one Who brought shu in the world of beyblade so he still knew about it prior S1. Yea thats why I said valt is what you called a late bloomer he always had talents For it because of that his growth wasnt that big of an issue the only difference he had with the rest of the cast was the battle an tournaments but 90% of S1 bladers wasn’t op. They only op bladers were Lui and shu while lui was the only blader that was dominating For 4 years was only lui with shu the only blader to be a challenge For him their they only 2, The rest was not really dominating we know the supreme 4 wasnt always the same as well to support that, Unlike free in S2 Who was nearly booked to be invincible in fact he was the only blader in S2 Who was booked that way. People arent missing what you meant we understand. I don't know if you realize they only characters brought up when the say newbie beating legends are the bros & aiga back an cho z plus lane (even though he always knew how to beyblade they Just never mentioned how long but he was no newbie). Most people are fine with Bell. Years doesn’t really matter what matter is how their getting beat no one is invincible nor unbeatable you can have 20+ year an lose to someone Who's whole career is that 20 plus year but if its written correctly theirs no issues.
On Shu becoming a supreme four member, we know he didn't start out as one and worked his way up there over a longer period and unlike Valt, Shu was never a casual blader which was the cut difference between the two. We know Ben and Gabe were former supreme four members and he beat them quick. Xhaka was a supreme four member for a while and he was said to have always beat Valt even before that. Since Zac basically = Xhaka he falls in that category too. These guys have been blading seriously at a higher level for long so Valt beating them within less than 2 months of serious training and proper blading is not realistic at all. Free, Kurt and even Silas have all been blading for years an should be better as well, you don't need to be overpowered to be leagues above a beginner. Years may not matter, but it doesn't change the logic behind the argument since they functionally shouldn't lose to Valt.
(Apr. 24, 2021 11:54 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 11:06 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]Valt was a natural blader as was mentioned early on. He'd been balding for at least a year and a half before the season began, that was mentioned in a particular episode. What he lacked was the fundamentals and the understanding for his need to train. He already had strong Resonance. His bond with Valtryek was already powerful and only grew. Once he grasped the fundamentals, he started to progress and even in that progression it was shown over and over that he wasn't at the level he needed to take down the top tier bladers, so he worked harder and it was only after working like a dog that he really began to reach their level and there were still setbacks along the way. And it took a further season before he reached the level of someone like Free, someone who'd been ragdolling Lui for years. He trained and worked through five tournaments before reaching the top. There's a big difference between that, and a newbie blader coming out of nowhere without that same level of hard work and training and beating the best.
He didn't already have strong resonance, the reason why we see more from him than we do other bladers (which is what makes it seem like his resonance it stronger than most) is simply because he was the main character, if you notice, Valkyrie and Valt hardly have any moments in Gt and Sparking for a reason, all these people are resonating you just don't see it. Lui openly told him that he didn't understand his bey in the season and Shu told him that he hadn't awakened as well. Fundamentals and general understanding are not something you acquire all that quickly, each season of burst doesn't span over very long being a month to 3 at most. Free has been working hard for over 4 years and loses to Valt who has been blading seriously for about a month. Valt is called a natural sure, so are Hyuga and Hikaru, as a matter of fact they are stated to have high potential just about all the time. But out of all of this do you notice the pattern in my replies? I am not denying the points you make, I am trying to say that realistically, Valt beating top tier bladers who have been working hard and remaining strong for far longer than he has makes no sense the same way Hyuga and Hikaru do. Sure, hes training hard but at the end of the day, that just makes him a better developed character and doesn't change the fact that what he was doing was unrealistic.
Yes, Valt still had things to learn about his bey, but doesn't negate the fact that he had a strong resonance with it. He still had learning to do though. We don't know precisely how long each season is, but it's certainly more than a month. Those first two seasons at the very least. Hiro Morita confirmed it to be 1-1.5 years. He was also blading another 1.5 years before that. His hard training across that time, through five tournaments was the foundation for his eventually reaching the top. That makes sense. It's a problem when a character suddenly reaches the top without that foundation, that's when it doesn't make sense. With Valt we had a basis to believe the victories he achieved because of how they handled his growth. He didn't come out of the gate blowing people away and he trained like crazy to reach the top level. It was that training among other things that lead to his growth in power. Again it's all in how's it's executed. The differences in how these bladers reached the top is really the crux of it.
(Apr. 25, 2021 12:18 AM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 11:54 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]He didn't already have strong resonance, the reason why we see more from him than we do other bladers (which is what makes it seem like his resonance it stronger than most) is simply because he was the main character, if you notice, Valkyrie and Valt hardly have any moments in Gt and Sparking for a reason, all these people are resonating you just don't see it. Lui openly told him that he didn't understand his bey in the season and Shu told him that he hadn't awakened as well. Fundamentals and general understanding are not something you acquire all that quickly, each season of burst doesn't span over very long being a month to 3 at most. Free has been working hard for over 4 years and loses to Valt who has been blading seriously for about a month. Valt is called a natural sure, so are Hyuga and Hikaru, as a matter of fact they are stated to have high potential just about all the time. But out of all of this do you notice the pattern in my replies? I am not denying the points you make, I am trying to say that realistically, Valt beating top tier bladers who have been working hard and remaining strong for far longer than he has makes no sense the same way Hyuga and Hikaru do. Sure, hes training hard but at the end of the day, that just makes him a better developed character and doesn't change the fact that what he was doing was unrealistic.
Yes, Valt still had things to learn about his bey, but doesn't negate the fact that he had a strong resonance with it. He still had learning to do though. We don't know precisely how long each season is, but it's certainly more than a month. Those first two seasons at the very least. Hiro Morita confirmed it to be 1-1.5 years. He was also blading another 1.5 years before that. His hard training across that time, through five tournaments was the foundation for his eventually reaching the top. That makes sense. It's a problem when a character suddenly reaches the top without that foundation, that's when it doesn't make sense. With Valt we had a basis to believe the victories that he achieved because of how they handled his growth. He didn't come out of the gate blowing people away and he train like crazy to reach the top level. It was that training among other things that lead to his growth in power. Again it's all in how's executed. The differences in how these bladers reached the top is different.
The first two seasons lasts a year and a half even though we see Valt going to bed and waking up the next day during most episodes and we have multiple episodes simply being continuations of the last? I would like to see the source of this because I highly doubt that- especially considering the fact that follow up events are often mentioned in the next episode and each episode often mentions events that end up happening in literally the next one. As for what you said after that, again I don't disagree. His journey is good and gives us something to root for but it simply isn't realistic. Many of the background bladers have been blading at serious level for years so it isn't realistic no matter how you look at it (this isn't to say that it's bad though). A naturally talented boxer isn't going to tko Mike Tyson within a couple of months.
There has to be a foundation to make snese that a blader beats a top player. Valt had that fiundation, through tournamnets(Example is the Team tournament in season 1) and through fighting bladers like Xander being a boss for Valt. Valt worked up to beat him and after that faced the final boss Lui. In God, Valt worked up as well to beat the Big 5 and not just God, season 1 & 2 were one whole story so we can include what has done as a base in God. Because of this he beated top players like Xander, Shu, Kurtz, and Big 5 members. He also lerend from his defeats and his mistake and took them and learn other new things helping him. But in Sparking, the brothers just slamed the Legends with nothing, Hygua and Hikaru beat them with no sense. The wwriters were like "Flare = WIns". No. Just because of flare they beat the legends? As for Lane it was the same thing beating legend after legend after legend with no proper base, same for the twins. Beating top players and going to the top for everyone is different but for Sparking it was a burnt castle for the base. Does this whole thing make sense?
(Apr. 25, 2021 12:30 AM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 25, 2021 12:18 AM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, Valt still had things to learn about his bey, but doesn't negate the fact that he had a strong resonance with it. He still had learning to do though. We don't know precisely how long each season is, but it's certainly more than a month. Those first two seasons at the very least. Hiro Morita confirmed it to be 1-1.5 years. He was also blading another 1.5 years before that. His hard training across that time, through five tournaments was the foundation for his eventually reaching the top. That makes sense. It's a problem when a character suddenly reaches the top without that foundation, that's when it doesn't make sense. With Valt we had a basis to believe the victories that he achieved because of how they handled his growth. He didn't come out of the gate blowing people away and he train like crazy to reach the top level. It was that training among other things that lead to his growth in power. Again it's all in how's executed. The differences in how these bladers reached the top is different.
The first two seasons lasts a year and a half even though we see Valt going to bed and waking up the next day during most episodes and we have multiple episodes simply being continuations of the last? I would like to see the source of this because I highly doubt that- especially considering the fact that follow up events are often mentioned in the next episode and each episode often mentions events that end up happening in literally the next one. As for what you said after that, again I don't disagree. His journey is good and gives us something to root for but it simply isn't realistic. Many of the background bladers have been blading at serious level for years so it isn't realistic no matter how you look at it (this isn't to say that it's bad though). A naturally talented boxer isn't going to tko Mike Tyson within a couple of months.
![[Image: J3N15D7_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium]](https://i.imgur.com/J3N15D7_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium)
The person was asking what age were Valt and Shu in Evolution. They were 11 in Burst and 12 in evolution/god.
(Apr. 24, 2021 11:54 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 11:06 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]Valt was a natural blader as was mentioned early on. He'd been balding for at least a year and a half before the season began, that was mentioned in a particular episode. What he lacked was the fundamentals and the understanding for his need to train. He already had strong Resonance. His bond with Valtryek was already powerful and only grew. Once he grasped the fundamentals, he started to progress and even in that progression it was shown over and over that he wasn't at the level he needed to take down the top tier bladers, so he worked harder and it was only after working like a dog that he really began to reach their level and there were still setbacks along the way. And it took a further season before he reached the level of someone like Free, someone who'd been ragdolling Lui for years. He trained and worked through five tournaments before reaching the top. There's a big difference between that, and a newbie blader coming out of nowhere without that same level of hard work and training and beating the best.
He didn't already have strong resonance, the reason why we see more from him than we do other bladers (which is what makes it seem like his resonance it stronger than most) is simply because he was the main character, if you notice, Valkyrie and Valt hardly have any moments in Gt and Sparking for a reason, all these people are resonating you just don't see it. Lui openly told him that he didn't understand his bey in the season and Shu told him that he hadn't awakened as well. Fundamentals and general understanding are not something you acquire all that quickly, each season of burst doesn't span over very long being a month to 3 at most. Free has been working hard for over 4 years and loses to Valt who has been blading seriously for about a month. Valt is called a natural sure, so are Hyuga and Hikaru, as a matter of fact they are stated to have high potential just about all the time. But out of all of this do you notice the pattern in my replies? I am not denying the points you make, I am trying to say that realistically, Valt beating top tier bladers who have been working hard and remaining strong for far longer than he has makes no sense the same way Hyuga and Hikaru do. Sure, hes training hard but at the end of the day, that just makes him a better developed character and doesn't change the fact that what he was doing was unrealistic.
I'll have to agree with Zeutron.
Some random idiotic blader coming into beyblade and defeating insanely powerful bladers who were champion or at a really high level. One of the reasons why I prefer MFB over Burst.
(Apr. 24, 2021 6:48 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 6:43 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]There's a difference though, it's not analogous. The Legends got tossed around by Lain like they were nothing by some rookie. They were treated like some back water bladers. That was my problem. I had a similar problem with Aiger in season 3; I never agreed with how they handled that in season 3. With Valt it's a different story given how hard he had to work before being able to take on Big 5 members, and that was only after an entire prior season of working to the bone and it was only after more struggle and hard work in season 2, that he was able to take down members of the Big 5. After all that training he did, it made his wins believable. It's all in how it's done. The execution is completely different between those seasons.
I was mainly referring to Hyuga and Hikaru, not Lane (he's even dumber though). Nonetheless Valt and Aiga were still newbies beating pros within the span of a single season which is the issue being addressed. The arguments people are making against Hyuga and Hikaru all revolve around the fact that they are beating blading legends.
Yes, beating legends which were before LEAGUES above HH group (HH group is Hikaru and Hyuga) which really annoyed me tbh.
(Apr. 24, 2021 7:03 PM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ]It's all in how it's done. It's in the execution, and S5 did not execute that well.
I'll say that most burst seasons were the same.
S1 and s2 and current DB are good.
(Apr. 25, 2021 12:46 AM)Ryuga\s Son Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 24, 2021 11:54 PM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]He didn't already have strong resonance, the reason why we see more from him than we do other bladers (which is what makes it seem like his resonance it stronger than most) is simply because he was the main character, if you notice, Valkyrie and Valt hardly have any moments in Gt and Sparking for a reason, all these people are resonating you just don't see it. Lui openly told him that he didn't understand his bey in the season and Shu told him that he hadn't awakened as well. Fundamentals and general understanding are not something you acquire all that quickly, each season of burst doesn't span over very long being a month to 3 at most. Free has been working hard for over 4 years and loses to Valt who has been blading seriously for about a month. Valt is called a natural sure, so are Hyuga and Hikaru, as a matter of fact they are stated to have high potential just about all the time. But out of all of this do you notice the pattern in my replies? I am not denying the points you make, I am trying to say that realistically, Valt beating top tier bladers who have been working hard and remaining strong for far longer than he has makes no sense the same way Hyuga and Hikaru do. Sure, hes training hard but at the end of the day, that just makes him a better developed character and doesn't change the fact that what he was doing was unrealistic.
I'll have to agree with Zeutron.
Some random idiotic blader coming into beyblade and defeating insanely powerful bladers who were champion or at a really high level. One of the reasons why I prefer MFB over Burst.
It took Valt a year to a year and a half to achieve that. He didn't just suddenly reach the top. It was well handled. Now season 3 is another story.
(Apr. 25, 2021 12:46 AM)Admiral W Wrote: [ -> ] (Apr. 25, 2021 12:30 AM)Zeutron Wrote: [ -> ]The first two seasons lasts a year and a half even though we see Valt going to bed and waking up the next day during most episodes and we have multiple episodes simply being continuations of the last? I would like to see the source of this because I highly doubt that- especially considering the fact that follow up events are often mentioned in the next episode and each episode often mentions events that end up happening in literally the next one. As for what you said after that, again I don't disagree. His journey is good and gives us something to root for but it simply isn't realistic. Many of the background bladers have been blading at serious level for years so it isn't realistic no matter how you look at it (this isn't to say that it's bad though). A naturally talented boxer isn't going to tko Mike Tyson within a couple of months.
The person was asking what age were Valt and Shu in Evolution. They were 11 in Burst and 12 in evolution/god.
In all fairness, we have no clue how close it is to the end of the year when S1-2 take place and it doesn't take into account a possible time gap between the season either.