Hey everyone, how's it going and welcome to my most recent combo thread, MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF! Lately, I've been playing around with Nightmare, and I've seemed to have some success with it. With no official Nightmare combo testing threads, I figured that it'd be nice to experiment with it, showing some official results. That's not all, though! I'll also be stating a couple of overall thoughts, mentioning things like the concept and more! Let's begin!
Right Spin: Launcher Grip + Grip Rubber + Grip Support + Metal Assist + L/R Beylauncher
Left Spin: Left Spin Beylauncher + Launcher Rubber
Of course, all matches will be taken in place in a BB-10 Attack stadium, too.
Like other Attack-based setups, to knockout ones with both less weight and quite possibly even some with more. Again, I thought I'd experiment with Nightmare finding some Attack potential in it, too.
This would really depend on what setup you'd be facing. You'd generally want to go for a sliding shot, though.
MF-H: Of course, always nice for Attack-based setups.
Uranus: A jagged clear wheel, like MF-H, always nice for Attack setups.
Nightmare: Just intended to be a wheel to experiment with. Like Uranus, it is quite jagged, too.
LW105: Simply a low track, helps out in this case, as the setup is a LTAC.
RF: Because of it's Attack abilities and significantly more Stamina than an R2F.
~ All SELF KO'S will be redone for more accurate results.
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Samurai Wyvang (Crystal Mode Up) H145RSF
RF and RSF in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 12/20 (4 OS'S, 8 KO'S) - 60% Win Rate
Samurai Wyvang: 8/20 (4 OS'S, 4 KO'S) - 40% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Earth Aquario 85RSF
RF and RSF in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 1/10 (0 OS'S, 1 KO) - 10% Win Rate
Earth Aquario: 9/10 (ALL OS) - 90% Win Rate
This match truly was no surprise, whatsoever, to me at least, haha.
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Scythe Aquario SR200RSF
RF and RSF in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 5/20 (ALL KO) - 25% Win Rate
Scythe Aquario: 15/20 (ALL OS) - 75% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Scythe Aquario SR200TB
RF and TB in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 13/20 (1 OS, 12 KO'S) - 65% Win Rate
Scythe Aquario: 7/20 (ALL OS) - 35% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Scythe Aquario 230RSF
RF and RSF in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 9/20 (ALL KO) - 45% Win Rate
Scythe Cancer: 10/20 (ALL OS) - 55% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Earth Cancer W145BWD
RF and BWD in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 15/20 (ALL KO) - 75% Win Rate
Earth Cancer: 5/20 (ALL OS) - 25% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Burn Cancer W145BWD
RF and BWD in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 12/20 (ALL KO) - 50% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 10/20 (ALL OS) - 50% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Scythe Cancer W145BWD
RF and BWD in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 10/20 (ALL KO) - 50% Win Rate
Scythe Cancer: 10/20 (ALL OS) - 50% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Meteo L-Drago W145BWD
RF and RSF in Their Prime - Uranus Launched First All Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 9/10 (ALL KO) - 90% Win Rate
Meteo L-Drago: 1/10 (ALL OS) - 10% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Burn Cancer 230MB
RF in its Prime - MB A Tad Aggro - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 7/20 (1 OS, 6 KO'S) - 35% Win Rate
Burn Cancer: 13/20 (ALL OS) - 65% Win Rate
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105RF versus Flame Cancer 90SF
RF and SF in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Nightmare Uranus: 10/20 (ALL KO) - 50% Win Rate
Flame Cancer: 10/20 (ALL OS) - 50% Win Rate
95/200 of the matches were won
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OVERALL THOUGHTS ON THE SETUP
From these testings, I can already guarantee that the setup or anything Nightmare-based probably isn't tier-list worthy. In a way, it does kind of remind like a Screw: Good, maybe not fit for the tier-list, or that great in comparison to competitive wheels for Attack like Omega, Pegasis and Lightning with L-Drago. I feel like the setup and Nightmare itself can definitely be looked into more! More testing will be necessary, though!
50% agaisnt a stamina type...? That's not too good. Could you do a benchmark with Screw agaisnt Scythe W145BWD? Also, testing against another attack type please.
Why using LW105 instead of CH120, or even W105 ? LW105 decrease friction, while W105 increase friction, (opposite for left spinning)
You do realize friction is a bad thing for a Beyblade, right?.... So saying W105 gives more friction would be incorrect in 2 ways and saying it's better for that reason is also wrong.
What friction are you talking about? The air? If so, the wings give little to no advantage of using W105 or LW105 it was probably for the height.
You don't understand. W105 give a little more friction, but it's negligible. More friction = a better grip with the stadium, less recoil, ect...
I would put Nightmare on the same level as Screw, if not a tier below, from my own experience.
Against anything competitive it's more than likely going to lose and there's nothing that can be done about it.
Nevertheless, I will do a few tests when I have the chance.
Just got it done. The results were a bit different from Nightmare. Here it is, Echizen:
MF-H Screw Uranus LW105RF versus Scythe Cancer W145BWD
RF and BWD in Their Prime - Launches Alternated Every Five Matches
Scythe Cancer: 6/20 (4 OS'S, 2 KO'S) - 30% Win Rate
Screw Uranus: 14/20 (ALL KO) - 70% Win Rate
Also managed to get this done, as well:
MF-H Screw Uranus LW105RF versus Libra SR200RSF
RF and RSF in Their Prime - Libra Launched First All Matches
Libra SR200RSF: 12/20 (ALL OS) - 60% Win Rate
Nightmare Uranus: 8/20 (ALL KO) - 40% Win Rate
The Supreme One Wrote:I would put Nightmare on the same level as Screw, if not a tier below, from my own experience.
I'm gonna agree on this one, you're definitely right.
The Supreme One Wrote:Against anything competitive it's more than likely going to lose and there's nothing that can be done about it.
Again, I really wasn't expect Nightmare to do all that impressive, or Omega/Pegasis good: Considering there are no threads relating to Nightmare's Attack use, I figured I'd play around with it myself, sharing the results here. There is truly nothing that can be done to make this combo better. Nightmare definitely isn't the smartest of choices out there.
The Supreme One Wrote:Nevertheless, I will do a few tests when I have the chance.
Thanks, it means a lot. Kudos to you!
pretty interesting results. someone can try it with 85 or 90. a lowest track may give it some powers due to its compact designs.
when i got some time I think to try MF-H nightmare kerbecs 85 RF/MF/XF/R2F.
the only thing that i don't have the good mold of Scythe and missing may be some parts to make a comparison. if you have other sugestion to try against, just let me know ^^
(Nov. 23, 2014 4:39 PM)|BeyBouncer| Wrote: [ -> ]You don't understand. W105 give a little more friction, but it's negligible. More friction = a better grip with the stadium, less recoil, ect...
It think it's you who doesn't understand...
If it's negligible then it has no affect. Friction henders movement, which you don't want and that certainly doesn't mean it gives it better grip. The only thing that can give a Beyblade a better grip to the stadium is the performance tip. And defenitely would not lessen the recoil... But also, why would W105 give the Beyblade more friction...?
Thanks for the benchmark!
I believe he's referring to the way the wings face on each track, which I believe was tested and found to be completely negligible, so it really wouldn't matter.
Anyway, these tests are interesting and give a good look at Nightmare's potential, though it's not the greatest. Still, thank you for the tests!
I'd try defense / stamina combo. Personally it has great stamina but low defense, I'd try it with a heavy track and metal face with a d/wd
I don't think its shape lends it any usefulness in anything except Attack. I could be wrong though.
could be a balance customization. get high speed and stamina on D based tips and have is power from smash on the metal wheel to do some counter-attack could be an idea but it doesn't mean it was powerfull to be top tier so.
Good tests and interesting setup, Shido.
Not necessarily the best option, but certainly a good topic to let us know where the part stands, competitive-wise.
While this is an interesting setup, I never expected to see Nightmare used for Attack. Knowing what it looks like it seems that it could work, but I don't own one. Even though it's not top-tier testing it is definitely appreicated so we know where it stands.
I do recall th!nk saying that it was about Earth-level in Defense though, so that might be worth checking out.
EDIT: Maybe something like MF-H Nightmare Kerbecs R145RB.
All mint parts. Scythe & Libra launched first.
Nightmare Uranus LW105 RF: 1/10 (10% win rate)
Scythe Aquario GB145 RSF: 9/10 (90% win rate)
Ties: 1
Nightmare Uranus LW105 RF: 5/10 (5 KO; 50% win rate)
Libra B:D: 5/10 (4 OS, 1 KO; 50% win rate)
Eh. 50% against a stamina type...
The Scythe results weren't much of a surprise to me. Defense kills this thing, haha.
As for the Libra B:D results, I think the fifty percent win rate could have been based off of Libra's actual weight. Regardless, it's still really not that impressive, still.
@[Wombat] : Oh, awesome, I'll try to compare the two soon!
(Nov. 23, 2014 5:33 PM)Echizen Wrote: [ -> ] (Nov. 23, 2014 4:39 PM)|BeyBouncer| Wrote: [ -> ]You don't understand. W105 give a little more friction, but it's negligible. More friction = a better grip with the stadium, less recoil, ect...
It think it's you who doesn't understand...
If it's negligible then it has no affect. Friction henders movement, which you don't want and that certainly doesn't mean it gives it better grip. The only thing that can give a Beyblade a better grip to the stadium is the performance tip. And defenitely would not lessen the recoil... But also, why would W105 give the Beyblade more friction...?
Thanks for the benchmark!
Friction and grip are the same thing
Rubber has a higher friction coefficent on the plastic stadium than either metal or plastic, and adding more weight increases frictional force. Both of these are strategies for improving Defense types and recoil handling in general.
Downforce (which W105 does not provide enough to have any real effect) will increase friction because it is adding to the gravitational force that is pushing the tip against the floor. The more that the tip is pushed against the floor (by adding weight or downforce or whatever) the more friction it will have, and thus more speed and less recoil. The problem is that adding weight slows down the Beyblade, which is why Synchromes don't rocket all around the stadium on RF.
Anyways, I'm glad someone found a use for Nightmare; it's a really overlooked Wheel that had the misfortune to come out at a really bad time (as Basalt was around already and 4D was underway). It's a good example of a good part that was overshadowed at the time by other parts, and fits the spirit of Limited nicely.
Interesting idea for a combo Shido! Glad to see people trying out new stuff regardless of whether it is good or bad.
MF-H Nightmare Uranus LW105 RF vs Scythe Scorpio B;D
Nightmare: 5 (5 KO, 0 OS)
Scythe: 15 (15 OS, 0 KO)
Nightmare Win Percentage:
25%
1. Scythe OS
2. Scythe OS
3. Scythe OS
4. Scythe OS
5. Scythe OS
6. Scythe OS
7. Nightmare KO
8. Scythe OS
9. Nightmare KO
10. Scythe OS
11. Scythe OS
12. Scythe OS
13. Nightmare KO
14. Scythe OS
15. Scythe OS
16. Nightmare KO
17. Scythe OS
18. Scythe OS
19. Scythe OS
20. Nightmare KO
Nightmare just got wrecked. It didn't seem like that strong of attacker when hitting and Scythe B;D just took the hits up. I expected Nightmare to do a little worse this match up than against Scythe W145 Stamina because I believe B;D has better defense and it showed. There were a few wall saves for B;D but not that many.
Also Wombat suggested MF-H Nightmare Kerbecs R145 RB so I decided to try it for comparison.
MF-H Nightmare Kerbecs R145 RB vs Scythe B;D
Nightmare: 9 (8 KO, 1 OS)
Scythe: 11 (11 OS, 0 KO)
Nightmare Win Percentage:
45%
1. Scythe OS
2. Nightmare KO
3. Nightmare KO
4. Nightmare KO
5. Scythe OS
6. Scythe OS
7. Nightmare KO
8. Scythe OS
9. Scythe OS
10. Scythe OS
11. Nightmare OS
12. Scythe OS
13. Nightmare KO
14. Scythe OS
15. Scythe OS
16. Nightmare KO
17. Nightmare KO
18. Scythe OS
19. Scythe OS
20. Nightmare KO
R145 RB did a lot better. Not just the games it won, but also it's losses were all really close. The OS came from Nightmare hitting Scythe against a wall so many times Nightmare Out spun it. In conclusion R145 RB is probably a better set up and R145 RB smashed Scythe around while LW105 RF would hope for a lucky hit.
your RB is agressive or not?
@[Shido]: Can you test this setup against Libra B : D ?
Dʀᴀɢá´É´ Wrote:Can you test this setup against Libra B : D ?
The Supreme One posted testings with it, where as it only on 5/10 of the matches. It's on the last page, though.
(Dec. 21, 2014 10:33 PM)Shido Wrote: [ -> ]The Supreme One posted testings with it, where as it only on 5/10 of the matches. It's on the last page, though.
Oh! then test it against
Meteo L-Drago B : D
I think Nightmare could be a good replacement for a competitive purpose. not really be added to tier list but could be usefull when you don't have enough powerfull metal wheel in limited Attack Customisation. it's a good part to make a compact and mid heavy attack combo IMO. for sure it's better than Storm galaxy ray. not sure if it could do better than Screw.