(Jan. 11, 2012 11:40 PM)Black Wing Wrote: [ -> ]And the balance of it is ok. Wn it gets off balance is wn u cn use the rushing speed of the wave comebined with the basalt to attack the opposing bey, some of the times resulting in a KO.
This is all I needed to read.
Please stop posting about things you really don't have evidence for, or apparently knowledge of either.
(Jan. 12, 2012 12:18 AM)Dan Wrote: [ -> ] (Jan. 11, 2012 11:40 PM)Black Wing Wrote: [ -> ]And the balance of it is ok. Wn it gets off balance is wn u cn use the rushing speed of the wave comebined with the basalt to attack the opposing bey, some of the times resulting in a KO.
This is all I needed to read.
Please stop posting about things you really don't have evidence for, or apparently knowledge of either.
Wait, 'rushing speed of the wave"?
Sounds like waterfall.
(Jan. 12, 2012 12:18 AM)Dan Wrote: [ -> ] (Jan. 11, 2012 11:40 PM)Black Wing Wrote: [ -> ]And the balance of it is ok. Wn it gets off balance is wn u cn use the rushing speed of the wave comebined with the basalt to attack the opposing bey, some of the times resulting in a KO.
This is all I needed to read.
Please stop posting about things you really don't have evidence for, or apparently knowledge of either.
Ok, thanks for the tip.
(Jan. 12, 2012 12:41 AM)th!nk Wrote: [ -> ]Wait, 'rushing speed of the wave"?
Sounds like waterfall.
Don't you dare speak of it! It hasn't been tried for years! Let the youngin's go without learning the gruesome existence of the Waterfall Technique..
As anyone considered MF Blitz Unicorno 85RF/R2F? I find it more effective than with CH120.
We discussed it to some length in the thread, and mutually came to the conclusion that Low Track Attack Combos are just not worth the effort anymore, comparatively.
The Blitz LTAC is actually one of the best LTACs ever, and due to its low height, probably
seems to be more effective than Blitz at a higher height.
I mean to say, that what you said is correct. Blitz Unicorno is exceptional on 85; and even I agree to it being more
powerful than its CH120 counterpart.
Now, look at the underlined sentences. This combo is powerful, and hence seems to be more effective. But in today's meta-game, the very origin of LTACs has been shaken. LTACs have not been effective in the game since the arrival of 230, and even BD145 (as I see it).
I know that I am actually just posting a "second opinion" since Hazel's post says it all, but I'd just like to tell you that LTACs
are powerful, just not effective anymore...
EDIT- CH120 was usually a popular choice due to its versatility. Even now, it is a popular choice. The higher height it offers, had already been extremely significant in the game.
Also, so that most members don't get me wrongly- The Blitz LTAC is powerful, and due to it being on a lower height, it
seems to be more effective. The word "seems" is important, so that you all do not get me wrongly.
I disagree with you both. Instead of making absolute statements, I think that we should focus more on the conditions under which a combo is effective or not.
You've outlined the areas where it isn't effective (230, TH170) but there are still a whole host of opposing tracks that we see used in every tournament for which a low track attacker can be very effective (many 145 variants and lower).
All the time I see threads on removing metal weights because they're "OP", I think we need to look at the broader picture... Tracks need to be banned. Look at BD145, it's literally effective in every single defense combo and shuts out just about every single attack combo. Not only this, but I think people find it useful in stamina, and it is also effective in attack. So that being said, it has grounds by the standards I've previously seen, to be banned.
If we banned BD145 then we'd see way for different track combos once again.
(Jan. 12, 2012 3:54 PM)Arupaeo Wrote: [ -> ]I disagree with you both. Instead of making absolute statements, I think that we should focus more on the conditions under which a combo is effective or not.
You've outlined the areas where it isn't effective (230, TH170) but there are still a whole host of opposing tracks that we see used in every tournament for which a low track attacker can be very effective (many 145 variants and lower).
The reason 100 and CH120 were chosen is that most people got better, or at least identical, results on those tracks against 145 and up, down, across the board and sideways, from what I recall.
I was one of them(for 100), and my primary testing vectors were BD145 and GB145. It also did infinitely better against TH170. My results with 100 always either exceeded or at the very least matched 85 on BD145, they were higher against GB145, and just outright mocked TH170.
Blitz 85R2F was the first "good" attack combo I ever used, and I'd like to think I'm a fair shot with it, but 100 works better for me, so I insisted upon it over 85.
Why is LRF on Blitz, though...
(Jan. 12, 2012 5:21 PM)Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]Why is LRF on Blitz, though...
Eh? Where do we see LRF?
If I recall correctly, one might put an LRF on a right-spin to be faster than RF, but slower than R2F. Maybe that's just my theory I suppose.
Oh right, ya a strange place to put it.
I feel like I don't want to put forth the effort to make RF prime, maybe if I launched it on sandpaper lol.
Priming an RF in a BB-10 only takes about half an hour or so, really. No need to invalidate the part.
LRF still gets top-tier worthy results even in right spin, same goes for r2f in left. I don't think it's even clear how they compare to rf in their opposite spin directions, I've heard basically every possible different thing at various times....
As for blitz 85, I haven't seen what people said about it being better against basalt bd145 than ch120, I find ch120 far more useful against everything.
(Jan. 12, 2012 7:15 PM)Hazel Wrote: [ -> ]LRF and R2F are both slower than prime(and slightly worn) RF in the respective opposite directions.
http://worldbeyblade.org/Thread-Competit...#pid458814
LRF is on here for some reason.
Probably best you put up some tests or something before starting dumb rumors, Hazel. People look up to you and respect you, don't forget that.
Deikailo had originally tried Blitz on 85 with the "Breaking Basalt" video and it basically surged up into prominence from that point on IIRC.
CH120 is probably the better track for any Attack combination, but I guess comparatives would be good, Th!nk.
I will try to do some with Duo when I get back from my holiday if I remember, but I've done a lot with Blitz CH120 vs DuoBD145CS, and Blitz performs significantly better on CH120 than low tracks. Same against Basalt BD145. Low tracks are far more risky against the niche combo's that CH145 is useful against, too, alongside some others.
I initially thought 85 was better from what I had heard, but after trying CH120 I haven't looked back.
Think about it in terms of Physics, do you really want to be hitting a huge plastic disk, or metal?
Most of the success with Blitz 85 that I had based around destabilization-esque shenanigans.
I'm going to be honest on this one. I've launched a Vulcan Horuseus 85R2F with a string launcher and got good control, it went pretty fast. I launched it with a light launcher 2 at full strength, it went way faster around the stadium once and then flew out on its own accord.
That being said, strength behind a launch also effects speed of the rubber.
Shenanigans is a pretty accurate descriptor, those kind of things are not something I like to rely on in tournaments, especially as CH120 is far more dependable against a much wider range of opponents (if not all opponents).
(Jan. 13, 2012 2:42 AM)Gibraltor Wrote: [ -> ]I'm going to be honest on this one. I've launched a Vulcan Horuseus 85R2F with a string launcher and got good control, it went pretty fast. I launched it with a light launcher 2 at full strength, it went way faster around the stadium once and then flew out on its own accord.
That being said, strength behind a launch also effects speed of the rubber.
Some people do get better performance with LL2's than string launchers, but it's almost always because they need practice with the latter.
It still nets a pretty good KO rate, mind, I just felt I'd mention that it is actually often striking under the disc, tilting it using the slopes on the MW.
Doesn't do it enough for me to justify sacrificing metal on metal contact. Maybe against basalt it might and I just haven't seen it enough, if so the destabilisation must also be down to basalts imbalance, seeing as I see the opposite against Duo.
Well of course - this combo rose to prominence in Basaltiverse, haha. It is pretty understandable that Duo might switch things around on it a little bit.
Haha, not sure how much or how I need to practice with a string launcher.
And I'll note that circle was the wrong word, it flower patterned out lol.
Anywho, I'm always curious how good the people are when they do testing.